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Frank Hubeny
Frank Hubeny
00:34
@Chelonian I was thinking this afternoon what kind of assumption the OP intended to make with "If God does not exist". I don't think it was a premise, because he likely does not agree with it. Rather it was an hypothesis that he introduced expecting a contradiction to be derived from it.
That is perhaps where we see something different in what the OP wrote. You view it as a premise that everyone is supposed to accept. I see it as an hypothesis presented in order to be refuted with an indirect proof.
I agree that Plantinga talks about cognitive faculties. They are too reliable for the hypothesis of naturalism + evolution to be reasonable. I think one could do the same with any ability we have. Those abilities would involve cognitive faculties to some degree.
 
2 hours later…
Chelonian
Chelonian
02:48
@FrankHubeny Than you for the explanation; I see how you interpreted now. Something like the OP is saying, "Can you give me support for my position, which is that there can be no benevolence without God?". Is that right?
If so, I'm not sure I agree with that degree of interpretation on SE.Philosophy questions. His first sentence and last are direct questions asking for alternative explanations. Even if the OP doesn't think there can be any, isn't it appropriate to provide them when they do, in fact, exist?
 
2 hours later…
Frank Hubeny
Frank Hubeny
05:07
@Chelonian Yes, that's how I read the question. I don't think atheism alone can lead to the contradiction he was looking for. Something more is needed. If it could then flipping over to any sort of theism should resolve the issue. Even Plantinga doesn't try to find a contradiction, but only a defeater, a suggestion that something is wrong, with believing in naturalism.
 
9 hours later…
Chelonian
Chelonian
14:36
@FrankHubeny OK, thanks for the discussion.

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