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00:02
Oop, heyo @Nilknarf
@user21820 Yeah, it made sense. Unfortunately, it seems that I didn't express the purpose of my question very well and lots of answerers misinterpreted it.
@SimplyBeautifulArt Hi!
My fibonacci sum obsession is still going
How'd your question go?
I've calculated
$$\sum_{k=1}^\infty \frac{1}{F_{6k-1}F_{6k+5}}$$
Which question?
ur Fibonacci series thing
Oh. Nothing useful so far.
00:04
I also found out today that$$\lim_{x\to-1^+}\sum_{n=1}^\infty p_nx^{n-1}=+\infty$$
It's looking like I'll never find a nice value for $\Phi_1(1)$ (but perhaps in terms of the reciprocal fib. constant)
Where $p_n$ is the $n$th prime.
What is $p_n$?
Oh
The question made the HNQ x'D
17
Q: Alternating prime series

Simply Beautiful ArtI was curious to know what the following limit is: $$\lim_{x\downarrow-1}\sum_{n=1}^\infty p_nx^{n-1}=\lim_{x\downarrow-1}(2+3x+5x^2+7x^3+11x^4+\dots)$$ where $p_n$ is the $n$th prime. I graphed the first 6 or so partial sums: but they converge terribly slow. WolframAlpha doesn't seem to ha...

How can that be?
00:06
And I very much find it non-trivial :P
Does it not oscillate?
Hm?
You can't take the limit into the series
Ugh.
I see... that's interesting...
00:08
Related:
9
Q: Alternating prime zeta function

Simply Beautiful ArtPrevious question: Alternating prime series I've been looking at the following function, defined on $\Re(s)>0$. $$\mathcal P^\star(s)=\sum_{n=1}^\infty\frac{(-1)^{n+1}}{(p_n)^s}$$ where $p_n$ is the $n$th prime. This function is clearly analytic on $\Re(s)>0$, and so I was curious enough to t...

Ooh
Wow, it seems like a question like that would receive a bit more attention.
*Shrugs*
Really want to brute-force take Taylor expansions until I hit $s=-1$
Is "nice question" also the badge that you have the most of?
But primes are not nice numbers for this lol
Haha, of course not.
Ah, second-most
Twice as many "nice answers"
Dang
Answering is easier than asking for me
Haha, yeah. Unfortunately I've lost my motivation to answer probability/combinatorics question (they get rather tedious to explain), and those made up a large chunk of my past answers.
00:13
hi guys
Broke 47k rep today
Hey @LeakyNun
Hello!
Haha
I'm working on an article for the fibonacci quarterly
00:15
It turns out that I can compute $\Phi_n(x)$ for some values of $x$ that are roots of unity
Amazingly still in top 20 as far as rep earned this year, even though I haven't done much for the past few months...
@Nilknarf Oh nice
Jeez, I've listened to this song at least 50 times today: youtube.com/watch?v=6mitCcl38rA
I've been listening to that lately
Lol, the background in yours is pretty weird
Yeah, I'm confused about why it's stuck in my head
@Nilknarf What language?
00:22
French
It's about a guy who gets stoned at the mall XD
The lyrics happen to be hilarious
Yeah, it's kind of strange
UGH I hate roots of unity
Oh, while you're here, mind if I ask if you think this answer is overly upvoted and deserves a downvote?
00:26
Witty, yes... but better suited as a comment. (-1)
I'm also cross eyed on how it managed to get 120 upvotes.
I can understand a few... but that's not a few.
Sigh... If I posted an answer like that and it became one of my most upvoted answers, I would start to doubt my worth on MSE.
Kinda like that answer I posted to a notation question that received 100+ votes.
Same.
But tbh
My most highly upvoted answer, I feel pretty stupid about it
And I wanna delete it to be honest
What is it?
Meh, you can find it on my answer page.
It basically says that "This is indeed polynomial division"
00:30
Don't delete it. Here's how I think about it: the points you get for stupid answers make up for the points you don't get for really good but unnoticed answers to questions that are difficult for the layperson to understand.
@Nilknarf nah, would much rather bump my better answers up and let people look at them more often then my stupidly upvoted ones.
Me too, but it doesn't work like that (sadly)
If only "upvote transplants" existed
Yeah. Much sads lol
Say, did you ever get around to showing 3003 is the only number which appears exactly 8 times in Pascal's triangle?
00:33
Um, I don't believe you've asked me that question before
Heh heh, want to have your mind blown?
I mean
Not literally
$$\sum_{k=1}^\infty \frac{1}{F_{100k-1}F_{100k+99}}=\frac{1}{F_{100}\phi}-\frac{F_{98}}{F_{99}F_{100‌​}}$$
Hee hee hee
Where $\phi$ is the golden ratio, btw
Seems like it should follow from the recursive relations you wrote on your question?
00:39
This is highly non-trivial. Note that in the series definition of $\Phi_n(x)$, the summand is $\frac{1}{F_{k}F_{k+n}}$, not $\frac{1}{F_{ak}F_{ak+n}}$.
Summand? Is that the right word? Like integrand?
Oh
Dear goodness
Heh heh heh
And yeah, I call it "summand"
Well
It seems to be of the following form:
And all thanks to the roots of unity!
$$\sum_{k=1}^\infty\frac1{F_{ak}F_{a(k+1)}}$$
00:40
Right
Dear lord
Well, you can have fun with that
Something like that
Oh yeah, and you should learn Ruby :P
yeah, now you see why I'm going to send something to fib. quarterly
yeah, I should
Gah, I have so much stuff to learn
00:42
I wish I could just pause time for like 5 years to I could learn Ruby, Python, Spanish, French, and master Complex Analysis :P
lol
Immortality would be nice too
Assuming you don't age and ur brain don't rot...
Sigh, maybe science can make me immortal someday
Or I can join a religion and believe that I'm immortal
lol
Maybe we all become immortal after death in some alternative world
Oh yeah, and btw, you should probably watch the anime "No Game No Life"
I'll add it to my to-do list XD
Well, did ur christmas go well?
00:50
It went well by default, seeing as how it was so uneventful
Basically a normal day
You?
I gtg in a min
Lol
Pretty much same
Well, happy New Years to u
 
3 hours later…
03:53
@Nilknarf Okay. Well my answer does address your intended question, if my claim (uniform computability of elementary integrals over elementary bounds) holds. Unfortunately, I do not know enough to verify that claim.
@Nilknarf Same for me. Normal days are good. I like predictable things. =)
@user21820 hi!
Hello! I'm just in the midst of writing a response to you in the Logic room. =)
@user21820 so your days are closed under conjugation?
@LeakyNun Har har..
Did you see my post about normal subgroups?
what post?
03:59
3
A: Why is the fact that a quotient group is a group relevant?

user21820The existing answers are about groups, but here is a more general perspective. Suppose we have some kind of structure $S$ with a substructure $T$, meaning that $T$ inherits the operations and predicates from $S$ and is closed under those operations. We could ask the general question of whether...

And I have no idea why someone downvoted it.
It explains what I consider to be the underlying reason for why we need normality to form the quotient group.
you do have a strange way to write equivalence classes
"For any x∈T it is clear that a∘x∼a" is it really clear?
@LeakyNun I'm sure it was clear to me when I wrote that, but it's not to me now. It's supposed to be because x~e since x∈T. I thought I had specified that T contains the identity, but I can't find it.
04:15
@user21820 well it's a substructure
so it contains every constant specified
Aha!
Great, so it is clear indeed.
Hahahaha..
I used e∈T in the second part of that paragraph as well.
But I should edit to make that clear, since it has successfully confused you and me for a while.
@LeakyNun Thanks for helping; is the edited version better now? =)
In fact, the language underlying S,T does not even need to have the constant for the identity e, because we can prove uniqueness of identity in T, so T cannot have a different identity from that of S.
@user21820 say the same for i
"g∗H∗g−1∈H" blatant error?
@user21820 why, in your opinion, do many people have difficulties processing universal quantifiers and existential quantifiers?
the former, more so than the latter
04:32
Wait something is subtle with what I just said. The ring Z*Z has subring Z*{0} but the multiplicative identities are different.
It only works for groups, which I do have there.
@user21820 what?
Z*{0} is not a subring because it does not preserve the constant
it does depend on whether your ring axioms have multiplicative identity
@LeakyNun That's if we have a constant symbol. I claimed we do not even need a constant symbol for the identity.
Basically, if e is an identity of S and i is an identity of T then i·i = i = i·e and hence i = e (by cancellation in S).
but there is no multiplicative cancellation
There is for a group.
Which is what I had in my post.
whatever
04:37
@LeakyNun Yeap. Should be "⊆".
why is it permissible in proof assistants to define 1/0=0?
@LeakyNun In my experience of teaching, there is no difference between the two. Anyone who properly understands one properly understands the other too.
@user21820 well, exists means that such particular thing exists
whereas people are prone to ignore the universal quantifier
Well those people don't actually understand the exist quantifier either. If you probe deeply you may find that out.
-- "gHg'=H for all g" and "gHg'⊆H for all g" are equivalent
-- but this example shows gHg'⊆H where gHg' is not equal to H!
@user21820 how would you elaborate on that?
04:42
@LeakyNun That sort of people might object to "For any natural n there exists a prime p bigger than n." with "If you say p exists, what is it?"
They do not understand "exists" as a "sentence-forming construct".
how do you help those people?
I don't think they object to that statement though...
I may experiment on humans, wait
@LeakyNun What example are you referring to here? I don't get what's the error.
@LeakyNun Hahaha!
@user21820 the "counter-example" is for a specific g
04:46
@LeakyNun Sorry I still don't get it.
What is the first phrase in my post that is wrong?
@user21820 so the other person is able to pick a specific g and H such that gHg' is properly contained in H
no
ugh
6 mins ago, by Leaky Nun
-- "gHg'=H for all g" and "gHg'⊆H for all g" are equivalent
-- but this example shows gHg'⊆H where gHg' is not equal to H!
this is related to the universal quantifier part of our discussion
not the part about your post
the first sentence is correct
the second sentence is thus an incorrect objection
I see.
The same goes with existential quantifiers.
The error in your example is that "forall" and "iff" do not commute.
Same with "exists" and "iff".
right
If you see more errors with "forall", it could be due to a biased sampling since basic mathematics uses more "forall" than "exists".
For example PA− uses a vast majority of "forall" quantifiers.
indeed
04:52
@LeakyNun In my opinion, all students (whatever their specialization) should learn programming to at least be able to write recursive programs.
That would force them to become 100% precise in that programming language.
And that would translate to being able to understand what it really means to be precise elsewhere, especially in logic.
Order of quantifiers is trivially seen to be important when you understand that order of loops in your code can make or break it.
exists.elim: let $\varphi$ and $\psi$ be formulas with $n$ being the only free variable. Then, $[\exists n \varphi] \to [(\forall n \varphi) \to \psi] \to \psi$
is this right?
No. Your conclusion should also have "exists".
I don't think so
at least in the version I know there is no exists
Then what is the free variable n doing in the conclusion?
@LeakyNun You need ψ to not have n free then.
right
can other variables be free?
insert sickle and hammer
04:58
If you're working in a Hilbert-style system then yes there can be other free variables, which would be bound by outer contexts in a Fitch-style system.
why do they need to be bound?
Anyway should we move this to the Logic room?
I'm not owner here so I'll just quote.
 
2 hours later…
07:23
@LeakyNun: I fail to understand what's going wrong with Math SE and the chat rooms, at least recently...
oh i’m enjoying the drama
I know. You cheeky fellow. You got two dramas in one day.
Wow I managed to write "write" as "right" without noticing. First time in a while.
@LeakyNun: I just realized that @SimplyBeautifulArt tells us to be free to do our calculus. Sequent-calculus, anyone?
you may like the drama here between me and typhon
07:51
@user21820
Thanks. You just gave me a clearer example of total lack of grasp of logic. I shall record it in the Logic room before I trash the conversation.
08:21
@LeakyNun: I think I may have a slight allergy to nuts.
@user21820 I think you mistook him for another user once again.
Nope. I've been around much longer than you. In the past his username was "thegreatduck" and many many things occurred, and the moderators had to step in, at one point even suspending him for misrepresentation of facts.
I was not even involved then. I was just a silent drama observer.
do you have... concrete examples?
Sigh...
You're driving me up the wall...
like humpty dumpty?
08:36
The most I can recall from my vague memory is that someone claimed that he kept lying in chat and that that was the reason for banning him.
Anyway why are you talking about him? I'm talking about nuts. I'm slightly allergic to them. They probably cause me slight heat rash.
 
1 hour later…
09:45
@user21820 I like lambda calculus more

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