@JosephWright I have a working ini, should I commit, or do you have one?

@UlrikeFischer /usr/local/texlive/2022/texmf-dist/tex/latex/pdfmanagement-testphase/fontspec-luatex-tmp-ltx.sty: \cs_set_eq:NN \XeTeXpicfile \fontspec_tmp: :)

@DavidCarlisle do we really do that? I wonder what for.

@UlrikeFischer that was my question:-) I was wondering if we need to fake XeTeXpicfile it would be mostly unused if we use luatex back end for l3backend and graphcs/color, but it is used in few places directly but fontspec, l3names, pdfmanagement, ... I suppose we should fake it anyway... (@JosephWright, @HenriMenke)

@DavidCarlisle ah it is already in the original file. It is part of the old code to support the loading of xunicode which tests for xetexpicfile. Perhaps one should simply drop that?

@UlrikeFischer ah I saw xunicode tested for existence.

@UlrikeFischer but do we want xxetex working for plain tex and Phil who uses primitives directly....

@DavidCarlisle yes, and after 11 years fontspec should perhaps stop to work around that?

@DavidCarlisle I didn't mean drop xetexpicfile, I was only wondering about fontspec and the euenc support etc. For xxetex one should probably try to add this primitive.

@UlrikeFischer yes I agree fontspec should clean up here. I guess I need to do the graphics primitives :(

@DavidCarlisle we could also say we don't support plain ;-)

@UlrikeFischer have you ever used this??? manual says \XeTeXpicfile ⟨filename⟩ [ scaled ⟨int⟩... int?? so you can make it twice as big but not half? but 1: [\XeTeXpicfile example-image.png] works but [\XeTeXpicfile example-image.png scaled 2] not

@UlrikeFischer non-optional space after 2 :(

does anyone get anything for 2: ? (with real xelatex)

\ifdefined\directlua
\ifdefined\XeTeXinterchartokenstate\else
\input{xxetex.tex}
\fi
\fi

\addtolength\textwidth{200pt}
\documentclass{article}

\begin{document}


1: [\XeTeXpicfile example-image.png ]


2: [\XeTeXpicfile example-image.png  scaled 2 ]


3: [\XeTeXpicfile example-image.png  width 3cm ]


4: [\XeTeXpicfile example-image.png  rotated 90 ]

\clearpage

5: [\XeTeXpicfile example-image.png  width 3cm rotated 90 ]

6: [\XeTeXpicfile example-image.png  rotated 90 width 3cm ]


\end{document}

@DavidCarlisle yes, but rather small. I think 1000 = 1 here, and 500 give scale = 0.5.

@UlrikeFischer ah...

@UlrikeFischer that works, thanks

try \( and \) systems differ on whether ( need to be escaped @Diaa

@Diaa According to npp-user-manual.org/docs/searching/#regular-expressions parentheses () are grouping characters. But curly braces {} are not listed for backslash escaping, so try unescaped curly braces as well.

@Diaa Just to make sure: your cursor was in front of the text you wanted to find, right? Asking because you did not select wrap around and the curly braces seem highlighted as if the cursor has been placed there.

@TeXnician Many thanks. That is one of the things I hate about searching in Notepad++. \\textlatin{([^{}]*)} worked for me.

@Diaa Why is that special though? Every editor I know of would search from the caret onwards if you do not check wrap around. It's not a bug, it's a feature ;)

@TeXnician You are right, but it doesn't suggest continuing the search from the document start as some editors do.

@orthocresol Here you go.

First is with opticals, second without, but it seems there is no character in your example that even has an optical variant.

@orthocresol I don't see how you're going to save money on this though. Sales tax is 19% in Germany and 20% in the UK and Typoma will surely have to pay sales tax in the UK for any purchase from there.

@UlrikeFischer works in xxelatex now as well

@JosephWright (@HenriMenke @UlrikeFischer) I added the ini file (very basic, everything deferred to \everyjob)

@DavidCarlisle I saw :)

@DavidCarlisle I hope to look at some expl3 adjustments later on or tomorrow

i got brave and tried an xepersian document;

! Undefined control sequence.
\TeXXeTOn ->\TeXXeTstate
                         \@ne
l.43 \TeXXeTOn

?

@DavidCarlisle also would like to make the ’ primitives’ using the Lua approach

@DavidCarlisle I did wonder about TeX—XeT

I may have to ask @MarcelKrüger to look at his tex--xet branch in xpdftex, if we make it work for one it should work for the other I think

@JosephWright Henri and I failed for that for the font primitives, supporting \the is hard (impossible?)

@DavidCarlisle does it need a specific definition? Can't one give it a dummy definition and then switch directions if needed?

@HenriMenke Thanks again - much appreciated. Yes, I'm 'just' a chemist so the equations I have are quite simple. ;) re. tax: I confess I don't know how it works, but I will make sure to check if I buy.

@DavidCarlisle In XeTeX it's somewhat more complicated due to HarfBuzz direction detection interfering in odd ways in XeTeX. For xpdftex it would help a lot to have some example documents using TeX--XeT to be able to test correct behavior and see how it is usually used.

@MarcelKrüger I think TeX--XeT _ HarfBuzz doesn't really work

@DavidCarlisle Ah, that is 'interesting'

@DavidCarlisle As you are loading after expl3, not actually so much of an issue - I think as this is really 'LuaTeX + adaptation' I can live with that :)

@MarcelKrüger I was using github.com/latex3/xpdftex/blob/tex--xet/examples/test-xet-1.tex but as that is LTR abc probably only working with pdftex, xetex/hb reverses the direction again, but really I don't think it matters if such examples can't be emulated as long as scripts in their natural direction work

@JosephWright yes given lua has to be executed late it seemed simplest just to do it all late so it's functionally equivalent to using lualatex and adding \input{xxetex} to the document

@UlrikeFischer you need to map \beginR and friends to something Marcel has some code in xpdtex but I couldn't quite get it working

@JosephWright xepersian seems to work well enough for its target users

@DavidCarlisle Exactly plan

@DavidCarlisle Good: I think that's enough

@DavidCarlisle Right, we need a bit of documentation then we are basically good to go here: it's luatex from an engine POV but can load XeTeX docs: sounds ideal

@JosephWright I mean it works with xetex, not xxetex

@JosephWright yes

@DavidCarlisle Sh :)

@JosephWright if the additions end up small enough we could just call it lualatex

@DavidCarlisle I was wondering about that

@DavidCarlisle One for the team list?

@JosephWright if it's just a couple of dozen definitons, I don't see why not. If we end up with additional "always on" callbacks, perhaps not but ...

@DavidCarlisle Could easily set up a way to disable that

@DavidCarlisle Which callback?

@DavidCarlisle I can only see the intertoks one, and I think that can be set up to be 'opt in'

@JosephWright xtex-et perhaps and for char toks I fudged it not to start until \XeTeXinterchartokenstate seen, but \XeTeXinterchartokenstate=0 doesn't unregister th callback (just makes it do nothing), you need new \XeTeXinterchartokenstateOFF to really remove it

@DavidCarlisle As long as you need to turn it on, having to actively switch off seems not an issue ...

@DavidCarlisle Only existing XeTeX docs will use \XeTeXinterchartokenstate at all

@JosephWright I wanted to define \XeTeXinterchartokenstate as a lua scanner so =1 registered the callback and =0 removed it but then I could see no way to support \ifnum\XeTeXinterchartokenstate=1 so (like Marcel's tex-xet one) \XeTeXinterchartokenstate is a real count register and the callback still runs but does nothing when that is 0

@DavidCarlisle Yes could see the issue ;)

@orthocresol Well, you don't actually have to check. It's the merchant that has to check because they are the one that have to pay tax on their revenue for the sale.

@JosephWright if it was a real lua table of count values you could (probably) use a metatable so setting count.XeTeXinterchartokenstate=1 in Lua activated the callback as well as setting the int but it's all smoke and mirrors accessing the tex part of the code...

@DavidCarlisle Using the LuaTeX FFI you could hook assign_internal_value of LuaTeX itself ;)

@HenriMenke tempting:-)

@JosephWright topics of the day, hidden math and xetex.... tex.stackexchange.com/questions/673243/…

@DavidCarlisle That would be much easier in LuaMetaTeX...

Oh, maybe you should run luametatex under the hood instead of luatex. :-P

@mickep we could call it xlmpdftex and then spend our time explaining that it has nothing to with xml.

@mickep alias -x xelatex=context