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Anonymous
19:00
I could say any of ðæts, æts, ts, or s
Anonymous
But I wouldn't be equally likely to write things corresponding to all of those.
Anonymous
I'd be more likely to write "S'pretty good" than "'ts pretty good" (??) or such, for example.
Anonymous
It doesn't really matter whether that t is there.
Anonymous
Also, I suppose I'd reduce the vowel too, if it were present.
I think 'ts pretty good makes me think of "It's pretty good."
Anonymous
19:02
Yeah, I don't think I'd transcribe the t if I reduced it to /ts/
Anonymous
It's really interesting to me how some reductions are more likely to be expressed in spelling than others.
Anonymous
I don't really know of any rules.
I think it's just like L1 learning. It comes naturally. No rules.
Anonymous
Well, there are probably patterns to be found.
Anonymous
In linguistics, "rules" are generally just observations of patterns, written down.
19:05
I'm sure we can write a handful of rules, if we really give it a try.
Anonymous
There might be too much variability for us to call the patterns we find "rules" in this particular case, but I'm sure patterns could be found nonetheless
Anonymous
I like possessive that's
Eh? possessive that's?
Oh, in the starfish's article.
Anonymous
> the only one [ that’s title has been released ]
Anonymous
19:13
It's non-standard. It bothers some people.
Anonymous
You probably shouldn't use it.
I see. People would perceive it very differently.
Anonymous
But I like it. :-)
Anonymous
It's not part of my idiolect, so I never use it, even informally.
Me too!
Anonymous
19:14
But I know someone who says it.
I agree with the article, I think. Languages do change.
Reading something written 30-40 years ago (in Thai), I can feel the difference quite clearly.
It surely sounds less English-like than today's Thai.
Anonymous
That's happening in Japanese, too. Of course, Japanese is adopting a lot of English vocabulary wholesale, but it influences it in other ways--certain bits of grammar, certain constructions have been influenced by English as well
Anonymous
Of course, Japanese changes in other ways, too.
In Thai, I can observe the change in grammar (something most people won't have a clue about the change). Vocabulary change is too obvious.
Anonymous
I think a lot of language learners have to cope with short-term language change to some extent because educational materials are often fairly dated
19:20
I think that's true.
Anonymous
Though with the internet, that may be less true than it used to be
Fortunately, English grammar hasn't changed much since maybe the last century?
Anonymous
Li'l bit. Not a lot. Little changes add up over time
I wonder how 12-year-old kids talk in their real speech.
Anonymous
You'll notice writing from a hundred years ago has a distinct feel--it feels old, even when it's mostly using words and grammar we use today
19:22
Yes. I can feel that.
I don't know how we can tell, but it seems to be true that we can tell.
Anonymous
Well, there are a lot of small cues that add up. Things like to-day
Anonymous
> Mr. Harmsworth entered a printing office twenty years ago as office-boy, and today owns thirty periodicals besides The Mail. Upon a friendly challenge from Mr. Pulitzer of The New York World, the English journalist issued the first number of The World for the new century in the ideal form. The size of the page was reduced to four columns and the general make-up was similar in appearance to that of one of the weekly magazines.
Even those were eliminated (or patched up), I think we could tell anyway.
I think Upon a friendly challenge is notable.
The Mail, and The New York World are also obvious.
Anonymous
Also, "the new century" :-)
But maybe I couldn't tell if it's printed in a neat modern-looking font. :-)
Anonymous
19:27
You can guess when this was written.
I think you can guess.
To me it sounds a bit like something from 1960.
Maybe before.
Anonymous
Oh, I thought the new century might be a hint. It's from 1901.
Oh, I missed that. :-)
Anonymous
> Current news was presented in condensed and tabulated form, of which the editor says: "The world enters today upon the twentieth or time-saving century. I claim that by my system of condensed or tabloid journalism hundreds of working hours can be saved each year." ["The Twentieth Century Newspaper," in "The Social Gospel," February 1901]
To be fair, we should avoid samples that give out too many context clues.
Anonymous
19:30
Yeah. I've never tried to do this in a rigorous fashion
I mean people's choices of words, phrases, sentence patterns, etc. change. They reflect how people thought at the time people wrote them.
Anonymous
When I say I notice these things, it's purely anecdotal and open to confirmation bias
Anonymous
Rigor takes effort. I'm lazy. :-)
Me too. :-)
> project ที่เรา plan ไว้ ก็คือจะจัด concert เพื่อ promote concept ที่ว่าจะ conserva- อะไรหว่า อนุรักษ์ เอ้อ ธรรมชาติ
That's a transcript of one spontaneous speech sample.
(with all English words written in English)
Can you guess the sentence?
19:57
By the way, I found five more it-cleft "contemplation" sentences.
> It is a little bit out of my field, but it is my contemplation that the public of the United States is going to benefit by superior service.

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