English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

Cerberus

00:04

@Vitaly Oh, wow.

And they're drilling into it!

Perhaps some anthropophage virus escapes...

RegDwight Ѭſ道

@Cerberus, check Kong chat #04

Racial slurs.

Cerberus

Ah fun!

@RegDwightѬſ道 Trying to get in, but chat won't load.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Looks like he stopped anyway.

Cerberus

Ah OK.

I see a grey area instead of chat.

Am I banned?

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Yeah it always looks like that in the last few days.

It does load eventually.

Cerberus

00:12

Weird!

Ah, I see it.

Vitaly

@Cer @Reg esk, sme, оз

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Оз?

Cerberus

Eng, Ned, Rus?

Vitaly

@Cerberus — Yes.

Cerberus

Hmm...

Vitaly

00:13

@RegDwightѬſ道 — What? :P

Cerberus

Eskimo, eskew...

RegDwight Ѭſ道

@Vitaly Is that the entire word?

Vitaly

@RegDwightѬſ道 — Ding! But you still have to figure out the other two words.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Eskimo, Smeskimo, Оз.

Vitaly

And no.

Cerberus

00:14

Haha no way.

Smeekbede, smederij, smeerolie, smeerlap...

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Smörebröd, Smörebröd, römpömpömpöm.

Cerberus

Smet, smeltoven, smerigheid...

Haha.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Smegma.

Cerberus

Eww.

I can't think of anything that starts with esk-.

It's probably some obscure word?

Vitaly

Esker

Een esker of smeltwaterrug is een heuvel in het landschap of onder de grond die is veroorzaakt door smeltwater onder een ijskap, zoals een gletsjer. Deze heuvel bestaat uit glaciofluviaal sediment (zand vermengd met grind en keien die klein genoeg waren om door het water te worden meegenomen) wat is achtergelaten in de bedding van de smeltwaterstroom. Eskers kunnen honderden kilometers lang zijn en tientallen meters hoog, volgen de richting van de ijslaag en hebben (dus) een slingerend verloop. Een esker is een voorbeeld van een fluvioglaciaal verschijnsel: een verschijnsel dat is ontstaa...

RegDwight Ѭſ道

00:16

Well I got the Russian word right, so my job here is done.

Cerberus

Ah...never heard of the English word.

The Dutch word makes sense, though I had never heard of it either.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Hahaha, verschijnsel.

You can't invent that shit.

MetaEd

Thank crank, I can finally vote again.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Vote early, vote often.

Cerberus

@RegDwightѬſ道 What the...

Is there no synonym for Phänomen in German?

RegDwight Ѭſ道

00:22

Fluvioglazialer Verscheißerl.

Cerberus

Or what is it.

Dutch has many Germanic words for scientific terms which are Latin/Greek in all other languages.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

German has Erscheinung just fine.

But Verscheißerl sounds way funnier.

Way funnier.

You should walk up to a German and tell him, Du bist mir ein Verscheißerl. If you don't do that you haven't lived.

Vitaly

@RegDwightѬſ道 — How would you render that in Russian?

RegDwight Ѭſ道

You wouldn't.

It's a neologism and an occasionalism.

Vitaly

Just make up a word.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

00:27

Засральчик?

Vitaly

Ehhh …

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Well you get what you ask for.

Cerberus

@RegDwightѬſ道 Ah OK.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

No asking for what you don't want to get in this chat.

Cerberus

I'm not making this up.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

00:29

You can't be stuck at that question as a Dutch now, canya?

Cerberus

I know!!

Double score.

This part is really weird.

I don't feel anything.

I want to put -10 on the left and +10 on the right; but I have no vertical preference.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Just click seven. No wait, eight!

Cerberus

Except perhaps that -10 is usually down on a thermometer.

@RegDwightѬſ道 No, I need to drag the circles to where I want them, and make them smaller or larger.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Seven.

Vitaly

fal, bra, пар

RegDwight Ѭſ道

00:34

параша

Cerberus

Hmm...

Braam, braafheid, brand, braspartij, brandnetel, branie, bralaap...

Vitaly

(Not sure if the Dutch word is a noun.)

Cerberus

Hmm...

RegDwight Ѭſ道

> Artydent (Phantom Commando) Level 104, Total points 499145 (Rank #31)

Cerberus

Falter, falsity, falcon...

Fallacy, falsetto...

Vitaly

00:37

6 letters, 5 letters, 3 letters

Cerberus

Hmm 5 letters...

Braam, brand, braak, braaf, braad...

Vitaly

@Cerberus One of those words is part of the answer.

Cerberus

Hmm...what is it again: blackberry, fire, ohh fallow.

Vitaly

Ding!

Cerberus

I suppose a fallow field is called a fallow as well?

Vitaly

00:41

Yeah.

Cerberus

I don't think braak is a noun, but I was warned.

See, this one was actually good, because I stood a chance!

This is more fun than with obscure words.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

I have no idea what any of the three words mean.

Cerberus

Untilled field.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

english.stackexchange.com/a/17398/300

Vitaly

Пар (сельское хозяйство)

Пар в земледелии — поле, оставляемое на одно лето не засеянным. Если в таком состоянии земля остаётся более одного года, то она уже носит название залежи. На этом основываются две исторические и до сих пор самые распространённые системы полеводства в России: залежная, или переложная, и паровая, или трёхпольная. Главная цель допущения в полях пара — возможность особо тщательно разработать землю под следующий сев. История Так понимали пар ещё римляне, что доказывают выражения, которые у них употреблялись для обозначения различных обработок пар Первое паханье, наш взмёт, они называли fri...

Cerberus

00:44

Probably ploughed first, so that the earth can get some air and become more fertile.

> Nar, Mee, Про — @Vit, @Reg

Eng, Deu, Рус

@RegDwightѬſ道 Haha!

So I'm not the only one who forgets things!

RegDwight Ѭſ道

I didn't say I didn't know the word. Only the meaning.

And the Russian word I never used that way.

Vitaly

@Cerberus something related to narrow?

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Only "под паром" etc.

@Cerberus Also, it's deleted.

You can't expect me to remember stuff I actively delete.

Cerberus

On the contrary! How often does that happen?

@Vitaly !

Vitaly

???

Cerberus

00:48

I'm guessing Про is very frequent in Russian?

Vitaly

@Cerberus it is

Cerberus

@Vitaly That means I'm not supposed to give hints, but yes!

RegDwight Ѭſ道

продавец прошлогодних продуктов

Vitaly

hummm…

просеки are usually narrow in Russian

but other than that, can't really think of anything

RegDwight Ѭſ道

прорубь

Cerberus

00:50

The word in English is not very common, but it would be the kind of word that you would know.

@RegDwightѬſ道 Nope.

Whatever that is, hehe.

I'm assuming Reg knows the English word too.

It is a synonym of a more common word.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Wak

Actually, Wikipedia is lying there.

Bijt, not wak.

Vitaly

is mee common in German?

Cerberus

I think not?

RegDwight Ѭſ道

In German?

Vitaly

I am stuck, I need hints from Reg

7 mins ago, by Cerberus

Eng, Deu, Рус

RegDwight Ѭſ道

00:52

Oh. Ah. Genghis Khan.

Cerberus

By the way, the English and Russian words don't have capitals or anything.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Well, Meer(es)-... gets you tons of stuff.

Cerberus

!

RegDwight Ѭſ道

But other than that, pretty much nothing.

Cerberus

You don't need anything else.

Vitaly

00:53

are those words exact synonyms?

RegDwight Ѭſ道

So it's related to water but not to прорубь that is usually narrow?

Cerberus

@Vitaly Very close in any case.

Vitaly

Related to water, huh.

narrowboat? (even though I can't think of a Russian word for it)

Cerberus

@RegDwightѬſ道 Not at all.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

@Vitaly Well Meer is sea.

Cerberus

00:54

@Vitaly Nope.

You're so close!

You're probably not thinking of the English word.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Meersalz.

проваренная соль

Cerberus

You already know narrow and Meer.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

nartriumchloride

Cerberus

The meaning of the word naturally follows from those two words.

Vitaly

… like a strait?

Cerberus

00:55

Yes!

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Meeresenge

Vitaly

Oh. Пролив.

Cerberus

@RegDwightѬſ道 Ding! Or Meerenge.

@Vitaly Ding!

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Meerenge, пролив

Vitaly

Nice.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

00:56

Well frigg, I typed that a year ago but my browser hung up.

I might as well go to bed.

We should start kicking people who haven't been active for X days.

Cerberus

So you know the English word?

> 2. spec. (Chiefly in pl.) a. A narrow part of a sound, strait, or river.
1633 T. James Voy. 106 We were in the narrow of the Straight. 1665 Lond. Gaz. No. 5/4 Three or four Privateers are crusing in the Narrow. 1702 Ibid. No. 3844/4 In the Narrow off of Winterton. 1743 Bulkeley & Cummins Voy. S. Seas 145 At Four this Morning weighed, and steered E.N.E. for the Narrows. 1840 Marryat Poor Jack li, We should have been taken possession of by a privateer in the very narrows. 1883 Stevenson Silverado Sq. 4 Through the narrows the tide bubbles, muddy like a river.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Not that it will help us. So actually, we should start threatening to kick rather than actually kicking.

Vitaly

@Cerberus — I wasn't thinking of it, but yes.

Cerberus

@Vitaly OK I thought you did.

@RegDwightѬſ道 Oh! Really?

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Yeah really.

Cerberus

00:59

Well, you guessed it. Congrats.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Anyway. I spent my last 20 on two losses. So muh and good night.

Over and out!

Vitaly

Muh on ya too. Night!

Cerberus

Night!

Vitaly

@Cerberus cuesta

Cerberus

@Vitaly Huh, no idea. It sounds like Spanish for quest, search?

Vitaly

01:04

@Cerberus en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cuesta ←

Cerberus

Hmm looks nice.

But not familiar. The word, that is.

@Vit Have you taken these tests yet?

Vitaly

no

Cerberus

DO you intend to?

Vitaly

1 min ago, by Vitaly

no

Cerberus

Why not?

You already know?

Too boring?

Vitaly

01:12

“the peace and silence to complete the test”
“make yourself comfortable”
“should not interrupt”

Cerberus

I interrupted it all the time.

I don't need to be concentrated at all to know my colours.

Vitaly

Well, you shouldn't have!

Cerberus

But I guess if you're relatively new to thinking about this, you might need to be very focused.

At the end of the test they explain that "synesthetes might score lower if they are too distracted".

Those researchers are rather forward.

MetaEd

05:09

@Cerberus Good out, eh? This test pegs my b—ls—t meter.

Cerberus

@MetaEd How do you mean?

The test seems all right?

MetaEd

If you get enough of a score, you're a synesthete. If you don't, you're probably still a synesthete, just too distracted. Who are these "researchers" and do they have any credentials?

Cerberus

@MetaEd They're not saying that: they're just saying that one should be careful in drawing conclusions from the test, because the results can be easily skewed.

Have you done the test?

MetaEd

I started it, but aborted after answering maybe 15 questions.

Cerberus

Understandable.

So what did you base your choices of colours on?

When you had to pick a colour for a letter or number or day.

MetaEd

05:20

I tried to follow directions – just pick, don't think much about it.

You know I don't think I answered even 15 questions.

I don't see a thing on the site about test methodology or interpretation.

Rigor! I demand rigor!

The weekday test displays an initial color ... Monday is blue for example. That's leading the subject.

This test cannot, cannot have been designed by a competent scientist. It's just random Internet cuteness.

Cerberus

@MetaEd Hear, hear!

@MetaEd I've also done a test designed by researchers at MIT, and it is very similar.

@MetaEd When was Monday blue? Was that an example question before the actual test?

Hmm wait it wasn't MIT, that was another site.

synesthete.org/index.php

And this scientific article from their site that explains their methodology:

synesthete.org/files/EaglemanetalSynesthesiaBattery2006.pdf

If you browse the PDF, look at the pictures and read the captions. Those clarify their methods.

MetaEd

Okay, I have now completed the entire weekday test.

Cerberus

Cool!

Screenshot?

MetaEd

Totally bogus results.

Cerberus

Really? How so?

The Battery test, not the other one?

MetaEd

05:33

Totally confounding, inconsistent conclusions, yet the test still concludes I am a possible synesthete.

Cerberus

Oh? What's your score?

MetaEd

85%.

Well into the green.

Cerberus

Oh, that is the first test.

MetaEd

Yes.

It was called weekdays, as I recall

Cerberus

Well, if you're no synesthete, that more or less invalidates the whole test!

MetaEd

05:34

lots of associations with the days of the week.

Right. But that makes my test result a false positive.

A rather blatant, huge, false positive, too.

Cerberus

Indeed.

MetaEd

And here's what's funny: to compare the individual conclusions.

positive indicator for synaesthesia. clear negative indicator for synaesthesia. You didn't answer the questions in a typical way for a synaesthete. typical for synaesthetes. you could might have this type of synaesthesia.

Cerberus

Huh?

MetaEd

In other words the subsections plainly contradicted one another. But the overall? Just added up the results into a number and concluded: Your results indicate that you could be a synaesthete

Those were the individual test results.

They flatly contradict. And now we get to my criticism of the test design.

Cerberus

Hehe.

I am convinced already.

But let's hear it.

MetaEd

05:38

Associations of male or female with names of the days of the week are supposed to be indicative of synesthesia?

Really? REALLY?

Not, say, indicative of A BASIC EDUCATION INTO THE HISTORY OF THE NAMES OF THE DAYS OF THE WEEK?

I consistently identified Thor's day as male? So I'm a synasthete?

Cerberus

@MetaEd I don't have any male/female associations. I just picked the Germanix gods the days were named after.

Jinx!

MetaEd

Freya's day is female? Wow!

I am a bloody synesthete!

Cerberus

I totally agree.

MetaEd

I'm with you.

My daughter's favorite day of the week is Friday. Only one that's feminine.

Cerberus

Besides, the number of days in a week is quite easy to remember.

MetaEd

05:39

She's 14 and she knew this stuff when she was eight.

Cerberus

In the other test, they asked the control group to do their best to get a score as high as possible with memorization techniques and such.

MetaEd

I mean really. She said at age eight she believed in two gods: Jesus and Freya.

Cerberus

Haha aww.

MetaEd

I loved her for that.

Cerberus

Sounds very open minded at least.

MetaEd

05:40

This is, I don't know, cargo cult science or something. Not science.

Cerberus

So perhaps you should try the other test too.

If you can pass it as easily, I will send them an e-mail.

MetaEd

So I should try to pass the other test?

Be the synesthete?

What's the name of the test.

Cerberus

If you're in the mood, I would be very interested to see if you can.

synesthete.org/index.php

MetaEd

Yes

Cerberus

Wait, let me see which part you should pick.

MetaEd

05:42

There are menus and so on, several tests to choose from though.

Numbers, months, the synesthesie-batterie or some such. There's a lot of inadvertent German.

Cerberus

OK try the numbers.

Because the letters might be a bit long.

I can't get that menu to appear again.

And read the captions of the three figures in this PDF afterwards to judge their methodology. synesthete.org/files/EaglemanetalSynesthesiaBattery2006.pdf

MetaEd

Good thing English is my maternal language.

Cerberus

This test was designed by researchers from American universities.

Mahnax

Hello.

Cerberus

Hi!

Ed is trying to prove that synesthesia tests are unreliable.

Mahnax

05:48

I should be receiving Fanatic any second now.

Cerberus

Is that a badge?

A card?

Mahnax

Badge. My first gold.

Cerberus

Gold?

Oh, a Kongregate badge, not Tyrant?

Mahnax

Ayup.

No, no! An EL&U badge.

Cerberus

Oh!

I see!

Mahnax

05:50

Yeah! Visiting 100 days in a row.

Cerberus

Ah that one!

Vitaly

Haha.

Cerberus

Do I have that one?

Mahnax

Cerberus

Hmm I have no gold badges.

Congratulations!!

Mahnax

05:50

Aww.

And thanks!

Cerberus

But I've been here for 365+ days!

Not consecutive, of course.

Mahnax

Very nice.

Cerberus

And hi Vit!

Mahnax

I feel like you should have a gold badge.

Vitaly

Ohai.

Cerberus

05:51

@Vit: Ed is trying to prove that this scientific synesthesia test can be cheated on.

Vitaly

@Cerberus — Isn't he right?

Cerberus

He already proved the first test unreliable, but that one wasn't composed by scientists.

@Vitaly We'll see.

synesthete.org/index.php

This test.

He is taking the numbers part, I think.

Mahnax

Hmm.

Still no Fanatic.

Cerberus

Aww.

Change of policy?

Mahnax

Nope.

The badge checking engine is updated once an hour, or maybe every 30 min or so.

MetaEd

05:58

I'm getting better.

Mahnax

I probably visited right after it ran.

MetaEd

99% on the number test. I am a f——g synaesthete.

Except I'm not.

Cerberus

@MetaEd Hmm can I see your results?

MetaEd

How would I share them?

Cerberus

Screenshot?

Transcript for

English Language & Usage: Multi-Layer…