The Pod Bay

TildalWave

02:57

The Space Show w/ Jim Muncy, President and founder of PoliSpace is now podcast live. More info in the newsletter

just a 60 minute show tonight

PearsonArtPhoto

03:15

Another tag badge:-)

StackExchange

TildalWave has added an event to this room's schedule.

TildalWave

^ (tomorrow, Keck Institute for Space Studies Lecture: Building the First Spaceport in Low Earth Orbit, kiss.caltech.edu/new_website/lectures/Blincow_Lecture_2016.html)

geoffc

@PearsonArtPhoto You monster.

PearsonArtPhoto

LOL.

StackExchange

TildalWave has added an event to this room's schedule.

TildalWave

03:20

^ (Mar. 24/25th, JPL's The von Kármán Lecture: What 10 Years at Mars Can Tell Us About the Planet, jpl.nasa.gov/events/lectures_archive.php?year=2016&month=3)

PearsonArtPhoto

I'm at 16/18 bronze tag badges. Still lacking a silver one...

geoffc

03:35

@PearsonArtPhoto Muhahahaha! Two Silvers! Haha! :) Waiting for enough questions on a couple to get badges.

Hmm, F-20 core that landed at LZ-1 was transported soon after to LC-39A. But today they moved it to LC-40. No one is quite sure why yet.

geoffc

03:57

Did anyone post the slick marketing video with music from SpaceX yet?

"The Falcon has landed" | Recap of Falcon 9 launch and landing

►

TildalWave

you're our SpaceX guy so that's your job :P

nice green flash from TEA/TEB

duzzy

I want one of those super cool jobs watching all the monitors when things launch.

geoffc

@TildalWave There is some new landing footage in this one, worth watching.

The flame of the engine as it flies through its own exhaust is interesting.

@duzzy I enjoyed the close ups of crowd folk and launch team. During and after. Really humanized it. But also makes you realize how young everyone is.

And no damn ties!

Brian Lynch

are there complete videos for the clips they show at 2:36?

geoffc

(I am a conscientious object to ties.)

duzzy

04:05

ties are terrible.

Brian Lynch

aw I love dressing up

duzzy

i hate it.

geoffc

@BrianLynch Not that I am aware of. Should ytou find them, SHARE!!!!!

Brian Lynch

most definitely will

geoffc

@duzzy Agreed! Designed to choke.

@BrianLynch I hate dressing up, but will wear a suit with a gun to my head. But ties I hate with a passion. I suspect Brian is one of them there skinny critters.

Duzzy is not a big guy, but I am too thick at the neck for comfort with a tie.

Brian Lynch

04:07

@geoffc haha yea I am fairly slim so that may affect it -- although I don't dress up often so maybe that makes it feel more special

duzzy

I don't think ties are comfortable for anyone, regardless of neck size.

geoffc

My bother in law, is apparently 5'11" and 120 lbs. I am unclear why the wind does not blow him over.

We were checking, my arms are close to the size of his thighs.

Brian Lynch

active control

TildalWave

ha there was quite some ground effect it looks almost as if it landed on a cushion

Brian Lynch

yea I wonder how much of a problem that was during design and simulation

kind of surprising there are no gratings actually

geoffc

04:09

I noticed this, driving for him water skiing. When I try to get up behind our very nice ski boat, I sit in the water, dragged for what feels like forever (5-10 seconds) while the boat gets planing, so my ski can plane, so I can finally get out of the water. He litterally pops right up as soon as I hit the throttle.

@TildalWave They slow mowed it, and I think the legs bounced a bit.

TildalWave

I'm a bit worried about that upwards flame on early ascent tho, looks like there was some excess oxygen somewhere higher up the vehicle, possibly frozen at the interstage?

geoffc

@TildalWave I was thinkinig gas generator, but there should have been 9of those.

TildalWave

@geoffc yes, I meant that slight bounce and slide to the right on the video

@geoffc I think that was the side where umbilicals go in so frozen oxygen ... or FOX :)

geoffc

@TildalWave That would make sense I guess.

NOt as bad as a Delta-4 heavy though! That is a scary burning affect!

TildalWave

they might wanna increase the interstage pressure for the next launch

pump more nitrogen into it

geoffc

04:12

Someone has reported the landed core is already vertical at LC-40!! So they drove it from LC-39A today to LC-40 and have it up on the pad at LC-40. Something is going on...

TildalWave

@geoffc yes, but that's a different cause, mostly because the paint catches fire and some residual fuel hanging there reflected off the ground with the ignition done in sequence

geoffc

LC-39A is assumed to not be ready for a hotfire yet, and they are in a hurry to get it done before they need it for SES-9 then CRS-8, then, then,... The manifest is busy, no time for testing. They need to get the second pad active.

@TildalWave I know. But scary looking if harmless. I still would like an answer to why shuttle style sparklers don't solve this issue on D4-H.

TildalWave

@geoffc they're test fueling it?

pressure check et al.?

@geoffc you know why

(it would involve innovation ... ULA ... )

geoffc

@TildalWave Maybe? Assumption is they are sneaking in a re-used core hot fire. Crazy people are saying maybe they will try to launch SES9 on it. Which is stupid.

@TildalWave Boeing bought Rockwell right? Ergo they own the sparklers from the Shuttle so not even Not Invented Here syndrome.

Or do the sparklers come from Aerojet, as SSME makers? Or are they KSC's?

TildalWave

@geoffc I think it would take more than that, for D4H the launch site might not take such pressure if all 3 engines ignited at the same time

you know what Shuttle did to the exhaust trench

should be similar, just smaller scale

they're probably happy with how it worked so far so don't think any change is needed (after the slight change to the paint and ignition sequence)

actually, didn't they do this ignition in sequence exactly to reduce residual hydrogen problem?

geoffc

04:21

@TildalWave Yes,since the first engine burning will burn any residual hydrogen better than any sparkler ever.

TildalWave

well sure, it'll blow most of it away

but I can see your point

launcher is already under so much sonic shock with ignition it's basically inside an explosion or air surrounding it, and having that expand upwards from one source means the vehicle is subject to resonance with the expanding wave... if they used sparklers at multiple locations along the length of it they could reduce that

they're still really cool launches to watch tho

there's just one D4H launch this year?

XKCD

06:11

I make tools for managing job-hunting sites for people who make tools for managing job-hunting sites for people who make tools for ...

geoffc

15:55

@TildalWave I likeD4-H it is a cool booster, but once F-H comes online it becomes mostly obselete. To be fair, SpaceX needs a better upper stage to truly replace it.

kim holder

16:16

@Hohmannfan things i am compelled to fix: really shaky hand-drawn circles by poor slobs without graphic tablets ;)

geoffc

@kimholder Or the ability to use a bloody circle tool in even the worst image editors.

kim holder

16:37

ah, true.

@geoffc must whine about comparative demands of formal wear between the sexes, to wit - at least ties aren't a constant threat of physical injury if you aren't careful, like high heels are.

geoffc

@kimholder Pshaw, both are deadly if used properly. A nicely broken off heel is great for stabbing deaths. :)

duzzy

I've never seen anyone hanged by a high heel shoe.

geoffc

The number of times I have caught a tie on something and nearly choked to death is too high for my comfort. I am sure Duzzy et al can understand that one.

kim holder

hahaha - i wasn't even thinking about the receiving end :P

geoffc

Ankles are cheap. Necks are forever.

kim holder

16:42

ok, well let's talk make-up. applying mascara - eye injury constantly 3 mm away.

duzzy

What about shaving your neck?

kim holder

hm...

there aren't straight blades any more though

duzzy

They're still blades!

at your throat.

but yeah, in the days of straight blades, I'd never not have a beard.

Actually, I don't even use blades now. I use the clippers thing.

I'm almost never actually clean shaven.

because the danger!!

kim holder

nice that that's an option these days. scratchy though, let me tell you.

geoffc

@duzzy I realized what a waste of time shaving was, and went full beard. :) It works in the winter well, keeps my face warm when biking/running in -20C weather. It protects me from sunburn in the summer, and is hydronamic, like a polar bear in the water in summer.

duzzy

16:48

When I have a beard, it's like a sponge. When I get out of the shower, I try and try, but cannot get my chin dry.

geoffc

@duzzy You need better hair. Mine dries well and quickly.

duzzy

I do need better hair. My hair is dumb.

I have to drive to a train yard now. You two have fun with the battle of the formal attire for sexes.

kim holder

that actually sounds like fun...

i mean the trains. i'd like to just drive around and look at trains for a while. it's that kind of day.

geoffc

@kimholder Duzzy spends all day working with trains. Lucky bastard.

And the slacker could not even get me a ride on a train when I was in SLC. What good is he? :)

Did I mention my attempt to get a tour of the USS Gerald Ford?

(Failed, alas).

kim holder

i'm watching a jpl talk about the darpa robotics challenge - open to the public! that sounds like a good time.

observation of very powerful, gigantic, or extremely advanced machinery. quite uplifting, no real substitute.

TildalWave

18:07

@kimholder shaky hand-drawn circles have a long tradition on SE, it's got nothing to do with inability to use "technology" :P

Some random quotes from MSE:

> I have added hand-drawn circles - it's just good manners.

> See attached picture (with meme-compliant hand-drawn circle).

> here's the prerequisite hand drawn circle from SO

> Now with red hand-drawn circles!

> ps: I would do hand-drawn circles but...

> Yes, I know, no hand-drawn circles. How dare I?

kim holder

please note that i replaced the shaky hand-drawn circle that blocked several letters with a smooth hand-drawn circle that included pressure-sensitive fading, and was also red.

TildalWave

2

A: How do we make UI Design suggestion for Stack Overflow?

When adding mock-ups be sure to use hand-drawn red circles to highlight changed areas - and if possible incorporate a unicorn or two in the design.

@kimholder you're just showing off :))

kim holder

actually i was avoiding 'real work' :P

TildalWave

hahaha fair enough :)

to be honest, I don't even know what you were referring to

this?

replacing ...

yeah... I can see some aesthetic improvement LOL

of course, the numbers are for a completely different engine, so that argument that it doesn't block several letters is a bit thin :))

kim holder

18:27

the wikipedia enty had changed, interestingly

so i picked a different engine, that had entries above and below

David Freitag

18:41

@TildalWave Wooow 96 inches... I'm jealous

Also, nice freehand circles :b

Hohmannfan

19:39

@kimholder No!!! My beautiful hand drawn circle! Gone forever

Was it not following the SE standard? I even left a first-attempt circle in the background, and a visible end connection 40 degrees from the top.

kim holder

it was a fine first attempt. just a little unrefined :]

i attempted to follow author intent.

TildalWave

hand-drawn circle snobs! :D

maybe we should change our room's description?

kim holder

heheheheh maybe we should

room topic changed to The Pod Bay: General discussion for space.stackexchange.com. Check our scheduled chat events at chat.stackexchange.com/rooms/info/9682/the-pod-bay?tab=schedule [canada] [cheese] [hand-drawn-circle-snobs] [procrastination] [space-exploration] [unobtuse-alcoholic-ducks]

Hohmannfan

Has someone created a tool for imitating hand-drawn circles?

TildalWave

nearly every image editor and vector graphics tool out there

Hohmannfan

19:49

@TildalWave But a tool making circles that LOOKS like hand-drawn :P

TildalWave

yes

mind, there's not many hand-drawn circles that are actually hand-drawn

these are hand-drawn

Hohmannfan

woosh

kim holder

oh, how delightful - an excuse to explain the wow! signal :D

Wow! signal

The Wow! signal is the name given to a strong narrowband radio signal detected by Jerry R. Ehman on August 15, 1977, while he was working on a SETI project at the Big Ear radio telescope of The Ohio State University, then located at Ohio Wesleyan University's Perkins Observatory in Delaware, Ohio. The signal bore the expected hallmarks of non-terrestrial and non-Solar System origin. The signal appears to have come from the northwest of the globular cluster of M55 in the constellation Sagittarius, near the Chi Sagittarii star group. The entire signal sequence lasted for the full 72-second window...

TildalWave

it was an alien ploy to popularize hand-drawn circles!

Hohmannfan

a plot realized with only 8 characters, that's golfing!

TildalWave

20:43

@Hohmannfan Did you write this question space.stackexchange.com/posts/13488/revisions with the XKCD substitutions plugin turned on? :)))

seems your space.stackexchange.com link was auto-edited to spaaace.stackexchange.com LOL

mind, you can make it replace space with thefinalfrontier that way URLs will still work... thefinalfrontier.stackexchange.com

kim holder

Ha! that's a nice touch :D

Hohmannfan

@TildalWave seems like I accidentally also created the tag "spaaacecraft". Is it possible to delete it?

TildalWave

it'll self-delete in a while with no questions using it

Hohmannfan

I will remember to turn it off in the future :)

TildalWave

at least you didn't s/crewed-spaceflight/pigs-in-spaaaaceeeee

Hohmannfan

20:52

ever heard of the Apsychic readingo Lunar Module?

TildalWave

huh?

Hohmannfan

caused by "poll" -> "psychic reading"

TildalWave

hehehe

Hohmannfan

21:35

What is the best practice if I find a dupe, but the dupe has gotten an answer, and the original question is unanswered?

TildalWave

21:52

vote to close as dupe on the newer one, then if the community agrees it is a dupe, mods can merge the two questions

Hohmannfan

@TildalWave I can not do that. I tried, and was rejected with "This question does not have an upvoted or accepted answer"

TildalWave

huh?

which ones are you talking about?

Hohmannfan

9

Q: Does ISS stop rotation for docking?

A question from 3 years ago got an answer that would be a great answer to a different question (and concluded with a comment that more would be posted later.) Let me re-ask, making the question clearer. Normally, ISS spins at 1 revolution per orbit, effectively one side always facing the Earth. ...

and

10

Q: ISS attitude during docking

The ISS is using the Control Moment Gyroscopes to maintain its attitude (the Cupola pointing towards Earth). That means the ISS is slowly rotating with respect to distant stars. What happens during docking of a visiting spacecraft (Soyuz, Progress, ATV, Dragon, etc)? These spacecraft should appro...

iss attitude docking

TildalWave

oh geez yes I deleted my answer to the other one because it became a subject to anal retentiveness

and then SF accepted an answer that is clearly wrong

bah

I'm not gonna touch it

Hohmannfan

It is clearly the same question, however, I can not see what the best thing to do in this case is

TildalWave

22:00

me neither and I don't have to even care, there's 2 more mods around here :P

I'm just gonna ignore it ... la la la la la la la la .... see? :)

Hohmannfan

Help! @PearsonArtPhoto and @called2voyage Tildal has turned crazy

TildalWave

LOOL

duzzy

turned? o_O

Hohmannfan

remains

duzzy

:P

TildalWave

22:03

better :D

I had an accepted answer to the other one too ... but let's just say that I don't like being pointed fingers at as if I didn't answer a question of someone else that didn't ask it

Hohmannfan

A possible but questionable solution: Edit original question to ask for what TildalWave answered, and then undelete the answer. New question is then not a dupe.

TildalWave

it's not my question to edit to change its meaning

kim holder

from the text of the new question, it sounds like SF hoped that old answer would reappear under the new one.

Hohmannfan

To change the meaning of someone’s question is not a good idea, I realize that now

duzzy

Yeah, that's what politicians do. We're not politicians.

TildalWave

22:09

@kimholder no, it's the same question... I was indeed beating around the bush in my answer there because it wasn't entirely clear to me at the time, something that was made clear with OP's comment and I edited to answer that part too.

I can still find loads of on-orbit status reports describing free drift attitude on final approach

kim holder

sure, i''m not saying it isn't a dupe, just that SF asked in the hope of things getting clearer

because they could see that answer

TildalWave

and there's some papers for propellant optimized approach also using ISS CMGs to better match attitude of the approaching craft, but no mention if that was ever implemented

kim holder

@Hohmannfan Can you see the answer to the old question or are you still below that point level?

Hohmannfan

@kimholder I see it

kim holder

> (pitch, roll and yawn)

4

oh, classic Tildal typo :D

duzzy

22:13

lol

TildalWave

@kimholder the usual thing to do is to ask for clarification in the original thread, add a bounty to it seeking new answers, or ask a new one with something different about it, maybe a request for reference (which was indeed missing there)

kim holder

i've tried twice now to draw SF in here, they don't go for it.

TildalWave

@kimholder who said it was a typo? :P

Hohmannfan

@kimholder gamer version: (twitch, troll and spawn)

kim holder

XP

kim holder

22:32

well, i downvoted the accepted answer, commented, and upvoted the comment that it isn't correct.

i'd love to talk to SF about the choice to post a new question rather than drawing attention to the previous one, but it seems like a bit of a delicate conversation to have in comments.

Hohmannfan

It created a situation known as M.E.S.S

(not "Multi Emulator Super System")

TildalWave

it's a complicated thing to answer, but ISS attitude during docking definitely isn't TEA, it can't even be because moment of inertia changes during vehicle docking

kim holder

it's a question that deserves a great answer, it would be a good introduction to the movements and forces involved in general in orbit.

for now though, my interest is in better coordination with one of our most active members.

TildalWave

22:48

Hear that @Hohmannfan? You're screw'd :))

kim holder

i meant SF, of course. Hohmannfan is already screw'd

TildalWave

I know :)

that questions would be perfect for our ex mod Chris, shame he's not around much any more

kim holder

there's an ex-mod? huh, who knew...

David Freitag

@Hohmannfan Yeah but which tool is making the circle, the software or the person using it? :b

kim holder

i imagine him hiding down dim alleys with newspaper blowing around, clinging to an old wine bottle...

Hohmannfan

22:53

screwed = function(userid){if(userid === 8693|userid === 103){return true}else{return false}};

TildalWave

@kimholder oh yeah things change, I was just looking through old meta posts to see any mention of him and realized that one of our CMs in the meantime changed sex too

David Freitag

I wonder how sensitive SETI instruments are to ground-based transmissions

@TildalWave From "Yes please" to "I have a headache" ?

TildalWave

@DavidFreitag no, the other way around

was this sexist? It wasn't meant to be

David Freitag

Yeah I really hope not

Guys can have headaches too ya know!

TildalWave

tell me about it, you caused about half of mine :))

David Freitag

22:57

Although usually the blood causing a headache goes somewhere else for men... But that's a different story.

@TildalWave Me? Naaaw... :b

TildalWave

you're gonna be there for the insomnihack CTF?

David Freitag

I would like to but for once I actually got my sleep schedule under control.

Hohmannfan

sleep schedule?

TildalWave

OK sorry that was a bit mean LOL

Hohmannfan

I missed it

TildalWave

23:08

bah not the best image generator if it doesn't overlay Bart after it draws the text

@DavidFreitag you could help us out for a couple of hours tho

@kimholder I don't think that boric acid was meant here space.stackexchange.com/posts/13517/revisions

Borax

Borax, also known as sodium borate, sodium tetraborate, or disodium tetraborate, is an important boron compound, a mineral, and a salt of boric acid. Powdered borax is white, consisting of soft colorless crystals that dissolve easily in water. Borax has a wide variety of uses. It is a component of many detergents, cosmetics, and enamel glazes. It is also used to make buffer solutions in biochemistry, as a fire retardant, as an anti-fungal compound, in the manufacture of fiberglass, as a flux in metallurgy, neutron-capture shields for radioactive sources, a texturing agent in cooking, and as...

kim holder

ooops

TildalWave

and indeed, that comment is spot on, the question is really not clear

kim holder

i'd voted to close and then i went searching and realized there is an interesting question that could come out of it

TildalWave

which one?

:P

kim holder

@Hohmannfan quick on the draw there dude. i guess that is the best solution for now.

TildalWave

23:17

there's radiation poisoning mitigation, radiation prevention, feasibility of using borax as material for various space applications,...

I kinda liked this tho:

> Can astronaut space suits be laced with boric acid help reduce or shield space radiation? Can boric acid be added to space craft design to help protect human cargo?

kim holder

alright, i'm going back to what i was doing before...

TildalWave

nooooo

kim holder

what? i mean i was watching a video on blender tools

TildalWave

Ah OK carry on :)

Hohmannfan

@kimholder Sorry about that quick roll-back, you improved a lot of grammar too

kim holder

23:30

no, it really probably was the best solution

i'm just afraid the OP won't edit, won't know how to clarify.

TildalWave

> I also read that a dairy farmer added borax to his cows water supply. The result was, it reduced radiation in the cows milk.

Jeez!!

I would be avoiding dairy products of farmers that add anything to water supply without having a thorough study of effects on the bovine and human body covering it with favorable conclusions. It's a banned food additive in many countries, including US. And inhaling borax dust has a long list of health-related issues. — TildalWave ♦ 4 mins ago

had to comment

and I'd be really interested to know which dairy farmer's products to avoid

> Borax was added to the Substance of Very High Concern (SVHC) candidate list on 16 December 2010. The SVHC candidate list is part of the EU Regulations on the Registration, Evaluation, Authorisation and Restriction of Chemicals 2006 (REACH), and the addition was based on the revised classification of borax as toxic for reproduction category 1B under the CLP Regulations.

> Substances and mixtures imported into the EU which contain borax are now required to be labelled with the warnings "May damage fertility" and "May damage the unborn child".

this is now in someone's .... milk??

pardon my French but WTF?

kim holder

clearly a very confused person. and yet there is an interesting topic in there somewhere

TildalWave

what is the question?

kim holder

you're asking me? :]

TildalWave

23:49

sorry, I was sarcastic again

Hohmannfan

light elements like hydrogen, beryllium, lithium and boron are actually useful for neutron shielding

TildalWave

sure, we have that covered already in other threads

Hohmannfan

Can I use <> for radiation shielding? In general, yes

Can I use radium plates for radiation shielding? No

duzzy

Mark Kelly is going to be here next month giving a talk at the university, and Scott Kelly will also be there via video call. hmmm

Hohmannfan

Give borax to cow. -> Cow dies. -> C-14 content in cow gradually decreases. -> Less radiation in milk.

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