English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room - 2014-02-27 (page 3 of 4)

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11:00 AM

@MattЭллен what is it?

Matt Эллен

it's a rising draft

you speak English

901345 is not a native speaker

I was trying to determine what they don't understand

It is what it is.

!!Youtube what is it red hot chilli peppers

!!Youtube what is it

11:22 AM

!!Youtube single "what is it" by red hot chilli peppers

Yes I know

So it means, he was beating his wings against the wind?

Matt Эллен

yes

but a particular type of wind

i see.

If a bird strikes the ocean, it doesn't actually strike it but due to the wind the sea makes waves?

Matt Эллен

I think a synonym for "rising draft" would be thermal

11:32 AM

Is that what it means?

Matt Эллен

It's plain English, as far as I can see. There is no hidden meaning. What is the part you're not sure about?

Because it is this

users.wfu.edu/moran/zhexuejialu/Zhuang_Zi_chap_1.html

Matt Эллен

sorry, I've misunderstood your question.

what are you asking?

I'm not going to read all that.

I don't understand the nuance of this "strike" in the last sentence.

Matt Эллен

oK

11:43 AM

Im sorry.

Matt Эллен

no, that's fine. context is good

I'm not exactly sure what strikes means there

it could mean strikes out which means travels

but it could also mean is the cause of storms

in some sort of metaphorical use

if a bird, thousands of miles in length, beats its wings, then it's likely to cause a storm

it could be something else

12:01 PM

I see.

Thank you for your answer.

1 hour later…

1:23 PM

!!wiki butterfly effect

Butterfly effect

In chaos theory, the butterfly effect is the sensitive dependency on initial conditions in which a small change at one place in a deterministic nonlinear system can result in large differences in a later state. The name of the effect, coined by Edward Lorenz, is derived from the theoretical example of a hurricane's formation being contingent on whether or not a distant butterfly had flapped its wings several weeks earlier. Although the butterfly effect may appear to be an esoteric and unlikely behavior, it is exhibited by very simple systems. For example, a ball placed at the crest of a...

!!wiki effect butterfly

@Mitch The Gods of Wikipedia did not bless us

dammit

Matt Эллен

!!mitch buttery fleffect

1:26 PM

@MattЭллен That didn't make much sense. Use the !!/help command to learn more.

2 hours later…

3:21 PM

Hello, can anyone please tell which of the two sentences is correct?

> Despite raining heavily, the mourners turned out in large numbers.
>
> Despite raining heavily, the mourners turned out in large numbers.

Matt Эллен

They're both correct. In the first the dummy it is elided, which makes the sentence read like a newspaper headline.

well, now you've edited they're both the same

Oh good, because I couldn't see how they were different.

Morning.

Matt Эллен

Hello

@MattЭллен Oops, sorry

> Despite raining heavily, the mourners turned out in large numbers.
>
> Despite **it** raining heavily, the mourners turned out in large numbers.

Matt Эллен

no worries :D

3:27 PM

The second one is clear. The first sounds like the mourners are raining heavily.

Matt Эллен

lol, so it does

I feel that it is important because otherwise, grammatically it'd mean that the mourners are raining or something like that.

Despite heavy rain, the mourners turned out in large numbers.

@KitFox My thoughts, exactly

Matt Эллен

however, since mourners don't rain, noöne would interpret it that way

3:27 PM

@its_me Yes, it has a name, but I can't remember it.

Matt Эллен

@KitFox dangling participle

Thank you.

Now put that thing away before I get in trouble.

Oh, meeting. later.

Matt Эллен

:D

CU

Nice participle.

@MattЭллен So in the sentence, "raining" is called a dangling participle?

Matt Эллен

3:29 PM

yes

great, thank you very much!

Matt Эллен

you're welcome!

Wow, many new faces in this chat today, but mostly zombies.

Matt Эллен

the zombies must be attracted to all the intelligence in the room

@MattЭллен I miss your face, you should change your avatar to the face one, lol.

Matt Эллен

3:38 PM

I prefer this one, the other is just a disguise so that humans find it easier to deal with me

Ah, I see your true colours.

Matt Эллен

Green

with a splash of red

I am trying not to take afternoon naps and to sleep 8 hours each day.

I also hope I can resolve certain specific issues soon.

I wish to remark again that it is very weird for Oxford to omit phonetics for simple words in some of its dictionaries.

I would get the Concise Oxford Dictionary if it contained phonetics for all words.

Matt Эллен

oxforddictionaries.com seems to have IPA for short words

or close to IPA, whatever it is they use

Yes, it does.

Wow, my total rep is a palindrome, 3883.

Matt Эллен

3:46 PM

and you can make 88 by merging together four threes

Wow, this is a sign...

Hi.

Matt Эллен

good meeting?

Well, short. So yes.

And I got the information I need.

Matt Эллен

the perfect meeting!

3:55 PM

Yes.

I just answered another lhf, lol.

Matt Эллен

you answered a dupe

I don't understand Peter Shor's comment there, do you?

Matt Эллен

he says that if the h comes after a vowel then he pronounces it

Yes, I don't get that, lol.

Matt Эллен

3:58 PM

and if the h comes after a consonant he doesn't pronounce it

My answer is incorrect?

Matt Эллен

no, he's just saying that your rules are confounded by his accent

Ah, then it is a weird accent to me.

Matt Эллен

Apparently, John Lawler swings both ways

Do you understand this joke? Bidirectional, like me in undergrad!

Matt Эллен

4:06 PM

no

Ah, people experiment with their sexuality in undergrad, and bidirectional means bisexual, lol.

Matt Эллен

ah. I thought that might be it, but that made it not a very good joke

Well, I learned it in the math room.

Matt Эллен

also in undergrad?

well, I say "not very good", maybe it's hilarious if you know the person telling it.

I intend to aim for 2k on ELU, and then retire, so I've got about 500 to go.

With the infiltration of American TV, everyone here is starting to call brinjals eggplants.

However, they have not started calling ladies' fingers okra yet.

Matt Эллен

4:14 PM

you should start calling them aubergines

My computer froze, so I used some magic.

In Linux, by typing Alt+Print Screen+reisub, one can safely reboot.

Matt Эллен

reisub?

Yes, six commands in succession.

Matt Эллен

oh!

I learnt this recently, lol.

It is safer than pressing the restart button.

Matt Эллен

4:20 PM

me too

You can google it for more info.

I have had many freezes since I started using GNOME shell.

The transition from GNOME 2 to 3 is a big mistake IMAO.

Answered another lhf, lol.

Plain old xterm is good enough for me.

4:36 PM

Wow, I am very lucky today.

Both lhf answers got upvoted soon after posting.

I find that many books are more expensive on amazon.co.uk than amazon.com, without adding shipping.

Of course, they are cheapest on amazon.in, but that does not ship to other places.

5:22 PM

@JasperLoy Don;t worry, at least someone in the Netherlands is calling those things brinjal more and more often, and I called okra ladies' fingers as well :)

@oerkelens Really? Hmm, I thought brinjal was only used in Asia, lol.

Never heard of the word.

@oerkelens Which province do you represent?

It is as far as I know, but since a friend introduced me to the Indian kitchen, I took a lot of her vocabulary

Ah, I see.

@Cerberus: I represent no province :) I have lived in 4 Dutch ones, two Belgian ones, a Greek and a Canadian one :P

5:24 PM

Nice.

In which one did you grow up?

At least my wife is getting used to brinjal, jeera, etc.

I have been in Singapore almost my whole life, lol.

I have only lived outside of Noord-Holland for a year.

I was born in Noord-Holland (geboren Zaankanter, getogen in Hilversum), but when i was 9 I moved to Belgium, to the village of Reet. (Antwerp)

Really!

5:25 PM

Reet is next to Kontich and Aartselaar

I went to the Gemeentelijk Gymnasium in Hilversum.

I am not joking

Haha, lovely.

Minckelerschool

Over het spoor West

The bad area of Hilversum :P

Haha.

So that is a high school?

5:26 PM

Nopes. As I said, I was 9 when I left there :)

To be honest, I never knew Hilversum well, my parents live in Naarden.

Ah OK, I misread.

I never did either.

Reet is pretty hilarious.

I thought most of it was on "our"side of the railroad

Do the Belgians use that word?

5:27 PM

Only realized later the center was on the other side :P

Haha.

I thought the bad part was north of the railroad?

They do, but only in the older meaning of "crack"

Do the Dutch call the Netherlands Holland as well?

Ah!

So that's what it means.

Yes, quite some Dutch call it Holland

5:28 PM

@JasperLoy Yes, but mainly when comparing the country with other countries.

@Cerberus, that explains a lot, right?

Not when just talking about things that happen in the country.

Ah, I found out from Wiki that Holland is only a province there.

@oerkelens Yes, the etymology.

@Cerberus, and when we sing "Hup, Holland, Hup"

5:29 PM

@JasperLoy A former province, but by far the most powerful one from the 16th century onwards. Is is now split in two.

@oerkelens International competition.

@JasperLoy Holland is two provinces, though one could historically argue it should be 4, plus a part of Belgium and a small part of France

@Cerberus Powerful? In what sense?

@JasperLoy Large population, most wealthy and influential politically.

Powerful in the sense that in the 17th century it became a colonial nation defying the English, the French, the Spanish and the Portuguese :)

Wow, anyway Netherlands seem a nice place, I don't mind being born there next life, lol.

5:31 PM

Heh.

It's kind of nice. But it has its faults.

Every place does. Most problems are small compared to many other countries though :)

We call our main problem Amsterdam :P

Hey!

shakes fist

@cerberus Now that we are past 30, we should aim to get married by 40, lol.

:P

@oerkelens Why are we a problem? And where do you live?

5:34 PM

Don't hurry to get married :)

@JasperLoy Or maybe we could not care about that stuff.

@oerkelens I'm not!

I live in Pijnacker now

Before that, 9 years in Rotterdam >:)

You could have guessed:P

brb after dinner :)

@oerkelens Ahh now it all makes sense.

Bye!

Careful now. I see the rule of trolls has resurfaced.

I don't know what you mean by resurfaced.

5:46 PM

Haha, I just gave an answer I thought was correct from google, turns out I was tricked.

Anyway, I have deleted it, lol.

@KitFox Maybe he means it has reappeared on the star wall.

Yes, I believe he does. Except it has always been there and will always be there.

My screen is too small to see it anyways.

How many can you see?

I see up to "That reminds me of the ...".

Now I see "First rule of ..."!

6:03 PM

@KitFox Wow, how did you do that? Amazing...

What? I didn't do anything.

I thought you changed the order of the messages on the wall.

It must be some kind of programming trick.

/me just realizes what the star wall is

The star wall is the wall of stars, lol.

It's the part of the screen I try to avoid looking at

I am aware of rule 34 of the internet

But Maggie Thatcher porn is just too much :(

6:08 PM

I don't know who Maggie is, I should look it up.

Maggie Thatcher was the prime minister GB in the 80

Margaret Thatcher, former British PM.

Bigger balls than any man in the position, one could say

Oh, Margaret!

I still think her best line was when she made a very short comeback. The movie "The mummy returns" was just out in the cinama's

And she dryly remarked that she noticed people had anticipated her comeback to politics

6:12 PM

Haha.

Yeah she was not humourless.

True. I have to admit that even the way she handled the Falkland situation had a touch of humour in it

I saw a very beautiful girl called Margerie at my friend's wedding. But she is too young, lol.

:)

Born too soon, man

I will try to stick to plus minus 10 years, lol.

Even then... I felt I was born ten years too soon, and in the wrong place at some point :)

(Well, still a bit sometimes)

6:21 PM

I don't like the half your age plus seven rule.

By the time your 60 it doesn; thold anymore I think

And when you're under 10 it doesnt work well either :P

I cannot imagine a 60 year old with a 37 year old.

There are cases of a 60+ with 20-somes :)

Mostly for the money I think.

Calculating... na, I kept to it nicely

Sure, most attractive feature in men: money

6:26 PM

Or power.

So, this leads me to the following question.

Is it OK to marry someone for the money? If not, why is it OK then to marry someone for their looks, or their personality?

This is a very deep question...

Well, depends on your definition of OK...

Hmm, a very deep answer...

Honestly, if you believe that the money will mak eyou happy, go for it

I think it definitely beats marrying someone because you your family says you should

Plenty of people marry for money.

6:30 PM

Oh? Hmm, I don't know about that.

The rule is half your age plus seven.

By the way.

That's the lower limit.

Yes, we just mentioned it above.

I learned it from you I think.

Oh.

Well.

I wasn't paying attention obviously.

I think I have a better rule. (1) Be at least 18. (2) Plus minus 10 years.

So...dating an 8-year-old is OK in your book? Icky.

6:34 PM

@KitFox No, it fails the (1).

I mean, the rule has to apply to both parties.

Oh, you mean the other person. I thought you were talking about you.

@KitFox But it doesn't really work when you're 17...

You should be allowed to date a 16yo when you're 17 yourself, right?

Why do you say that?

Yes.

What's half of 17?

It's when you get below 14 that it doesn't work.

But you shouldn't be dating at that age anyway.

Oh, a 14 and a 14 together.

The rule works, except when you are under 14. Then it gets weird.

aaah

I'm too slow

But as I mentioned, the rule doesn't really stick anymore when you ar e60

6:38 PM

When you are 60, just prepare for the coffin, lol.

Tell that to Hugh Heffner

:P

I guess at some point the minimum age becomes inversely proportional to the size of your wallet

I have made plans for myself to live up to 100.

So you will spend 40 years preparing for the coffin?

If only everyone dies at 100, that would make planning easier.

@KitFox Ohh I can't even do basic division. I thought half of 17 was 10.

I think when kids "date" below 14, they don't really know what they're saying.

6:41 PM

It is, for very large values of 17

They just hang out and play "dating", just like they play "war" or "tea party".

My first crush was when I was 5.

So I think even a 5 year old knows what dating is, lol.

I was on my second marriage when i was 5

It all went downhill from there

I still remember her name.

:)

I remember the second one's name, but the first one, no

6:43 PM

Yeah it's hard to call back memories when one's early childhood.

yup

Have you ever hated someone after falling in love with them? I have.

no, I haven't

I have helped someone to marry someone else while I was in love with them...

The girl was very nasty when she rejected me, lol.

So I grew to hate her.

I guess I did not know her well enough.

Hate is selfdestructive

6:45 PM

Also, when I was 23, I had a crush on someone who was 13, but luckily nothing happened.

well, there you go with you +/- 10

Well, I just added "at least 18".

@oerkelens Ouch, that sucks!

Then again, I had the same, only it happened when we were both 15 years older

well, it sucks

But we loved each other

But it simply couldn;t be

so I did the next best thing

helped her to find the right guy

You said you are married? What were your ages when you got married?

6:47 PM

My wife and I are less than a year apart. We got engaged at 22, married at 29

Wow, very nice.

@oerkelens Why not?

That is the main reason why things could not go through with the other girl

Well, I was married, living in the Netherlands

She was single, but living in India

A lot of reasons all together

but I did go to her wedding last December

I also went to the wedding of my high school crush.

It hurts, but if you love someone, you want to see them happy

6:50 PM

@oerkelens Ohh you were already married.

Did your wife know?

I visited her weding with my wife

well, not initially, she didn;t

Well, I emailed my high school crush a few months ago, saying that I would date her if she was not married.

And by the time of the wedding?

This reminds me of the book I am reading, Sex At Dawn

about the mating arrangements of ancient humans

@JasperLoy Hah, tough luck.

6:51 PM

Oh, yes, by the time of the wedding she knew

she knew almost a year before that

Did you live in India?

@MετάEd Interesting title.

No

Met her when she came to the Netherlands as a programmer

Met her again when I went to India to get MS certification

For the rest, Skype

Was she of Indian race?

Yes

6:52 PM

I am just wondering about interracial marriages.

It seems increasingly common here.

One of the problems was of course she wasn;t supposed to marry a non-Hindu

But she was wlling to stand up to her parents for me

Ah, I did not know Hindus were that strict.

@oerkelens Ah, understand.

@oerkelens You even talked about marriage with here?

I have met some very pretty Indian girls though, but I don't think I would ever marry one.

Oh, in the cities "love-marriages"are becoming more common

But in rural area's it;s all arranged

Yes, I talked about that

6:54 PM

Parents like to monitor the transmission of their genes. Not to mention the people they will have to sit next to at Christmas dinners for all eternity.

So you were seriously considering leaving your wife?

And if they can get some extra status by trading their daughter to a nice party, they won;t say no

yes i was

Oh, dear.

yup

Complicated situation.

But everything is sorted out now I guess.

6:55 PM

@JasperLoy Yes, it's a nice pun.

It's sorted out, has been for a year now

Lucky you.

Good, good.

But that doesn't mean it doesn't hurt sometimes :)

I can't imagine truly falling in love with someone who was so different from me, in age or culture.

I'm sure it does!

6:56 PM

The author of Sex At Dawn has a TED talk about the book. It's lovely.

I don't like the idea of Muslims marrying 4 wives.

I couldn't imagine falling in love the way id did. With anyone :)

That alone is enough to make me dismiss the religion.

But it's OK as long as they're pagans?

@oerkelens Haha fair enough.

I just hope that the Hindu religion is right about reincarnation and karma

6:57 PM

Well...

I currently believe in rebirth.

I am more or less a Buddhist I guess.

Then I may get to be with her in the future :)

OMG...

Patience :)

I think about my future life too.

6:58 PM

I have to say, I learned a lot about it the last years :)

Can an atheist have good karma?

Apparently, reincarnation is the most popular religious belief in this chat room.

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