English Language Learners

Damkerng T.

04:40

10

Not every word in English that ends in -s is plural. Consider: gas bus canvas news atlas The why is probably because the word lens was taken from the Latin word lens, which is also singular. See Online Etymology. The Oxford English Dictionary says the same.

I thought we wouldn't do etymology on ELL!

Crazy Ninja

05:04

Good Morning ! @da

@DamkerngT.

Damkerng T.

Morning!

Crazy Ninja

Small clarification on a sentence

@DamkerngT. "It was really a nice movie. I would rather say, It was stunning!" instead of 'nice movie' what would be a proper phase here?

Damkerng T.

A nice movie is fine.

Crazy Ninja

is that sentence, a good one? i mean, it doesn't stands as an attractive

Damkerng T.

Hmm... what is your intended message?

Crazy Ninja

05:09

I watched a nice movie. So i wanted to tell my friend also to watch it

@AmilaPasan hey buddy! good to see you!

Damkerng T.

You can say what you've just said to me.

Amila Pasan

hello guys... Am I permitted to chat here?

Damkerng T.

Of course! :-)

Crazy Ninja

@AmilaPasan patta rasnei needa machn?

Amila Pasan

kauda bn umba?

Crazy Ninja

05:10

kind of surprise :P

@AmilaPasan ado, first time i met a sri lankan, machn here... Where are you from ?

Damkerng T.

Though for a long-term learning goal, I'd like to recommend trying the other chat room: chat.stackexchange.com/rooms/22937/the-english-learning-cabin

Amila Pasan

I'm from Katukurunda... You?

Crazy Ninja

@DamkerngT. I'd rather accept that sentence too. But i wanted to know is there any mistakes on that sentence

Amila Pasan

@CrazyNinja

Damkerng T.

Mistakes? No.

Crazy Ninja

05:13

@AmilaPasan colombo bn.

Amila Pasan

Campus?

Crazy Ninja

@AmilaPasan are you doing any job? Yeah, Sliit

Damkerng T.

@CrazyNinja Though I think you might want to consider other words, like awesome, a must-see, and such.

Amila Pasan

I'm @ Mora

Crazy Ninja

@DamkerngT. absolutely. That's the word i was looking for! "Awesome"!

Damkerng T.

05:14

But a nice movie is perfectly okay.

Crazy Ninja

@AmilaPasan which year? what are your subjects?

Amila Pasan

@CrazyNinja But I wanted to know if there is any mistake in that sentence

@cra

Crazy Ninja

@DamkerngT. thank you Sir. :P My word chooser guru :D

Amila Pasan

@CrazyNinja 2014 Efac

Damkerng T.

My pleasure.

Crazy Ninja

05:17

@AmilaPasan what does that stands for?

Amila Pasan

Engineering faculty.. We are not still split to departments.. It'll be decided after this end semester exams... @CrazyNinja

Crazy Ninja

@AmilaPasan you might need to learn few stuff. Go here and play around with it. It might help for you to communicate here much efficiently > chat.stackoverflow.com/rooms/1/sandbox

Amila Pasan

@CrazyNinja I'll look for it..

Crazy Ninja

@AmilaPasan seems like 2 nd year?

Amila Pasan

No 1st year.... @CrazyNinja

Crazy Ninja

05:20

oh great! eekiyanne oba A/L kale 2013 da?

Amila Pasan

ow bn umba?

Crazy Ninja

@AmilaPasan same ^_^

I love science & maths.... I want to be a scientist.

Wish you all the best!

Amila Pasan

What a coincidence!!

Me too !!

Crazy Ninja

@AmilaPasan "coincidence" word that getting famous in these days ... lol

Amila Pasan

I love science and maths too...

Crazy Ninja

05:23

so you are doing full time studying ?

Amila Pasan

What's your real name? Are you @ facebook?

Crazy Ninja

yeap. This is my name

Amila Pasan

Yes full time.. Next week we're gonna have our end sem exams...

Crazy Ninja

@AmilaPasan chat.stackoverflow.com/rooms/77411/ninjas

Amila Pasan

BTW the link you gave me to play around doesn't give me permission to chat there... I've got a reputation less than 20... :(

Crazy Ninja

05:26

what about the second link ?

Amila Pasan

The same bro

Crazy Ninja

i think, StackExchange and SO counting two different reputations

that's why you are not allowed to get into SO chatrooms

Amila Pasan

What are SO chatrooms?

Crazy Ninja

StackOverFlow

@AmilaPasan i pretty sure you might know Nuwan Tharaka, from Ananda

Amila Pasan

Yes.. I've seen him but I haven't still talked with him... He's not in our group... But he's a famous guy indeed..

You know there are more than 900 odd guys in our batch... It's the biggest faculty in Sri Lanka...

Crazy Ninja

05:33

@AmilaPasan he was with me in Sola's class. Though i didn't got a bigresult to select for CS there, i chose my own way

Amila Pasan

There are many paths to follow now in Sri Lanka. Even though not getting into a state university isn't a big deal.. You agree?

Crazy Ninja

@AmilaPasan you have only two questions asked in SO, so i did what i could. But that's not enough to you to get 20 rep

@AmilaPasan yeah i know. In my work place, there are lot's graduates. But doesn't seems to like being an graduate

Amila Pasan

What it does matter is skills and courage... Not anything else...

Crazy Ninja

But more important, values!!! And that's why most of time, i don't care about those who comes out of government uni ... except very few people. I believe you are no indeed in that first set

Amila Pasan

Hey thanks mate for up-voting my questions... (But don't up-vote anything in spite of their worthiness... :)

Crazy Ninja

05:40

@AmilaPasan usually, i'm not doing that. As this is the first sri lankan i met to chat and you too in my age, i had to consider that as you didn't have much rep even to enter to a chatroom. Don't just take decisions by a single act you seen from a person

Amila Pasan

You are right... Values and attitudes play a major role in the workplace...

That's why I bracketed it with a :) smile mate!! Don't get upset..

Crazy Ninja

@AmilaPasan you might get to experience after few years when you go to the industry.

@AmilaPasan are you kidding me? That reveals the nature of a fresher to a forum like this. I met many new comers like you. Does it really sounds like that i got upset?

Amila Pasan

Yeah friend indeed! nothing else than experiences taught in my life!

Don't take that seriously bro...

Crazy Ninja

need a big change of this world! People don't know where they heading up to.

No 'bro's here -_-

:P

@AmilaPasan i was kidding! I am a employee in virtusa

Amila Pasan

Then you must be a sis!!

I thought of it when I asked your name!! :)

Crazy Ninja

05:47

@AmilaPasan what's that freaky three letters stands for?

Amila Pasan

Hey don't say you dunno!!

Crazy Ninja

just for the record, i really don't know those creepy sms format languages

Amila Pasan

bro-brother [\Rightarrow] sis-?

Crazy Ninja

(these kids have go hell of it)

@AmilaPasan ahh haa.. you got to the right question... (after all)

Amila Pasan

after all :)

BTW do you enjoy your work @ virtusa?

Crazy Ninja

05:51

@AmilaPasan Yeah. Of course

Amila Pasan

What do you do there? I mean can you explain like coding or..... taking managerial decisions etc?

Crazy Ninja

@AmilaPasan developer... yeah i know, that word gives you a clear idea

Amila Pasan

You work @ night?

Crazy Ninja

this week

@snailboat Good morning! How do you do?

Amila Pasan

fine gtg(this stands for "got to go") xD , bye , nice to meet you... @CrazyNinja

Anonymous

05:56

@DamkerngT. Sometimes etymology and morphology overlap. You can say synchronically that not every noun ending in s is plural, and you can also explain where these other s ends come from diachronically if you so choose :-)

Anonymous

Morning, @CrazyNinja! And @AmilaPasan, welcome to ELL chat!

Crazy Ninja

@AmilaPasan alright buddy. Have a nice day!

Anonymous

Have a good day, @AmilaPasan :-)

Damkerng T.

@snailboat Giving gas as an example overlooks a trivial fact, though, I think.

Bye @AmilaPasan!

Crazy Ninja

@snailboat Is that normal for you to welcome even for frequent visitors :D

Anonymous

05:58

@DamkerngT. Sure. Seems trivial enough. Actually, sometimes that's effective—it may be seen obvious to them in retrospect once you've pointed out an obvious example!

Anonymous

@CrazyNinja To my knowledge I've welcomed you once, maybe a week or two ago, and AmilaPasan once, just now

Damkerng T.

Of all the examples gas, bus, canvas, news, atlas, I think only news would make a learner wonder why it's singular. :-)

Crazy Ninja

@snailboat just saying :D

Damkerng T.

(Maybe it's safer to say uncountable.)

Anonymous

So I believe my answer is no

Damkerng T.

06:00

I don't know if it's lens in Latin because it's a "double" something.

Anonymous

Physics is, news is, gas is

Damkerng T.

The Queens is :P

Anonymous

By the way, I'm not entirely sure how to respond to "How do you do?" Maybe you could say something like "How are you doing?"

Damkerng T.

I remember that I had to fight with Siri to get King's Road instead of Kings Road once. :-)

@snailboat I think it's another example of blocking.

Anonymous

What is blocking what?

Damkerng T.

06:04

How are you doing? has already taken the meaning, so we get How do you do? left unassigned.

(in that meaning, I mean)

Anonymous

Well, I know that How do you do? means something like "Pleased to meet you", but it seems inappropriate since I've already spoken with CrazyNinja, so I'm not sure how to interpret it

Damkerng T.

Hmm... maybe I was thinking backward.

@snailboat Perhaps like, "Maybe I should reintroduce myself. I'm Damkerng. How do you do?" :-)

Man_From_India

How do you do? - a greeting used on first meeting somebody. Alternatives are pleased to meet you, nice to meet you. The formal response is to repeat the phrase. (from here)

Anonymous

But we've already met! :-)

Anonymous

That phrase is obsolete in my dialect, by the way

Anonymous

06:09

I've never heard anyone say it before in real life

Damkerng T.

Come to think of it, I think How are you? was way more often over here. (I'm not sure about its current frequency.)

Though I've heard a lot of How do you do?'s in cassettes and clips.

Anonymous

I think I've heard people use the reduced form howdy in real life, but not very often

Anonymous

That one's a generalized greeting

Damkerng T.

nods

If I can still remember it correctly, I think it was almost always Nice to meet you in Frankfurt.

Man_From_India

'How do you' is clearly the exact 16th century equivalent of our present day 'how are you?'. It was specifically asking after someone's health and a reply in kind would have been expected.
There are numerous records of variants of 'how do you', dating from the 16th century to the 18th century. (http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/how-do-you-do.html)

Anonymous

06:13

Ah, that's etymology

Anonymous

How do you is entirely archaic

Man_From_India

yes it says it's old use...

Damkerng T.

BTW, I don't know what to think of answers starting with "I guess..." or "I think..."

Anonymous

I'm afraid I only speak Present Day English :-)

Damkerng T.

(How about: Hey, let me guess (or think), too!?)

Anonymous

06:16

You want people to only post answers they're certain of

Damkerng T.

I think. :P

Man_From_India

This is another way of saying this is the fact, I know. But if you find some evidence and prove me wrong, I am not to blame :-)

Damkerng T.

Anyway, I guess, I believe, I think, I suppose, ... are some obvious ways to ensure that what we say (or are going to say) is never wrong.

Hello, @TylerJamesYoung!

Tyler James Young

hi there hey there ho there

Man_From_India

oh just remembered another thing....one student asked when to use to + verb and when to + verb-ing, and while explaining the teacher here referred to an example - to try to riding horse is not fun. this strike me as incorrect.

Damkerng T.

06:21

Hmm... it sounds wrong to me too.

Anonymous

Trying to ride a horse is no fun.

Tyler James Young

to try to ride a horse is no fun

Anonymous

It's no fun to try to ride a horse.

Tyler James Young

it’s only fun to ride a horse and to not ride a horse

Damkerng T.

Me trying to ride a horse wasn't fun.

Man_From_India

06:22

yes both is fine for me...but not riding...so it proves @DamkerngT. that that teacher had learned English from that FLAWLESS BOOK :P

Damkerng T.

HAhaha!

LOLROTF

Tyler James Young

I can’t think of a situation where to + verb-ing would be correct

Damkerng T.

(My cat is looking at me suspiciously...)

Anonymous

Just search a corpus

Man_From_India

Those books should be banned...I don't know how such errors and that too huge number of errors escaped editors careful scrutiny :-(

Anonymous

06:24

To the preposition can be followed by a gerund clause. To the infinitive marker cannot

Anonymous

Searching a corpus is difficult for me on my phone so I'll let you do the legwork :-)

Anonymous

I can always make up examples. They'll be silly, though.

Man_From_India

That is what I was telling to the student...and to decide when to use verb+ ing and when only verb, you have to place a noun after to, and if that sounds good, you can correctly place verb+ing in that case after to.

Anonymous

That's more or less correct

Damkerng T.

corpus.byu.edu/coca/?c=coca&q=39715046

^A complimentary gift, your leg says. :P

Anonymous

06:28

Um, there are some iffy examples there :-)

Damkerng T.

Obviously, {trying|tried} to verb+ing is very rare.

Anonymous

Using COCA is difficult on my phone

Damkerng T.

(Enough that I think all of them are errors.)

Oh, this could work: You're trying to trying.

Man_From_India

yes I also find try + to + verb-ing a bit strange.

Anonymous

She won't talk to me. I tried everything from giving her cash to bribing her with candy, but nothing works! ← made up example

Man_From_India

06:32

g2g...see u all later...

Damkerng T.

See you around!

Anonymous

I don't understand *You're trying to trying.

Anonymous

Of note as well is that most jobs require you AT A MINIMUM to have attained or be at the level of N2. Most University language programs will have levels for foreign students between "never haven spoken before in your life" to "can speak better than a Japanese native". — The Wandering Coder 7 hours ago

Anonymous

This is the second time this week I've heard something like "better than a native speaker"

Anonymous

I'm not sure what it's supposed to mean

Damkerng T.

06:38

@snailboat I think it's parallelism at work. (It's from COCA.) Perhaps like, but build we had.

(Hmm... what's the exact words of that version? I can't really remember them now.)

@snailboat I think I know. It's a part of IELTS spec (sort of), iirc.

I think their basic idea is about being able to use the language to discuss some non-trivial matters. So, though the true L2 ability may (and should) be lower than that of a native speaker, the overall performance can outperform a native speaker because it's not only about L2.

Things like argumentation skills, thought organization, etc. are part of the performance too.

M.A.Ramezani

09:36

We really need something to star here.

That Zalgo text makes my eyes bleed now.

Anonymous

10:14

I can't think of anything clever or starworthy. I'm afraid you'll have to wait for someone cleverer or starworthier to show up

Anonymous

I'm splitting my attention three ways right now—doing three things, all of them poorly

Anonymous

One of those three is chatting! :-)

M.A.Ramezani

@snailboat You're turning into me - I'm a bad influence.

Anonymous

On the bright side, that means I'm getting younger.

Anonymous

By the way, don't look for any stars from me. This mobile chat thingy doesn't seem to let me star anything

Anonymous

10:17

So even when your messages deserve one, I can't give you one.

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