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00:00 - 21:0021:00 - 00:00

00:02
@kimholder thanks! Hey are (will be) the slides from these talks available? I'd like to see those Iridium usage dot plots more clearly.
 
2 hours later…
01:45
@uhoh i don't know. the IAC has never broadcast their presentations at all, so i sort of doubt it.
01:56
Anyone here hear about the physics SE elections?
Just that they are having them.
Ya decided to vote?
 
6 hours later…
08:10
Mercury is apparently geologically active.
 
6 hours later…
14:23
oh - planets are tectonically active because they are shrinking? that's neat.
@SirCumference are you deciding who to vote for?
14:39
> A spinning spacecraft does not need to constantly determine and adjust its attitude like a 3-D stabilized spacecraft does. Isaac Newton does all the work to keep a spinning spacecraft pointed in inertial space.
it would be too chatty to respond to Mark Adler's comment this way, so i'll say it here
Wow, that Isaac Newton is a hard-working guy :)
:) neat approach
Jim added a nomination there at the top that has a certain panache too
15:31
Heh, I got a badge for looking at that candidate page.
 
1 hour later…
17:00
90 minutes to Elon's speech on How To Colonize Mars in 12 Easy Steps
17:14
@kimholder Two days, two amazing events! Tomorrow is gonna be a let down.
reddit.com/live/xnrdv28vxfi2 has some live coverage from r/SpaceX, in case you can't watch video
the talk is being anticipated by major news outlets. that's a big splash already for something like this.
17:42
Ho. Ly. Crap.
look at the size of that thing...
17:57
^ another link for the speech
28 million lbs thrust. That will literally blow away Orlando as Zubrin likes to say...
Vs 7ish for Shuttle and Saturn V!
4 X S-V thrust level. Dear lord, that is gonna so awesome!
thanks, i was just looking that up :)
Holy amitious BATMAN!
that it certainly is
meh, how hard can it be? :)
18:04
Land, and refuel with fuel tanker right after and go. They have said no one has the balls of Elon Musk. They were NOT kidding.
No rotation for gravity on transit. Interesting
especially if the estimates of 30+ Raptors on stage 1 are correct
and they plan to land the whole ship on mars
The image sure looked like 30 or so.
That launch tower would be 3-400 feet tall?
Like the new leg design.
@geoffc they may well simply not have shown that
They animate the transit with Solar cells deployed... Zubrin suggests tethering to second stage and rotatinig about that. No stage to do that with on MCT upper stage.
They do not plan small, do they. Of course, compare the original reuse videos to current reuse, and while they did not do 100%, they got the biggest parts done.
18:07
the thing is big enough to have a centrifuge inside for occasional shots of artificial g.
i don't know, i just can't imagine that they are ignoring that issue.
All I'm seeing on the livestream is the IAC logo; @geoffc, are you just talking about previously released images?
scroll up to the video?
the one on youtube, just went up.
@DylanSp Kim posted a Youtube of their BFR/MCT mission plan.
4 minutes long
in the first part, there are frames where you could pause it and count the engines...
ah, ok.
12m rocket booster diameter, 17m spaceship diameter, 122 m stack height - twitter.com/elonmusk/status/780831628104966144
18:11
3 rings of engines. 6 in inner ring. Makes me think 30 is about close. Been told the nozzle may be 12 feet wide. So 6 engine widths for diameter of the stage. 50 feet wide? 15m width? Wild. That is big.
SLS's core stage is 8.4 meters. Saturn V was 10.1 meters
42 engines!
Shuttle ET is also 10 meters, made on same machines I think.
Or modified versions.
saturn v was 111 m tall
660Klbs thrust, 42 engines is about 28 million lbs thrust.
Wow.
18:14
I should just pull up the Saturn V wiki page, I have a feeling I'll be referencing it a lot
Let me summarize... Wow. The balls it takes to design such a thing, and then ACTUALLY plan on doing it, seriously, without joking.
This is like Kerbal gone bad.
(I am stuck on wow, at the moment).
N1 was 105 m high, 17m around
@DylanSp Wussy N1 only had 32 engines, what a piker. :) Unambitious Soviets.
thought it was 30?
Ya, sorry, 30.
Pikers!
18:20
ok... getting ready to put in the MCT for comparison...
needs New Glenn, as well
Missing Antares (old model and new 230 model).
yeah, the thing is it has the scale. there are some others...
@DylanSp Only 17m at the base, Soviets do a lot more cone shapes than US boosters.
18:23
yeah, true. N1 had the big spherical tanks, IIRC
lol Iron Giant
That was a good one!
At a friends house, on Fiber. Did a speed test, 50Mbps down, 25Mbps up. Nice and speedy.
interesting that the promo video shows them launching from 39A. speculation I'd seen was that they'd be launching BFR/IST from Boca Chica
i wondered about that too. but really, it is a promo video, and there is lots of history at 39A
yeah.
ok 90 seconds...
18:28
I wonder whether ITS will need to burn to circularize the parking orbit; if not, BFR could technically qualify as SSTO
200 kw of inflight power is more than the ISS. 120kw max. So big panels.
@DylanSp hm, the upper stage is the craft that will head to mars...
@DylanSp Boca Chica is just not ig enough, far enough away from people for somethingthis big.
28 million lbs of thrust is ALOT! There is not enough room there to do it.
@PearsonArtPhoto Kim beat you to it. But still, wow.
18:30
@PearsonArtPhoto beat ya :) but worth posting again, so people can reference
Oh well. I wonder how much that stole the thunder from Elon's talk...
oh, i'm sure they posted it to whet people's appetites.
hello did the talk already happen?
@kimholder Agreed. Wow.
No legs, interesting...
18:31
@kimholder Consider, if this is not the 'big' news, how interesting this is gonna be!
@mbigras nope, should start any time
@PearsonArtPhoto No legs on Stage 1? ITS had legs
the links are at the top of the list at the side
there's another
It lands on a special mount.
@kim
18:32
@mbigras spacex posted that youtube vid a bit ago; we're still waiting for the talk to begin
@kimholder and @DylanSp thank! is this the link you are talking about: livestream.com/accounts/4426843/events/6315496/…
yep.
that hall must be crazy packed right now.
also just wondering do you have to click the name after @k or is it possible to auto select it? As you can see I tried hitting enter when it popped up and it just sent the @kim
kim also works.
i'm not sure why, actually....
clicking the name is more reliable
ahh, so annoying :) oh well, I'll keep clicking then
18:35
you can also use tab to go through the names
@kimholder boom! tab works!
it autoexpands too, thanks I've been wondering about this for a little while, sorry to pollute the channel about it ;)
So, it looks like it's a very quickly reloadable 2 stage rocket. I can believe they could re-load the rocket in 1 orbit. Hmmm...
@mbigras no problemo :)
we have music
Well, it's streaming now... Nothing really, but...
is there a way to insert a tweet, with preview?
18:39
@DylanSp yeah, click 'copy link to tweet'
it will post the whole thing here
Waiting for everyone to reach their seats and get settled. Starting in 5 to 10.
there we go. thx
Mexico time speeds up for no one :)
It's a big conference, and I suspect there's a lot of excitement on this one...
Well timed to blow out of everyone's mind the US presidential debates...
(shhh.... we're in our happy place right now...)
:D
Hey, I look at that as a very positive thing:-) Space is always more interesting than politics, and that's part of why SpaceX's plan is so appealing.
18:46
ok, if anyone hasn't seen the video, i sticky starred it too. Summary - 4x the thrust of Saturn V, 42 engines, 2 stages, upper stage is also the interplanetary vessel.
2
Second launch on same first stage booster, for fuel only.
SpaceX's plan: SPAAAAAAACE furiously sweeps politics under the rug SPAAAAACE
2
Not to mention quick re-launch capability implied, and no landing legs, as the booster will land on a special mount.
yeah, that mount is an odd detail
@PearsonArtPhoto Though watch the time lapse, it is meant to imply a much slower pace than shown, like time is sped up.
18:50
It seems very likely it is very quick, the next payload was waiting when the first payload launched, at least I thought it was...
@geoffc Still seems like a relatively quick relaunch; a day, maybe two?
@DylanSp Yes very quick.
I don't know how the orbital mechanics work out exactly, but I think you'd want to launch a day later so the longitude of the ascending node lines up
(I think that's the right element...)
Elon talk at #IAC2016 will definitely start late. Crowds are out of control https://t.co/sG15royap2
Link has a picture. pretty crowded for a relatively small venue
you know, this has now been delayed enough i am wondering if crowd control is an issue
@DylanSp They should have built a wall to keep the Mexicans in!
18:53
Definately start late, posted 15 minutes after it's supposed to start...
That's so Elon...
^
There are a lot of people here. Is a thing happening?
@duzzy SpaceX MArs reveal. Scroll up, find the youtube Kim and Pearson linkes in. Actually, starred right now.
@duzzy Yeah; elon musk's talk about SpaceX's Mars architecture
Watch and report back,
Ohhhh
I'll have to watch when I get home. :(
18:55
this is duzzy. don't think he is innocent.
They are running on Mexican time, per Kim, so almost 30 min late to start. Apparently the crowd is very roudy, and crowdy.
Use your phone! It is worth the data.
Unlimited data!
gotta get my earbuds!
WHOOP WHOOP!
one part Mexican time, two parts Elon time
i know my mexico, i bet there is a crush at the doors and like 500 people trying to pull favors.
18:56
@DylanSp True.
damn, did anyone else's sound just come in and then go out?
I suspect they didn't expect to be on hold for 20 minutes...
Mine did.
mine is okay
@geoffc did you hear someone talking about being "delighted about photos being taken" and then it cut out?
18:58
Someone started talking about photos and then cut out. So yes @mbigras
Starting!!!!!!
WHOOP WHOOP round 2!
hey, it's on!
but i had to reload
18:59
CNES (kenes).
welcome you ear.
:)
Can someone repost the link, please? Mobile is a pain.
Thank you.
That's an easy url. :P
Go Go- Muskinator!
19:00
The audio isn't great...
Audio is out f sync with video but who cares.
I'm using $10 earbuds from my cellphone. I'm not even going to know if it's poor audio. :P
Be funny if his presenter tool was a Tesla Model S keyfob.
@geoffc try reloading, mine is fine
@geoffc mine too
as in mine is fine too
19:01
Looks/sounds fine to me.
MIssed a few seconds, reloading. Oh well.
I love how he included the population...
lol I was going to say that.
I like that font.
That's awesome.
19:05
I figured it'd be something like that line...
has anyone found any comments from elon about what he thought about the Martian like the book
haha, ya it's a little tricky ;)
aiming for a cost of 200k to move to mars. when he talks about martian colonization en masse, I really want to hear what sort of political/societal structure he has in mind; that's a very important problem if we ever get to that level of colonization
It seems like he's been reading "The Case for Mars", amzn.to/2cIV0xc
so, there is an implication here that they still can't figure out how to make an upper stage reusable.
@PearsonArtPhoto Zubrin may not have invented ISRU but he did a good job of pushing it hard.
19:13
There's far more than ISRU that he's borrowing from.
Case for Mars talks about getting the ticket price to $500K, for instance.
comparison of BFR/ITS with saturn V and current boosters, including new glenn
I love how Elon just blow the New Glenn out of the water...
Less than a month after too.
enh, New Glenn's aimed at a different range of stuff. it's ambitious enough as it is, given BO's relative lack of experience
See, the second payload is sitting to the left of the pad.
19:16
I still need to read The Case for Mars. does it talk about political/societal stuff (on Mars) much/at all?
I think so.
it spends a lot more time on the politics here
yeah, that video implies same-day launch of the fuel
A good (Fictional, but good) account of that is the Red/Green/Blue Mars series, amzn.to/2dxhGzp
@PearsonArtPhoto that series is on my (far too large) to-read list
it looks like they do some aerobraking at mars using one whole side of the ship
19:20
I buy Kindle books almost monthly, and rarely read them...
Yeah, that's pretty close to the plan for Red Dragon.
made from the SpaceX CAD models
aerobraking to shed most of the velocity, retropropulsion once it's down to supersonic/low-hypersonic speeds
4-5 refueling missions..
Depart en masse. Hmmm...
lol 1000!
19:22
1000 ships in orbit
that's just crazy talk
And they'll have lasers!
and they can go faster than light!
It's quite big...
@SirCumference If you are around, can you do some software testing in return?
That was a great pan out. The engine pipig at the bottom was pretty cool.
That's huge.
I don't see any lasers, though.
19:24
Gonna have to do a LOT of fracking to get that much CH4!!!
carry the luggage...
@geoffc Or a lot of cow farts.
40-100 years to create a fully sustainable mars colony
carbon fiber without a liner - they think they have the tech....
very interesting...
19:27
I don't know a lot about carbon fiber... but my trekking poles are made of carbon fiber, and they don't always stand up very well.
I'm sure that's what they said with the COPVs...
how does the pressure for subcooled methane/LOX compare to the pressure for the He COPVs, though?
@DylanSp Way WAY WAY lower than He.
500 tons to LEO...
@geoffc That's what I thought; sounds a lot less challenging than COPVs
19:30
Good lord, the flame trench for this!!!
The current building is WAY to close for this vehicle. :)
How big will those grid fins be?
39A for the Saturn V was supposed to be specked to handle this...
YUUGE!
sounds like they want to use both 39A and Boca Chica, which makes sense for the volumes he's talking about
lots of stats w/ handy comparison to saturn V
Raptor specs
3 MN of thrust at sea level; F-1 had 6.7 MN
booster specs
19:35
No legs, is supposed to directly land on target.
The specs for F-1 are not great, pretty much everything was sacrificed to get the engine large enough.
staging velocty is 8650 km/h (~2400 m/s)
so not SSTO
spacecraft slide
still planning for 100+ passengers in one ship (long-term)
Public Private Partnership. Hmmm...
That's interesting, and doesn't surprise me...
Elon's only accumulating wealth to go to Mars.
Not the best with timelines... That's an understatement...
lol
I can imagine how he started with a Mars piggy-bank or something.
Public Private Partnership, the worst^H^H^H^H^H best of both worlds.
19:54
lol is he just brainstorming on stage?
Elon always talks like that...
what a dead-pan guy
I know, but I just kind of expect him to pull out a piece of paper and a pen, and just sit down and quietly start writing.
trying to figure things out.
Well, he knows he is on stage, so... He just does the best he can in his head.
I wonder if he has someone who makes sure he isn't holding anything to write with/on when he gets on stage.
No cellphones! No whiteboards!
19:56
LOL.
I was watching Penn and Teller's Fool Us.
One of the episodes someone asked Penn for a Cell Phone, which he pulled out and stated he wasn't supposed to have it on him.
Musk: spaceship could also be a large suborbital reusable vehicle for point to point delivery. (Translation: gimme some sweet DoD money)
So, his talk wasn't geared at all relating to the recent failure...
tank!!
wooww
Is he talking about The Expanse?
'i wouldn't recommend this for interstellar journies...'
20:04
So Elon...
Oooh, questions!!!
@Hohmannfan Yeah, sure
"Construction of booster and spacecraft is possible in some of the Gulf states. Booster and spacecraft possibly built in multiple states with final assembly at the launch site."
Sooo... are they just letting anyone ask questions?
20:07
I guess...
It costs an arm and a leg to get in, so...
Not if you're a student.
translation: Congress, fund us and we'll spend that money in your district
yOUR husband is there! Also!
Aldo!
@kimholder You let Aldo go to Burning Man?
What kind of a stoner question is this?
20:08
@geoffc :) i thought that. but my husband is muuuuuch smoother
@kimholder Also not a stoner.
I wonder how the radiation problem on Europa will be dealt with...
Interesting that he is not interested in Nuclear on Mars. Only solar.
Speak of the devil.
absolutely no mention of co-development of the Moon to make best use
He said if the public is interested in it.
20:09
well, at least he's sanguine about the risks. I'm glad these plans are at least a little grounded
He did mention a bit about the Moon.
@kimholder He said the moon is possible, he is not opposed, but he has a goal, Mars.
@Hohmannfan What is it?
@SirCumference Language interpreter.
@geoffc Yeah, that's interesting. given how solar's efficiency keeps going up, though, I think it's reasonable
20:10
Also, if they do not initially start a fleet to Mars, the booster will be idle and available for moon missions if someone (NASA?) wants to pay for it.
@DylanSp Mars is quite a bit farther away, dust, etc...
yes, they let anyone ask a question
@SirCumference If you have got it, I take the link down.
But nonetheless...
plus, they probably have enough mass budget that they can afford to bring a bunch of solar panels
100K people watching now on YouTube, I forgot to check when it started to see what it peaked at...
5 minutes and I have to leave, one way or another... Sigh.
20:12
@Hohmannfan Not sure what I'm supposed to be doing with it
Oh
There's syntax
Neat
@geoffc that's exactly what i thought he'd maybe mention
@SirCumference Just see if it runs. If everything freezes, that is a bad sign.
Elon Musk delivers a credible plan to colonize Mars, and CNN doesn't even have a mention of it on their front page... Sigh.
Zubrin makes a great point. to Elon's insprining point. He says, what happened in 1492? Well Columbus. But also Medici died (richest man in the world). Borgias took over the papacy. Also a peace treaty I forget. But what do people remember? COlumbus, who at the time, was a non-story for people there.
@PearsonArtPhoto It is not credible, it is incredible.
20:16
he has an awesome plan for a credible rocket. the rest? i'm not sure...
ITAR! Not his fault.
I knew the answer to that question before Elon answered...
@Hohmannfan Runs fine
@SirCumference Good. You are running osx, but what browser?
Uh...how'd ya know that?
20:18
People are just trying to push their products...
I don't want to, but I've got 5 more minutes and I've got to go home... Sigh.
Dumb ass questions.
Just stay.
it'll be online
@SirCumference You have the __macosx resource fork in all your zip files. zip on mac is broken.
20:18
It's already online!
I've been well familiar with ITAR since I was in college working on a student satellite project...
@Hohmannfan Oh. Well, I'm using chrome
i wish someone had asked about artificial gravity on the trip
That would be a good question.
It almost seems like it could be set up that way, but wasn't...
good point...
20:20
Not quite true, but pretty close...
You can't really get anywhere in 24 hours, but it's pretty close...
I also wish someone asked more about the first trip, and test runs...
@Hohmannfan Nice job by the way
Good question...
Okay, I've got to run, sigh... Will have to check the cliff notes later...
it'll all be there
I'm really curious how they'll approach vibration/oscillation problems with 42 raptors
from reddit: Robert Zubrin, Bill Nye, Buzz Aldrin and Charles Bolden were all definitely here today
I want to see what Zubrin has to say!
20:28
What's a cycler? Like... someone who rides a bike? geoff?
the aldrin mars cycler
A Mars cycler (or Earth–Mars cycler) is a special kind of spacecraft trajectory that encounters Earth and Mars on a regular basis. The term Mars cycler may also refer to a spacecraft on a Mars cycler trajectory. The Aldrin cycler is an example of a Mars cycler. A cycler trajectory encounters two or more bodies on a regular basis. Cyclers are potentially useful for transporting people or materials between those bodies using minimal propellant (relying on gravity-assist flybys for most trajectory changes), and can carry heavy radiation shielding to protect people in transit from cosmic rays and solar...
^ beat me
Heart of Gold. yep, that's briliiant.
I was hoping for a Culture reference, but I'l take Heart of Gold xD
Dumbass questions.
Heart of Gold is awesome.
20:35
and that's it! wow.
well, all in all, that was a pretty great talk.
I liked it.
he did mention consideration of a propellant depot on the Moon, over the long term.
That was great. Totally worth blowing off the afternoons work!
Yeah, if I had any work, I would have loved to blow it off for that.
20:36
and now there will be a raft of articles :)
Not busy?
I never have real work to do. Just school work. :P
interesting note on ISRU: looks like they're planning to mine ice, get hydrogen from that, instead of bringing hydrogen from earth
@DylanSp Different than Zubrin, so there @PearsonArtPhoto and in a major way! A good point. Also, solar for power not nuclear.
also probably means a landing site near the poles, which is...interesting
20:41
oh, i don't know... there is subsurface ice over a large part of the planet
00:00 - 21:0021:00 - 00:00

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