Moonwards

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kim holder

00:03

oh - also the appetites of astronauts on the ISS decrease, even with intense exercise programs they have to follow

with the low gravity on the Moon, that phenomenon would likely be less, but it would also likely continue to be true.

MolbOrg

00:38

"the 15 m2 was an estimate, as i didn't want to go find the figures myself right now either." - I did, and you will not find good numbers, but 15 is reasonable estimation. BIOS-3 had 45m^2 per 3 humans with 80% food covering (the rest were meat supplements outside of the system)
Chinese had worms they consumed, but there is no data about surface for plants used.
I prefer 20-25 because I prefer to have meat(fish) and do not like to eat bugs myself.

But really I'm more interested in energy system discussion(because biology is a big topic), but 1 million people they also should have same diet and export favorite food?

kim holder

some bugs are really quite tasty. you just have to get used to it.

in fact, lots of them are.

the city uses the entire crater as farmland and parkland. other than a few plazas and large buildings for popular use, nothing is built on the ground

MolbOrg

be consistent ) they export favorite food or they eat delicious bugs )

kim holder

it also has gardens elevated high above the ground, and high-intensity specialized greenhouses outside the city, for a few crops like grains and legumes

by that time, sure, they may well export a few delicacies

the people live in the towers that extend between the ground and the dome, and in the crater walls up near the rim

MolbOrg

00:55

ok, 0.75×60000 = 45MW

what do robots do?

or better what is the goal of the colony

kim holder

what was the goal of colonizing the new world?

i know everyone is all in knots about the business model in the early days, but this project is intended to look at the big picture.

MolbOrg

finding better live.

kim holder

yes, i suppose that was the motivation for most early settlers in the new world

for the moon, i expect it will have more to do with seeking new experiences, and a new way of living.

MolbOrg

and later, and even today people immigrate to US for a better life

kim holder

yes, the moon might indeed count as a better life in a lot of ways

but also, people will definitely have to give things up to go

no oceans, barely even a lake, a very limited set of animals and plants

MolbOrg

01:02

"to give things up to go" - completely disagree on that. - just as page checking note.

ok then, what robots do, which industry is present

kim holder

the big thing is construction - satellites, spaceships, space stations.

eventually it would probably even make sense to build solar power satellite installations - not in the near term though

MolbOrg

at 60'000 city level - their industry

kim holder

60,000 people can most definitely build lots of such things for profitable sale

but the early days of the colony are funded by the Residency Program

moonwards.com/timeline.html#ResidenceProgramBegins

the timeline has a lot of stuff in it, but if you read just that section, it is a lot easier than me trying to summarize it here

MolbOrg

Will read it, a bit later (preparing food right now)
I would define myself as energoanarchist, it's like capitalism but even worse.
Energy balance should add up, if not, everyone dies. money, gold all that crap worth nothing, only energy makes sense.
Say me the number, energy consumption )

btw. 1GW is about 1600t of aluminum production per day with energy efficient methods.

kim holder

we can get a lot more stuff done by using basalt, glass, and iron

i am about to label the sketchfab model of the current rough draft of the tank

but i should probably make dinner first too

skfb.ly/6q6SV

it isn't annotated and the materials haven't been set up, but it is there to look at, at least.

MolbOrg

01:50

@kimholder nice model )

12 hours later…

Feeds

13:26

Q: If there is actual ice on the moon, why hasn't it sublimated?

The Ars Technica article NASA seeks industry help with lunar landings, potentially sample return discusses the potential value of ice on the moon as a source for fuel in future space missions. Ice sublimates. Even if it is very cold hiding in permanent shadows in craters near the Moon's poles, I...

4 hours later…

MolbOrg

17:55

phys.org/news/2017-05-bricks-moondust-sun.html

bricks from regolith with 3d and solar

kim holder

.....

holy cow. vindication.

that is the first time i've seen a current paper using a technique closely analogous to what i propose for construction.

MolbOrg

)) U'll probably like then youtube.com/watch?v=Tsk-24UYFs0

kim holder

i am curious why they sinter (it seems) rather than liquify the material completely. Maybe it makes it easier to make forms.

btw, usually when people use the )) to indicate a smile, they add eyes using a colon - :)

i have a hard time getting used to your eyeless smiling faces :P

@MolbOrg oh yeah, that video i know well. I have used it to sell the idea several times.

MolbOrg

smiles well known phenomena quora.com/Why-do-Russians-use-as-a-smiley-instead-of

kim holder

heheheh. well that i didn't know.

why are people so focused on making little bricks that have perfect shapes? it makes building so much harder.

i really like my laminated approach with panels and boards better

i'm going to the plaza to buy vegetables. back in a while.

MolbOrg

18:09

as about video did you saw the version I linked? or other because I also know about it for a long time but I do not remember such good closeup shots of melting process. Pay attention how liquefying and tensile strength draws nearby particles which aren't molten but stuck to the liquid
So sintering is the way to increase accuracy. But I'm also a bit curious, other factors aren't excluded

kim holder

18:34

@MolbOrg yes, that's the one i know. a member showed it to me in the main chat room about a year and a half ago. brian lynch. he is really sharp, but he doesn't have time to spend here any more.

i haven't heard such a technical description before though of why the liquid pulls in nearby particles. interesting.

MolbOrg

s/tensile strength/surface tension/fix

kim holder

yeah, i sort of figured out that is what you meant.

MolbOrg

18:55

a bit boooring ted talk video, but a healthy idea and nice to see someone makes something about it - self-assembly at macro level youtube.com/watch?v=0gMCZFHv9v8

kim holder

19:41

now the model has notes skfb.ly/6q6SV

2 hours later…

kim holder

21:52

btw, i darkened the text of the website a little. i think it does make it a little easier to read, now that it has less contrast.

and i made the background a bit less transparent

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