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04:17
A cone-shaped water tank with height H=10 m and radius R=5 m is as shown in the figure below. Water is leaking at a rate of π m3/s through a small hole at the bottom of the tank. How fast was the depth of water decreasing (in m/s) when the depth of the water is 5 m.
My answer ends up as a positive 4/25 m/s but i think it should be negative right since the height is DECREASEING
Hi there,
Is every positive definite matrix must be symmetric matrix?
04:33
@CroCo To me, yes, but not to everyone.
@TedShifrin, how so?
For A=[2 1;0 2], x^T A x > 0 but not symmetric
@user71207 It could be right if you set up coordinates upside down. Show your work.
I know that. I said Most people, but not all, use the term only for symmetric .
@TedShifrin but math is precise how come opinions have impact on definitions?
x^T A x > 0 is precise definition. Symmetric matrix could be positive definite if its eigenvalues are positive, so it is special case.
@CroCo The source from which you get the term must have a precise definition. It does not mean that the phrase must be used consistently from source to source.
For example
a characteristic function in real analysis is very different from a characteristic function in probability
@TedShifrin Would you please explain why you adopt that it is always the case.
04:42
As a more relevant example, not every text defines "increasing" and "decreasing" functions in an interval the same way. Some include equality, some don't.
@Clarinetist, I'm reading pure math book. It states "A matrix is positive definite if it’s symmetric and all its pivots are positive."
@Clarinetist if the book is about physics, I would totally agree with you.
What about a mathematical physics book?
@user6232128, what do you mean?
Would you agree then?
I have never studied physics, and even with that I'd say that plenty of math books are inconsistent with terminology. What matters is that definitions are consistent within a source.
04:45
@user6232128, generally speaking, I would say yes because usually in physics, people tackle specific problems with specific constrains.
@user6232128 but the problem is severe if mathematicians themselves are not consistent with definition.
Good math textbooks state their terminology convensiopn
@CroCo It's not as severe as you might think. It's either implied by the context, or you go to the original source for the definition.
For example, there are two different ways to define "semiring."
@Clarinetist but if the book states specific definition where I can come up with counterpart example, then it would be awkward.
Not necessarily. In such a situation, all you do is you're using that definition if it's not clear.
@Clarinetist, in another book I'm reading, the author states "Some books generalize the idea of positive definiteness and negative definiteness to include nonsymmetric matrices."
04:51
Here's another example: in probability, there are two ways to define "geometric distribution" and "negative binomial distribution," and also two ways to write the "exponential distribution." In all three of these situations, you gain experience over time to know how to explain these concepts so that it's not ambiguous, or you just state the definition right out
Right, and there's nothing wrong with that
What matters is that the source you're using states the definition somewhere when it uses a fact on positive definite matrices, or it's clear from the context
I'll quit throwing examples at you, but for example, people use $A \subset B$ to mean the same as $A \subseteq B$, but people also use this to mean "$A$ is a subset of $B$, but $A \neq B$"
> What matters is that definitions are consistent within a source.
don't use too many sources
@Clarinetist, I'm not sure if I totally I agree with you about the subset. While you're making an excellent point, but I feel some times it is plausible to have two definitions for the same notion but sometimes not.
@user6232128, I'm not sure really what to say but I got confused for this definition since linear algebra is mature field and it is every well studied.
CroCo, everything you've typed is consistent with my statement. You say you're reading pure math, but the definition with pivots sounds more applied or numerical. What is the source ?
There are commonly different definitions of Fourier transform and inverse transform. 10% of undergraduate differential geometry texts have the sign wrong on the definition of torsion of a curve. Deal with it.
@TedShifrin, for the first book, Introduction to Linear Algebra by Gilbert Strang, 4th Edition
The second book is Optimal State Estimation by Dan Simon
@CroCo but this isn't high school where everyone uses the standard textbook
05:00
Yeah, Strang is an applied guy. I know him very well.
@TedShifrin , am I picking up the wrong book then? When I say wrong I mean it is not written carefully.
@user6232128, I totally agree but my question is really how come someone can come up with a definition where one can come up with counterpart example? This is really weird to me as graduate student in engineering
How come depends on the author's intention
@CroCo Depends on your purpose and what you're trying to learn.
@TedShifrin would you please state your definition for definiteness for matrix if you don't mind?
I told you. I use the term only for symmetric linear maps (a map $T$ satisying $Tx\cdot y = x\cdot Ty$).
I wrote my own linear algebra book after teaching from Strang's because I wanted to teach students to write proofs, and Strang is terrible for that.
05:12
@TedShifrin link to the book please. Would love to buy it
In my profile is a link to my webpage, and all books are linked there.
Did you ask Strang why he avoids proofs?
@TedShifrin nice book but a bit expensive. I will try to check my library or purchase used one.
@user6232128, may be he is trying to target a wide audience. Interestingly, I like his style.
Yeah, they take time away from applications.
05:27
He does not avoid them. His style is very intuitive. But you'll note I said i found the book bad for teaching students to write proofs.
Exercises and style not intended for that.
that's probably how he was taught
Hello everyone. I'm trying to prove that every compact subset of a metric space is closed. I wouldn't like to prove it through the openness of its complement. Any hints? What I have (aiming at contradiction) is a $y\in K'$ such that $y\not\in K$. So there's a neighborhood $V_{r}(y)$ that always has an element of $K$ within its arms, whatever positive value $r$ assumes. How can I use Ks compactness to arrive at a contradiction?
05:44
@user6232128 No, he just has different goals with his books.he,s a superb applied mathematician.
Openness of the.complement is the obvious approach.
@EduardoC. Do you know sequential compactness? And it's equivalence to compactness?
@SayanChattopadhyay Yes, but haven't properly arrived there yet
Then there's a much quicker way to prove this
So you know only the open covering defn and no theorems?
I thought I could prove it by contradiction or directly using only definition of limit point (and therefore of closed/open sets) and compact set
05:49
Why are you avoiding openness of the complement?
Hello
Ah, you can do a contrapositive proof.
@TedShifrin That's how the the author is doing and I'm trying to reprove each theorem by myself, so I feel that if I prove it using openness of the complement I would be too influenced by the author's idea.
Which may be a nonsense thing to do.
I mean that's the easiest proof. Other things would require you to know theorems
Sometimes it is, but I like your spirit.
No, contrapositive is totally elementary.
Suppose $y$ Is a limit point not in the set. Create an open covering.
05:53
But if someone is asked to tackle this question, won't their first try be to use the openness? Seems most natural.
Anyway, there are plenty of ways to prove this. It's topology after all
Tao's analysis 1 just arrived. Is that book good for real analysis?
I don't know Tao's books, but I hear nothing but praise.
I'll give it a thought, @TedShifrin, thanks.
@SayanChattopadhyay Indeed!
@mathguy I really like Tao's books. He's got this amazing way to think about analysis, which shows in his texts. Especially in his problem sets
After finishing volume 1 and 2 of tao's analysis, I would start studying complex analysis. Any book recommendations for complex analysis?
05:58
You may want to look at Stein and Shakarchi, but it's problem sets can be really hard. It's not too much on the rigour side of things. Some people prefer that, some people don't.
But to be honest, I have never seen a good complex analysis book yet, which doesn't skip important details.
I totally rely on books and (haha that's true) you people for studying since I am old and don't go to university.
What about Lars Ahlfors's complex analysis? Is that good?
06:32
@mathguy Tao's analysis texts are great. I wish I had learned from them my first time.
I don't know any complex analysis, but my inclination is to open up Gamelin's text for that
06:51
I was reading Apostol's introduction to analytic number theory and found this:
My question is, how did he turn the sum $$\mu(1)+\mu(p_1)+...+\mu(p_k)+\mu(p_1 p_2)+...\mu(p_{k-1}p_k)+...\mu(p_1...p_k)$$ to $$1+\binom{k}{1}(-1)+...+\binom{k}{k}(-1)^k$$
I am sometimes really bad in noticing obvious things so please tell if this is obvious from the definition of the mobius function.
BLM
BLM
07:31
@mathguy beyond my level, i am of little to no help in this
Surely someone will help you
Okay @BLM
BLM
BLM
@mathguy, @LeakyNun is a really good at this
yes he may help
each of those $\mu(p_i p_j)$ contribute to $+1$ in the sum right
how many of those are there
@LeakyNun What about the others?
07:35
you need to choose 2 increasing indices right
you need to choose 2 distinct primes from those k prime factors
that's why the contribution of +1 has weight (k choose 2)
oh ya
07:56
why do you guys like math?
BLM
BLM
@Stupidquestioninc one can study it all alone
no human interference required
Can someone prove $\phi(n)>\sqrt{n}$ for $n \neq 2$ and $n\ neq 6$
@Stupidquestioninc because it's beautiful. Like, see the mandelbrot set.
Or $e^{\pi i}+1=0$. Who would have thought about this unexpected connection between $\pi$, $e$ and $i$?
@epic_math To start, note that both sides are multiplicative in the number theoretic sense (i.e. when the factors are coprime)
 
1 hour later…
09:24
Is it always true that (k+1)'th prime number is smaller than 2*(k)'th prime integer?
Can we use that thm to prove sigma 1/p diverges? where p is a prime numbers
like sigma 1/n
I don't think that is enough, no, since the same is true of the sequence $a_n = (1.5)^n$ (let's say rounded down)
So in that sense, Bertrand's postulate is not very strong as a statement about the distribution of the primes.
Hmm.. I see. Thanks
I can't find the proof using Bertrand's postulate
 
2 hours later…
11:12
@Stupidquestioninc cool concepts
@user2103480 hello!
1
Q: Is the 3d convolution associative given that it can be represented as matrix multiplication?

HereItIsI'm trying to understand if a 3D convolution of the sort performed in a convolutional layer of a CNN is associative. Specifically, is the following true: $$ X \otimes(W \cdot Q)=(X \otimes W) \cdot Q, $$ where $\otimes$ is a convolution, $X$ is a 3D input to a convolution layer, $W$ is a 4D weig...

 
1 hour later…
12:21
@MikeMiller I would appreciate that, as a matter of fact.
@ShaVuklia Sorry to have been hurtful. To clarify the meaning of the jokes, I thought you were still pursuing physics, so learning alg geo seemed very arcane for what you wanted to know.
Instead you are pursuing it because you want arcane knowledge, which is respectable, but makes you an algebraist. :D
@MikeMiller Thx :)
Hmm, so now we need to figure out whether being called a physicist or an algebraist is the bigger insult :)
If the origin of a 2-manifold $M$ is $O=(1,1)$ and geodesics through $O$ are $y=x^{\pm n}$ for $x,y,n \in \Bbb R^+$ then what can be said about the curvature of $M?$
12:38
@TobiasKildetoft So people soing AQFT are the worst?
I was not aware that was a thing. But yes, anyone studying that must by definition be the worst
lol
I have a question. What happens to geodesics under a diffeomorphism?
well okay a geodesic diffeomorphism preserves geodesics between two manifolds
Hello, I need some help
What is the meaning of Tuition ?
12:56
Money you pay to attend school
I've passed school and I'll be going to college
So what's tuition in college?
same thing
college is also a type of school
So why we pay college fees and college fees separately?
What that means?
tuition?
You just wrote the same thing twice, but probably because that means the school gets to extract money from you twice :P
So, we pay college and tuition because as school fees?
I don't get it...
Do teachers teach twice? one for School and one for tuition?
13:00
Your questions are very hard to parse
Ummm?! Why?
Because the words you use do not usually go in that order or together in that context?
So, I'll have to pay for School and tuition for getting regular classes?
What if I only pay for school?
What they'll do? :P
School = college
Total confusion
13:03
College = school
Let's see... I'll never get it, I guess....
What do you think tuition is
Extra classes to reteach what is already been taught in school? Probably
Fee = tuition
Yeah that's not at all what we said above
Tuition is money
Tuition is money you pay to be allowed to attend college
13:05
Actually, tuition is the teaching. Tuition fees is money
2
Owwwwww! I now get it!
@TobiasKildetoft Ohhhhhh! I get it.
Tobias are you trolling
But often, it is just called tuition
Hullo fellas!
@MikeMiller No, that is literally what the word means
13:06
British vs american english
Fuck this
Tuition is such a weird word
In tuition
Intuition
oooo mike spoke the 'f word'
Like a tutor
@MikeMiller Ahh, I see that Americans have made it their own and changed the meaning to be the fees
Intuition: When you are drowning in student loans
13:07
tution=fees^2
I was not aware that this was one of those cases where American and British English differed
tuition: the charge or fee for instruction, as at a private school or a college or university
In the US they actually consider fees a separate category so they can suck more money out of you
Fees you have to pay to join student groups (which you have to pay even if you don't want to join any student groups), gym operation fees, etc
I suppose I could make some snarky remarks about how this difference came to be, but I will leave it at that :)
The language chosen to justify maximal extraction
13:09
I am intuition, Mike
Help
@TobiasKildetoft Probably because of irritating conversations like the one we just had, given that apparently people in the UK still say tuition to mean what you call tuition fees
When I was in university I had a home tutor who literally taught me that groups are associative. hahaha
Tuition is the teaching that a tutor does in a tutorial
He was the most expensive tutor ever
The explosion of costs started in the 70s after the language split
13:10
tuition is way too high honestly
@MikeMiller Words change meaning following popular usage. Since nobody normally uses tuition in the original meaning, it made sense to cut off the word that had become superfluous
Yes, that's what I was saying
And especially in a system where education and money are already so synonymous, it was not much of a change
I paid him like 120 dollars per month for no reason
I truly regret tuition.
@mathguy a month? That would buy like 1 hour of my time now (And I keep wondering why nobody wants to hire me as a tutor)
13:12
@mathguy Wow! These kinds of people become Godel when they grow up!
That amount of money was very much in that time
@TobiasKildetoft Like I said, the language split happened before the 1970s --- I can find the definition of tuition as "payment for instruction" in a 1910s american dictionary
The less common definition still at the time, but I don't think the narrative that this is about the cost of US university is correct
@MikeMiller Wow, that is way earlier than I would have guessed
By that "literally taught me that groups are associative" I meant "literally taught me that groups are commutative". sorry for typo
(This is in no way to defend the US system to be clear)
Also, sorry for being so belligerent this morning
13:15
Live and learn
I'm also sorry for
asking too many questionable questions in the chat
I am also sorry for keeping that tutor.
He also taught that every monoid is a group.
:'(
Are there tutors that tutor PHD students
that is a questionable question :-)
@geocalc33 Yeah. @user6232128 would.
He is a descendent of gauss
13:22
@user6232128 my bad lol :-)
@user6232128 =p
:---)
Have you people really started reading that?
I don't see much point reading a claimed proof of that which is 10 years old
(nor a recent one for that matter, but even more so an old one)
13:28
I have a question. Please don't make fun of me, anything can happen in mathematics
Anything can happen in mathematics, including me making fun
Does this way od differentiating make sense? For example, if we want to calculate $\frac{d}{dx}e^x$, first calculate: $$\int 1\,de^x$$ by this method:$$\int 1\,de^x=int \ln(e^x)de^x=\int \ln\,y\,dy$$
where $y=e^x$
@TobiasKildetoft second thing for sure
Now $$\int \ln y\, dy=y\,ln y-y=xe^x-e^x$$
13:35
Hey what is happening with my computer
I think this is a trojan
Oh shit
Are there any analysis subjects that are more elegant than harmonic analysis and functional analysis?
p-adic analysis
yeah p-adic analysis
13:40
rofl
I have no clue whether you are trolling, I literally couldn't care less about p-adics
And what does p-adic analysis even mean, is there also p-adic harmonic analysis then?
Number theorists gtfo
Hey I am back on my mobile phone. It was a trojan called something like memz trojan.
13:42
Next thing you'll be talking about analysis over F_5 or some other nonsense @EdwardEvans
lol you just complete Q w.r.t. a non-archimedean absolute value and then you get a complete metric space
so
calculus
Is any fan of number theory here?
(Well I myself am not a fan)
(I like algebra)
@EdwardEvans are there p-adic manifolds
13:44
just think of a thing and stick p-adic on it
So that they are locally diffeomorphic to a patch of (p-adic for some p)^d
there are p-adic lie groups so
yeah I guess
arithmetic manifolds or some shit
Isn't all of this what perfectoid spaces are meant to deal with in a unified way?
something like that
I'll report back if we learn about them this semester lol
13:46
And why should this be more elegant than real analysis? If it's comparable to complex analysis, from the style, then BEGONE
Can someone tell me what p adic analysis is? haha I really don't know about this
it's just easier because the absolute value is non-archimedean
Complex is just the algebra devil trying to seduce innocent young analysts
*cries in contour integrals
13:48
in the p-adic metric topology you get weird shit happening like "every point in a circle is the centre"
@EdwardEvans thanks I hate it
@EdwardEvans what the hell
Euclid is dying
@MikeMiller Let $M$ be a Riemannian manifold, then the gradient is an operator $\nabla : C^\infty(M) \to \Gamma(M; TM)$. Completing with respect to the $L^2$-inner product on both sides gives $\nabla : L^2(M) \to \Gamma_{L^2}(M; TM)$, I suppose? This must be a bounded linear operator, and $\nabla^* : \Gamma_{L^2}(M; TM) \to L^2(M)$ be the adjoint, so we can define Laplacian $\Delta = \nabla^* \nabla$ (this is like saying $d^* d$ but without going to forms).
Automatically self-adjoint; but why does it have discrete spectrum?
@Tobias oh damn, didn't know Scholze posted on MO lol
@EdwardEvans It is an old post. I haven't checked if he is still active
13:50
I don't know why but I jumped from my seat when I found that terence tao is on MO.
Because you're a child, I think
@MikeMiller haha the inverse function of a child
@BalarkaSen You want to show that $\Delta - \lambda I$ is Fredholm for all $\lambda$. A Fredholm operator never has eigenvalues accumulating to 0
13:51
And that should be the case for general elliptic operator reasons
@EdwardEvans ok yeah p-adic analysis is definitely out, keep it real and slightly complex
Mahler's theorem is too good for anything analysis
it's pretty cool, but I'm only just learning it tbf
Hello
I had a question and wrote its solution in latex. Please verify the solution.
The question is this:
And this is my answer:
Where Theorem 8.21 is this:
I think my answer is probably right, but I asked because a small mistake can happen.
14:08
Okay I have to go byeee
Can't handle 2 accounts at once huh
Your proof is fine
Also I guess I want to complete wrt $L^2_1$ on the domain
Because derivative
I won't get $\nabla$ otherwise
I am just going to slowly rediscover Hodge theory instead of learning it from a book
And in that case continuity of $\nabla$ is also clear
lol
Actually there is a problem with your argument
You're implicitly assuming $\chi$ is positive
Eg, it is not true that 1/6 = |1/2 - 1/3| <= 1/2 |1-1| = 0
Whereas 5/6 = |1/2+1/3| <= 1/2 |1+1| = 1
14:26
@mathguy i don't know about differentiating, but this way of integrating makes sense, you can look up the riemann-stieltjes integral
This brick
The symmetry group should be 8
But I am missing a symmetry in my head. I have 3 rotational symmetries, 3 reflectional ones, and the identity
I feel so dumb I can't find where #8 is for some reason
which 3 reflections?
through the xy, yz, xz planes
Is it a reflection I am missing @TobiasKildetoft?
hmm, so the opposite sides have the same color, right?
Yes.
14:41
So you are missing what you get by rotating and then reflecting around the same axis I think
OH
composition
I think you are right @TobiasKildetoft!
Thanks!
I am sad my computer is infected :(
Someone in chat told me that when he clicked on my profile, it said this user does not exists. Why is this happening?
can someone help me?
So what is happening in the link I gave?
it has the wrong usernumber
14:55
Why is it saying user doesn't exists?
because there is no user with that number
@anakhro There are exactly $4$ rotational symmetries (identity, and 3 of the other ones you described), so that's the symmetry group inside of $SO(3)$. Taking preimage under $O(3) \to SO(3)$, which is a $2$-sheeted covering, gives all symmetries, so that's of order $2 \cdot 4 = 8$. It seems you are missing the antipodal map: Suppose $[-1, 1] \times [-2, 2] \times [-3, 3]$ is your cuboid, then $x \mapsto -x$ gives an isometry, given by composing all three reflections.
@TobiasKildetoft hmmm.... how does this happen?
To prove that there are exactly $4$ rotational symmetries you can use orbit-stabilizer, orbit of any face can be exactly 2 because there's only one other face which looks like it. Stabilizer is also exactly 2, the rotation through the axis going through it's center.
$2\cdot 2 = 4$
aahhh yes so my proof was right
14:59
No I added a comment below that your proof doesn't work
My initial assessment was wrong

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