TeX, LaTeX and Friends

Alan Munn

4:00 AM

does tikz have a manual? — David Carlisle 5 hours ago

Romain Picot

7:24 AM

@PauloCereda Did the voting squad play with de upvote button 7 hours ago?

Joseph Wright

@egreg Well on lockded0down systems ShareLaTeX is a good idea, plus it allows collaboration without file copying, etc. LyX on the other hand ...

Johannes_B

7:59 AM

I wonder why nobody of the SE-team said something about the bold tags.

Joseph Wright

@Johannes_B I'll ping them later on (US day time)

Johannes_B

@JosephWright Ok, thanks.

Joseph Wright

@Johannes_B You remind me I need to ask about corporate TUG membership

@DavidCarlisle I'm working on the .cfg/.ini file stuff: doing some checks on the MiKTeX set up

Johannes_B

@JosephWright I did? Just a coincidence, i am sure.

David Carlisle

@JosephWright OK

Joseph Wright

8:02 AM

@DavidCarlisle Looks like Christian has pulled it into line with TL w.r.t. quoting file names containing spaces

David Carlisle

@JosephWright local configuration sounds good in theory but browbeating distributions to conform to a standard configuration also has its merits:-)

Joseph Wright

@DavidCarlisle Yes

@DavidCarlisle I'm going to put some ideas together then will mail you (I'm at a meeting today but there will doubtless be less interesting talks I can work during)

David Carlisle

@JosephWright I see luatex85+ has had an effect on luaotfload (not entirely surprising)

Joseph Wright

@DavidCarlisle I've missed that: will take a look

David Carlisle

"When Hans changed the
fontloader to the new model (which was in experimental for
some time already at this point, I gather), he did away with the
old code paths." no backward compatibility? what a shock...

Johannes_B

9:28 AM

@JosephWright This is a strange question tex.stackexchange.com/questions/288865/…

yo'

9:44 AM

@Johannes_B honestly, I would zap it just to show that this is not a way how to ask questions on the site; he asked an unclear question and self-answered it with a solution to a completely different question, which he took from the comments. But today I slept well and I am in a good mood, so I'd leave it be :-)

Johannes_B

@yo' I think the Q/A is not of any use for others.

yo'

@Johannes_B I agree

Johannes_B

How can i print the inverted b? "Oh, figured it out, it is d."

yo'

@Johannes_B LOL!!! However, here it seems to me that he asks "How can I print the 'b'?" --- "Oh it's 'd'!"

Johannes_B

@yo' I really don't know.

David Carlisle

9:48 AM

@egreg you get an honourable mention in my last comment on site:-)

egreg

@DavidCarlisle My attempts at stealing ticks are much better than Werner's.

David Carlisle

is it just me or does facebook always email people saying "lots has happened since you last logged in" followed by "5 new notifications" (or sometimes 2 or 3 or whatever) and then a link to a page that says "No new notifications"

@egreg true more numerous certainly, I hesitate to say better

where is Gonzalo? I just noticed that I'd almost caught him up but since he's not been on site since November that isn't really surprising.

yo'

@Johannes_B I'd zap it, however, while you don't seem to feel the need to have an answer there, beacon_bonanza was the first to point things out and he should have answered the question in the end.

Johannes_B

@DavidCarlisle What happene to your profile picture on FB? You look like a spy :-)

@yo' I seem to notice that self answering with the help of comments happens more often now.

yo'

@Johannes_B it may be a good trend, I don't know. I mean, I don't mind it myself, since I really don't need the reputation. But new users who try to follow our answer-in-comments policy can righteously get upset.

Johannes_B

10:00 AM

@yo' Agreed.

egreg

@DavidCarlisle It happened also last year, IIRC: Gonzalo was missing for a few months.

David Carlisle

@Johannes_B perhaps I am, I have had a FB account forever but never log in, except occasionally I try to follow links in their emails

yo'

@DavidCarlisle Can you operate FCB from an emacs buffer???

Johannes_B

@egreg @DavidCarlisle Maybe Gonzalo is a spy?

David Carlisle

yo'

10:07 AM

@DavidCarlisle The Big (S)Quad!

David Carlisle

@yo' of course: emacswiki.org/emacs/facebook.el

yo'

@DavidCarlisle I'm not surprised.

yo'

10:30 AM

@egreg Janáček!!! But it's Händel after that!

egreg

@yo' ?

yo'

@egreg Listening to the "radio D dur" (D major), and this is the programme. I'm not really fond of some Janáček's pieces...

egreg

@yo' Turn it off and wait for the next piece. ;-)

@yo' Is there any piece by Janáček worthy listening to? :P

yo'

@egreg The Cunning Little Vixen is perfect, if done properly! The play it in the National Theatre now, the scene, costumes and direction is done by the biggest Czech expert on the fashion and manners of the 20s and 30s, so it's really nicely put together!

Paulo Cereda

@DavidCarlisle Very good point! :)

By the way, good morning, people!

yo'

10:35 AM

@DavidCarlisle @StrongBad @JosephWright I've always voted for \TeX\@ -- it works well, too.

@PauloCereda morning!

@yo' <3

Hi all

@Alenanno yo!

@yo' but \TeX{}Live works better than \TeX\@Live in package files....

yo'

@DavidCarlisle Ah well, that's a problem of catcodes ;-)

David Carlisle

10:44 AM

@yo' are there problems of a different kind?

Paulo Cereda

@Alenanno yo!

Alenanno

@yo' yo! lol

@PauloCereda quack!

Paulo Cereda

@Alenanno quack to you too, kind sir!

/bows

egreg

@DavidCarlisle Although it should be \TeX~Live

yo'

@PauloCereda a bowing duck, I want to see that!

David Carlisle

10:46 AM

@egreg bah humbug: don't spoil my example with such trivialities

yo'

@egreg that's not entirely clear; I would go for \TeX\,Live

Paulo Cereda

rescued mallard duck loves bowing infront of her rescuer!

►

Alenanno

Paulo Cereda

Oh YouTube, you have videos for everything...

@Alenanno Wow, that's a classy fancy dancy duck!

Alenanno

@PauloCereda That's how I pictured you when you said "sir"

:D

yo'

10:48 AM

@Alenanno :D

Paulo Cereda

@Alenanno Poor me, I don't have a suit. :)

yo'

@PauloCereda oh!

Alenanno

@PauloCereda None? :P

Paulo Cereda

I mean, tuxedos and whatnot. :)

David Carlisle

@PauloCereda useful wiki page on how to dress a duck:

wikihow.com/Field-Dress-a-Duck

Alenanno

11:05 AM

@DavidCarlisle That was kinda cruel lol

:P

Poor @PauloCereda

Paulo Cereda

@DavidCarlisle /cries in Portuguese

Johannes_B

11:16 AM

@JosephWright Imho, tex.stackexchange.com/questions/288735/… and tex.stackexchange.com/questions/288872/… won't help any other soul.

David Carlisle

@Alenanno cruel, perhaps, but tasty :-)

Alenanno

@DavidCarlisle Never ate a duck lol

Paulo Cereda

@Alenanno I ate one once at a Chinese restaurant. I hate the taste. :)

Alenanno

@PauloCereda Is it like... chicken?

Paulo Cereda

@Alenanno No, it was another flavour.

David Carlisle

11:31 AM

Now we see why the UK is secure, other people have nuclear weapons and guns and things we have Fusilier Llywelyn, the goat:

Paulo Cereda

@DavidCarlisle Royal goats?

David Carlisle

@PauloCereda bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-35371670

Paulo Cereda

@DavidCarlisle goat-simulator.com

David Carlisle

@PauloCereda hmm but for some reason i get "www.duck-simulator.com is unavailable or may not exist"

Paulo Cereda

@DavidCarlisle :)

Johannes_B

12:03 PM

@DavidCarlisle How to plant an apple tree is one thing. Showing people how to shoot a shotgun or prepare a ghillie suit is another. I don't like the latter.

yo'

12:39 PM

@Johannes_B TEMPLATES EVERYWHERE!!! :D

Johannes_B

@yo' Where? I can t find it :-)

yo'

@Johannes_B ufffff (sound of relief)

Johannes_B

@yo' I would have asked the editor about what template to use.

yo'

@Johannes_B the Q is OT anyways

Johannes_B

@yo' Yep. By the way, did you mention templates?

yo'

12:56 PM

@Johannes_B ! LaTeX Error: File `googletranslate.sty' not found

but I love this one: (One for @egreg I think)

\def\<>#1{\big\langle{#1}\big\rangle}

Johannes_B

@yo' Take a look at the bunch of defs. I think some of them are shortcuts for citekeys.

@yo' I dared not to ping him. :-)

yo'

@Johannes_B He's like the inquisition: Allowed to see anything, to be able to properly judge it.

Johannes_B

@yo' :-)

Danu

Hi guys

Small question: Does the code from this answer compile without problems for you?

3

Q: Is there an efficient way to draw torus knots and related ''complicated lines'' (simple shapes, but on nontrivial surfaces) in TikZ?

In the process of typing up a set of lecture notes for a course, I found myself in need of a nice picture of a torus knot, which basically comes down to drawing a very complicated line. With some trickery, I was able to produce the simplest such knot, which wraps around both circles only once. Th...

tikz-pgf

Paulo Cereda

@Danu Looks like it requires a UTF-8 powered engine.

egreg

1:04 PM

@yo' Beautifully silly!

Danu

@PauloCereda Damnit.

Paulo Cereda

@Danu But the code still gets stuck with me.

Johannes_B

@Danu Additionally, \end{document} is missing.

Danu

@Johannes_B I already saw that ;)

@PauloCereda Same problem :(

Johannes_B

@Danu Worked for me with lualatex. Took forever for those 36 pages, but ... it worked.

Danu

1:11 PM

36 pages?

Paulo Cereda

@Johannes_B @Danu: Oh, I tried with XeLaTeX.

Danu

@PauloCereda OP also told me to try XeLaTeX

David Carlisle

@PauloCereda @Danu i doubt the code needs a unicode engine but just change the macro names to be ascii \pgfmathsetmacro \τ won't work in pdftex but change \τ to \anythingthattexcanuse and it should work

Danu

okay. Thanks.

Paulo Cereda

@DavidCarlisle Indeed. :)

Johannes_B

1:13 PM

@Danu Yes.

yo'

@egreg :)

egreg

@yo' Maybe you like this one

0

Q: How to prove that $\lim_{(x, y) \to (0, 0)} \left(\frac{1}{|x|} + \frac{1}{|y|}\right) = 0$?

Prove that $$\lim_{(x, y) \to (0, 0)} \left(\frac{1}{|x|} + \frac{1}{|y|}\right) = 0$$ I couldn't prove this. Please suggest a solution.

multivariable-calculus

yo'

@egreg love the comment to your answer! :D

Rico

@egreg the comment is pure gold :D

David Carlisle

@Danu I added a pdftex version to the answer

Danu

1:30 PM

@DavidCarlisle I got it to work too, luckily :)

Thanks

daleif

1:42 PM

@DavidCarlisle wasn't there som tl_case macros removed from expl3 lately? A user is using the tikz knots lib which in turns use spath3, I get an error at \tl_case:Nnn

Will Robertson

@daleif Yep, should now be \tl_case:NnF

Anyone here know about catcode tables in Lua? :)

I'm trying to fix:

if luatexbase.catcodetables == nil then
latexpackage_catcodetable=luatexbase.registernumber("catcodetable@atletter")
else
latexpackage_catcodetable=luatexbase.catcodetables['latex-package']
end
function fontspec.sprint (...)
tex.sprint(latexpackage_catcodetable, ...)
end
... local function tempswafalse() fontspec.sprint([[\bool_set_false:NTF \l__fontspec_check_bool]]) end

daleif

@WillRobertson I'll have to contact the author. Any suggestion as to what one can add in the preamble to make it work (still a bit green in this expl3 stuff)

@WillRobertson did you see the discussion about mathtools vs unicode-math discussion the other day?

Will Robertson

@daleif \ExplSyntaxOn\cs_set_eq:NN\tl_case:Nnn\tl_case:NnF\ExplSyntaxOff should do the trick

@daleif I'm a bit swamped at the moment; I saw there was an email but didn't really understand without delving into the details (which I didn't have the time for)…

daleif

@WillRobertson it was a user that contacted me about mathtools messing up his fonts in xelatex while using unicode-math, turned out to be unicode-math's attempts to "fix" mathtools in unicode-math-xetex.sty, you should be able to find it in the archives.

David Carlisle

@WillRobertson something:-)

Will Robertson

1:52 PM

@DavidCarlisle Ah, I got it!!

I should have just guessed :) luatexbase.catcodetables['expl3']

David Carlisle

@WillRobertson ah

Paulo Cereda

@WillRobertson I know about cats, tables and lua is moon in Portuguese. So if the question is about cats on the table at night, I might answer. :)

Will Robertson

@DavidCarlisle But I am curious what the status of all this is; weren't you taking over swathes of this functionality?

David Carlisle

@WillRobertson yes that's what the test luatexbase.registernumber is doing, seeing if the new code is there

daleif

@WillRobertson works, thanks

David Carlisle

1:56 PM

@WillRobertson see base/ltluatex.dtx :-)

barbara beeton

@DavidCarlisle -- good thing you didn't suggest "pressed" duck instead of "dressed" duck.

Will Robertson

@DavidCarlisle I'm glad I asked; sorry not to be on top of things. There's no \catcodetable@expliii?

@DavidCarlisle I have such a small amount of code being passed through here I could easily write \csname bool_set_true:c\endcsname{...} but didn't want to be ugly.

David Carlisle

@WillRobertson no doesn't really fit in base, the luatexbase package (ctan or joseph's githib) adds % \DescribeMacro{\CatcodeTableExpl} but adds a lot of other stuff as well of course:-)

Joseph Wright

@WillRobertson We added what seemed sensible

David Carlisle

@JosephWright I was wondering if expl3 (somewhere) if running on luatex should define a suitable catcode table? (@WillRobertson)

Joseph Wright

2:10 PM

@DavidCarlisle Certainly can do

Will Robertson

@DavidCarlisle So for forwards compatibility I should have:

if luatexbase.catcodetables == nil then
  latexpackage_catcodetable=luatexbase.catcodetables.expl
else
  latexpackage_catcodetable=luatexbase.catcodetables['expl3']
end

David Carlisle

@WillRobertson that looks wrong if it is nil you take the first branch and error on nil.expl don't you?

Will Robertson

@DavidCarlisle Oh, it would help if I actually read the code I was writing!

if luatexbase.catcodetables == nil then
    latexpackage_catcodetable=luatexbase.registernumber('CatcodeTableExpl')
else
    latexpackage_catcodetable=luatexbase.catcodetables['expl3']
end

I was mislead by (in Joseph's luatexbase):

% The standard way to access catcode table numbers from Lua in
% \textsf{ltluatex} is the |registernumber| function.  This
% package provides a |catcodetables| table with a metatable
% that accesses this function and is extended with aliases for the
% predefined tables so you can use |catcodetables.expl| as an
% alternative to |catcodetables.CatcodeTableExpl|, both being
% equivalent to\\
% |registernumber('CatcodeTableExpl')|.

Which makes me wonder whether that test will still work. Okay, better actually start messing around with things.

David Carlisle

@WillRobertson by the time luatexbase is loaded expl3 catcode table is defined but the point there is that the new way is to use a function but the old way was to use a table so that is defining a metatable to call the function for each index so the old table syntax should work.

@WillRobertson have you loaded luatexbase by then? (or have you defined the catcodetable directly?) if luatexbase package is being used you should be able to get rid of the test and just use the latexpackage_catcodetable=luatexbase.catcodetables['expl3'] form

Will Robertson

2:27 PM

@DavidCarlisle fontspec loads luaotfload which loads luatexbase, so that should be fine. I didn't write any of this lua code myself so I can't vouch for it

David Carlisle

@WillRobertson no luaotfload has (or will) stop loading luatexbase (my pull request was accepted:-) it just needs ltluatex

Will Robertson

@DavidCarlisle Ah, so I should now load luatexbase myself. Easily done. And I now (finally) see how the new luatexbase supports the old syntax, so that looks good. Thanks for keeping me out of trouble!!

@DavidCarlisle Or... maybe I should just use \csname…\endcsname after all and avoid another package!

David Carlisle

@WillRobertson would be better not really: Joseph and I went to some trouble pruning that and if every lualatex document just loads fontspec and loads it all again we are back to square one:-)

Will Robertson

@DavidCarlisle I agree!!

David Carlisle

@WillRobertson it is only three or four lines to just define a suitable catcode table, so you could do that and use it in probably less code than it takes to test and certainly a lot less code than loading luatexbase emulation

Will Robertson

2:40 PM

@DavidCarlisle It is also fewer lines just to write this with an appropriate definition in the .sty file :) please don't hate me

local function tempswatrue()  tex.sprint([[\FontspecSetCheckBoolTrue ]]) end

David Carlisle

@WillRobertson agreed! using _ in macro names is an abomination! whoever suggested it!

Will Robertson

@DavidCarlisle Now that's going a bit far :)

David Carlisle

@WillRobertson it's OK: Frank's not here:-)

Joseph Wright

-1

So I am still new to TeX and wondering how far it's practicality and utility actually extends. I know there are useful macro packages . . actually I'm not sure if they are indeed packages because I don't have to add them like other packages. Are they simply compiled with different compilers? L...

tex-core

Other relevant links? (See my last comment)

Will Robertson

@DavidCarlisle I am going to be soooo happy when I no longer get this in my console:

(/usr/local/texlive/2015/texmf-dist/tex/generic/oberdiek/luatex-loader.sty
(/usr/local/texlive/2015/texmf-dist/scripts/oberdiek/oberdiek.luatex.lua)))
(/usr/local/texlive/2015/texmf-dist/tex/luatex/luatexbase/luatexbase-compat.sty
)
(/usr/local/texlive/2015/texmf-dist/tex/luatex/luatexbase/luatexbase-modutils.s
ty
(/usr/local/texlive/2015/texmf-dist/tex/luatex/luatexbase/luatexbase-loader.sty
(/usr/local/texlive/2015/texmf-dist/tex/luatex/luatexbase/luatexbase.loader.lua)
)
(/usr/local/texlive/2015/texmf-dist/tex/luatex/luatexbase/modutils.lua))

But I guess we're stuck with this: (?)

(/usr/local/texlive/2015/texmf-dist/tex/luatex/luaotfload/luaotfload-main.lua)
(/usr/local/texlive/2015/texmf-dist/tex/luatex/luaotfload/luaotfload-log.lua)
(/usr/local/texlive/2015/texmf-dist/tex/luatex/luaotfload/luaotfload-fontloader.
lua)(using write cache: /Users/will/Library/texlive/2015/texmf-var/luatex-cache/
generic)(using read cache: /usr/local/texlive/2015/texmf-var/luatex-cache/generi
c /Users/will/Library/texlive/2015/texmf-var/luatex-cache/generic)
luaotfload | main : fontloader loaded in 0.044 seconds

Joseph Wright

2:46 PM

@WillRobertson Yes, as the loader isn't in .dtx format so is not 'assembled' from the sources

Will Robertson

@JosephWright I'm inclined to suggest that .lua files needn't be displayed in the console… don't know how heretical that is though

David Carlisle

@WillRobertson well unless we byte compile the font loader and load it at everyjob... (@JosephWright) (but that raises issues about defaulting to tfm fonts and OT1 in lualatex:-)

Will Robertson

Along opposite lines, I've just broken fontspec.dtx into around 15 separate files…which are all reassembled into a single fontspec.sty.

Joseph Wright

@WillRobertson Yes, same plan for siunitx

David Carlisle

and also would mean you have to rebuild the format if any of that changed

Joseph Wright

2:52 PM

@WillRobertson So we then don't know what files are used ... ;-)

Will Robertson

@JosephWright Yeah, there's always the hideously bloated log file if you really want to know :) no, having them in the console is probably the thing to do.

David Carlisle

@WillRobertson what do you have to do to get so many .lua in the log? I only get one .lua file from

\documentclass{article}

\usepackage{fontspec}
\setmainfont{TeX Gyre Pagella}

\begin{document}
a
\end{document}

Will Robertson

Maybe I'm out of date -- I'm on my laptop here… that would be good news!!

Joseph Wright

@DavidCarlisle Agreed (more or less)

David Carlisle

@WillRobertson for the above on the console I get

$ lualatex gg723
This is LuaTeX, Version beta-0.88.0 (TeX Live 2016/dev)
 restricted system commands enabled.
(./gg723.tex
LaTeX2e <2016/02/01>
Babel <3.9n> and hyphenation patterns for 79 languages loaded.
(/home/davidc/texmf/tex/latex/base/article.cls
Document Class: article 2014/09/29 v1.4h Standard LaTeX document class
(/home/davidc/texmf/tex/latex/base/size10.clo))
(/usr/local/texlive/2015/texmf-dist/tex/latex/fontspec/fontspec.sty
(/home/davidc/texmf/tex/latex/l3kernel/expl3.sty
(/home/davidc/texmf/tex/latex/l3kernel/expl3-code.tex)

which is still far too much:-)

Joseph Wright

3:03 PM

@DavidCarlisle We are working on getting rid of HO's stuff, I guess :-)

@DavidCarlisle And Ross's dependencies

David Carlisle

@JosephWright yes (or planning to work on, which is almost the same)

Joseph Wright

@DavidCarlisle I have some thoughts on .ini/.cfg stuff: mail coming up soon (coffee break here in a moment)

Paulo Cereda

New HDD for satyagraha!

I have lots of M&M's!

Today is the best day ever.

I need a name for my machine. City names, anyone? Preferably, no South American ones. :)

I am thinking of nineveh.

Johannes_B

3:19 PM

@PauloCereda Dresden? Leipzig? Freiberg?

Paulo Cereda

@Johannes_B ooh

David Carlisle

@PauloCereda There is one in north west England, just south of the Scottish border

Paulo Cereda

@DavidCarlisle Carlisle?

David Carlisle

@PauloCereda you could check on a map:-)

Will Robertson

@JosephWright My current plan is to upload a new version of fontspec quite soon that contains the TU encoding, but have it off by default. So people can try it out with a package option, and package authors have time to change. Then presumably in TL2017 move TU to latex2e and make it the default in fontspec. Is that too slow for your liking?

Paulo Cereda

3:22 PM

@DavidCarlisle I don't know how to use such contraptions. :)

David Carlisle

@WillRobertson it seems slow compared to people(soon) having to swallow much bigger changes like half the primitives not being defined anymore, with no warning (unless you follow luatex dev lists)

Will Robertson

@DavidCarlisle Well, I'll try to release the conservative version ASAP (this week?) which still gives us time to switch to TU by default for TL16 if all seems well enough (even if some package authors don't make the switch)

David Carlisle

@WillRobertson then you can write that issue of ltnews

Will Robertson

@DavidCarlisle very true!

Johannes_B

@WillRobertson What does TU stand for again? Several german university classes have that prefix (tudscrartcl or TUBAFarbeiten).

Will Robertson

3:27 PM

@Johannes_B "TeX Unicode" :) We could change it — no-one seems to mind what it's called exactly

@DavidCarlisle it would be my pleasure

David Carlisle

@WillRobertson just beware of @barbarabeeton reading it

Will Robertson

@DavidCarlisle @JosephWright After loading the unreleased [tuenc] option for fontspec, the console output becomes:

LaTeX2e <2015/10/01> patch level 2
Babel <3.9m> and hyphenation patterns for 79 languages loaded.
(/usr/local/texlive/2015/texmf-dist/tex/latex/base/article.cls
Document Class: article 2014/09/29 v1.4h Standard LaTeX document class
(/usr/local/texlive/2015/texmf-dist/tex/latex/base/size10.clo)) (./fontspec.sty
 (/usr/local/texlive/2015/texmf-dist/tex/latex/l3kernel/expl3.sty
(/usr/local/texlive/2015/texmf-dist/tex/latex/l3kernel/expl3-code.tex)
(/usr/local/texlive/2015/texmf-dist/tex/latex/l3kernel/l3pdfmode.def))

Johannes_B

@WillRobertson I don't mind bit of confusion :-)

David Carlisle

@WillRobertson all the lua inputs gone, on your machine too?

Will Robertson

@DavidCarlisle I just updated the relevant packages :) thanks for pointing that out

David Carlisle

3:34 PM

@WillRobertson ah, so looking quite good then,

Will Robertson

@DavidCarlisle — the real challenge is `\documentclass{article}\usepackage{graphicx}\begin{document}\end{document}
`

LaTeX2e <2015/10/01> patch level 2
Babel <3.9m> and hyphenation patterns for 79 languages loaded.
(/usr/local/texlive/2015/texmf-dist/tex/latex/base/article.cls
Document Class: article 2014/09/29 v1.4h Standard LaTeX document class
(/usr/local/texlive/2015/texmf-dist/tex/latex/base/size10.clo))
(/usr/local/texlive/2015/texmf-dist/tex/latex/graphics/graphicx.sty
(/usr/local/texlive/2015/texmf-dist/tex/latex/graphics/keyval.sty)
(/usr/local/texlive/2015/texmf-dist/tex/latex/graphics/graphics.sty
(/usr/local/texlive/2015/texmf-dist/tex/latex/graphics/trig.sty)

David Carlisle

@WillRobertson not here:-)

Will Robertson

@DavidCarlisle Oh I probably need a new pdftex.def right

David Carlisle

@WillRobertson luatex.def went to ctan yesterday (but it only works if you have luatex 0.87 or 0.88 (compile from source)

@WillRobertson although it still loads quite a bit as I haven't recoded the eps to pdf stuff, I get....

Will Robertson

@DavidCarlisle Maybe we should have just dragged oberdiek/ into base/

David Carlisle

3:39 PM

$ lualatex gg724
This is LuaTeX, Version beta-0.88.0 (TeX Live 2016/dev)
 restricted system commands enabled.
(./gg724.tex
LaTeX2e <2016/02/01>
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barbara beeton

@DavidCarlisle -- but you'd probably rather i've read and commented before instead of after it's been published.

Will Robertson

Oops, late. Baby will be waking me sooner rather than later… catch you, uh, soon!

David Carlisle

@WillRobertson almost all of that could be avoided, the old context supp-pdf.mkii coudl be replaced by lua (luamplib has equivalent code but the interface is different and I didn't have time to adapt it) and similarly if writing a lua interface to eps to pdf conversion you probably wouldn't just do minimal updates to the pdftex one if you had unlimited time....

@WillRobertson :-) hope it's all going well.

@barbarabeeton of course:-)

Will Robertson

@DavidCarlisle Yes, having a good time :)

Joseph Wright

@WillRobertson I'm happy with that but also see @DavidCarlisle's point :-)

@Johannes_B There's a system to encoding names honoured only rather weakly. Personally I favoured 'UC' (Unicode) but that hasn't worked out.

Johannes_B

3:51 PM

@JosephWright Nobody liked it?

Joseph Wright

@Johannes_B Not enough people

@Johannes_B Historically U is for fonts with no fixed encoding so anything starting U was not popular

Paulo Cereda

@JosephWright U is for Unicode, but...

Sesame Street: Cookie Monster Sings C is for Cookie

►

David Carlisle

@Johannes_B all the "standard" encodings start with T as in T1, T2a etc, and the only encoding starting with U is U which is "undefined" so there were some arguments against it (it would have been Ok though) but TU is probably better except it means technical university rather than text unicode to some people :-)

Joseph Wright

@DavidCarlisle ConTeXt use UC :-)

David Carlisle

@PauloCereda thank you for your important contribution to the debate

Joseph Wright

3:54 PM

@DavidCarlisle wiki.contextgarden.net/Encodings_and_Regimes

@DavidCarlisle :-)

David Carlisle

@JosephWright yes but they don't follow NFSS names

Joseph Wright

@DavidCarlisle No, but we do more-or-less agree on font encoding names ....

David Carlisle

@JosephWright you could try again for UC (you've got until Will releases fontenc with a package option using a name)

Johannes_B

@DavidCarlisle Use CU as a tribute to all RTL thinking people. Problem solved.

:-p

Paulo Cereda

@DavidCarlisle My pleasure. <3

Johannes_B

4:33 PM

I'm voting to close this question as off-topic because it asks to do the impossible. — Mooseman ♦ Feb 16 '15 at 17:42

Joseph Wright

5:06 PM

@DavidCarlisle Mail on the way

David Carlisle

@JosephWright OK

Kristian Nordestgaard

5:46 PM

hello

I hope it's okay for me to go a bit OT since this is chat ... I'm looking for a way to export an entire WorldCat search as RIS (which will then be made BibTeX, of course) ... what should I do?

yo'

5:59 PM

@KristianNordestgaard hi. I'm afraid thhat peeople who visit this chat won't be able to answer your question, and you are right, this would be off-topic on the site...

Alenanno

6:13 PM

How much I hate it when I spend time coding an answer and then it turns out the code is useless. >_>

Kristian Nordestgaard

thanks, @yo'

Paulo Cereda

8:07 PM

Hi @wipet! :)

Joseph Wright

9:23 PM

@DavidCarlisle Mail :-)

David Carlisle

9:37 PM

@JosephWright yep:-)

David Carlisle

9:50 PM

@JosephWright Ok i'll do the repo now unless something really important comes up on the News in 10 minutes...

Joseph Wright

@DavidCarlisle OK

David Carlisle

@JosephWright can I make it writeable by everyone in the latex3 organization or do I have to add people individually

Joseph Wright

@DavidCarlisle Should be Admin for all of us now: I've adjusted the overall LaTeX3 settings

David Carlisle

@JosephWright OK thanks

@JosephWright pushed, but still need to fill out the readme

Joseph Wright

10:11 PM

@DavidCarlisle Reminds me I need to work out how to get l3build to avoid a warning if there is 'nothing to do'

David Carlisle

@JosephWright yes I looked a bit at that for luatex-def the other day but decided to leave it to you, could always go back to my two line bash script that just ran zip:-)

Joseph Wright

@DavidCarlisle Yes, of course, but I should sort it anyway

David Carlisle

@JosephWright copied from texlive graphics.cfg claims to be public domain, color.cfg says nothing, do you think I can get away with claiming PD, or CC0 or ...

Joseph Wright

@DavidCarlisle You can probably get away with all sorts

David Carlisle

@JosephWright well sure, I'm thinking of CC0 but not sure if that's really best

Joseph Wright

10:26 PM

@DavidCarlisle These files seem to all be that way

@DavidCarlisle color.cfg comes from tetex I think

@DavidCarlisle tug.org/svn/texlive/trunk/Master/texmf-dist/tex/latex/…

David Carlisle

@JosephWright ultimately it probably came from me, so if push came to shove I wouldn't have qualms about relicencing it under any licence I wanted, if I knew what i wanted..

Joseph Wright

@DavidCarlisle :-)

@DavidCarlisle I guess if starting from scratch we'd go with LPPL, as we have for the Unicode support files, but here that's not the case

David Carlisle

@JosephWright but cfg files are explicitly editable for local config, it's possible to allow that with LPPl but a pain really.

Joseph Wright

@DavidCarlisle OK, so CC0 (which is I guess my favoured approach for most stuff), or if you want to insist on a record of authors MIT/BSD-3-clause

David Carlisle

@JosephWright I'll go for CC0 and also write something about how it can be edited to set up site defaults, but is usually just edited by people setting up tex distributions. Possibly tomorrow, getting a bit late for thinking of words.

Joseph Wright

10:32 PM

@DavidCarlisle Sounds like a plan to me

@DavidCarlisle I'll probably tidy up the .ini stuff tomorrow

David Carlisle

@barbarabeeton (and anyone else in that general area) hope you avoid worst of the weather.

Alan Munn

10:58 PM

@DavidCarlisle And here I am where it's supposed to snow with barely a dusting. It's just not fair. :)

David Carlisle

@AlanMunn no sledging tomorrow then?

Alan Munn

@DavidCarlisle No. The snow has been so light here that that I just sweep it off the walk with a broom. But we're in a very different part of the weather pattern in the continent and so the storm system on the east coast will likely have no effect here at all.

It's also quite warm, around -2C or so, which for mid-January is really warm.

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