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12:28 AM
Here's one curious dig
Leaderboard for score on the QM tag
What's with that weird gap?
Oh, ok
seems to be this user
8
A: How do physicists use solutions to the Yang-Baxter Equation?

user346Ah. Finally a topic I know something about ! There are many places in physics where the YB equation pops up. I can think of two at the moment. a. Exactly solvable lattice models b. Quantum Computation (QC) It is the second application I find most exciting, so I'll focus on it. The canonical ...

No, wait
Just a query artifact
It's just all deleted users
 
1:10 AM
Oh, Noes! He might email a screenshot to The Authorities! What ever shall I do?
::face palm::
 
1:39 AM
Any of you jokers in Oakland want to get a beer?
 
If I was in Oakland I'd want a beer. But if I lived there I couldn't afford one on account of the rent.
 
2:08 AM
Sometime ago, I took part in MIT's EFT mooc. I did not go through the whole thing, and the level was also a bit above me. Are there any EFT tutorials on blogs or a quick short text written for hopeless people like me? I understand some of the concepts like matching, at least for simple quantum mechanics scattering problems. I am looking for something that has the full qft considerations, and eft concepsts introduced for a very simple case. What is the best text for this?
 
2:21 AM
Double oh noes! He took the screenshot!
 
2:59 AM
thx for the offer @DanielSank here's to the original team of decades, cheers!
 
3:10 AM
Are particle phenomenologists basically effective field theorists?
 
talking about screen shots @dmckee have you seen this?
 
4:05 AM
@Sᴋᴜʟʟᴘᴇᴛʀᴏʟ Team of decades?
 
@DanielSank what. . . you are going to grab virtual beers?
 
vzn
@DanielSank hey thinking of visiting LA around jul4. offer still stands? =D
@#$& oops rats forgot oakland far from LA :(
 
4:24 AM
@vzn you live in Oakland?
Oakland CA or somewhere in Europe?
 
vzn
@kevinTahN. live in rocky mtn region, planning trip/vac to san diego & maybe some time in LA.
are you a student?
 
I used to be a student, I am planning on heading back to School soon. Hopefully grad school shortly after. I am currently in Los Angeles
 
vzn
@kevinTahN. back to school for undergrad? what major?
 
I read the Quantum technologies project. It looks very promising.
 
vzn
@kevinTahN. yeah. exciting! =D
 
4:30 AM
Well I was a Physics senior, and also a computational mathematical science senior. I am thinking about grad school in Physics somewhere.
 
vzn
@kevinTahN. mind me asking, why take time off? (nice combination)
 
@vzn Severe financial circumstances. I have been off for close to 4 years now. In that time I sort of picked up Physics, Math and CS while hanging around grad schools lol. I like HEP, Condensed Matter and Quantum information. I am not sure what the best options are, I have some interests in a few particular topics but I am super flexible.
 
vzn
@kevinTahN. so a "near miss". know another close cohort who dropped out of EE with 2yrs to go & then went back, wild story. it can be done. strongly advised him against leaving at the time tho :|
 
vzn
4:47 AM
have you worked on open source or other software prjs? it would be interesting to hear about those
 
@kevinTahN. Virtual?
I don't get it.
@vzn Nope. Getting married around then.
 
 
1 hour later…
6:17 AM
Hi Noah
 
Hi @JohnRennie I'm afraid I can't discuss the question at the moment - I have a lesson starting soon - but could if possible in around 5 hours time? (7:20 for me at the moment, and I have a free at 12 - I'm guessing time difference could be an obstacle here)
 
I'm in the UK too. I'll be around at 12 though only for a bit. The chat is busiest from mid afternoon, say 3-4 p.m. Try me at 12 though.
 
Have you ever seen Hawking talk live @JohnRennie?
 
6:35 AM
wait can someone tell me like intuitively why (partial wrt x) (partial wrt y) f(x,y) = (partial wrt y) (partial wrt x) f(x,y)
 
user54412
@skillpatrol yes... not that you were asking me ;)
 
6:57 AM
@skillpatrol No, though I was at Cambridge when he was the Lucasian professor and I did occasionally see him being pushed along in his wheelchair usually by his students.
It seemed rather gauche to go running up to him and ask "hey are you Stephen Hawking or just some other dude in a wheelchair" :-)
 
7:15 AM
Lucasian professor of mathematics.
 
You @JohnDuffield disapprove?
 
Newton, Stokes and Dirac are surely not immediately thought of as mathematicians
 
@skillpatrol : yes. Because of stuff like this: "Hawking explained that M-theory allows the existence of a “multiverse” of different universes, each with different values of the physical constants. We exist in our universe not by the grace of God, according to Hawking, but simply because the physics in this particular universe is just right for stars, planets and humans to form.
There is just one tiny problem with all this – there is currently little experimental evidence to back up M-theory. In other words, a leading scientist is making a sweeping public statement on the existence of God based on his faith in an unsubstantiated theory."
@yuggib : Newton didn't go in for the speculative stuff that cannot be disproven. That's all Hawking has ever done.
 
What would you do if you had that chair @JohnDuffield?
 
@JohnDuffield But that's not a distinguishing feature of mathematics. And Hawking is not a mathematician
 
7:26 AM
::offers yuggib popcorn::
 
7:44 AM
@yuggib would you consider it a form of speculation to use infinitesimals in Newton's days?
In the sense that it was stuff that could not have been disproven back then.
 
@skillpatrol I am attached to etymology of words
and the etymology of speculation is from speculor, that means "to observe"
so yes, he was speculating
anyways, the fact that back then mathematics was not well developed yet, does not mean that calculus could not be disproven if wrong
 
please elaborate
 
the fact that you're not able to do something, does not mean that thing can't be done
 
true
 
in fact, Fermat's theorem or Poincaré conjecture are provable (and now proved), even if nobody succeeded in proving them for a very long time
on the other hand, there are things that are unprovable
either because they are not logic statements
or because they are not provable in a given theory
for example, the continuum hypothesis is not provable in ZFC
and on that end, mathematics is much more precise than other sciences: a statement is either true, false or undecidable
(given a theory, i.e. a language and axioms)
I went to mathematics from physics because I like that precision better
And in mathematics, all the discussions (e.g. the ones with JD) would not be so easy
because you may discuss on a conjecture, but a theorem is a true (because proved) statement
and apart from eventual errors, there is no discussion on that
 
8:04 AM
BUT WAIT
The asymptotic states can't be evolved to any time in between, can they
You can't do a time evolution of $e^{iH\infty}$
 
?
 
Shhh...let him finish please :)
 
I was finished ;)
 
(I've been talking to myself on this topic since yesterday)
 
@JohnDuffield remember, that's the sort of stuff you shouldn't be discussing here
 
8:05 AM
ok, thank you @yuggib
 
@Slereah do you know about scattering theory, yes?
 
@JohnRennie What about asking him for an autograph
@yuggib I do
 
in particular Haag-Ruelle scattering theory for QFT ;-)
so what's the matter?
 
Trying to figure out if I can say anything in QFT about what happens in between the asymptotic states
I am guessing that no
Is that a correct assumption
 
if you don't know the true dynamics (million dollar question for Yang-Mills), no you can't say
 
8:08 AM
I suspected as much
So I guess it's back to non-perturbative QFT for that :p
 
if you know it (like e.g. for $(\varphi^4)_3$ with small coupling constant)
then you can do whatever you want
@Slereah the desolated desert of non-perturbative QFT ;-P
 
Yeah it's pretty hard finding much about it
Especially for $D > 2$
$D = 2$ I already know that quantum inequalities apply for all reasonable QFTs :p
 
yeah $d=2(1+1)$ is "pretty easy"
not trivial, but reasonably easy
 
One day I will be able to understand how to do the Thirring model, hopefully!
 
Was asking him what he would do in that chair off topic @DavidZ? ;)
if so, please delete that message
 
8:19 AM
@vzn: Yes, I also heard yesterday that it's even further along than I thought!
 
Why can't we live in a 1+1D universe, really
Most physics questions would be pretty easy
 
because life would be so boring
already flatland is boring
 
The Planiverse is a pretty good book, tho
I like that they are required to have two arms on each side because they can't turn around
 
what do you find to be the most exciting part of mathematics @yuggib?
 
@skillpatrol I am not a so pure mathematician, so I find the applied (or partially applied) part the most interesting
i.e. analysis, measure theory/probability, etc.
however set theory and model theory are by far the most intriguing parts for me
 
8:33 AM
 
@skillpatrol I dunno, maybe. No need to worry, it's ancient history.
 
Thnx for letting it slide :)
 
8:59 AM
hey guys, what did I do to this to extract the real part:
$i c_0 \ln(-i(a-x))$
 
in which branch of the logarithm are you on? it is not single-valued
 
@user507974 well only you know what you did...
 
@DavidZ derp, meant do
 
;-)
 
@yuggib looking over it now, this was the result of Fourier transforms of a diff eq with heaviside functions
 
9:03 AM
anyways, you're lucky and for this particular problem it shouldn't count ;-P
whops
on the contrary
it counts
also, you're on the damn branch
is it $a-x$ pos or neg?
 
positive
also I realized something weird happened in my diff eq when I plugged it into mathematica, somehow the time dependence disappeared
 
Mathematica is nice but it has the worst font
 
wait, you're not on the branch
 
oh wait, x-a is positive
not a-x
 
Mathematica reports $i\ln(-i(a - x)) = -\frac{\pi}{2} + i\ln(x - a)$ for $x - a > 0$, if that helps
 
9:09 AM
this is a diffusion problem with this IV
 
the real part should be $-\frac{\pi}{2}c_0$
yeah, thanks @DavidZ ... I was calculating it by mind T__T
 
I'm lazy :-P
also happened to have Mma open anyway
 
@DavidZ something weird is bugging me though, basically my time dependence diappears when I do the inverse fourier on this
 
With respect to what? $k$?
 
yea
$i\ln(-i(a - x))-i\ln(i(a - x))-i\ln(-i(b - x))+i\ln(i(b - x)))c_0\over{2 \pi}$
aka it stays a $c_0$ and the system doesn't evolve
 
9:15 AM
That is a little weird...
 
like the edges are impermeable barriers or I set a BC like that...
thats my non mathematica work for the most part, its pretty straightforward so i dont really see the source of error
 
that's really hard to follow
 
sorry about the slightly shitty readability, planning on rewriting
if i ever add to a notebook
if that helps
 
It does, somewhat
So, let's see if I have this straight: you start with the diffusion equation and you're solving it by Fourier transformation
 
@Danu: I'd be surprised if you were allowed into our play pen ...
 
9:28 AM
@DavidZ yea
@DavidZ i know its kinda like putting flashy lights on a turd
 
Eh, even a little bit helps
So $\tilde c$ is supposed to be the Fourier transform of $c$ with respect to $x$, right?
 
yea
 
Does anyone know modern probability? Specifically, random variables and conditional distributions?
 
BTW could someone post something in MathJax as a quick test?
 
$\mathfrak{Penis}$
 
9:41 AM
@DavidZ $e^{test}$
$\mathfrak{Wenis}$
 
@JesterTran it depends what do you mean by "know"
 
@user507974 I guess it's actually not time-dependent... the second derivative of your expression with respect to $x$ actually is zero
 
@DavidZ thats really weird
 
Actually, I kind of get it now.
If you simplify the expression with the logs, assuming that $x$ is real, it just works out to $\theta(x - a) - \theta(x - b)$ - it's a rectangular window function
With zero second derivative in $x$, there is nothing causing the solution to change over time
It's like one of those 1=2 proofs where you wind up dividing by zero without realizing it
 
@AcuriousMind how have we goofed in the previous area
@DavidZ physically we somehow made the walls kind of into fixed BC somehow from the IV
so the concentration couldn't diffuse out
 
10:01 AM
Were the walls not supposed to be walls?
 
@DavidZ thats just like an initial condition, you know. You start with a vessel of air in a vacuum and the vessel walls magically disappears
 
Oh, so like the air (or whatever) all starts in a certain region $[a,b]$ with uniform density and then at $t=0$ you remove the barriers keeping it there and allow it to diffuse away?
Ah, now I think I get it
It has to be an issue with the boundaries, $a$ and $b$. I bet when you use Mathematica to do one of these Fourier transforms (or inverse) it ignores the points at $a$ and $b$.
Just plug it into DSolve and you get $$c(x, t) = \frac{1}{2}\biggl[\operatorname{erfc}\biggl(\frac{a - x}{2\sqrt{D t}}\biggr) - \operatorname{erfc}\biggl(\frac{b - x}{2\sqrt{D t}}\biggr)\biggr]$$
which is probably more realistic
 
yea, I solved the problem doing superposition of delta function solutions and got that, so I was wondering why I couldn't recover it
 
oh now you say so :-P
 
@DavidZ =)
well i got erf but thats probably just cuz im stupid and wrote it wrong
 
10:15 AM
note that $\operatorname{erfc}(z) = 1 - \operatorname{erf}(z)$
Well, anyway... it's beyond my abilities at the moment to figure out exactly why the Fourier transform method fails, but it definitely has something to do with those boundary points $a$ and $b$.
That would be a pretty good question to write up and post on either Physics or Mathematics. My guess is it better suits the latter.
I am curious to see a full explanation.
 
11:05 AM
Hi? @JohnRennie
 
Hi means hello
 
It does - I'm wondering if he is currently here, hence the "?"
 
I am, and I do have an ark.
 
Hi Noah. I'm on the phone for a few minutes. Won't be long ...
 
11:12 AM
Ok, thanks!
 
Sorry about that - real life intruding. I am now available to talk about vacuum fluctuations!
 
Brilliant!
So am I correct in saying that the concept of virtual particles falling and escaping from the hole would be an incorrect analogy?
 
I should say I'm not a QFT expert as my area is more general relativity. So I may struggle with specifics.
 
@user507974 I think @DavidZ is exactly right - the lack of derivatives means your equation can't drive the evolution of the rectangle. It's a "meta-stable" configuration, you only get evolution once something disturbs that configuration and creates a gradient that then can drive the diffusion
 
@NoahP In QFT when a field is quantised this gives negative and positive modes.
 
11:17 AM
@JohnRennie Sorry, what?
 
Overall I'd say using virtual particle pairs for Hawking radiation isn't terribly helpful
 
Which would thus give rise to a pair of particles, one being positive and the other negative?
 
It's not mathematically true and intuitively, it doesn't help either
 
@Danu I saw a popup saying "Danu requests access to the hbar moderation room" or something like that.
@NoahP No. The modes are unrelated to virtual particles.
 
@DavidZ At $t=0$, that "solution" is identically zero ($\mathrm{erf}(\infty) = 1$, so $\mathrm{erfc}(\infty) = 0$), what's that supposed to tell me?
 
11:19 AM
@Slereah What would you suggest instead? The mathematics are a bit out of my league
 
Easiest way to understand Hawking radiation I'd say is that around a black hole, there's an outward flow of positive energy and inward flow of negative energy
 
@JohnRennie Ok
 
In the vacuum state the positive and negative modes cancel out to leave the vacuum.
 
@Slereah But what gives rise to this?
 
@JohnRennie Ah.
 
11:20 AM
@JohnRennie That makes sense
 
@JohnRennie ::twitches::
 
But when spacetime is curved the distinction between the positive and negative modes shifts, so they no longer cancel perfectly.
 
@JohnRennie Seeing as how DavidZ asked me to post some stuff there, I expect to be granted access.
 
Our QFT expert is about to scream at me :-)
 
@JohnRennie This seems nonsensical :P
 
11:21 AM
Both the positive and negative modes have positive energy though in the vacuum :p
 
@Danu all right, you explain Bogoliubov transformations to someone who is still at school then!
 
@ACuriousMind Please bear in mind that I'm studying A levels in the UK, aged 17 - The complicated maths is beyond me...
 
Well then maybe tell the truth!
 
@JohnRennie The vacuum is empty, there's no cancellation going on, it's the ground state. The positive modes become particles, the negative modes become antiparticles. A state with positive and negative modes in it is very different from the vacuum, it's rather explosive!
 
without the math, there isn't much that you can explain
 
11:22 AM
@JohnRennie Spend some years studying first ;)
 
The point is that in curved spacetime different observers will disagree about constitutes the vacuum state.
 
^^Now that is true, and what drives both the Unruh effect and Hawking radiation
 
So what looks like a vacuum to one observer looks like a state containing particles to a different observer.
 
Obviously the Boulware vacuum is the true vacuum
 
How does that lead to the 'emission' of energy?
 
11:24 AM
@NoahP Well - each observer determines the particle or energy content of a state with respect to their own vacuum
 
Yet from any reference frame the black hole will lose mass through HR?
 
@NoahP because the state that corresponds to a vacuum for someone falling freely into the black hole corresponds to an excited state for we observers far from the event horizon.
 
@JohnRennie So what's so wrong with that for an explanation?
 
@Danu it's not a proper explanation, it's a "then magic happens" explanation
 
So: From an external reference frame, it appears that the vacuum around the hole contains particles/energy?
 
11:26 AM
Yes
If you are interested
It's similar to the Unruh effect
if you accelerate, something which is a vacuum at 0 acceleration gains particles from an accelerated point of view
 
@JohnRennie No, then you can talk about what a particle means
 
Okay, so how does this give rise to the black hole losing mass and energy being 'radiated;?
 
And that it's not invariant under all the transformations you want to do in curved spaces
 
@Slereah You can also see it as the apparent Rindler horizons radiating Hawking radiation, then it's pretty much the same
 
As said, this causes an outward flow of positive energy
And to preserve energy conservation
Inward flow of negative energy
 
11:28 AM
@ACuriousMind but $\operatorname{erfc}(-\infty) = 2$, so if $a-x$ and $b-x$ have opposite signs, the overall value won't be zero
 
I don't think I like "flow of negative energy" one bit---why resort to that kind of "spooky terminology"?
 
This can be considered as the black hole radiating away its mass
Because that is true!
 
@DavidZ Oh, right! It's indeed the rectangle at t=0
 
The energy conditions are broken at some point in the Boulware vacuum
 
There are a lot of messages here - could you compact that into one concise message and thus explanation?
 
11:30 AM
 
There are no easy answers :)
 
IIRC the outward-directed modes are positive energy and the inward-directed ones are negative
If I recall Wald correctly
 
lol, my Mathematica notebook has like 5 lines of integrating Bessel functions (what I'm supposed to be working on) and then pages of this stuff about the diffusion equation
 
Also I have the Popeye tune stuck in my head
(toot toot)
 
@NoahP although ACuriousMind smiles, he's quite right. This is a fundamentally horrifically complicated area. At school level all we can really say is that in curved spacetime the quantum state isn't uniquely defined so depending on where you are you will see what appears to be a vacuum radiating.
But the point of all this is that it nowhere involves pairs of virtual particles.
 
11:33 AM
Well they do appear in the analysis, IIRC
I recall something about only even number operators eigenstates being implicated or something
 
@JohnRennie @Slereah @ACuriousMind @Danu If I were to do some work on refining this and then get back to you later with a new understanding, could you give me some constructive criticism (Unlikely to be 100% praise...) on it?
 
Sure
 
Brilliant, thanks! I'm off to lunch now and then a couple more lessons but I'll definitely be on later.
 
@NoahP Well, I can't guarantee when I will be here, but if I catch it, of course
@JohnRennie I usually smile when I'm right, I'm smug like that :P
 
@NoahP of course, though I fear we haven't given you enough for a good description. I'll have a scout around and see if I can find some reasonably accessible explanation.
 
11:35 AM
@ACuriousMind thanks
 
Thanks everyone for the help :D
 
Hm
 
by the way, i spent all of april 20th making 420 puns and jokes and only actually realized the date at about 10pm
 
That makes me think
 
anybody else ever feel like they are cosmic conduit for terrible jokes
 
11:37 AM
Even for an infalling observer, things would look different
Since energy conditions are invariant
 
@user507974 Now that's the true stoner attitude!
 
@Slereah lol
@Slereah but would it be nothing or a ball with nothing in it
 
:O
how can they say that?
 
11:42 AM
@Slereah You have these things in your dropbox?
You're a strange man.
 
in a curious way
 
Right, well it's 12:43 in the UK so I'm off to score myself some lunch. See you all later.
 
cya later
 
Where else would I keep them
 
why keep them?
 
11:44 AM
In case I need them
 
As emergency currency after the apocalypse?
 
do you find them that profound?
 
I find them amusing
 
@skillpatrol You...do realize none of these are real quotes or intended to be factual, right?
 
@ACuriousMind the one about gauss is well known, if you replace count with add
 
11:46 AM
Except this one :
 
I use to keep things in my dropbox til some of them started mysteriously disappearing
i still have one folder of FDA FOIA documents I haven't been able to ever find thanks to Dropbox sync deleting it from everywhere
 
@skillpatrol Uhhh...he (anecdotally) invented the right way to add to 100! What do you mean?
@user507974 The NSA took them, clearly
 
That's what I mean.
 
@ACuriousMind what is the right way to add to 100 compared to before then what they were doing?
Oh you meant the summation
i was thinking you guys meant x + y = 100 for a sec by that
 
You said none of these are intended to factual.
 
11:53 AM
@user507974 The "right" way is to note they pair up as 1+100+2+99+3+98+4+97+--- = 50*101, the wrong way is to waste your time by successively adding 1+2+3+4+...
2
 
Or (0+100) + (1 + 99) + (2 + 98) + ... + 50 :p
50*100 + 50
 
I always thought it was more than just an "anecdote"? @ACuriousMind wasn't he quoted as saying he did it?
 
I have no idea, ask the hsm people
 
IIRC it's a story that Gauss told
He might have been telling tall tales
 
Or small tales, considering he was a child when he did that
 
11:59 AM
@Slereah i find that a surprising number of tall tales are true, the weird things that will happen around me that constitute the realm of things you should not see happening is very high
its like 5% rather than 1% probably
 
Perhaps you are magnifying the 1% by 5 :P
 
@skillpatrol I'm just a channeling of cosmological funk, a lagrange point for weirdness
 
I see, carry on :-)
 
most of them are little unnoticeable details that are not very likely but just occur
for example, as I was biking home I happened to randomly think about the movie She's the Man, and when I arrived home after I took a short nap there was a post related to that movie on a (distant) friends timeline
I've had advertisements that directly targetted things I did that have never been done online and sometimes there are very weird sale patterns around me
newegg happens to put an item on sale the day after I search up on it, about 4 times (and its not like they have a massive inventory)
 
21
Q: Did Gauss find the formula for $1+2+3+\ldots+(n-2)+(n-1)+n$ in elementary school?

GeremiaI heard Gauss's primary school teacher gave some busy-work to his class: to add all the numbers between 1 and 100 up. Gauss immediately wrote 5050. His teacher was shocked, so she told him to add up all the numbers to 1000. And just as quickly he wrote 500500. Did Gauss derive the $1+2+3+\ldots+...

 
12:10 PM
@skillpatrol : stuff that related to scientific evidence. I wouldn't turn my back on the maths. It's just that I'd be talking about electrons and gravity instead of branes.
 
@skillpatrol now you wanna hear a truly weird one
 
sure
 
somehow I was holding a washer with a rod that was secured on both ends by a rigid wider tip
 
@yuggib : I agree it isn't a distinguishing feature of mathematics. As for Hawking not being a mathematician, let's just say I'm not a Hawking fan. Nuff said.
 
and while i was holding it and looking away I pulled the rod out of the washer
 
12:12 PM
@Danu Here's another one
117
Q: \includegraphics: Dots in filename

fuenfundachtzig\includegraphics cannot handle filenames that contain more than the one dot, separating the filename from the extension. Apparently it uses everything after the first dot as extension and then, of course, complains about an unknown graphics extension. This is annoying as I very often have filena...

Same with spaces in filename
It messes up a bunch of workflows
No call for such restrictions nowadays
 
i still feel like i wouldve hallucinated that one were it not for the fact that I was working with other people there
 
And still everybody just pretends this is perfectly OK
 
@skillpatrol statistically i suppose its possible for that to occur I suppose but I dont like to believe I was looking off to the side and missed the chance to observe macroscopic tunneling
 
Interesting...
 
@skillpatrol like it sounds really stupid to say it and its impossible to prove but yea, weirdness
in less weird examples somehow 4 shoes broke on me in the course of 3 days
 
12:19 PM
...I wouldn't worry about it.
These kind of things come and go in cycles.
 
@skillpatrol mine will probably just be like an 80 year cycle
i remember i opened a notebook on the first day of university, when i was still waiting for fin aid to come, and in that notebook (I'd bought like 3 years ago), there was birthday card with $100 in it
its really fun to be me though with all this shenanigans
 
serendipity
 
12:35 PM
@Slereah lol
 
@JohnRennie : I agree. But I'm not allowed to discuss physics here, so see this answer.
 
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