P.S. I am compiling with lualatex with -shell-escape and loading luatex85

@egreg thank you again, Enrico. And thanks to all the people here who considered my answers worthy of an upvote :-)

@karlkoeller Congratulations <3<3<3

@DiaaAbidou Look at the arara.log. There should be more info there.

@AlanMunn I wouldn't have thought how attractive girls in penguin suits can be :-)

@karlkoeller: CONGRATS

@DiaaAbidou If I recall correctly, there was a name clash with an old command line tool shipped with Windows (which had the name convert). I believe there might be a mention to this in the manual, hold on.

@CarLaTeX arara?

\standaloneconfig{convert={convertexe={convert}}}

Perhaps something along those lines...

@PauloCereda See comments of this answer: tex.stackexchange.com/a/339227/101651

@CarLaTeX Ah pardon

Good morning CarlaTeX and Paulo.

@karlkoeller Hi :-)

@Sebastiano Ciao!

@ChristianHupfer I never thought in the least that it was you. I just wanted to know if my question was clear and why there was a negative vote.

@CarLaTeX Ciao, again.

@karlkoeller welcome to the club:-)

@DavidCarlisle ooh

@DavidCarlisle Are there ducks in the club?

@PauloCereda finally we have some reliable high rep Italian in the 100K club

@PauloCereda real yes, rubber no

@PauloCereda I see an owl. No ducks.

@DavidCarlisle ooh

@HaraldHanche-Olsen what about that moderator/l3 bloke?

@DavidCarlisle ah yes :)

@DavidCarlisle you all should celebrate with pizza /wink wink

@HaraldHanche-Olsen ooh

Owls are cool

@PauloCereda is your credit card still good for a round of international pizza delivery

Speaking of owls, where's @Jake?

@DavidCarlisle Oh, right. Thumbnail too small, I didn't spot it.

@DavidCarlisle don't mention! :) At least in TUG 2018, they won't add the exchange rate...

@daleif Lars, I am happy to say that I will use memoir to typeset my (never ending) thesis. I was able to reproduce a ABNT-compliant document in less than 10 lines of code. :)

@PauloCereda Last seen 2 hours ago … but perhaps he doesn't like to hang out in chat?

@HaraldHanche-Olsen Hm it's been a while since I saw Jake here, but he's a regular here.

@JosephWright: can you mod-ping our resident owl #2? :)

I miss him!

@PauloCereda Well, sometimes real life interferes with the virtual one. He has posted only once since 2016.

@PauloCereda 10 lines of code, how many lines of text?

@HaraldHanche-Olsen oh

@DavidCarlisle uh-oh

@DavidCarlisle What – you expect him to do real work?

@HaraldHanche-Olsen no

@DavidCarlisle oi

@Jake ^^^

@JosephWright Thank you! :)

@DavidCarlisle I see we need to get l3build to work for the HO bundle!

@DavidCarlisle It is working for beamer so it's not impossible ...

@DavidCarlisle \based_on_ideas_from_frank_chris_and_david:nnn ;)

@JosephWright The HO bundle was built with arara. :)

@PauloCereda hehe

@daleif Thanks for maintaing a great class!

@PauloCereda have to admit, I don't do much work on it. Should be doing more.....

@daleif oh you certainly do, at least by providing support for users. :)

@PauloCereda Thanks for your help. This answer tex.stackexchange.com/a/411473/2288 fixed my issue.

@DiaaAbidou Ah cool! Nice to hear you managed to solve it!

@CarLaTeX Very kind, thank you

@DavidCarlisle I am honored by your welcome

@Sebastiano Buongiorno and thanks to you too, since I know you've upvoted answers of mine more than once :-)

@PauloCereda Thank you very much, my friend :-)

@JosephWright the difficulty with the ho- stuff is that the versions and dates are sprinkled everywhere with cross consistency checks on them everywhere else... (I think because in reality the dtx were generated by some generator from a private version) So I never touch them "by hand" but have some elisp to go and change the version numbers. If we knew dtx maintained in gh was going to be permanent I'd simplify it a lot (and split it up)

@PauloCereda actually I used bash github.com/ho-tex/hyperref/blob/master/mkctan

@DavidCarlisle I think we can be sure about the long-term: it's not going to move

@JosephWright see line 4 of the above link

@DavidCarlisle :)

@JosephWright yes but politics is politics. Speaking of which I was sorely tempted to create a gh repo for geometry over the weekend.....

@DavidCarlisle SAXON?!

@PauloCereda java -jar saxon9he.jar if you prefer

@DavidCarlisle <3

@PauloCereda given that no one else but me runs it (which is why it's called a "team" :-) it seemed Ok to reference my personal shell aliases...

@DavidCarlisle ah!

@PauloCereda Have you got couple spare minutes, please?

@yo' Always!

@PauloCereda Is there a chance to spend a few days in SP after TUG?

Like, visit something interesting and stuff?

@yo' Poking you in Hangouts. :)

ok

ooh mr. marmot is here

@DavidCarlisle Cwac :(. Broke my script.

@PauloCereda Cwac :-).

@cfr Cwac! Long time no see! <3

@DavidCarlisle Indeed

@DavidCarlisle One for an email?

@PauloCereda Bit distracted. I sent you something, though.

@DavidCarlisle Probably, yes. Upset my script.

@cfr Really?

@PauloCereda I am sorry, but I would like to create a configuration file for arara that uses pdfcrop and convert command of imagemagic. So, may I ask the question and give you its link?

@PauloCereda Really :).

@DiaaAbidou You know about standalone?

@cfr Yes, I do. However, I would like to know how to make such a rule in order to extend it later.

@cfr E-mail?

@DiaaAbidou Oh I am in a hurry, but I gladly can look at it later.

@PauloCereda Na. Snail-mail.

@PauloCereda I didn't know how long it would take to Brazil.

@cfr oooh

@cfr When did you send it?

@PauloCereda 8th Jan.

@cfr It will take a while, but it will arrive. :) I trust the Royal Mail thingy. :)

@cfr can't be there ;-). I sent something at the begin of december to @PauloCereda and it didn't arrive yet ;-(.

@UlrikeFischer ooh more mail

@UlrikeFischer, @cfr: Frank Mittelbach once received a parcel from me in February. I sent it in November. :)

@PauloCereda Ah. OK. Good to know. I know roughly how long things (usually) take to the US and Germany, but I've not tried Royal Mail's Brazil service yet.

@UlrikeFischer Thank you. I needn't worry yet, then. ;)

@PauloCereda My hope were flying high at the begin of january when you wrote something about a package delivery but then ...

@UlrikeFischer Air mail? There is another version which goes by ship. My mother used to send me tea that way when I lived in the States. (In an emergency, she'd air mail me a few tea bags in the meantime.) Then it depends whether you are lucky or not: when the container is full, they ship it. So it could go right away or it could be sitting waiting for an empty container to fill ....

@cfr sorry, blame git for not having svn version numbers

@JosephWright probably or upcoming team meeting (must answer that doodle thing)

@DavidCarlisle OK. Happy to blame git.

@cfr sending tea by ship to the states is notoriously unreliable

@DavidCarlisle Can I blame git for @PauloCereda not getting his post from me and @UlrikeFischer yet, too?

@cfr the only important thing is: it's not my fault, so yes.

@DavidCarlisle True. But did they use Royal Mail?

@cfr <3

@UlrikeFischer <3

@cfr we could try slingshot. :)

@DavidCarlisle ooh :)

@cfr the majesty

How I love typography in LaTeX: There's a package fancyhandout from 2017 that aims at "well-designed and clear structured handouts" and "sections are highlighted by underlining them".

@TeXnician The taste is like... :D

@TeXnician It's technically not impossible to screw up typographic rules with (La)TeX ;-)

@ChristianHupfer although I find if you add enough tables with coloured vertical lines, it tends to compensate for typographical errors made elsewhere.

@DavidCarlisle something that is possible with colortbl, I assume? ;-)

@DavidCarlisle As long as they are longtables and spread to text width and one can insert a footer like "Blame DPC" you could get away with it ;)

@TeXnician Such a footer with that content should be made a feature of the LaTeX kernel ;-)

@ChristianHupfer :)

@UlrikeFischer concerning chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/message/41598189#41598189: I tried to fix this with github.com/samcarter8/tikzducks/commit/… (not sure if this has any disadvantages...)

@TeXnician it is not really underlining, but a thick blue line below the section. (But there is a missing \fi in \maketitle, and the test for empty title/author in the header is wrong...).

Another interesting issue with` unicode-math: tex.stackexchange.com/q/411558/3929

@DiaaAbidou No need for a question, just tell me what you would like to achieve and I will try my best to help. :)

@CarLaTeX Grazie!

@PauloCereda Prego :)

@CarLaTeX Martello. :)

@AlanMunn ^^ no one will understand my sense of humour here :)

@PauloCereda Neither do I :)

@CarLaTeX "Prego" in Portuguese is nail, hence my hammer reference. :)

@PauloCereda Oooh 😆😆😆😆

@daleif See tex.stackexchange.com/a/411573/2388

@CarLaTeX, @DiaaAbidou: answer added.

@PauloCereda LOL!

@UlrikeFischer Well yes, but that's how the documentation describes it. Besides the code flaws you mentioned it also mixes LaTeX and TeX syntax (notably \def).

@ChristianHupfer -- some of us actually believe that there are some poor decisions in the basic latex document classes. (that's why some publishers roll their own, but keep the body structure compatible with the basic classes to make switching as easy as possible.)

@barbarabeeton as true as always!

@yo' -- i suppose if i really want to be nasty, i could write a paper listing the defects. but i'm uncertain how it would be received, since it's obviously much too late to do anything about it.

@barbarabeeton there's never too late for a rant :) /sarcasm

@barbarabeeton You can take your time, just try to get those thoughts published before the l3 team starts to work on own classes in the next decades ;)

on a more positive note, i saw the surgeon this morning, and i've pretty much been given the "all clear". i will have to continue to do some serious exercising, but i'm allowed to go back in the pool! hurrah! (have to figure out the best way to get in and out of pool, but in principle it's a very positive improvement.)

@barbarabeeton yippee!

@TeXnician -- one of my pet peeves is that entirely too many structural elements are treated as lists. that makes so many things very difficult, if not impossible. but that train has left the station, even for l3, i think.

@barbarabeeton Yes this is definitely a problem. And that's an internal issue, nothing to do with the typography itself, really.

@barbarabeeton I thought l3 did not even bother to create a real document-level interface for everyday tasks, so it could change coding of these details. But maybe I've misread that.

@AlanMunn -- didn't say all my objections were typographic; in fact, most of them are more structural in nature.

@TeXnician -- i haven't studied l3 closely enough to answer that with certainty. but i suspect that the structural design won't/can't change much and still be considered "latex". (i'm hoping for backward compatibility, for the sake of the ams publishing production. but in fact i'll be retired before that really matters, so it will be up to someone else to tame the new system.)

@barbarabeeton I know. Just remarking, since the discussion seemed to have started with typography.

@barbarabeeton I still prefer the basic classes over many so-called amendments. Together with a few packages like enumitem it's possible to improve some features of the standard classes.

@PauloCereda ^^^ is vim ever not in a weird mode?

@DavidCarlisle Or its users?

@DavidCarlisle weirdness is a feature viture of vi ;-)

@ChristianHupfer -- well, i admit to bias for the ams classes. the body structure is the same as the basic classes, with the addition of amsmath and amsthm, and (necessarily) rather different top matter. since those two packages are often added to the basic classes by mathematician authors, all that's necessary to change (from an author's point of view) is the top matter coding. we mostly get in trouble when authors add packages that redefine core commands and interfere with hyperref.

@barbarabeeton I am looking from a different point of using documents -- I am not writing articles or books for special journals or publishers. I 'design' work sheets, exams, collections of problems and solutions and other content

@DavidCarlisle Yes: When it's not running.

@HaraldHanche-Olsen always then

@barbarabeeton Yay!

@ChristianHupfer -- for that sort of document, honestly, i prefer plain tex. of course, the first task is always to define an effective user interface. (been there. done that, on the other hand, nearly all the "administrative publications" that were once created this way are now on line with xhtml, and never see paper or pdf.)

Gotta love maths:

@barbarabeeton I still prefer LaTeX and its standard classes ;-) And I need printed copies, not this xhtml thingies...

@yo' -- er, what is that?

@yo' Something printed in base 6? ;-)

@barbarabeeton intermediate results of an algebraic-number-theoretical experiment (basically dividing random numbers into 8 classes by some their properties). But I love the matrix feeling of it :-)

@ChristianHupfer Took me a while to spot any 5's. Anyhow, seen from a distance, the 1's form a dark pattern, kind of interesting. (For this, cataracts help.)

@HaraldHanche-Olsen there are even 3s, which is disappointing to us. (We would prefer having only 0,1,2,4, but God disagrees)

@yo' I don't see any 7s, though. But the pattern my brain insists on seeing makes me doubt that these numbers are independent.

@yo' I was hoping to see a pattern of 0 and 1 in the shape of a duck, at least.

@HaraldHanche-Olsen 7 would be almost disasterous!

i've just learned of a published report on knuth80: dn.se/nyheter/vetenskap/… (it's in swedish, but google translate does an okay job on it.)

@AlanMunn Some weird association made me recall Pizza Pizza in Toronto! From 1980! And they still have the same phone number, it seems. The stupid jingle on their radio commercials from back then still echoes in my head, after all these years: nine six seven – eleven eleven!

@HaraldHanche-Olsen Haha! Yes, that is still in my head too. It just shows how successful an ad campaign it was. (Although I don't think I've ever actually ordered one of their pizzas.)

and the result is beautiful:

@AlanMunn They do have pineapple for the pizza toppings. No duck, though.

^^ @barbarabeeton @HaraldHanche-Olsen @ChristianHupfer

@yo' Looks good indeed. From the same problem?

@HaraldHanche-Olsen yep. Easy to say is that each number above has its colour, and the colours "combine" in a way.

there's 100k "random" points in the drawing

@barbarabeeton You got to read it? It's behind a paywall for me. Maybe because I can read Swedish without google translate.

@ChristianHupfer You posted this comment tex.stackexchange.com/questions/411569/… after the OP had already updated the question with an article version based on my earlier suggestion.

@HaraldHanche-Olsen --actually, the link i was sent was for the google translation. that's translate.google.se/… but i don't know whether it might also be behind a paywall for you.

@yo' -- yes, that is pretty. (but i certainly can't say what it might mean.)

@barbarabeeton neither can I. If I could, we would have an interesting proof finished :-)

@barbarabeeton Thanks! That worked. I can now read it in any language other than Swedish. (I tried Norwegian. It translated “organ” wrong, into the word for organs of your body, like heart and lungs and such. The musical instrument is called by a different word in Norwegian.) It's odd, since Swedish and Norwegian both use those two words the same way.

@yo' Your numbers have interesting structures :)

@samcarter haha, well, you know that they are PSG, so this is (for me at least) quite insignificant? :)

@HaraldHanche-Olsen -- in this question (and answers) there's a colon -- differently entered in the two answers -- and i don't know which would be correct: tex.stackexchange.com/q/411571 can you please enlighten me? (and the op and persons answering)

@WillRobertson It's amazing how we can use software for years without knowing what it can do! This of course explains why @PauloCereda is still using Vim.

@AlanMunn -- here's a typographic conundrum for which i have only a hackish workaround. mathematician authors tend to include math in their titles, no matter how strongly it is recommended that they don't. traditional book and journal styles set running heads in small caps. but this looks ridiculous when a "tall" math letter is included. the workaround is to set the running head in regular caps, but this is kerned more tightly than small caps. other ideas?

@DavidCarlisle -- or a virtual font with slightly different metrics. possible, but kind of a pain.

@barbarabeeton shrink the maths (might not work if your small caps require a lot of shrinking) oh you could use the small caps font, scaled up to full size

@barbarabeeton David has made the same two suggestions I was going to make.

@barbarabeeton sc in computer modern didn't seem to have that different kerning than full caps, so I didn't try letter spacing here as I wouldn't know how much to kern

\documentclass{article}

\parskip=\baselineskip

\usepackage{textcase}

\begin{document}

Something about $G_F^2$ or $P=NP$ or Something

\MakeTextUppercase{Something about $G_F^2$ or $P=NP$ or Something}

\textsc{Something about $G_F^2$ or $P=NP$ or Something}

\textsc{Something about {\small$G_F^2$} or {\small$P=NP$} or Something}


\textsc{{\large \lowercase{Something about}} $G_F^2$ {\large\lowercase{or}} $P=NP$ or {\large\lowercase{Something}}}

\end{document}

@DavidCarlisle -- requires manual recoding or fancy parsing. \MakeTextUppercase can be applied automatically to \title or \section.

@barbarabeeton no not really, only here in the trial (\MakeTextUppercase could make any of those)

@barbarabeeton maketextuppercase allows you to apply \uppercase (and so with minor changes, \lowercase) to just the text, missing the math, for all of the above you just need that plus the ability to specify the fonts (and in particular font size) separately for math and text, and latex always allows that.

why is this question protected? I don't see any instances of users posting spam or unnecessary answers; and if anything given the question has been open so long I would expect that the most likely person to answer (if at all) may in fact be a new user who has discovered something and searched for this. tex.stackexchange.com/questions/358642/…

well I just noticed and clicked on "unprotect" and it worked, so I guess I have the power to do that :-) (Still can't figure out why it was protected in the first place though…)

@DavidCarlisle -- okay. understood. have to contemplate what this might imply in terms of additional font sizes.