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10:15 AM
1
Q: Biblatex, Biber, and LaTeX: citations undefined

user2205916I get "There were undefined references" errors and can't fix it after two days of trying. I have tried switching editors from Sublime Text 3 to TeXStudio on a Mac, then trying both on a PC. I am willing to try anything at this point. My test.tex file: \documentclass{article} \usepackage[style=n...

I find we have several questions partly-covering this. Do we need to try to organise a 'big list' question 'How to set up my editor to run ...' with say one (CW) answer per editor?
 
10:47 AM
Or indeed to take this question and edit?
I'm minded to give a permissive answer, akin to the LaTeX Community policy
 
@JosephWright I would support that. I actually don't mind crossposts very much as long as a link is given
 
11:27 AM
@JosephWright I am with @cgnieder here. As long as it is properly marked, crossposts are just fine.
@cgnieder can you open the .tif over at LaTeX Community?
 
@Johannes_B Yes
 
@cgnieder Well, apparently you can, but i can't
 
@Johannes_B No. I downloaded it to be able to see it...
Well, ok: obviously after downloading I was able to open it :)
 
@cgnieder Same here, but there isn't the standard link?
 
@Johannes_B No idea why... let's ask @StefanKottwitz
 
11:35 AM
@cgnieder @JosephWright It is somehow funny to see the same faces/names on so many TeX related pages :-)
 
@Johannes_B Like I said in the meta question about cross-posts ;-)
 
@Johannes_B I asked over there in the moderator's forum
 
@cgnieder Thanks
 
@Johannes_B quite. Most interesting to me is that a few users try to stay anonymous but have such a unique way of answering that it's quite easy to tell it's them... (not mentioning names here, though)
 
@cgnieder concerning the same faces?
 
11:49 AM
@Johannes_B Sorry, I didn't get what you mean
 
@cgnieder Do you mean some users answering at different places with different user names, and yet you know they are the same person?
 
12:05 PM
@Johannes_B yes :)
 
12:30 PM
Trivial question: \textit doesn't work if I have spaces in the text. Is there an alternative? Or do I need to use \textit repeatedly?
 
@FaheemMitha Yes, it does:
\documentclass{article}
\begin{document}
\textit{text with spaces}
\end{document}
 
@cgnieder I meant blank lines, sorry.
 
:13142005\documentclass{article}
\begin{document}
\begingroup\itshape
text

with

blank lines

\endgroup
\end{document}
 
@cgnieder Thanks, I'll try that.
Can I use \textit instead?
 
@FaheemMitha best thing would probably be to define an environment that reflects the semantics rather than the font shape
 
12:34 PM
@FaheemMitha Does {\itshape ... } help?
Damn, basically what @cgnieder said. :)
 
@FaheemMitha \textit has a mandatory argument which cannot contain \par (as you've experienced)
blank line = \par
 
@cgnieder As opposed to \itshape?
 
@FaheemMitha \itshape is a switch: it switches to another font shape until the current group ends or another switch like \upshape changes it again. It has no argument
22
Q: Is there a difference between \textit and \itshape?

squidbearI have only ever used \textit (and \emph for emphasized text), but have noticed that in some TeX examples, \itshape is used instead of \textit. Is there a difference between \textit and \itshape? If so, what is that difference?

 
@cgnieder I see. Thanks.
 
@PauloCereda :p
 
12:38 PM
So, \itshape and \textit are functionally equivalent? Both convert the text to italics?
 
user image
2
 
@cgnieder LOL
 
@cgnieder I thought it was "you will not pass".
actually, it was "you cannot pass".
 
@FaheemMitha I don't know: I watched the movie in German... but it's not my picture, anyway...
 
@cgnieder Yes, that's the movie quote.
 
12:41 PM
@FaheemMitha \textit is defined in terms of \itshape
\DeclareTextFontCommand{\textit}{\itshape}
 
@cgnieder So, they are basically the same thing. Thanks.
 
@cgnieder Love It!
 
@FaheemMitha I'd say they resolve to the same thing, but they are not the same. :)
 
Hmm, I guess there are some other differences, per the link you provided.
@PauloCereda Ok.
 
@FaheemMitha It the same as with \textsc and \scshape or \textbf and \bfseries and so on
@AndreaL. :)
 
12:45 PM
@cgnieder Thanks. I really need to remember these things.
 
!!/fortune
@PauloCereda Psmith, the TeX bot: Here is your fortune: An ice cream a day keeps the bugs away.
 
It's embarrassing. I've used LaTeX so long, yet I don't know the basics.
@PauloCereda Which bugs?
 
@FaheemMitha It's just a fortune cookie from my bot.
!!/battle
 
@FaheemMitha If you understand German: texwelt.de/wissen/fragen/27#39
 
@PauloCereda Psmith, the TeX bot: The current score is egreg 215 vs. 50 David. So far, egreg is winning.
@egreg: Oh my! ^^
 
12:47 PM
@cgnieder I don't understand German.
 
@FaheemMitha Who does? :)
 
@FaheemMitha Well, it was worth a try...
 
@PauloCereda Hehe...
 
@PauloCereda No idea...
 
@cgnieder But I can use Google Translate.
 
12:48 PM
@cgnieder Who's that Clemens fellow? :)
 
@PauloCereda Never met him... but he stole my avatar!
 
@cgnieder Oh no! :)
Maybe Mr. Gundla knows him. :)
 
@PauloCereda lol
 
@cgnieder Is this a Stack Exchange related site? Maybe 1.0?
 
@cgnieder Where's Patrick when we need him? :P
 
12:50 PM
@FaheemMitha Not really. It is a site of its own hosted by @StefanKottwitz
But the idea is the same
It uses osqa.net which is not the same what stackexchange uses
 
@cgnieder This may (and I think it is) dumb, but what if SE merges with other sites on multiple languages, so that one user can navigate through SE(italy) and SE(UK), this may be spread over the world! World Conquest!
 
@cgnieder Oh, that's interesting.
 
Sorry I was over-reacting...
 
@AndreaL. are there many others in other languages? (Apart from GLU and similar sites?)
 
@cgnieder
24
Q: Where did "you shall not pass" come from?

3nafishOne of the most memorable lines from the Lord of the Rings movies is when Gandalf stands before the Balrog and says "You shall not pass." He doesn't actually say that in the book. In the Fellowship of the Ring, Gandalf blocks the Balrog saying: You cannot pass....I am a servant of the S...

 
12:59 PM
@cgnieder: we forgot we have Psmith in here! :)
!!/texdef -t latex textit
 
@cgnieder Uh... Maybe I was misunderstood. The language SE deals with Language Related Questions, but the network I imagined deals with Questions regarding TeX on multiple platforms spread over different countries on different languages. For example, in France, one user could see TeX related questions by the users on his state and communicate with other countries.
 
Psmith, the TeX bot, in fixed font mode: Here's the output from texdef:

\textit:
macro:->\protect \textit


\textit :
\long macro:#1->\ifmmode \nfss@text {\itshape #1}\else \hmode@bgroup \text@command {#1}\itshape \check@icl #1\check@icr \expandafter \egroup \fi
!!/song
@PauloCereda Psmith, the TeX bot: Paulo is not listening to any songs at the moment.
 
@cgnieder Talking about TeX.SX, now it's only in English (the most spoken language over Earth), but who said that one SE format couldn't exist by another language such as Italian, french, spanish, et similia?
 
@AndreaL. I believe there has been a meta question on that topic IIRC
 
@AndreaL. Userbase would be fragmented.
 
1:02 PM
@FaheemMitha :)
 
@PauloCereda That's why I stated at the beginning it was a dumb idea! A little utopian dream!
 
@AndreaL. I guess Stefan had a similar dream when he started texwelt.de
 
@AndreaL. It would be awesome to envision some sort of Great TeX War: general egreg vs. major-general Sir David Carlisle. :)
Expect a lot of \expandafter's! Oh the horror! :)
 
@PauloCereda LOL!
 
And Joseph would be the secret agent with license to redefine commands. :)
 
1:06 PM
@PauloCereda we'd both use L3 and fighting with \expandafter would be like fighting with a flint arrow in a nuclear age.
3
 
@DavidCarlisle Oh my! :)
 
@PauloCereda like in this answer tex.stackexchange.com/a/8036/5049 :)
 
@cgnieder Aaaugh! It's burning!
 
@cgnieder Oh my, it hurts! :)
!!/choose David, egreg
@PauloCereda Psmith, the TeX bot: The great oracle says: David
Oh.
 
@PauloCereda excellent choice (unless it is choice of who to send to the gallows)
 
1:09 PM
!!/eightball Can we use \expandafter's in a war?
@PauloCereda Psmith, the TeX bot: The great 8-ball says: absolutely not.
@DavidCarlisle :)
!!/eightball Is 2014 the year of xor? :)
 
@PauloCereda Then there is still Bruno's multiexpand package...
 
@PauloCereda Psmith, the TeX bot: The great 8-ball says: no way.
@cgnieder No fair, Bruno is so overpowered to enter in any kind of war. He's like the momentum from Doctor Who. :)
 
@PauloCereda lol
 
@PauloCereda Ahah!
 
!!/fortune
@PauloCereda Psmith, the TeX bot: Here is your fortune: A cynic is only a frustrated optimist.
 
1:12 PM
!!/cricket
 
Psmith, the TeX bot, in fixed font mode: Let's take a look at the last cricket results:

- Bengal 317/10 &  267/10  v Railways 222/10 &  314/10 *
- Pakistan 165/10 &  359/10  v Sri Lanka 137/1 &  388/10 *
- Australia Women 57/5 &  207/10 * v England Women 201/10 &  190/10
- Border 136/3 * v Eastern Province 134/3
- Easterns 89/10 * v North West 118/8
- Pakistan Women v South Africa Women 115/6 *
- Knights v Lions 77/1 *

Our cricket expert David might explain these results later on.
Yay go England Women!
 
@PauloCereda I fear not looking at that scoreline
 
@DavidCarlisle Since I have no idea of what that means, I'm just expecting the best. :) Woohoo!
 
In the inbox:
> Congratulations on passing the (admittedly completely arbitrary) 100k reputation mark on TeX - LaTeX Stack Exchange!
9
 
@JosephWright Congrats!
 
1:16 PM
@AndreaL. Thanks
 
@JosephWright Congrats @Joseph! Keep'em goin'!
 
@PauloCereda it means England have had both their innings and have 391 runs, and Australia are half way through their second innings and have 264
 
Currently looking as though the moderators will have to make a judgement on the TUG votes (tie for last place)
 
@JosephWright Psmith decides.
@DavidCarlisle hmmmm
!!/choose this guy, that guy
 
@Joseph wright Ohoo. Congragulatons.
 
1:18 PM
@PauloCereda Psmith, the TeX bot: The great oracle says: that guy
 
@JosephWright oh congratulations on the 100K.
 
@DavidCarlisle :-)
 
@JosephWright Yay, congrats! Go get 'em, tiger!
!!/eightball Does Joseph deserve 100k rep? :)
@PauloCereda Psmith, the TeX bot: The great 8-ball says: most likely.
:)
 
@PauloCereda Seems legit... :)
 
@AndreaL. Psmith is 100% accurate.
!!/choose vim, emacs
@PauloCereda Psmith, the TeX bot: The great oracle says: vim
See? ^^ :)
 
1:20 PM
@PauloCereda Whoa!
 
@PauloCereda But not in all cases it seems :p
 
!!/choose vim, emacs
 
@DavidCarlisle Psmith, the TeX bot: The great oracle says: emacs
 
!!/choose tex, word
 
that's better
 
1:21 PM
@AndreaL. Psmith, the TeX bot: The great oracle says: tex
 
@PauloCereda I had "absolutely" no doubts! ;)
 
@AndreaL. :)
!!/choose tex, latex, xetex, luatex, context
@PauloCereda Psmith, the TeX bot: The great oracle says: xetex
 
@PauloCereda How the heck does it know my favourite TeX system? It's sorcery! ;)
 
!!/eightball Are you psychic, Psmith?
@PauloCereda Psmith, the TeX bot: The great 8-ball says: affirmative.
Are you dead, Psmith? :P
 
This one will make me go crazy, but how about...
@PauloCereda !!/answer question What is the meaning of Life, the Universe, and Everything?
Hehe...
 
1:36 PM
 
@cgnieder LOL
!!/answer question What is the meaning of Life, the Universe, and Everything?
Psmith, the TeX bot, in fixed font mode:

Ultimate Question of Life, the Universe, and Everything
What do you get if you multiply six by nine?
(according to Douglas Adams' humorous science-fiction novel The Restaurant at the End of the Universe)
@AndreaL.: ^^ there you go. :)
 
@PauloCereda Can we expand TeXbot as an earth-sized supercomputer? It will tell us the Quesiton then, why not to take advantage? ;)
@PauloCereda Jokes apart, and to be honest, I was certainly expecting that result!
 
!!/answer Do you love me?
Psmith, the TeX bot, in fixed font mode:

Do you like me?
Of course; I like all humans who ask me questions I can answer.
 
!!/answer What's a Grothendieck category?
 
Psmith, the TeX bot, in fixed font mode:

Alexander Grothendieck  (mathematician)
full name | Alexander Grothendieck
date of birth | Wednesday, March 28, 1928 (85 years ago)
Mathematician known for his role in the development of the modern theory of algebraic geometry
Discovered the (script l)-adic étale cohomology, the first arithmetic Weil cohomology
Especially influential in the fields of algebraic K-theory, motivic homotopy theory, and motivic integration
Grothendieck's constant  |  Grothendieck's theorem
 
1:47 PM
!!/answer What's the fugitive element in a compact group?
 
Psmith, the TeX bot, in fixed font mode:

indium | group
13
!!/answer tell me a joke
Psmith, the TeX bot, in fixed font mode:

Tell me a joke.
Q: What do you call a young eigensheep?  A: A lamb, duh!
(according to what passes for mathematical humor (my favorite sub-genre), drawn from several sources but primarily from P. Renteln and A. Dundes in their paper "Sampling of Mathematical Folk Humor" in Notices of the American Mathematical Society, vol. 52, pp. 24-34, 2005)
that was bad, Psmith.
 
@PauloCereda This is the answer to a different question I believe (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indium)
 
@cgnieder LOL
 
2:13 PM
1
Q: problem with psfrag, eps file and texworks

GuestTexI need to compile file using psfrag ans eps figure. I use texworks on windows and I have read that there are problems with pdflatex and I should go the latex->dvi->ps way but all I have found so far is not at all understandable for me... could you help me please? Thanks by advance :)

Do we have another 'TeXworks + dvips' question?
Links to what I was saying earlier about a wider 'configuring editors' things
 
Nice avtar:
@Stiff Jokes You really rock. :-)
 
2:51 PM
@HarishKumar Just noticed, and never forgettable...
 
@JosephWright Wow, people still using dvips?
 
@FaheemMitha well, of course they do. It's basically the only way to go if you use PSTricks, for instance. Many journals have never switched to PDF, basically because it's a proprietary format.
 
@tohecz I needed dvips for something recently, and realised I didn't have it installed.
 
@FaheemMitha I wo with full TeXlive, so I don't have these problems ;)
 
@tohecz Oh. I didn't know some journals didn't use PDF. Also, didn't know PDF was propietary. Isn't the spec published?
@tohecz Ok. I just install the bits I need.
 
2:57 PM
@FaheemMitha the spec is published, but it doesn't change the fact that it's proprietary.
 
@tohecz Ok. Can someone remind what the defn of a proprietary language is?
 
@FaheemMitha well, it's released by a (profit) company, not by a (non-profit) institution. The company is Adobe in this case.
 
@tohecz Um, so was Java.
Is that also proprietary?
 
many people also don't like that it's called "portable" while it's "stupid" in their opinion. You can ask Brent about it, but he doesn't seem to be around...
 
@FaheemMitha Java is not proprietary.
 
3:00 PM
@FaheemMitha Quite. Java is still pain-in-the-ass, because it's either non-free (therefore not included in many unix distros) or non-working
 
@PauloCereda True. That's my point.
@tohecz I'm no fan of java. Just wondering what proprietary means in the context of a computer language.
 
@tohecz OpenJDK, Harmony. Those VM's are opensource, and the first is shipped with your Fedora distro. :)
@FaheemMitha Language per se cannot be proprietary. Compilers can. :)
 
@PauloCereda well, 4 years ago, with Fedora12, I got some java that was a bullshit, unable to run 80% of java stuff. I've never managed to install the Sun java, so I just let it be. Gladly not many people use it.
 
@PauloCereda That makes sense, but where does that leave PDF?
 
@tohecz I know what you mean. :)
 
3:03 PM
The best thing about Java is that it is not PHP.
 
@FaheemMitha any problem with PHP?
 
@tohecz You mean, do I have a problem with PHP?
 
@FaheemMitha yes, that ;)
 
If so, then yes, it is an abomination.
 
@tohecz It's an ISO
 
3:04 PM
Not so much a language as an abomination.
 
@FaheemMitha It's an open format recently. :)
 
@PauloCereda What is?
 
btw, I got a nice metal puzzle for Christmas, I solved it, but then I was like: "Is my solution optimal?" and "Is the puzzle optimal?" So I wrote a nice program solving the puzzle, guess in what language ;)
 
@FaheemMitha PDF
 
@JosephWright yeah, I know, but AFAIK this is quite a recent things
 
3:04 PM
@PauloCereda What does that mean?
 
@tohecz I don't think that's why journals still use DVI, in any case
 
@JosephWright yeah, they use DVI and they deny you to use anything newer than 2007 :-/
 
@FaheemMitha PDF is now an open format, with a public specification, and now regulated by a standards organization (that's why @Joseph mentioned ISO). :)
 
@JosephWright International Standards Organization?
 
@tohecz: I'm gonna create my own format and dominate the world. :)
 
3:06 PM
@tohecz Well I think they have a working workflow and don't change it: if they are using TeX within a bigger package then it's not easy to alter
 
@PauloCereda So, is it still proprietary?
 
@FaheemMitha Adobe have made extensions, but they can't change the ISO version
 
@JosephWright Good to know.
 
@JosephWright yeah, because it's soooo difficult on any machine to install a second TeX distro along the old one, check that everything work (having the old one as a backdoor) and switch once they debug it
 
Sounds non-proprietary to me then. At least the ISO version.
 
3:07 PM
@FaheemMitha Nope. Although Adobe can provide extensions, they can't incorporate stuff that easily now. :)
 
@JosephWright which is one of the reasons why still Acrobat deals best with PDF files. in all honesty, the viewer in TeXworks is quite bad.
 
@tohecz I think you underestimate the complexity on a server, probably running VAX or an old Linux
 
@tohecz Indeed.
 
@tohecz Poppler is certainly not perfect
 
I wish I could have time to tackle a PDF viewer.
 
3:08 PM
@JosephWright and it's very slow on some files. When I say "very", I mean like 15seconds a page.
 
@tohecz I meant build-in as in 'hidden', not as part of a stand-alone and accessible TeX system
@tohecz Not my experience, but that almost certainly depends on what you have in your pages
 
@JosephWright Well, I can understand they have "reasons", I just say it's ridiculous
@JosephWright sometimes it's big imcluded PNG files that are not mine. In Acrobat it's quite fluent, not in TeXworks.
but there're many ridiculous things around journals, some of the templates are really bad.
 
@tohecz Don't really have much experience in that area
 
@JosephWright well, of the journals/proceedings I've ever published in, it's 50-50.
 
@tohecz ask Barbara about that: tex.stackexchange.com/questions/59541/…
 
3:12 PM
@tohecz Remember I have to submit Word files, which get typeset properly if/when accepted
 
For example our faculty yearly PhD proceedings are LaTeXed in 12pt on A4, to be printed on B5 later. Yuck!
 
@cgnieder This is actually something I've been thinking about: some sort of TeX sandbox, where you can keep versioned stuff, so say, $ tool-name l3-stable will set the stable branch of L3 as default, and $ tool-name l3-nightly will make things bleeding-edge. :)
 
@JosephWright yeah, I know. I actually get many articles in Word, and I have to typeset them properly in LaTeX. Quite a task I tell you
 
@tohecz My lot do it by importing into 3B2, so XML-based
 
@PauloCereda interesting idea
 
3:15 PM
@JosephWright I open the file in openoffice (I don't have MSWord newer than XP anyways), save as .odt and then I use writer2latex -clean
 
@tohecz I meant on an automated basis: I don't think it's done by people!
 
@JosephWright /fear There's no working automated solution for word2latex.
 
@tohecz Well (almost) the whole of chemistry uses Word, and we are talking thousands of articles
@tohecz Not converting to TeX, converting to XML
3B2 doesn't use TeX
 
@JosephWright yeah, it's stupid. Even more stupid is the fact that quite a number of chemists hate this fact.
@JosephWright ok, I think I don't know what do you speak about
 
@tohecz Only a small number: most are happy with Word
@tohecz Articles are converted from Word (or indeed LaTeX) into a proprietary XML format. It's then used to generate PDF/HTML output using an automated typesetter, but not TeX
 
3:20 PM
@JosephWright well, I know couple such ones :)
 
@tohecz Yes, but I probably know a lot more chemists than you :-)
 
@JosephWright ah ok. I wonder what the quality of the output is
 
@tohecz 3B2 is the 'market leader'
 
@JosephWright ok, I should remember that for once some article author will ask me about it
 
3:33 PM
Right, what should I ask for from the swag list?
 
@JosephWright and what is on the list?
 
Does that work for other people?
 
@JosephWright yep it does. I can't click on anything, but that's probably correct
@JosephWright well, I would take the merit badge and put it on my scout uniform ;)
 
@JosephWright I can't select anything but I can see the "stack winter collection" ;-)
 
3:50 PM
@tohecz I'd probably go for the mug :)
 
@cgnieder My preference too: mugs are always handy
 
@JosephWright and can not only be used for beverages... maybe serve as a pen holder or something
 
@cgnieder :-)
 
@cgnieder however, it's SO and not SE :-/
 
@tohecz yes, that's a pity...
 
4:03 PM
@tohecz Still a mug
 
@JosephWright yep, I know :)
 
Watching the last of our selection process, the snooker and reading some lecture notes :-)
 
@JosephWright I can only watch snooker in three hours... they're not broadcasting earlier here :(
 
@cgnieder Won't update you, then
 
@JosephWright :)
 
4:20 PM
so, we have 40 minutes until the end of election, and a 3-tie on the 7th and 8th place :)
 
@tohecz Yup
 
@JosephWright we'll have to see if those "if-and-only-if" ones decide to simplify the task
 
@tohecz Mods will make a decision
 
4:36 PM
The version status of pgf/tikz at sourceforge is 3.0.0
Does anyone know by chance, when it is released to CTAN?
 
4:47 PM
@Johannes_B Does it matter?
 
@FaheemMitha I am just interested.
 
@FaheemMitha It does, with TeXlive, the release date can singnificantly influence when it gets to the end users
 
@tohecz Miles off :-)
 
@JosephWright ?
 
@tohecz The TL freeze
 
4:50 PM
oh, yeah, that's true
 
@tohecz I thought PGF wasn't in TeX Live. At least Debian packages it separately.
 
@FaheemMitha Debian only has what is in TeX Live!
 
@JosephWright I'm pretty sure the PGF package is separate.
 
@FaheemMitha I would never ever install a linux distro's LaTeX again
 
I packaged it one time, because the maintainer was very slow. He just used the version that is of the sourceforge site.
 
4:57 PM
@FaheemMitha Yes, but it's taken from the TeX Live 'master'
 
@tohecz I don't see why not.
@JosephWright How do you know? Does it say this somewhere?
 
@FaheemMitha it's always outdated and badly updated
 
Not that it matters.
 
@FaheemMitha Everything TeX-related in Debian comes from TeX Live
 
@tohecz Out of date, true. Not sure what you mean by "badly updated"
@JosephWright Ok.
 
4:59 PM
@FaheemMitha when you have linux release from year 2012, you get TeXlive 2010 or 2011, and you have no easy chance to get 2012, even after 2 years.
 
@tohecz Actually, I think Norbert does a pretty good job, though it is just him. Which is a bit worrying.
@tohecz Backporting is possible.
That's what I do.
 
@FaheemMitha Yes
@tohecz There were structural changes, so I think things may improve
 
@JosephWright Yes to pretty good job, or yes to worrying? :-)
 
@FaheemMitha Both
 
@JosephWright heh
 
5:00 PM
@JosephWright well, good to hear :) I would be basically most happy with the distros packaging an improved tl-install script that would be universal throughout time
 
An alarming number of important packages in Debian depend on individuals.
 
!!/fortune
@PauloCereda Psmith, the TeX bot: Here is your fortune: Ignore previous cookie.
 
@PauloCereda Did you see the match? First half with slippers on. ;-)
 
@egreg :)
 
5:31 PM
!!/fortune
@PauloCereda Psmith, the TeX bot: Here is your fortune: Use longtable.
 
5:53 PM
@pops Could you make arrangements to forward the names/details of our 'representatives' to TUG: complete results at meta.tex.stackexchange.com/questions/4150/…
 
!!/eightball Will he forward the results?
 
@JosephWright can you @ call someone who's not in the room?
 
@PauloCereda Psmith, the TeX bot: The great 8-ball says: certainly not.
 
@PauloCereda ouch, we're screwed :P
 
@tohecz For short periods after they've visited, anyone can. Mods can use a 'special' version (@@) to address anyone with an account on the site
 
5:56 PM
@JosephWright well, ok, I just that @p doesn't suggest pops, only Paulo and Peter
 
@tohecz Depends on timings, as I said
 
@JosephWright I thought @foo worked for anyone on the relevant site. I mean, if they are not in the chatroom they would see it in their mailbox.
 
I've used the 'mod' ping to make sure of it
@FaheemMitha No
 
@JosephWright Huh. That's too bad. Why not?
 
@FaheemMitha they would not.
 
5:58 PM
@FaheemMitha There are lots of people with the same name on the site, which can be confusing enough. I can do a ping by user ID, so can be sure I get the correct person.
 
@tohecz Too bad.
 
@FaheemMitha for the same reason why private messages do not exist here, whatever reason it is.
 
@JosephWright Ok.
 
@tohecz Feeling is they would not in general be positive
 
@FaheemMitha Network gives you different ID's.
 
5:59 PM
Does it work if you stick a @name inside a question or answer?
 
Moderators get 'special' powers as there are occasions it's needed
@FaheemMitha No
 
or only if that person contributed?
 
@FaheemMitha no, only for "relevant people"
 
@FaheemMitha Only comments, and only if they've contributed
 
@FaheemMitha that
 
5:59 PM
Idea is that a 'good' question shouldn't be addressed to one other user: not the point of the site/network
 
@JosephWright Ok, thanks. My illusions are being shattered all over the place.
 
I would like to see it expanded to close votees and editors, though
 
@tohecz I can see that: there is a reason I usually leave a comment if I mod-close a question
 
@JosephWright No, my thought was that they would get a notification in that case.
 
@JosephWright well, that's a good point
 
6:00 PM
@FaheemMitha Think of this: TeX is a language in which @ has a special meaning. Think of the madness if any occurrence of it resolves to a random ping. :)
 
@tohecz Editors is a bit more complex, as if you don't like it you can roll-back and leave a comment
 
It would be cool. :)
 
@PauloCereda Good point. But it still works in comments, so their is potential for confusion there...
 
@JosephWright but sometimes it's more complicated than that. After all, if you rollback thinking the edit was bad, they wouldn't even know
@FaheemMitha btw, in chat, you can ping @Paulo more @Joseph people, in comments, only one person per comment, and remember that the Q/A owner gets pinged automatically
 
@FaheemMitha Only one person can be addressed in the comments, so @foo, @bar and @foobaz only will resolve to a ping to foo.
@tohecz Exactly. :)
 
6:02 PM
@tohecz Well if they watch the front page they would :-) Again, I think the idea is that it's not supposed to be 'personal'. If you roll-back an edit, presumably it's got some 'generic' reason such as 'All: I really did mean \relxa not \relax'
@PauloCereda That one can be tricky :-)
 
@JosephWright :P
 
@JosephWright I know, still sometimes we have different point of view, and a edit war isn't a way to discuss them :)
Yeah, I will definitely call the most important command of my next package \relxa :D
 
6:16 PM
!!/fortune
@PauloCereda Psmith, the TeX bot: Here is your fortune: Error 404: cookie not found.
 
@JosephWright Message received! I've actually been waiting for the results of this election; our financial person has been after me for those names for days.
 
!!/eightball Should Pops troll the financial person because of our TUG election?
@PauloCereda Psmith, the TeX bot: The great 8-ball says: yes. Beware, Alan might stab you.
 
And yes, you can @-notify people who aren't in the room, but they have to have been in the room recently. (Otherwise if you tried to do it for "user" or "tim" or something you'd annoy and confuse a riot-grade horde of people.)
 
@Pops For some value of 'recently' :-)
 
Also, congrats on the sixth digit, @JosephWright!
 
6:20 PM
@PauloCereda Fun for a day: change your user name to »foo« (one for @StiffJokes?) and get a lot of confusing messages. The rest of the month until you can change your name back, well...
 
@cgnieder ooh that would be very evil!
 
@Pops Thanks
 
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