Rogue One criticism and discussion

heather

16:29

hello

DanielSank

Yo.

So, I thought that for what the movie was, it was done really well.

It decided to be an action/heist movie and committed to that pretty well.

heather

yeah, I thought it was a great movie.

DanielSank

Definitely better than the prequel trilogy.

I could have done with less full-on action for the third act, but I have to say that what it did, it did really well.

heather

yep. though, to be honest, most people seem to hate the prequels, but I think they're fine.

DanielSank

My favorite is still Return of the Jedi.

@heather You know... the overarching plot of the prequels is, in my opinion, rather excellent. However, the acting is so bad that it ruins it for me.

Hmmmm, family Trivial Pursuit game is starting. Guess I have to go. Talk later?

heather

16:31

@DanielSank I don't think I know enough about acting to be able to see the errors.

DanielSank

I love talking about Star Wars.

heather

@DanielSank Sure, yeah!

Star Wars is the best =)

you should make a blog post about it

DanielSank

@heather Hmmm, about what exactly?

(You can always file an issue on my blog repo with post ideas!)

heather

The pros and cons of each Star Wars movie, how they compare, etc.

@DanielSank okay, I'll do that.

DanielSank

github.com/DanielSank/DanielSank.github.io

heather

16:32

Enjoy Trivial Pursuit!

DanielSank

ok back in a bit.

ciao

heather

yep, see you

DanielSank

18:16

@heather yo

I'm no acting expert, but I just didn't like watching the dialog etc. in the prequel trilogy. It just seemed kind of... flat or something.

And Jar Jar was annoying.

heather

yes, Jar Jar is the worst.

he was the worst part of the prequel trilogy.

the other bad part was wanting to smack the senate over the head every five seconds.

(because palpatine kept gaining power.)

DanielSank

yes

That's the point, of course.

But see, that's why so many people disliked the trilogy: the plot was good but the execution was so awful.

It would have been better if there were a reason that the senate couldn't get along.

Having characters just be stupid is not good storytelling.

I call this the "great sin of storytelling": when you make a character do something inexplicably dumb just to create conflict so your story can continue.

It's lazy.

Lots of movies and TV shows do it. ::shrugs::

I think Rogue One did a reasonable job. The rebellion didn't want to try to steal the plans because they didn't want to risk open conflict.

That's an understandable reason.

heather

yep.

the one thing that bugged me was how at the end, they shot off the top of the tower and created a shockwave instead of just directly hitting the base. why would they do that?

DanielSank

I liked the idea that Palpatine orchestrated the war to gain power. That's a pretty good story IMHO.

heather

^yes

DanielSank

18:24

I actually read one of the Star Wars books about the guy who trained Palpatine, Darth Sideous. It was pretty good.

heather

i'll have to look it up.

DanielSank

It's good. Sideous orchestrated a lot of what lead up to the Clone War.

heather

hmm, okay.

DanielSank

I kinda wish he were in the movies because he's a cool character.

oh well

heather

you know, speaking of the sith

i always thought darth maul was way better than count dooku

just cooler, you know?

::shrugs::

DanielSank

18:25

Yeah Dooku was annoying in the movies.

They gave Maul so little backstory though. He felt like a prop more than a character to me.

heather

yes! he just kind of entered, died, and that was that.

DanielSank

yeah exactly

I also couldn't stand the lightsaber fights in the prequels.

heather

especially when he was like the coolest sith, it was a bit disappointing.

DanielSank

They were so fancy-pantsy but with little gravitas.

@heather Right.

The fights in Empire and Jedi were so much better.

heather

@DanielSank really? I thought Yoda vs. Count Dooku was one of the best fights in all of the episodes.

DanielSank

18:27

@heather Interesting.

heather

In terms of just how it was choreographed and everything.

DanielSank

I like Luke vs. Vader in Empire because Luke loses.

@heather Oh yeah, that part was great.

It's just so surprising and important for the plot and the characters that Luke loses that fight.

How many movies are willing to have the hero lose?

heather

true, yes. but it is a series =)

in the end Luke wins.

DanielSank

Well, sort of. See, that's why I love Jedi so much.

Luke loses that fight too!

He's on the ground on the verge of death when Vader decides to save Luke.

I really, really love that.

heather

yes, it just fits correctly.

DanielSank

18:29

It's brilliant.

Luke never wins an important fight in the entire series!

Han saves his ass in the Death Star run in the first movie.

This is why I didn't like The Force Awakens as much as I would have... Rey just... wins.

Like... why do I want to see the next movie? She's already the best.

heather

yes! Han Solo is the smart one.

@DanielSank well, it was kind of a "hey, another deathstar! let's kill it!" movie. it was more to get the next trilogy rolling.

and, I mean, BB-8 was just so cute =P

DanielSank

@heather Right. It made sense for new viewers, but for me as an old fan it was kind of boring.

A third death star. Really?

heather

yeah, right?

DanielSank

@heather Heck yes!

I liked K2Swhatever in Rogue One.

heather

like, oh, the last one was huge, this one is even huger-er!

DanielSank

18:32

^

heather

@DanielSank yes, he was hilarious!

did you notice the little mouse droid?

that was following the storm troopers?

=)

DanielSank

It would have been marginally more interesting if they hadn't blown up Starkillier Base in the first movie. They could have at least left it around for a movie or two.

@heather Yes, absolutely.

100% noticed that.

That sound it makes...

heather

@DanielSank eh, but that's no fun

giant explosions are the best

DanielSank

@heather :|

Good plots are the best!

heather

I know, kidding =P

DanielSank

18:33

The original trilogy works so well because it takes three movies to bring everything together.

At the end of TFA I feel like the story was over and the next movie will just be totally separate.

heather

yeah, but now they have to develop a new storyline. if it was the same thing as 4 5 and 6 everyone would be bored.

DanielSank

We'll see. The directory of the next one is really good and has done some really original stuff.

heather

can't wait =D

DanielSank

@heather Uh, it was was the same as 4!

heather

well, okay

DanielSank

18:34

TFA is episode 4 almost exactly.

Obi-Wan dies in IV, Han dies in VII.

Both have a Death Star blowing up a peaceful planet(s).

Both have two villains, an evil bureaucrat military dude, and a black-robed masked Sith.

In both cases, the hero comes for a desert planet etc. etc.

heather

true, i guess i meant 7 = 4 and then 8/9 will be the next storyline.

but yeah i hadn't thought through all the similarities.

they are basically exactly the same.

i've been wondering who snook is

DanielSank

Meh, I blame JJ Abrams.

@heather EVERYONE WANTS TO KNOW ZOMG

I was really REALLY hoping he would be Darth Sideous.

But I'm pretty sure he's not because the Lucasfilm people said he's not :(

heather

i was thinking maybe it was palpatine back from the dead, but then i thought it through and realized it was ridiculous

in many ways

maybe some weird split after-death thing with darth vader? like, there's his good jedi ghost, that you see at the end of 6, and then his bad sith ghost, that you see as snook?

but i don't know if that really makes sense either.

DanielSank

@heather That would be crazy!

heather

@DanielSank, it would indeed, which is why i'm suggesting it =)

but it's probably just a new sith.

and kylo ren = apprentice.

DanielSank

18:42

Is he a sith?

heather

snook?

DanielSank

I'm not convinced of that.

heather

well i thought so.

snook -> some new emperor palpatine, was what i thought.

after my palpatine back from the dead ridiculousness, which lasted only a few minutes.

DanielSank

He says he saw the rise and fall of the Empire.

heather

oh, yeah, i'd forgotten that.

darth sidious....=P

DanielSank

18:45

It would be slightly weird for him to be a Sith since there are only supposed to be two Sith at a time. Then again, Vader tried to train an apprentice in secret...

@heather YES

But sadly, no.

heather

oops, just realized i completely mis-spelled, it's snoke

DanielSank

Darth Sideous almost figured out how to manipulate life, i.e. he could bring things back from the dead.

It would have made a cool story for him to still be alive because of that and be Snoke.

heather

hmm, the wiki article says he's a force sensitive male humanoid alien.

the wiki article also gives the impression that leia knew about him.

DanielSank

o_O

orly?

heather

"orly" ?

DanielSank

18:50

= "Oh, really?"

heather

gotcha

DanielSank

Hello @user140278, we're talking about TFA at the moment.

heather

hmm, lemme check wookieepedia

user140278

@DanielSank Hello. What is TFA ? :)

DanielSank

The Force Awakens

Oh, BTW @heather, the music that plays when Snoke is on screen is very similar to the music that plays in Episode III when Palpatine tells Anakin about Darth Sideous.

user140278

18:52

I see. :) I was attracted to the title of this chat room :P

heather

@DanielSank, ooh, cool

DanielSank

@user140278 Wanna talk about Rogue One?

What did you think?

heather

the star wars website itself says that snoke is "powerful with the dark side of the force"

I think we can call him a sith.

DanielSank

Eh, Sith is a particular thing, like Jedi. Maz is strong with the Force but she's not a Jedi.

Same with that dude at the beginning of TFA, what was his name...

Lor San Tekka

Anyway, back to Rogue One.

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