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00:04
Spring cleaning eh
Guess I've been out of the loop for a while
00:20
@ringo welcome back :D
@ringo Came back just in time!
@hBy2Py I guess you can edit in a BOLDED, ITALICISED, CAPITALISED SECTION at the top of Martin's question, telling people that the first event is scheduled for XYZ time on ABC day.
And I'll update the community event on main site.
@orthocresol <nod>, that's what I was figuring would make the most sense.
I won't be able to make that edit just now - should we coordinate these edits/updates to happen at the same time?
Nah, no big deal. I can edit it in, if you'd like.
I'm hungry and need to eat something before going to bed anyway
Go ahead and edit in the notice if you have time & inclination.
Otherwise, I'll do it when I get the chance & ping you to update the main site thingummy.
00:25
@hBy2Py Do you want to give it a name?
I can't think of anything except "chat event 1", which sounds really lame and uninspiring.
01:18
@orthocresol "Spring Cleaning I: Inhibiting s"
01:41
@hBy2Py I don't think it's too short notice, but I won't be having time on saturday
@Martin-マーチン <nod>, I think M.A.R. might not be available either, and penta doesn't want to do it during the day.
Is ok. We'll get as far as we can, and hopefully there'll be some people that come on board spur-of-the-moment.
I think it's best to just create a chat event for that time. It should show up on the main site. Otherwise, just create a new event. Leave the header event like it is for now, or we need to edit it every time (cc @orthocresol)
Yeah, agreed. If we don't move forward with this, we'll postpone too often...
@hBy2Py shall I create the chat event for you?
CLEANUP ACTION completed [reaction] co-tags with [ions]
I think I can take care of it, as room owner.
I see a schedule events option in the room dropdown
As long as it will still appear on the Chem.SE main page if I do it, even though I'm not a mod, I'll take care of it.
yep, that's it
01:46
Otherwise, yeah, you should create it to ensure it's visible.
@pentavalentcarbon <high-five>
You're marking it off in the GH project, right?
well, just do it now, and we'll check and take further action
hBy2Py has added an event to this room's schedule.
@pentavalentcarbon Use your downvotes! (On the answer, too.)
i mean in general
@Martin-マーチン Even though the answer is not terrible quality?
Such a downvote on the answer serves to help the system cull the question?
01:51
hm, yeah
I think
I mean, it should
when everything is negative, it should be picked up by the clean up processes
I guess either way, the answerer will get dinged
But it'll all get reversed when the Q gets blasted
ups and downs
@pentavalentcarbon CLEANUP ACTION: Inferring rate of reaction from time taken [closed] (deleted)
It is important, that within the cleaning process, everybody uses their votes.
So, "your answer is fine, but you answered a crappy question" is a valid reason for a downvote?
01:54
But then I would downvote almost everything.
(also: I don't see a chat event notice on the mainpage .. but, I'm registered, so maybe that's why?)
it says the answer is not useful
that may mean anything
in that case it was more of a comment to begin with, as the question itself was terrible
CLEANUP ACTION @ortho @mith @heather @Melanie @M.A.R. The first Spring Cleaning event has been scheduled.
there is no point in keeping it, if it isn't helpful
01:58
<nod>
also, someone could voice an opinion here:
7
Q: How should we deal with bad questions that attracted not too helpful answers?

Martin - マーチンWhile I am trying to rid us of the reaction tag, I come across a couple of questions that have a negative score and thus could be classified as bad or a bad fit for our site. Usually such questions will be removed eventually as abandoned unless they attract an answer. Sometimes these questions...

because the one i just culled falls exactly into this category
^^ @pentavalentcarbon
I was waiting for your reply to my comment, before posting anything
ah yes, the sede...
sorry forgot, too busy
To quote @penta: ಠ_ಠ
But yeah, that question probably was caught by my query, so.
well, that query is awesome
02:05
Covers the space you're talking about?
The number of records it returns seems awfully low compared to the numbers you cite in your post, though.
@hBy2Py signed up for the event
actually
oh darn, i misread the date
that's the one saturday when all the things are happening for me =P
@heather Sorry it doesn't overlap well with your availability
haha, it's ok
i'll attend if i can
It might just be ortho and I working it this time; not sure if MAR can do weekends, and penta is slammed, too
Hopefully we'll have some wanderers-in.
@hBy2Py ummm... i didn't cite anything O.o
02:08
@Martin-マーチン Well, handwave
10000 questions in 2016, third closed, third answered, etc.
no i said that 10k was asked, 5k deleted, 2.5k was answered in 2016
No, you said 10.000
Maybe that was over the lifetime of the site?
that was just in general
Ahhhh.
02:09
Ok, so 10% of the Q's on the site fall into this category. Wow.
nope... your query covers everything
Ok. I'll chew on it & post an answer, eventually.
I still don't see any notice on the front page about a chat event.
it's about 6% of all remaining questions
@hBy2Py i know...
@heather This won't be the only event we run; AFAIK we'll be scheduling them at different times so different people can attend.
give me the exact time you entered again please
02:12
Saturday 8 Apr 1600-1800 UTC
That'll do!
Thanks
Is that sort of thing a diamond mod power, or do 10k+ members get that one too?
nope, that's all diamond
Sensible
and I only found that by coincidence anyway
it is not very well documented...
02:23
heheheh
at least not obvious in the initial guide
sounds like Stack Exchange :-P
Do you (i.e., diamond mods) still have the power to convert questions to CW?
@pentavalentcarbon Close enough to be a dupe of my answer here?
1
A: What is the correct way to calculate the rate constant for the reaction of NO and O2?

hBy2PyEither definition is acceptable, as long as you clearly identify relationship between the calculated rate value $R$ and the rates-of-change for each of the species in the system. In case (1), you've effectively calculated the rate constant defined as: $$ R_1 = k_1\ce{[NO]^2[O2]} = -{\mathrm...

doesn't sound like it
The reason for the discrepancy is the same - the rate constant can differ based upon how you define it
I agree the question is not the same, though, so dupe is probably not warranted.
Oh, no... that looks like a book typo
There's no way the decomp rate at [H2O2] = 10 is greater than the decomp rate at [H2O2] = 14.45
@hBy2Py Pinging @Mart about this. (Relates to an idea about part of the 'old bad questions' meta post.)
02:56
ummm, just had a meeting... lemme take a looky
@hBy2Py Oh, the homework question writer was playing tricks. Yomen's answer is spot-on
@pentavalentcarbon I think this one is actually ok
It would be better if it were written more generally, though.
sigh
Yet another canonical candidate.
btw, @Mart, you lead the edits race: data.stackexchange.com/chemistry/query/654095/…
@hBy2Py half a year ago my lead was a lot larger
Believe that - @ortho's been quite the active seal
Jan is also coming strong
but he's a no show... guess very busy with getting ready and stuff
mmph, yes - if he's writing, he'll be silent the whole way through, more'n likely
I'm half-mad with anticipation to get to 10k
Been so occupied (some unnecessarily) with SC work that I haven't been posting much at all on the main site.
03:06
@pentavalentcarbon I think the q is quite good actually; free comment flags though ;)
i think he has or already had his defence
maybe vacation or prepping for post doc
Got a couple in the pipeline, though -- one on airhuff's hexamethylbenzene question, and one as a followup to the comment train here
Oh, no kidding, didn't know
I knew he'd had a committee meeting; didn't realize it was his defense
btw, @penta, I (think I) can now resolve these questions in the comment thread. Post forthcoming.
@hBy2Py @pentavalentcarbon one should always remember that the fock equation is only a psudo-eigenvalue equation
@Martin-マーチン Because of numerical error?
no, because the fock operator depends on its solution
Ungh, that's weird in my brain
It uses eigenproblem solution methods, but the problem itself is not a "fully proper eigenvalue equation"?
similarly I don't think $PSP=P$ is necessarily true until convergence but that's not exactly the same thing
So ... certain properties of eigenvalue problems can't be reliably/safely applied to it?
CLEANUP ACTION completed [reaction] co-tags with [theoretical-chemistry]
@hBy2Py well, I would say so
it only looks like an eigenwert problem, but it actually is not
I guess I don't really have a full understanding of eigenvalue problems -- all the implications
03:29
for the record I think this is pretty uncommon
which 'this'?
yeah i think that is only HF
Something like a pseudo-eigenvalue problem (not to be confused with SVD and other decompositions).
But it's the recursive definition that throws the wrench in, right?
Ok, I'll stop hammering the front page now.
Yes, that's unusual
03:31
$F = f(\Psi) = f(g(P))$?
ok
Wow
you cannot take the operator, throw it on a waffle function and get an eigenvalue, because the operator changes depending on the wafer function
Melanie's rep is less than twice her total edit count
@Martin-マーチン Ah. "Eigenproblem solution methods work for the equation, but it's not an eigenequation." ?
(Same thing as I said above, but I think I actually get it now.)
Boooo, CREATE FUNCTION is disabled in SEDE. :-(
Someone must be on their phone. What's a waffle function?
@pentavalentcarbon i have an odd sense of humour
I liked it :-)
Now if you can just work some maple syrup into the metaphor...
"can't get eigensyrup," maybe
lol ...
but true
03:47
whoa.
I just had insane deja vu, working on this query
04:22
@hBy2Py why is this off-topic again?
Why is this closed? It's not even homework. @hBy2Py @M.A.R.
-3
Q: How can I tell what are the products and the reactants in an equilibrium?

NedIf someone could clear this up for me that would be great. Here are my thoughts: if an equilibrium reaction is constantly producing both reactants and products, how do you decide which is which? Here is an example question: Given the reaction, at equilibrium, it was found that $[\ce{C}] = \pu...

 
3 hours later…
07:41
cleanup action: chemistry.stackexchange.com/questions/72053/… (closed, down-voted, m.)
 
3 hours later…
10:29
@Martin-マーチン That's not HW. I VTC'd as unclear. Dunno why
@hBy2Py I just opened up a slot for 16:00 to 18:00. I will be available and retagging
10:56
@Martin-マーチン Overzealous HW close reasoning
I really want ortho's new close reason active
@Martin-マーチン This one too, ortho's new close reason would be great -- basically, "closed because not even wrong"
(@M.A.R.)
I mean, sums of concentrations in a reaction quotient expression...?
@Martin-マーチン forgot that that existed too..
11:12
@ortho, do diamond mods still have the power to convert Q's to CW?
Yes it should be possible
For answers it is and I'm sure it's no different for questions.
Regular users can't CW their questions currently
Saw it on Meta.SE, and confirmed on the site
(I ask b/c it relates to a potential strategy for an aspect of Mart's meta post for potential cleanup)
(for poor questions with great answers, a mod could CW the question for the community to improve)
(Stack Exchange Jeopardy, of a sort)
11:27
I think you can just edit the question in such cases.
Most of these users are inactive anyway
I've edited Q's to fit the A's before
Sorry but I have shifted the Walsh diagram and your discussion of the frontier orbitals to my answer. I really don't wish to steal any credit from you (everything you said is 100% correct), but this question is old and the current answers have zero discussion of the Walsh diagram and frankly, do not really match the question. By moving around the information I am only hoping to present a more logical flow of discussion for future visitors. — orthocresol ♦ Sep 7 '16 at 17:33
It was either that, or flagging every other answer as NAA.
@orthocresol One could, but a CW question would diminish any element of a "why should I spend a bunch of time so someone else can get rep?" mindset.
11:49
@orthocresol only mods can convert q to cw
@Martin-マーチン You still have that power, though?
On the Meta.SE post, I think at one time they were debating even removing the power from diamond mods.
0
Q: The Great Retagging Event -- Episode 2: Spring Cleaning

M.A.R.Finally, TRE is back, and we've got stuff to do. The next TRE will be held at 2017/04/08 16:00 – 18:00 UTC. Register for the event here. This episode will feature the following tags: reaction questions: As we see fit, we will retag ones that are worth it, delete ones that deserve it, and ...

Edits welcome
@hBy2Py last time i checked: yes
but what's the difference? It's not recommended
12:29
@Ortho @Mart could you feature that post up there? The event is set to Saturday so we'd need some exposure ASAP
Mart (づ。◕‿‿◕。)づ
@M.A.R. patience little padawan, patience. A drunk one is only as fast as whatever... forgot the beginning of the senten....
@M.A.R. doesn't help... too many stuffs in the side bar...
at least i don't see stuff
12:48
@Martin-マーチン Remove the first Spring Cleaning
If such a thing is possible
nope... that's the header event that leads to the faq
the other one points to the first chat event
everybody who doesn't have a watch on meta won't be there anyway...
@Martin-マーチン We don't need to link to the FAQ when I have it linked in the event announcement
I made the announcement specifically to enable everyone to edit as much as they want during april... i'm not moving away from that. The chat event is a gimmick, it's already featured. when there is some meta stuff happening on the mother site it's not my fault... also that editing thing is blocking the space.
@Martin-マーチン Oh
But you didn't make that clear
So I'm not sure it had the intended effect :/
Shrug They will probably end up on the meta post
It will probably appear in the Hot Meta Posts
So it will gain visibility
Or maybe it will appear somewhere when the cache refreshes
13:06
we have too little influence on that little box...
 
8 hours later…
20:58
@ortho @Mart @M.A.R. @heath @Melanie Well, change of plans. Shog9 just burninated .
wow
that's some crazy effort yall
We knew it was coming sometime in the relatively short term
No, it's not crazy effort
sane effort
It's the SE team forcibly detagging from everything
19
Q: Should we delete and blacklist [reaction]?

Martin - マーチン I am officially changing the post to a tag-blacklist-request. I think, and so far there was no objection, that it is a meta-tag, and that it is not helpful. Unlike homework or reference-request it basically only serves as a placeholder. I would say it is on par (maybe a tiny bit better) with ...

21:01
The information is still in Sunday's SEDE dump
I (or someone) will just need to curate some question lists off-site for people to work from.
21:12
whooooo...
hmm.....
well....
this is why cleanup has to occur prior to any action... and we got it the wrong way round this time..
The tag information is still there in this week's SEDE dump
SHould be possible to pull out lists of links
ok
manually?
or hopefully a less labour intensive way..
Nah, should be possible to generate active links
Pull the query results over to meta posts, maybe, or a dedicated chat room
the links should auto-activate
Testing:
http://chemistry.stackexchange.com/q/32416inorganic-chemistryelectrochemistryreactionredoxhttp://chemistry.stackexchange.com/q/59690organic-chemistryreactionredoxcarbonyl-compoundsselectivityhttp://chemistry.stackexchange.com/q/59704inorganic-chemistryreactionredox
Nope
OK
@ortho
I can copy the links out from this query: data.stackexchange.com/chemistry/query/654628/…
Run the query on all the remaining co-tags
Stuff the results into some Google Docs
And then people can delete things question by question as they clean them up
21:33
Ok, seems good
Need any help?
"What is Redox reaction? Is it really possible?" doesn't sound very promising...
3
Q: What is Redox reaction? Is it really possible?

Ravindra SahayI was a reading a book that a senior gave me, it said that redox is a type of reaction in which both reduction and oxidation take place. I know about oxidation but not reduction. After googling reduction reaction I found it's simply just the opposite. But then how can a reduction and oxidation ta...

heheh
no, redox reactions are like quantum mechanics and bigfoot.
Totally fictional.
@orthocresol Sure, anybody can should be able to do this, depending if there are quirky technology differences/behaviors. One sec
GDoc is here:
Query is here:
For me, it works to simply copy-paste the contents of the formatted query results into the GDoc
The query showing the list of co-tags is here: data.stackexchange.com/chemistry/query/650071/…
Booooooo.... it only copies the set of records shown on screen. :-(
Oy.
that's really weird
Well, it gets all the content if you check for "text-only results"
it just doesn't paste as links
21:44
ok
if you insert a space after each link, it'll autoconvert
but that's really annoying
it's ok, people can copy/paste each link
I think i've figured out a way
okay
I found one too, I think
Copy textonly results to Notepad
Recopy over to Excel
Excel 'text tocolumns'
You can download a csv file of the results, too.
Well, if you want to be FANCY about it.
Ok. Do what you can; I'll be back at some point tonight to finish up if you don't get through them all
21:47
ok
Probably go from the top down; otherwise it'll be a pain to be sure we've gotten all of them
hold on
oh ok
nvm
Should we just not bother doing the co-tags/
Should be possible to get all of them in one go.
yeah
sounds good
actually
Full set of links is now in the GDoc
21:53
that's every single reaction question that existed on sunday?
In the end, this might make things go faster
Yep
ok
i'll try and figure out a way to number them
730 Q's
why?
OH
duh
avoiding collisions, right. :-)
ummm
hold on
There, now they're sorted by post ID
we can just declare ranges of post IDs for people to work on
21:56
sec
Once a post is addressed, it just gets deleted from the doc
Did you make a query for that?
I'll revise the two-tag one for later use with, e.g.,
And, just in case: Three-tag query
22:14
@hBy2Py Ok, I've just numbered them in sequential order, I think that's slightly easier for people to follow. I've also taken out ~14 or so questions which had been cleaned up after last Sunday.
22:28
@orthocresol Looks good!
I've also cleared 1 through 5.
Well, it now seems that much of the meta post is outdated. :/
Let's deal with that later, I guess.
Gotta tend to some other stuff
23:37
Short answer:
cleanup action chemistry.stackexchange.com/a/28113/402 answer deleted (ortho)
cleanup action chemistry.stackexchange.com/questions/41769/… Nuked. This guy posted the same question twice (note that the duplicate question was posted by the same person), it should have been nuked long ago. (ortho)
Discussion on this question:
cleanup action chemistry.stackexchange.com/questions/47348/… edited since it has a decent answer (ortho)
Terrible question, but phenomenal answer. Should we keep the answer and re-ask the question? Edit the question to fit the answer?
Delete this one?
cleanup action chemistry.stackexchange.com/questions/71485/… Will be roomba'd, so no need to do anything. (ortho)
And this one:
cleanup action chemistry.stackexchange.com/questions/15192/… nuked (ortho) I could've downvoted and roomba would've cleaned it up, so I just took the liberty.
Another poorly worded question with a good answer:
-2
Q: Which is more basic: aniline or pyridine?

NatiMPlease explain why, thank you very much.

I'm done for now, but thought these would be good to discuss.

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