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12:16 AM
@Marcel hello, long time. :<
 
@Icosahedron ah hey
yeah got some stuff to do the last couple of days
how's it doing here?
did I miss a chat session?
 
12:53 AM
@0celo7 cats
 
 
1 hour later…
2:06 AM
@StanShunpike It seems to me that the question has an elementary conceptual aspect to it and there is some effort shown. So, there is the question of research effort. My downvote-o-meter isn't in the red on this question but YMMV. Remember what I wrote in my reply to your comment: If you're unsure if your down vote is adding value in fact, don't down vote.
 
user54412
2:29 AM
Wait, people actually think there's a shortage of STEM talent in the US and need to have this debunked?
 
0
Q: Vibrating Objects

Jimmy360I'm not sure if this belongs in Engineering, but if it does, please migrate the question. What methods are used to vibrate objects extremely quickly? What are the most common?

 
@AlfredCentauri my meter wasn't in the red. I just used it as an example. I think I will just keep doing what I am doing unless some other policy becomes the norm
 
 
5 hours later…
Mew
7:47 AM
0
Q: Why is the colour gradient in the sky at sunset on an angle?

GeodudeBelow is a picture of a typical sunset that I have been observing lately at an undisclosed location in the Southern Hemisphere: Given that the base of the picture is parallel to sea level, you can see that the line where the dark blue meets the red in the sky, is on an angle of elevation of ap...

 
 
5 hours later…
12:46 PM
0
Q: How to mathematically describe a spin-0 particle

Damon BlevinsThat simple. I can't buy anything; I am only 15. I don't know all the technical things like Eigenstates. I want to know, mathematically written out for beginners, how to quantize a scalar boson particle. (I'm in need of it for my theory, which I do for my general interest.)

It is just me, or the quality of the questions is trending down in the last period?
0
Q: # significant figures in calculations?

user45220I was taught to use the same number of significant figures in my answer as the piece of data with the lowest number of significant figures, so I was a bit confused when the solutions manual for this problem stated the answer as 2.45ms^-2. Problem: The acceleration due to gravity at the earth's s...

 
 
2 hours later…
2:29 PM
@yuggib It's not just you :P
 
2:50 PM
@ACuriousMind good (?) to know :P
 
3:41 PM
To emphasize the problem that @yuggib pointed out: this has now become one of the site's hot network questions.
It seems our quality is slipping
 
4:08 PM
@ACuriousJim T_T
 
 
3 hours later…
6:43 PM
@ChrisWhite What what what?!
 
7:11 PM
I've been getting a nice, slow but steady stream of upvotes on old post. I wonder what's going on :P
@yuggib What a #!$(#& that guy is
 
Max
Can anyone (attempt to) describe where the weak force is? I know what it's for (if I'm not wrong, it "somehow" helps up quarks turn into down quarks by [for instance] emitting a W boson). But what I don't get is what the actual force is - I understand the interaction that occurs, but not where the weak force actually is. How does the force help explain this formula: n --> p+ + W+ --> p+ + e- + anti-neutrino ?
I think I've misunderstood the concept completely here, because it just won't make sense
 
@Max What do you mean "where"?
 
@Max It's a quantum theory
 
If you want an actual, classical force acting on something, there isn't one here.
 
Max
@ACuriousMind Oh, so it can't be explained like gravity, etc.?
I know that it's abstract and all, but I'm finding hard to understand what the actual weak force is. I know how the process works and all
With where, I meant like this: the "where" for gravity would be "a force which acts on two objects with mass directed towards each other", if that makes any sense
 
7:25 PM
@Max Nope, the strong and weak force are purely quantum, you should not think about them like gravity and electromagetism (although there's little distinction in the formalism of EM and weak/strong forces as such)
And quantumly, it is unclear what a "force" in the classical sense of acting on objects would even be.
 
Max
@ACuriousMind That's interesting. But can't the strong force be explained in the same way? I can sort of see how the strong force is a force (because I can imagine the direction, on what it acts, etc.), but for the weak force, it seems different. Have I misunderstood the concept of the strong force too?
 
No, I don't think you can see the strong force that way.
 
The strong force is a bit more like electromagnetism than the weak force because gluons, in contrast to W/Z bosons, are massless, but I would not advise thinking about the strong force in terms of classical forces, either.
 
So, indeed, I do not think you can understand it classically
 
When talking about confinement, it sometimes sounds as if people are thinking classically about "flux tubes" and "the force between two quarks" you try to separate, but this comes indeed from treating the strong force almost classically in these derivations, I think. It's not what the strong force does in the full quantum theory.
 
Max
7:32 PM
I see. But in what way is the strong force represented? I know that vectors can be used to describe gravity, etc. Is there something corresponding for these types of forces?
Or maybe you can't represent it in a similar way
 
I don't understand the question, you are probably still trying to impose a classical picture. What do you mean by "represent"?
 
Max
I think I am, haha. I mean, is there a similarity of representing it in the way that vectors are used to represent "everyday forces"
 
@Max No, I don't think so.
 
Max
Oh, I see. I guess it's pretty difficult to picture for someone who hasn't learned everything about particle physics yet.
 
I think that we basically have to give up all classical intuition for non-abelian gauge theories
 
Max
7:41 PM
Haha, well then
 
All hail mathematics!
 
Max
Just a quick question though: Is the right track towards understanding these concepts to think of nuclear forces as particle interactions?
I don't want to get on the wrong track again :P
 
@Max I don't think that there is one way of thinking about this stuff, but thinking in terms of interactions corresponds to thinking in terms of Feynman diagrams, so I think it is fine as long as you are in a setting where perturbation theory makes sense.
 
...which is a dodgy issue, especially with the strong force, hehe
 
Max
Haha, well okay then. Thanks a lot for the help! Both of you
 
7:49 PM
Basically, I'd always warn against trying to make statements about stuff before really studying it in depth, with the full formalism and everything.
 
Max
Well, good thing I came here then. I almost simplified it way too much
 
8:06 PM
(of course, my recommended approach is no fun at all for most people... But at least it avoids strange errors)
 
user54412
@Max "Explained like gravity"? xkcd.com/1489
 
user54412
@NeuroFuzzy Here's the story (pdf)
 
8:39 PM
@ACuriousMind Do you know of an easy way to show, nonrigorously, the transformation of the Dedekind eta function under the $S$ modular transformation? Everything I find online is really complicated or uses lemmas and formulas from number theory. I'm not necessarily looking for a full proof, just a way to strongly motivate it.
 
@0celo7 QFT is a lot more interesting than QM isn't it?
 
@Icosahedron That's wholly subjective.
 
@Icosahedron yes. Also that's not QFT what he's doing.
 
Do you mean in my opinion?
 
@Danu It was an unrelated random question.
@0celo7 I suppose.
 
8:49 PM
I think it is more interesting, yes.
I also think GR is more interesting than QFT.
 
I think they are equal, at least in a currently sort of uneducated opinion.
 
@0celo7 No, I do not know of such a way
 
Though QM is deathly uninteresting, I think.
 
@0celo7 From the definition of the function it seems very unreasonable to expect this
 
@ACuriousMind Do you know of any way? BLT/Weigand use the good old: the partition function demands it.
@Danu The $T$ behavior is trivial to verify.
 
8:52 PM
@0celo7 No, I'm not a number theorist :P
 
$45
@Icosahedron The basic machinery of QM is omnipresent in QFT and ST.
 
@0celo7 I know that's the only reason I have to do it.
@0celo7 Did you report me yet? :<
 
You and a whole bunch of others.
Y'all are going down.
 
@Icosahedron If you find QM "deathly uninteresting", why do you think it will be different with QFT?
 
Ok, GSW Vol. 1 claims the proof is in Vol. 2, but I can't find it.
 
9:03 PM
@ACuriousMind I don't know how to answer that.
 
Hmm, perhaps the eta function is related to the derivative of the first theta function somehow.
These calculations are ridiculous.
Infinite sums and products everywhere.
 
@0celo7 I don't know where you reported that, as I can't find any sort of information about it online.
 
@Icosahedron You have got to be kidding me. They tell you where to report it!!
Do you sleep through the instructional period?
 
I don't remember them telling you anything about anything.
It was 8am, probably.
 
Office of Testing Integrity is practically a meme.
 
9:09 PM
Does it exist at all?
 
@Icosahedron You sounded to me as if you were "enduring" QM to learn QFT. Why do you want to learn QFT?
 
@ACuriousMind I don't know, it's interesting.
@0celo7 About that, isn't dark matter certain to exist? Then why are there modified gravity theories currently in development that do not included dark matter?
 
I simply cannot imagine finding QM boring and QFT interesting, I guess. Finding the major ingredient of something boring, but the something interesting sounds weird to me.
 
They don't get the other stuff right that GR does.
Don't ask about specifics, I don't know non-mainstream stuff.
 
9:20 PM
@0celo7 Though is dark matter certain to exist at this point?
 
If ST is right, then GR is also right to an extent, so, yes.
If someone found a framework for gravity that eliminated DM as well as reproduce all verified GR predictions, I guarantee you'd hear about it.
 
@ACuriousMind I'm weird too though.
 
Do you think special relativity is weird too?
 
I think it's the atomic physics section that I find uninteresting, and I'm currently there.
 
In Shankar?
 
9:23 PM
@0celo7 I was there in griffiths about a year ago, I haven't started shankar objectively yet.
 
Then what are you reading??
 
Who said QM was boring?
 
::hides::
 
LOL
Yeah, I disagree. I think it's awesome. Even Newtonian mechanics I don't find boring because I think it is amazing it actually works to some extent. But perhaps I am easily entertained lol.
 
@ACuriousMind Is the pole in the logarithm essential?
 
9:28 PM
@0celo7 Cahill, and Arfken.
 
@0celo7 1. A pole is never essential, an essential singularity is defined as a singularity that is neither a pole nor removable 2. The singularity is not isolated, so you can't talk about the removable/pole/essential classification.
 
@ACuriousMind 1. My bad, debated which term to pick and did so poorly. 2. Ahhh
@Icosahedron Arfken et al. math methods?
 
@0celo7 Yes.
 
42 pages on the gamma function should be good.
Holy crap that book is long.
Surely you're not reading 1100 pages.
 
I have to.
 
9:33 PM
Doubtful.
 
Most likely not.
Though... I'll start the $5$ next week and continue them diligently until next term.
Currently I am just wasting time.
 
1200 pages and no topology? You're not a man until you know what a clopen set is.
 
I'm taking topology this term, though I already knew what that is.
in the se thread from a long time ago, which field of maths has the worst notation.
 
10:16 PM
@0celo7 what book are you reading?
 
@StanShunpike Same as last time you asked ;)
I can't read 800 pages in a week.
 
Lol well, I read usually 5 books at the same time. I like to jump around.
 
^^^^^
 
Yeah, its like I'm melding their understandings together so I can't just use one
 
...then 5 completely different books don't count?
 
10:25 PM
Um, no that counts lol
I was just saying in my head they don't seem different because its all the same material
Usually
 
what if they are on different topics
 
5 books is 5 books.
 
tell that to ocelot.
 
Is that @0celo7 your new nickname? Lol
Ocelot
How did your AP go? Does your school take AP credit?
 
you can't talk about it.
 
10:31 PM
Psych was meh, calc was trivial. UTK's nuke dept takes 5s for STEM and 4s for other stuff.
 
it's not trivial without a calculator. :<
 
You literally could not do parts of the test without one.
 
This is why we read instructions.
 
I wasn't told.
 
10:35 PM
Why would you need to be told? They assume you are mature enough to Google.
 
LOL I would like to have seen you take the calc test. I bet you were done in record time or at least waaaay before everyone else
 
AP week is always when everyone in the school is dead with allergies and other sicknesses.
 
The girl who sat behind me said: "Ryan, I hate you. You can't finish so early!"
 
Materials for AP exams: pencil, pen, calculator, 100 boxes of tissues
 
I'm on a Vitamin-C high ATM.
@Howcan Photo ID.
 
10:37 PM
@0celo7 lol, the phrasing :P
 
@ACuriousMind lol
 
@Howcan ocelot will send the tissues to the examiner instead for trying to understand his solutions.
 
@0celo7 how many credits are you getting from AP courses at your college?
@Icosahedron I could imagine.
 
@0celo7 did you report her too?
 
@Howcan 11 tests. I think I can only get one econ, so 10. I don't think I can get multiple history credits, so 8. Maybe.
 
10:40 PM
@0celo7 You might not be able to get placed out of multiple history classes, but I think it's possible to get some general credit. I know AP World gets me some random credit for who knows what, but doesn't place me out of a class.
Not sure how your school works though.
 
@Howcan I met with a counselor during my visit and if I get 4s and 5s on this years' tests I won't be taking any gen ed besides freshman english.
+stupid honors courses
@Icosahedron What?
 
@0celo7 that's good stuff. I'll try to place out of some, I doubt I'll get to that point though. Also, 11 tests, solid. Did you actually take all the classes too or just signed up for the exams? My school limits the amount of APs kids take to ~4.
 
I took the classes.
 
So much freedom
 
@0celo7 I forgot you're a law abiding citizen and write ap level solutions.
 
10:43 PM
I took 5 exams last year.
 
Kids here fight for a 4th/5th Ap.
 
I'm taking 5 this year.
 
I think we have so many qualified kids that they can't have so many sections of the classes.
 
and in none of the classes.
 
@Icosahedron The liberal arts tests are more difficult.
 
10:44 PM
Over 100 kids in my graduating class are taking BC, 30 taking differential equations, another 30 taking actuarial
 
Holy shit how large is your class??
 
800 people
 
I didn't know there was ap differential equations.
 
It's a class for kids who took BC junior year
 
Mine is 600 and we had 11 people in the BC class + 4 random super nerds.
 
10:45 PM
they went onto multivariate and diff eq/actuarial
 
Private school?
 
We had 2 kids taking math classes at a university because they finished the curriculum.
Nope, public
 
State?
 
whatever I think doing multivariate without the proper background and rigor is a waste.
 
NY
 
10:46 PM
County?
 
It's in NYC.
 
@Howcan Do the lectures I told you and you will know more than them. It should only take you about 3 weeks or less.
 
My school is shit.
 
@Icosahedron I'm trying! I'm trying to balance schoolwork with learning all that. I know it's very possible but my work ethic isn't the best, but it is getting much better.
what a horrible sentence
 
@Howcan I don't do school work at all.
@0celo7 Then what is mine?
 
10:51 PM
@Icosahedron Things must be different in Canada. My dad would beat the shit out of me if I did that.
 
@Icosahedron What do you mean? You just don't do any homework? I have a lot more free time now because I'm a second term senior.
But I still have to write my essays and what not.
 
@Howcan I only do assignments if I must.
 
@Icosahedron that tends to be the case too often for me.

What colleges are you guys going to?
 
Tennessee.
 
@Howcan I'm in junior lvl : chem, phys, and precalc at the moment...
why in the world would i even listen in class or do homework...
 
10:54 PM
So you can get A's and your parents can be proud?
Trivial stuff, I know.
 
i don't care about that.
 
Ah, well good luck when college apps come around @Icosahedron

@0celo7 I'd say you deserve an ivy with some solid financial aid!
 
@Howcan I'm bad at standardized testing.
 
@Howcan Don't worry, here in canada all you need to do is click apply on the university website with your marks and that's it, you wait until spring to get your result.
literally takes 1 second.
 
@Howcan You going to NYU?
 
10:56 PM
@Icosahedron I hate you. College apps were the bane of my existence.

@0celo7 I got into NYU but I can't afford ~50k a year.
 
I applied to Tennessee and got in. Very affordable and great school.
I didn't apply anywhere else.
 
I committed to Stony Brook. It's also good and a lot cheaper than NYU.
 
The great thing about Tennessee is that I can get in-state tuition and I have family somewhat close by.
 
Yeah money is a huge factor, it kind of sucks.
 
@Howcan In Toronto it's 5-10k tuition.
 
10:59 PM
@Icosahedron If you apply with your grades and you don't have good grades...how do you get in?
 
@Icosahedron in the US it ranges anywhere from 5k (City colleges) to 80k a year (Columbia).
 
@0celo7 They can't reject me...
I have trump cards.
 
@Howcan I got screwed financially. My area (D.C. suburbs) is really wealthy but the cost of living is one of the highest in the nation. On my FAFSA I look like a shitlord but my family can't afford private.
@Icosahedron What does that even mean?
What's the point in applying if they can't reject?
 
@0celo7 I am registered there as a visiting researcher and audit, and supervised by head of phys.eng department in his research group.
 
@0celo7 I didn't get financial aid for other reasons, so I feel you. Colleges are extremely cutthroat with their prices. Probably the most expensive country to go to school to.
 
11:05 PM
They can't reject me for that.
 
@Icosahedron That definitely helps a ton, but I don't think it's a guarantee. Maybe it is in Canada, but I would still be wary.
 
@0celo7 Though it may not be enough, I'm going to write the physics and math GRE subject tests next term too, along with 5 ap 5's.
If they still reject me because of my marks... then I'm done for.
Though that certainly won't happen.
 
GRE?
Why?
 
the one you write to go to physics or math graduate school. (subject test)
 
I know what it is.
 
11:12 PM
to show them what level i'm at?
on paper.
uh the gre is just 2nd +3rd year stuff.
i was going to write it this year but it was full.
 
In America, we place value on work ethic. If your GPA isn't >4(W), kiss any good schools goodbye.
Also extracurricular activities and leadership skills.
 
well i'm not there.
@0celo7 Do your parents support your physics study?
 
@Icosahedron No, my grades aren't as high as they would like.
 
My parents don't, they want me to do school work.
Though...
too bad.
 
Did you at least take a practice GRE to see if you're really at that level?
 
11:20 PM
@0celo7 But... you seem to have a solid grasp on topics way beyond high school. Personally, I'd say that's more impressive than having top grades in some hs classes. Then again, I'm not one to judge or say anything.
 
@Howcan I agree with them. There's no reason to learn stuff early, and every reason to get good grades now.
Too bad I have an addictive personality and have replaced video games with physics.
 
I was, and still am jealous of all the kids who are ahead by years.
@0celo7 I'm slowly starting to do that haha.
 
@0celo7 Yes I wrote the practice booklet last fall, haven't look at math though. I still need to do number theory and others.
@Howcan It's not by years if you spend a lot of time on it, and start immediately.
Later.
 
11:47 PM
@Howcan So what are you going to study in college?
 

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