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10:30
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Q: How to politely ask people from East Asia to give way?

Rodolfo PerottoniI've arrived in Australia 9 months ago and I've noticed that often when asking people from East Asia to "give way" they will simply ignore me or even answer a "yes" but not move at all. This is a situation that at least my wife, friends and work mates also faced a lot of times. Some examples: ...

In case they block your exit of a train, you can use the internationally understood, if rude, method of just walking on. Hands in but elbows out, aimed at body parts of theirs will improve the delivery of the message and will teach for next time.
Tom
Tom
You mentioned two out of three were texting / using their phones. This type of rudeness extends across ethnic boundaries. People seem to think their texting / social posting is far more important than the needs or safety of people around them.
Is it really an Asian problem, rather than a tourist problem though? I assume those are Chinese tourists rather than local Australians with Asian roots.
Unfortunately this seems a cultural problem with young people pretty much everywhere. I often wonder what is the required IQ to leave pathways open in corridors, point of passages and doors and not keeping hanging out and talking there.
@JonathanReez Definitely Asian problem. It's common for anyone living in any of the big cities of Australia.
10:30
"it's just that they all have the standard Asian look (stretched eyes)" Oh my. Hint: when you feel you have to start your question with "No, I'm not being xenophobic", you need to rewrite it.
@Tom It's not that people think that their gadget use is more important; it's just that using any such gadget requires a certain amount of concentration and that requires blocking out one's surroundings.
This has nothing to do with ethnicity, you're just afraid of getting close to a stranger and you don't know what "excuse me" means.
user97303
The information about the "stretched eyes" is not relevant, moreover you spent the first 3-4 opening lines describing how this is about Asians, as if somehow that is the only possible explanation. Nevermind that various east Asian cultures are very different from each other and that this can very well be a problem in misinterpreting English. Are these people distracted? Are they tourists? Please rewrite your question.
Based on your examples as written, it seems like in most of the cases they are deliberately stopping you which seems unlikely. I say this because the average person would understand what you are trying to do in these situations even if there was a language barrier. If I am in a foreign country and the bus has just stopped and the doors open I'm pretty certain what a tap on the shoulder and a gentle but firm nudge means. It makes me think you are not properly conveying what you want and you may need to be more direct if people are distracted by technology.
I'm not clear why any of the references to a particular ethnic group are necessary to ask this question
10:30
I had edited to take out Asian, but it would make some of the answers gone strange. So I rolled it back.
I've been to China and South Korea recently, it is custom to shove through people when getting on/off trains. Bumping into someone is just a thing that happens so often no one (other than western people) bother saying "sorry"
Tom
Tom
@DavidRicherby - the fact that people feel texting while driving is OK, shows unequivocally that they feel texting is MORE important than safety and other people's lives. And the fact that they stop in the middle of stairs, in front of counters, etc to text or post also shows that they put their need to text or post above the needs of people around them. Civility and politeness went out the window with smart phones.
Internet police is so boring. My question is 100% related to ethnicity - come to Australia and see by yourself if you think I'm targeting Asians just for the sake of the example.
@LightnessRacesinOrbit we're all grown up here. Guessing people's ancestry because of their look is common and not offensive at all.
Bob
Bob
@RodolfoPerottoni And here I was wondering why we had a reputation for being racist. FYI, I've lived in Australia all my life and I've not noticed any pattern near what you are implying, much less one specific to a certain ethnicity.
@Tom: It has nothing to do with smartphones. There are plenty of people of all ages who have a talent to pick locations for their group conversation, bag repacking, map reading, etc. that are right in the path of the main flow of people.
Tom
Tom
10:30
@ormapper - the fact that other reasons cause people to stand in the way does not eliminate the fact that smartphones have contributed to a major decrease in politeness. But of course I expect some more rebuttals from phone addicts.
@RodolfoPerottoni Yeah, I have been to Australia and I did not notice this. In fact, I live in Asia and I have not noticed this.
@Bob should've visited CBDs during peak time more often then, mate. By the way, "reputation for being racist" - take me out of this.
It is not unique to Australia and not unique to Asians there or anywhere in the world. And it is likely not all people from the same part of Asia you see, you just are not educated enough to make a distinction. But with your question you paint a very wide stripe over all Asians.
If I replace "Asian" with "Parisian" in this post that works too ;)
Simply judging by the controversy so far, either the ethnicity should be edited out of the question or it should be closed as a bad fit for this exchange. It's not really generating helpful Q/A as much as discussion.
10:30
Taking this as racist is the silliest damn thing. This guy is trying to understand how to be polite in a culture other than his own. Cultural norms are a real thing. Taking them seriously and trying to adapt to them rather than expecting the world to act the way you expect from your own upbringing is the least racist thing I can think of. Just don't expect every "Asian" you run into to be from the same Culture or Marget Cho will make fun of you.
There are ways to describe cultures that span huge swathes of the world that are more appropriate than "the standard Asian look (stretched eyes)".
@LightnessRacesinOrbit The passage has been edited out a long time, so stop bickering for the past. Please give an example for a sentence which describe the problem succinctly and accurately which you would find appropiate.
@ThorstenS.: I'm not "bickering for the past"; I am responding to a comment that was addressed to me. Not to you. There is no need for you to get involved.
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Sorry, I needed to scroll up many comments to understand what was meant. It looked like you were involved in the debate below. Mea culpa.
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I guess you don't have anything else to do besides creating a storm in a teacup. What's so offensive about stretched eyes? Asians are the only people in the world with this look. Blonde and strong bodies are usually german. Dark hair, swearing and strong body language is common among italians. Maori descendant? Can spot one from a good distance. If you're that easily offended by the look you inherited from your family than you're the problem. I take pride in my Italian genetic. It's what defines me and what makes me different than you. You need to grow up, mate.
10:30
I wasn't "offended". At least, not until you decided to resort to comments like "you need to grow up, mate". I have flagged you for moderator attention. Good day.
@RodolfoPerottoni We don't doubt your question is related to ethnicity, that's what you are being blamed for. And the implicit subtext of “shut up if you are not Australian and do not share my prejudice” isn't making it any better.
@Relaxed I've edited my question 2 times to clearly state that this happens more often with people of Asian ethnicity, but someone else edited it removing all "asian" references. It is now clear to me that some here consider calling someone "Asian" bigotry or prejudice. Go figure. People just care about being politically correct nowadays that even a simple question like this ends up in unnecessary fights. C/C Moderators: I'm someone living somewhere I don't belong but still people think I'm in position of prejudging foreigners. Ban me or not, there was no bad intentions in this question.
Its worth pointing out that localisation still makes an impact, here. We have many areas with a very centralised culture, and from experience, people in these areas are more likely to have a language gap. I worked for 4 years in a mostly Arabic area that neighboured a mostly Asian area, and there was a very clear difference in the average understanding of English than in comparison to other areas of similar ethnicity. But many will just smile and nod, I assume in hopes that this will answer whatever your saying to them.
@RodolfoPerottoni It's very easy to convince yourself of that but you already got several people telling you it isn't so in their experience. And you wrote much more than this in all your comments and earlier version. Yet you ignore critics and prefer to play the “politically correct” card to ignore criticism. That's part of the problem. Nobody wants to ban you but there is something to learn in all this. Note that prejudice need to be conscious and having no bad intentions doesn't make the question sensible.
One way to approach this in a more sensitive way would have been to ask your actual question and add a single sentence to the effect of “It seems this happens more often with people who look Asian” or something like that. It gets your point across. Everything else if full of assumptions, silly generalizations (you realise how big Asia is for example?) and, yes, prejudice, whether you like to hear it or not.
There is one thing I would like to ask. The phenomenon seems to be genuine according to the answers and it seems to have a completely innocent explanation ("Excuse me" is misunderstood and Asian people are accustomed to crowded environments and may not feel to be in the way). Given the attention and positive reinforcements the question got could we change the question to "How to politely ask Asian people to give way", describe the experience and ask if the perception is true and what possible reason it has ? Discussing the OR's racism and bad first impression seems to be pointless now.
10:30
Ali's answer shows why the ethnicity is relevant. There are many Chinese international university students in Sydney who often don't or barely speak English and aren't aware of the customs. Which perfectly describes the situation. Now you can focus on how to be polite in these situations. Leaving the reference to ethnicity out makes the question a joke of itself. This is a very local question with a local answer, don't try to make it worldwide general.
You don't find it offensive/racist because you are not on the receiving end. And your assertion on describing people with physical appearance makes me wonder why it's not okay to call Africans black - they have pretty darn black skins.
Replace "Asian" with "smartphone zombie" and the question becomes a lot less offensive.
fgb
fgb
Africans have a wide variety of skin colors. They don't have "darn black skins". Calling people rude, or zombies is insulting, and puts the blame on them, rather than being accepting cultural differences.

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