Ask Different Chat - 2012-02-17 (page 1 of 2)

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1:35 AM

@stuffe cool!!

thanks

2 hours later…

3:36 AM

If anyone here uses Safari, and doesn't mind being a guinea pig briefly, I could use a hand trying to reproduce a bug...

I do, what do you need?

stackoverflow.com/users/978917/ruakh?tab=answers

@KyleCronin Try to load that, let me know if you see any problems (absurd # of requests, etc) ^^^

I don't see anything absurd, it took 16 requests

formatting looks OK

cool.

Thanks, @Kyle!

no problem

3:53 AM

@bmike So Puma, Mountain Lion, and Panther are all the same cat?

10.1 = 10.3 = 10.8 hmmm

a panther's different I think

...or not

The cougar (Puma concolor), also known as puma, mountain lion, mountain cat, catamount or panther, depending on the region, is a mammal of the family Felidae, native to the Americas. This large, solitary cat has the greatest range of any large wild terrestrial mammal in the Western Hemisphere, extending from Yukon in Canada to the southern Andes of South America. An adaptable, generalist species, the cougar is found in every major American habitat type. It is the second heaviest cat in the Western Hemisphere, after the jaguar. Although large, the cougar is most closely related to sma...

(which is the onebox I linked to above)

Thus the musician John Puma Mellencamp.

so you did

the problem with being precise is that sometimes the name is a genus, but is often colloquially used to refer to specific species

so the genus panthera covers a lot of cats, but "panther" is more specific

4:28 AM

Hey @KyleCronin Did you get a chance to read my post?

@daviesgeek I did, I posted a response here: chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/message/3445387#3445387

Oh, sorry I didn't see that.

I will take a look at that.

Actually....

What do you think of this?

well like I said a while ago, I think the best approach would be less news reporting and more of a deep dive/opinion piece

I think we can assume that most people reading the blog have heard the news

I know, but did you like the flow of that one?

strictly speaking of the flow, it's better in that post

4:32 AM

Ok.

Sorry, I have a tendency sometimes not to flow well when writing.

what I'd really be interested in is if maybe you took a single new feature or change and explained why you're really looking forward to it

or why you hate it

or something

@daviesgeek menwithpens.ca/how-to-add-flow-to-writing

@jaberg Yeah, one thing I forgot to do: read my post aloud.

That usually fixes it for me.

@daviesgeek julia-purdy.suite101.com/how-to-make-your-writing-flow-a103907 (Those lists are solid in my view)

@KyleCronin I will get on this tommorrow

4:39 AM

@daviesgeek my post (which I was in the middle of writing when you asked about writing yours) is going to to up tomorrow, maybe you can find a jumping off point from there

take something I say and agree or disagree

Ok.

@daviesgeek My only other suggestion regarding developing flow and style—both of which I struggle with in my own writing—is to start studying writers you like. Really studying. Don't read them for the message, read them for the words. Dissect sentences. Read them aloud. Put favorites in a clipping file to study later.

Ok. thanks

I would be remiss if I didn't warn you that obsession with craft of writing leads to cirrhosis of the liver.

4:54 AM

:-)

Hey @KyleCronin have you read my blog at all?

If so, does my writing flow well there?

@daviesgeek to be honest, I haven't read much of it

Ok, just wondering.

I always appreciate criticism on my writing....

I need it

read some of John Gruber's longer articles

and then try to emulate his style

@daviesgeek Just remember, if I ever send you a marked up revision, you asked for it.

I think for my blog I write more in the style of David Pogue.

but I'm not sure.

@jaberg Please

I already get it from my Mom, so I'm used to it.

user image

My current paper

The green highlights are my Mom's notes.

5:01 AM

If you want to be a writer, more Gruber, less Pogue.

I haven't read anything by Gruber.

And like I said, I'm not even sure that's who I'm emulating...

daringfireball.net/2006/05/good_journalism

Can you point me to some good articles by Gruber?

Doh, I'm stupid

Also, though it pertains to dramatic (script) writing, this memo from David Mamet nails it: movieline.com/2010/03/23/…

Daring Fireball is John Gruber.

5:05 AM

Make. Every. Word. Count.

I'd say Gruber is Daring Fireball, but yes.

I meant Daring Fireball is written by Gruber, but...

I know

I see.

But those two phrases carry different connotations.

Right, I know...

I am going to read some of those articles after I finish my paper.

So TTYL!

5:09 AM

Here's a nice example of personalizing something. Normally I don't think Siracusa is a great writer. He's a critical thinker and good *hyper*critic, but his prose doesn't do it for me. However, when he took off his reviewers hat and penned [*Steve Jobs: a personal remembrance
*](http://arstechnica.com/staff/fatbits/2011/10/steve-jobs-a-personal-remembrance.ars) his voice really came through.

And if you have a chance, lemme know what you think of the way I've written my blog articles.

Your blog is too hard for old eyes to read. ;) Fortunately, Safari offers me the Reader option.

I know.

I am going to eventually switch to a .com and a better template.

First glance, you use a lot of "extra" phrases. You're a bit redundant. (Reading aloud would help) and, as you say, you struggle for voice and flow. None of this is should discourage you. It takes 10,000 hours to become good at anything.

(And remember this comes from a guy who is probably only 8,000 hours into the process).

@jaberg Which post?

5:12 AM

I read through two or three. Like I said, a general impression.

And some of it would be more a question of taste than correctness

But, for example:

thegeektechblog.blogspot.com/2012_01_01_archive.html

I'd cut the first sentence. It's a quick little post (obvious, because it's short) about a little hidden feature. (Redundant, and and inaccurate, the feature isn't hidden at all, it's just little known.)

I see.

Good catch.

You're writing conversationally, which is good when done well, but it takes time to get out of the habit of writing what you're saying to yourself in your head.

You can go through any of my longer answer posts and find the same sorts of errors.

Refresh the page and see how you like it now.

I ruthlessly revisit everything I write. Paring away until, someday, I'm satisfied.

@jaberg Yes, I write conversationally, especially tutorials like that one.

5:17 AM

Keep writing conversationally, but recognize that you still have to apply discipline to the writing.

Ok.

Another minor thing to note is that this blog was for SEO purposes; to just get original content out there.

However, now that it's become a little bigger, I'm going to be better with my writing.

Start with a good voice. Blogging for SEO is blogging for the wrong reason. You have to be someone that others want to read, or you're just part of the problem.

Here's a two minute rewrite of your opening of the ML story:

I've been waiting for news of the next version of OS X. Apple announced OS X 10.8 Mountain Lion today, and made a preview release available to developers.

Some of the major new features of the new cat include:

I see. Concise....

Some of it might not be your voice, for example, using new cat so I didn't have to repeat Mountain Lion

Right

5:23 AM

And on reflection, I'd say new cat from Cupertino

@jaberg would you like an account on the Ask Different Blog?

we're looking for contributors

Probably the most important thing is to not rush to post. Write in Byword (or Text Edit or Mars Edit)

@KyleCronin I have been seriously considering approaching you--from the day you announced the blog.

well we'd love to have you on board

… Write in an external editor (not "on the web") and let a post sit there. Re-read it. Read it aloud. Rethink and rework it.

Don't be the first to press, be the best to press.

And, as Kyle has been encouraging, find something to say. Feature lists are one step above Ten Reasons Why slide shows.

Ok I changed it up a little:

New Apple releases and announcements always interest me. Apple announced OS X Mountain Lion (10.8) today, and made a preview release available to developers.
Major features of the eighth release include:

I changed some stuff to make it more my style of writing.

5:26 AM

eighth release of the computer (or Macintosh) operating system

But yes, that is much better.

Major features of the eighth release of OS X include:

If I was going to nitpick--and I trust you're taking this constructively--I'd start with "New from Apple interests me" because "announce" appears in two consecutive sentences.

(See, this is brutal. Brutal to write. Brutal to proof. Brutal to revise. That's why writers won't go50/50 because you provided the idea)

New Apple releases always interest me.

Go through and rewrite it with your new thoughts in mind. Let it percolate for a few hours, then revise it again. Then seek critique from others.

Always is redundant.

You are interested, therefor they interest.

Do you hate me yet?

@jaberg I hate you now.

No, to be honest, I don't

I really appreciate the help.

5:32 AM

(And don't think I'm "holding this stuff back" at first--I'm posting it back at you as it occurs to me--same as I do for myself.)

Yeah.

I have made so many revisions to already posted articles on my blog.

In an ideal world, blog revisions should be limited to minor corrections (unless you're Violet Blue). Get it right before you hit publish.

@daviesgeek instead of trying to focus on SEO, maybe you could use your blog as a way to get better at writing, and to come up with some posts you can propose to cross-post to the Ask Different blog

Yes, I know.

The original intent of my blog was just to drive traffic to sites I've been working on.

However, as I've built up my blog and especially now that it has some weight, I should probably have someone proof it first.

@daviesgeek How can I send you a text file? Fair is fair, I want to give you a shot at one of my articles. (It has some rough patches, but was already published in a local newsletter)

@daviesgeek I'm opposed to your morally corrupt SEO tactics. ;)

5:35 AM

212

Q: Does e-mail address obfuscation actually work?

Most of the time when I see someone post their email address online, especially if it's a personal address, they use something like me [at] example [dot] com instead of the actual email address (me@example.com). Even top members of this community use similar styles in their profiles: jt...

Problem is, my Mom has no computer knowledge, so it would be hard for her to proof my posts.

@jaberg do you have my address?

'cuz I'm going to delete it.

Yes

Sure would have been easier if I could have one-clicked it though,

:-)

You should have mail

yup

Very good article

Easy to read and good.

I need to go

@jaberg Ha!

5:43 AM

Gnite @daviesgeek

Lemme know if there's anything else you find.

I guess I need to go back and re-read all my posts when I'm not so tired.

@KyleCronin I'll dig into the trunk and put some pieces into shape, then submit them to the blog.

@jaberg sounds great

from what you've said here and there, it sounds like you've been using Macs for a long time

Looking forward to working with the team. Maybe it'll get me off my ass to (finally) get my own blog going too.

I'd love to get some pieces about what it was like in the classic Mac OS days, and how things are different now

that is, if that's something you're interested in writing about

5:48 AM

Macs since 88 or 89 I guess. But you'll need someone with a better memory to wax rhetorical on the old days. I can't remember what 10.4 was like, never mind 9. ;)

Besides, it's all part of the diabolical plan @stuffe and I have to argue the superiority of the Amiga.

@jaberg admittedly, technical details would be helpful in such a piece, but I think the core of it is about people and what it was like in those times

@jaberg looking forward to working with you too, it'll be great to get the blog off the ground again with some great submissions

@KyleCronin I'll start tossing notes into my clipping pile. Maybe something will emerge.

@jaberg you also seem to be really into writing, maybe an article on the tools you use and the process you have?

Not sure of the details, but I'd love to see a peer-review process in place for blog posts. (Not just a single read/approval)

I have my version of the Ode to Plain Text, All hail Markdown sitting in my dropbox awaiting polish. Need to revise it because I've added Markdown Services and Quick Cursor to the mix, but I can get that together quickly.

@jaberg yeah, I agree, that would be fantastic. we'd probably have to get more people on board so it's not the same "peers" every time :)

@jaberg nice! by the way, the blog is Wordpress but you can paste Markdown into the HTML view

5:54 AM

Agreed, but it would really benefit the blogs credibility if the facts we publish prove to be accurate.

@jaberg I agree.

Nice thing about the Markdown piece is that it has local (AD) relevancy as well as global appeal.

exactly, a lot of stuff is done in Markdown these days

I just did the post that's going up tomorrow (would love to get your thoughts on it by the way) in TextMate in Markdown, previewing in Marked

If Gruber would shave I'd… Okay, I would't really. But I do owe him a beer or ten.

it is pretty amazing that his talent is so diverse

5:57 AM

How do I read it. Is there a pending cue?

yes

sorry, when I made your account I added you as a Contributor

I made you an Editor now, so you should see everything

Ah,

just please don't post or schedule a post

Gotcha

I'm trying to keep a regular schedule

5:59 AM

Found it

You do realize that iCloud offers folders that work same as iOS? Drag a document over another, make a folder. (Per MG Siegler if I'm not mistaken)

I hadn't heard that definitively, but I presumed as much

I really need to see a screenshot of how that works, because in my head it looks ridiculous

"Key" apple developers is too strong. Anyone who pays $99 can be issued the certificate. Perhaps "registered" is a better word

I meant the key is doing the signing

I could word that better though

key that Apple provides developers

The context can be misconstrued.

The article is solid. There is some prose that I would adjust, but nothing so odious that I scream NO! I don't agree with much of what you say, but that's fodder for the comments and not an issue regarding the quality of your Op Ed.

@jaberg should be interesting to see the reaction :)

6:12 AM

Because my head doesn't hurt enough from reading the comments on Ars.

by the way, if your disagreement is substantial, that could make for a great post

Indeed

did you make any edits?

No

What is the mechanism for edits--is there a revert?

I think that there's some basic versioning, but I don't rely on it

6:14 AM

I would be more prone to suggest edits to you so that you could work them in with your own voice. Dammit, we need a CMS!

I'm making my changes in TextMate and copying them back up

by the way, even though you said you disagree with most things I said, I suspect that on the whole it won't be nearly as disagreed with as apple.blogoverflow.com/2011/10/disappointing

Here was the most glaring offender (corrected)

Instead of holding a press event or waiting until WWDC to announce the next Mac OS X, Apple chose to secretly met with an indeterminate number of journalists in both California and on the east coast to provide few-on-one presentations of Mountain Lion. (The "one" being a single journalist).

(And now I'd further revise it as the next version of OS X

Going to give you the same advice I gave @daviesgeek. Read it aloud. It's solid, but there is some awkward phrasing.

yeah, I agree

that sentence has been hashed and rehashed

The hash/rehash is process is something that I usually take to be a warning sign. Through that process, it's way too easy to keep "extra" words or phrases in place, make mistakes of case or tense, etc. Often best to paste the problem bit into a blank document and attack in in isolation.

ok, rephrased as "Instead of holding a press event or waiting until WWDC to announce the next Mac OS X, Apple chose to secretly meet with an indeterminate number of journalists in both California and on the east coast to provide presentations of Mountain Lion to journalists individually."

6:22 AM

That's even better than my cut at it

(basically, your phrasing with a corrected typo and removing "few-on-one")

Moving on...

n any case, I am not a journalist. No one at Apple has presented this to me, or given me a MacBook Air with a pre-release version of this software on it.

I am not a journalist. I didn't attend a presentation and I don't have a pre-release copy of Mountain Lion.

Kill the bit about the dev program/own hardware.

yeah

And move right into "I do not have the ability"

those bits fit better when there was a huge rant between the two paragraphs

6:25 AM

Period after capacity. Capital My opinions and impressions are based on the reviews I've read.

Simpler, Just as powerful. You already referenced Verge, MW, etc above.

right

As you got into the review itself the phrasing got less awkward. It's worth a careful read, but the changes weren't as obvious as these.

thanks for your help with the first bit

And again, some of this is "voice" so be sure to use yours, not mine.

everything you said is what I would say

6:28 AM

My pleasure. I think this is a great way for us all to improve our writing and the blog site itself.

you can see the rant I cut here: kylecronin.me/blog/2012/2/16/ambushed.html

and a quick read will make it clear why I cut it

but those two paragraphs we've been working on were just the first and last ones from the rant with minor tweaks

Sometimes when you've plodded through that first draft you have to walk away for a while, the approach it as a fresh "write". The constant re/writing process generally makes the prose more complex before it becomes simple

I'm not really a very good writer

My feelings about this were long a little angry, so I cut them from this article and posted them

long is out of context

I think I'm just going to drop that whole sentence

6:31 AM

You may be a weak writer but you have an analytical mind and strong opinions. As a Navy Master Chief once said to a SEAL Team candidate who had walked across the bottom of a swimming pool, Hell son, we can TEACH you to swim.

the thing is, I can only produce words on stuff I'm internally motivated to write about

You might say something like "I had mixed feelings" or my initial response was one of anger.

Write what you know. (Mark Twain)

I'm sure that would have gone over well with my teachers :)

Actually, apparently it wasn't Twain. Seems as if the origin is untraceable.

Twain did however pen Be good, and you will be lonesome

That has no relevance, but it's always stuck with me.

I'm not really sure what that means

6:36 AM

That would be another hour of debate. And the hour here grows late, so I'm going to defer.

indeed, I need to be getting to bed as well

this has been fun

Catch you tomorrow in all likelihood

sounds like a plan

I'm in the office all day, which is a euphemism for no clients

So I might get some writing done. :)

nice

I have not listened to this show, but the description makes me thing it might be something you might be interested in: 70decibels.com/thepenaddict

5 hours later…

Ask Different Blog

12:03 PM

Ask Different Blog: Of Mountain Lions and Men

Kyle Cronin on February 17, 2012

I awoke yesterday morning to a sea of posts about Apple’s latest operating system, Mountain Lion. Instead of holding a press event or waiting until WWDC to announce the next Mac OS X, Apple chose to secretly meet with an indeterminate number of journalists in both California and on the east coast to provide presentations of Mountain Lion to journalists individually. The journalists were then given a MacBook Air with Mountain Lion preloaded and an embargo not to publish until yesterday. My feelings about this were long a little angry, so I cut them from this article and posted them here. …

3 hours later…

2:37 PM

@KyleCronin The press release and available now route, or the keynote route, both result in sloppily written, repetitive and incomplete "First!!!11!!!!1one!!!11!" posts that litter the view over yonder internet vista. I'm giving a cautious welcome to allowing a small number of people time to provide a considered un-rushed complete opinion without the pressure to be first, or the potential to be swamped by the lower quality me-too posts.

Check the Macworld content - fantastic, and not just a marketting materials rehash thrown up in 10 minutes that any copywriter could accomplish, but some proper journalism backed by first hand experience.

In other news - I'd be interested to have a discussion (I missed the one above but have skimmed most of it) on how we can integrate a workflow to discuss Blog posts for collaborative improvement. I know it's early, I haven;t even provided a draft of anything yet, but if it's going to get bigger, perhaps we need like a standards guide and peer-review system in place? Not sure if Wordpress allows such discussion to take place. Perhaps a Wunderkit workspace?

2:51 PM

@stuffe I've been mulling over thoughts for a collaborative edit system myself.

@Jaberg I'd love to read your Markdown stuff even if it's not finished

whoa.....

Sneaked up on me there....

I was already typing mine before yours came up

Ah, simutaneous occurence

Took me a minute to glean your surprise but I got it—as you were explaining. ;)

The blog chat room might not cut it once there are a couple of drafts kickingg around

Yeah. My thoughts were that the existing SE edit system could work with a couple of "improvements". (Not saying they should make these changes--just using it as a starting point.)

1) Voting allows for a quick and dirty peer review. If three out five collaborators give it a thumbs up, it's probably good to go (Unless and editor kills it)

2) Edits need to become line item approvals. The ability for the author to page through the individual changes and accept or revert (preferably through multiple revisions) as warranted.

3) And comments for clarification of technical points, suggestions, etc.

Not sure I would want to get into micro editing someone else's copy

but discussion of tone, omissions, errors, possible extra material, inconcistencies etc plus a general kicking of the tyres opportunity for all but the time sensitive posts would be nice

2:57 PM

I don't think your copy would warrant it, but some of our collaborators don't have your writing chops and its one way to help them improve. The point of the

plus, I really want an excuse to use Wunderkit for something other than admiring it's clean lines ;)

…individual edits is that they can accept or reject suggestions--or change them into their own voice--but some of the copy is so wrong (and I say this from a style and flow point) that there's no easy way to make the suggestions.

I don't know Wunderkit but I'd be happy to have a look.

Unless we all write in C and use subversion and GITHUB ;)

Because writing in C improves all prose. ;)

Absolutely. Sloppy grammar can't be ignored, if you miss a comma it will just utterly fail to parse ;)

3:01 PM

If you read through the discussion from last night you'll see the struggle of expressing "critique" without the ability to go in and make wholesale changes. That being said, I would never want such changes to be carried forward (unless and Editor dictates it be so) without the author's approval and input.

I never miss a comma, I use them too often—and incorrectly.

that's why I skimmed a lot, I couldn't follow it

(I am a decent editor of prose, but not of punctuation)

@KyleCronin I'll give it a listen, but truth be told the pens I refer to are mostly metaphors. Byword is my pen. Markdown is my ink. DropBox is my notebook.

(I wish you could reference your own comment here)

@KyleCronin I do have one good pen. A Rotring (from back when it was still a product of Germany) "3-way" that incorporates a ball point pen, a mechanical pencil, and a PDA stylus (where a second pen would normally live) used back in my Palm Pilot days. As the current Rotrings aren't as nice I rarely carry it for fear of losing it. It's been relegated to desk duty, a terrible fate for a quality tool

3:20 PM

Rotring 600 Trio. Based on the asking price, I'm not the only person to find the current Rotring to be substandard

3:37 PM

@jaberg ah, then never mind. I somehow thought I read you were into pens and paper.

@stuffe I guess I like the process of sites coming out with the story as soon as they can, then fleshing it out and writing followup stories throughout the day

@KyleCronin I love it too, it's exciting refreshing and finding out a new tidbit here and there throughout the morning etc. But I also recognise it as a guilty pleasure - like eating donuts for breakfast, I still do it, but I know it's a really bad way to do breakfast

I also don't like that there's no canonical version of the presentation

it can somewhat be pieced together by combining all the coverage, but it still feels like you're getting this information secondhand

The canonical version of the presentation will be the screenshots and videos that appear on Apple's product site in the coming weeks.

the product pages have never held as much information as the presentation

@stuffe Dammit man. Now I need to head out for Maple Bacon Donuts

@KyleCronin Toward the end of the Lion preview cycle those pages were packed with information.

3:51 PM

maybe I just never noticed because I always watched the presentations and so none of it was news to me, but even still I don't particularly like waiting :)

So to break it down, if apple were to post a video of Phil running through the presentation you would be happy?

0

Q: Holding down 6 keys during startup. Help program that erases personal data

Two months after my update to Snow Leopard, my computer hung. When I restarted I could log in, but then the only thing I could do was moving the mouse cursor. So I called my support. The support told me to hold 6 keys on the keyboard during startup. This erased all my personal information but kep...

snow-leopard startup

mostly, provided they posted it when the embargo lifted so I could have watched that instead of having to rely on third-party sites for the info

I'm troubled by this question. The answer I provided is the best available, and as such provides useful information, but as the question itself has no answer (AFAIK), I wonder if it should remain open.

@KyleCronin I have no insider information, but it wouldn't shock me to find a "First look at ML" video posted in coming days.

Sorry, didn't mean to toot my own horn with "best available" up there. Meant that it's the best information I can provide on keyboard shortcuts.

@jaberg that question is bizzare

so we're sure that the premise of the question is nonsense?

Not as bizarre as his attempt in meta, but yeah.

Run it by @bmike to double check me, but its such a twisted interpretation of the things that are possible, I believe so.

3:59 PM

ok

if it really is nonsense then I suggest we close as too localized

I think the question has two things going against it: Non-native (or less than fluent) English and a complete lack of understanding what happened. Plus his "acceptance" where he deems the whole thing "unimportant".

right

@stuffe Care to weigh in?

gimme 2 mins to catch up

So a "vote to close" is just a down vote with a comment about why? Or am I missing something?

4:02 PM

I just uploaded a drag blog that I bashed up in the last hour. Dunno if I need to share it or if you will see it anyway, but I shared it too. Comments welcome.

@jaberg I think the guy is not fully recalling the history of his problem, and as such no-one will ever understand his issue. Close.

That's a great summation of what I was trying to say.

I think he had a real problem. I think it was solved, somehow. I don't think there was a single six keystroke startup combination that did it.

Nathan Greenstein

See also meta.apple.stackexchange.com/questions/1106/…

@NathanGreenstein I had seen that. Even weirder than the question on the main site.

I already close voted that one I think. Mental!

in the WP blog, can we not read other peoples drafts unless they share? There are 5 drafts, 1 pending, and I can only read my own draft

I see @daviesgeek is risking my ire with his choice of tags ;)

He means well. He just needs molding and shaping.

4:12 PM

I'm just humoured :)

He's got the number 1 attribute - enthusiasm

@stuffe Absolutely. And the number 2 attribute - intellectual curiosity (wants to learn)

@jaberg how were you reading @daviesgeek blogpost? I can't access it

I read it on his site.

There's a link up there somewhere.

Not the pending review on the AD BlogOverflow WP site?

thegeektechblog.blogspot.com/2012/02/mountain-lion.html

No, I didn't read it there.

4:23 PM

Thanks.

You have access now tho, yes?

Yes I do.

But I have sworn to use those powers only for good.

Whoa, just received OSX update via App Store with a firmware update in it for my MBAir.

Notification Center alert, no proactive checking

Nice.

Can you check see if you can read all the drafts or just the shared ones?

WILCO

4:28 PM

..?

How would I know the difference between the two. I am on the page now, and i can tell you what I see.

can you read all 5 drafts?

WILCO. Radio shorhand for WILl COmply

(ahhh)

Sounded disturbingly close to my nickname at school (Wilko)

Well you know how I've stalking you.

In terms of recent activity I see two drafts and a pending.

Then a draft dated last October.

4:30 PM

I don't have a recent option. Posts > All posts > Drafts (5)

Ah, found that switch now. (Missed it when I looked.) 5 drafts in total.

can you open them all up, or just mine - I shared mine, but I don't know if I can read it because it's mine, or because it's shared....

davisegeek's piece is marked "pending", not "draft"

True

Yes, I can open all 5.

4:33 PM

You much have more privilege

Anyhoo, I done blogged.

minor skim for typos only, no formatting attempted, 1st draft

You are a mere ink stained wretch while I am in, in your humble world, the level above a diety, an Editor.

(I trust I don't need to use the (sarcasm) or (tongue-in-cheek) tag every time I post.

Not if you post enough lines for me to see your avatar face ;) :P

I can't even see other users listed or my own level. It's enough to get a draft up tho

(I have to say I see your avatar, and I think "Gandalf in Shades")

Yup, Gandalf in shades. definitely.

Well should we develop the collaborative workflow I'd petition to be dropped back down to collaborator level on WP. I'm fearful of accidentally replacing the entire blog with the inane rantings of Violet Blue.

Interesting, because it's actually Jeff in the right-hand seat of a Found, flying over beautiful Lake of the Woods in Ontario. The Found is a bush plane.

...whatever...Gandalf!

Can you take my entry out of pending? I don't want it put up yet.

4:44 PM

For the record, you're comparing a guy whose hair is short by marine corps standards to a white haired wizard with flowing locks.

I can make that change, but not while you're editing it.

i logged out

It's a draft again.

(Or it was posted immediately. I are confused by buttons. Computers are hard.)

Have you got a Wunderkit account @Jaberg?

No. But if you approve of it, I'm willing.

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