Sustainable Living

Chad

17:18

My understanding of this SE is that is is questions specifically about Sustainability specifically applying sustainability.

rather than trivia questions about environmentalism.

And I think you are going to drive away quite a few people if we open up the defintion of sustainablity to include any environmentalism and climate change questions

There are these on A51 now:

77

Climate Change

Proposed Q&A site for climatologists, meteorologists, statisticians, and other scientists including students that study the science of climate change or work on atmospheric and oceanic global climate models.

Currently in definition.

84

Geoscience

Proposed Q&A site for those interested in the geology, meteorology, oceanography, and environmental sciences.

Currently in definition.

And at one time there was an environmentalism proposal but it seems to be gone now

EnergyNumbers

@Chad Hi Chad, thanks for coming over. Can we start with an idea of what you consider sustainability to be: of the questions the site has had to date, which are good examples for you?

Chad

There are quite a few of them

most of them that have to do with applying sustianaiblity.

EnergyNumbers

@Chad great - let's start with 2 or 3 then

Chad

23

Q: Producing my own energy options in urban area with windows but no roof access?

I'm wanting to produce my own energy, but I live in a condo with no access to the roof. I'd like to produce electricity, so maybe turning that energy into electricity safely. I have windows that have access to some sunlight depending on the angle of the sun. What are the best ways to produce my o...

12

Q: What is an easy way to cool off during the summer without electricity?

What are some easy ways to stay cool during the day without using electricity?

electricity thermal-regulation cooling

EnergyNumbers

@Chad OK, that's helpful, thanks. Would I be right in thinking that sustainability is very closely wedded to self sufficiency, for you? (just a guess based on 2 data points, so I could be way off course here - please do correct me if so)

Chad

17:31

no

I get that there are places where environmentalism and sustainability merge

EnergyNumbers

@Chad OK, so is it an issue of it only being on-topic for you if it's directly about what someone does in their own home / life?

Chad

I think that those questions are squarely on topic

EnergyNumbers

@Chad if I didn't have plastic recycling facilities, I'd consider plastic derived from fossil-fuels to be unsustainable - that's why I'd consider it on-topic. As to the toxic chemical side, I think this qustion covers it really well:

Chad

What are some common personal care products I can use that minimize toxic chemicals and plastic (or all) packaging? - That does not mean sustainable

4

Q: Is my car more sustainable with or without an EGR?

I drive a 2003 Volkswagen Jetta with a 1.9 liter turbo-diesel engine. I often get well over 50mpg on the high way, and I love the fact that I have such a fuel-efficient car that is also fun to drive. A few months ago, my check-engine light came on, and my local mechanic told me the EGR was bad....

vehicle fuel-efficiency

I think that is on topic... (not necessarily a great question though)

EnergyNumbers

0

Q: How are pollution and sustainability related?

In discussing "green" policies, the words "sustainability" and "pollution" are occasionally mixed together, as if they were antonyms. My gut feeling is that something that is polluting is by definition not sustainable, but I don't have a very clear view over the definitions of the two terms. Th...

pollution

Chad

17:40

@EnergyNumbers The subject question is on topic... the actual text of the question is terrible

EnergyNumbers

@Chad OK, let's look at that EGR question. With or without EGR the car uses fossil diesel, which is unsustainable. Can I take it that we agree on that?

Chad

Yes if you look at my answer i go further than that...

EnergyNumbers

@Chad ok, so it's an on-topic question, if not a meaningful one (i.e. it is based on a false premise). In highlighting the pollution/sustainability question, I was thinking of the answers; and in particular, the source/sinks issue. That would seem very relevant to the questions re toxins, pollutants, plastics etc

@Chad Are there any questions on the site at the moment that you consider to be on-topic, but which are not about the things people do in their own homes / lives?

Chad

2

Q: Is gasoline or Diesel refining less sustainable, per energy output?

Inspired by my own answer here, I'm wondering what the actual numbers are regarding gasoline and Diesel fuel refining. I have read (don't remember where) that refining of Diesel fuel is less environmentally damaging than that of gasoline. But is this actually true? And for the sake of this que...

energy ecological-footprint fuel

is probably a perfect example... despite the fact that the answer is no

EnergyNumbers

@Chad ok, so that's about sustainability at an industrial or process level. As is my question on Iceland's decarbonisation. So what for you are the elements of the gasoline / diesel question that make it on-topic, that are absent from the Iceland question?

Chad

17:55

My problem with this question is more that it is bacically a trivia question. But even so it is more about environmentalism and climate change than sustainability.

EnergyNumbers

@Chad I don't know what you mean by "environmentalism", so let's leave that. Yes, it's predominantly about climate change (and also about reducing fossil fuel consumption). Climate change would seem to me to be the biggest sustainability question facing humanity. So a question on measures to reduce catastrophic climate change would seem to me to be a question about sustainability:

that is to say, it can be about both climate change and sustainability, just as a question can be both about transport and sustainability (your examples)

Chad

And that i guess is our biggest disagreement.

EnergyNumbers

@Chad ok - but which specific element is the disagreement at? Which words of mine in particular that I just wrote?

Chad

Climate change is its own topic

And yes a question that is about BOTH sustainability and climate change would be on topic

EnergyNumbers

@Chad Yes, I agree with that.

@Chad and that

Chad

18:01

But if it is just about Climate change I do not think that it is on topic for sustainability

EnergyNumbers

@Chad That's the bit I don't yet understand: how can reducing the impact of climate change not be about sustainability? What makes the difference, for you?

Chad

Even though I agree that most Climate Change solutions are going to be tangental to Sustainability.

It could also be that a solution for climate change is an unsustainable solution

EnergyNumbers

@Chad Yes, that's true: tackling climate change is necessary, but not sufficient for sustainability

Is that what makes it off-topic for you? That climate change is only a subset of unsustainability, so tackling climate change intersects with sustainability, but is neither a superset nor a subset of it?

Chad

@EnergyNumbers Yes

And honestly I have less of an issue with questions that are asking for applied solutions that the poster can take, or even suggest at a city council, than those asking macroeconomic questions. I think that is where the off topic comes into play.

EnergyNumbers

@Chad ah, thanks, that's really helpful. Now I'm starting to understand. Sorry for being so slow. I think I see why the questions you cited are on-topic for you now, because they ask directly and explicitly about sustainability per se, rather than a particular component of it.

@Chad ok, but we agree that there is a macroeconomic angle to sustainability, don't we?

Chad

18:13

But the question I am asking on meta is does the macroeconomic belong here. I think all of those questions are more macroeconomic questions

EnergyNumbers

@Chad Just to check- by macroeconomic, do you mean macro / global? (the Iceland question isn't an economic question per se I think, though one could draw economic aspects of it out - something I haven't yet done)

Chad

@EnergyNumbers The iceland question would be better I think if you asked what has been done to decarbonize. That is asking for practical information instead of a statistic.

EnergyNumbers

(I do miss economics.SE though - you were a contributor too, weren't you?)

Chad

@EnergyNumbers Yes and though we are at opposite sides on most economic questions I think we did well keeping it civil

And maybe as I reread that question you are asking for what they have done and I am reading it wrong.

Chad

18:43

But then again it looks like someone else read it the same way I did... looking for a statistic

EnergyNumbers

@Chad Can I be very cheeky and do a bit of self-promotion of some economics I wrote in 2011 - I'd be fascinated to get your thoughts on it:

energynumbers.info/why-the-green-economy

@Chad Maybe I should clarify the wording: I was after the statistic and what they had done to achieve it - and what they planned for the remaining decarbonisation

Chad

@EnergyNumbers I would say it is a macro economic question because a statistic like that is only going to be useful when you compare it to other countries so it would be global.

EnergyNumbers

@Chad I had Iceland in mind as a pioneer - so it's the "how", as well as the "how much", that's interesting.

Chad

@EnergyNumbers And I got that out of a rereading several times. But my initial pass thought you were just asking for a statistic

@EnergyNumbers I am surprised to see that we agree on everything except for the climate change stuff at this level.

EnergyNumbers

@Chad Glad we agree on lots of it. So which bit in particular do we diverge on?

Chad

18:57

I am very skeptical on climate science. I think it was sold to the left as the only problem that needs solved and we can solve it by making a few people that set up the carbon trading very rich..

But the reality is we are poisoning the entire planet... we are already seeing real problems from it. Rising sea water is going to do little if we can not breathe, farm, or fish because we have polluted it with drugs and other chemicals.

EnergyNumbers

19:19

@Chad Ah, I see. ok. Anyway, I'll get round to updating my Iceland question in the next day or so, and try and add something to your meta question, based on what we've discussed here. Dinner time for me now (GMT timezone). Thanks for the chat, and bye for now.

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