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16:00
@TedShifrin and what if we consider any other measure? let say $\mu$ a generic measure, if instead of $\int u d\mu$ I write $\int u \mu(x) dx$ what does $\mu(x)$ represents inside the integral?
No, you can't do that. $\mu$ assigns values to measurable sets, it's not a function of $x$.
They're using $\delta_y$ to denote both the measure and the usual "Delta function" (which of course isn't an actual function).
you are right, I messed up with the notation, actually my book is not using the notation from wikipedia
Wiki is not, despite all appearances to the contrary, the Bible of mathematics. :)
So this only holds for the case where we are dealing with Dirac measure, right?
because we can use this sort of trick involving the Dirac function
Right. There's really nothing going on, other than confusion of notation.
16:10
that's great, I am kinda noob in measurement theory, and sometimes I get really confused about notation when checking more than one source
Sometimes reading different sources can get really confusing, because you need to keep a table of notation for each of them ...
That's one reason that if I taught a course using a required textbook, I almost always followed the textbook's notation.
I am actually doing this for personal pleasure (?) and hence I don't have a "required textbook" though my main reference is "Measures, Integrals and Martingales"
Yes, I understand.
@RScrlli May I suggest Folland's Real Analysis for a nice exposition on Measure Theory as well as Stein and Shakarchi's Book 3 Real Analysis. Both have served me very well
Those may be tough going for someone without a strong math background ...
16:15
@TedShifrin True. I'm not aware of @RScrlli 's background
@RScrlli, according to his profile, seems to be on the interface of econ and statistics.
@NicholasRoberts I will definitely check them out, I started reading the last chapters (on measurement theory) from Baby Rudin, but I was advised not to
@NicholasRoberts yes actually I am Ms. in Economics
Halmos has a measure/integration theory book with a probability slant to it. It's a bit more old-fashioned, but might help.
and I'm starting my PhD in statistics this fall so I wanted to introduce myself to some more advanced topics
16:17
@RScrlli The second book I mentioned, Stein and Shakarchi, is more forgiving than Folland. I see it as a nice bridge between Undergrad and Graduate analysis. Folland is definitely a graduate text.
very nice @RScrlli ! Depending on your background in analysis, Stein may be good for you to look at.
For the PhD in statistics, they will probably want you to take more mathematical analysis courses, actually.
@TedShifrin random question, but do you know any good Functional Analysis books? My only background in the subject is Chapter 5 in Folland (which is very brief) and I'm interested in going deeper in it.
Actually you are right, I'll be follwing Functional Analysis on the first semester, and Measurement Theory/ Probability Theory as well
This is far from my expertise, but standards are big Rudin and (old but good) Riesz-Nagy.
I think lots of people like Conway's book(s).
16:20
rudiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiin, good book
ok thanks!
I'm not a big fan of Rudin, but lots of people are.
hi, Abhas
When you say Big Rudin, what book are we referring?
reffering to*?
Functional Analysis
@TedShifrin hi
16:22
I had a hard time dealing with baby rudin, I don't want to meet Mr. Grandpa
ahahah
I've not tried other mathematical analysis books, (except GN Berman)
No, I'm not recommending it for you, @RScrlli.
I know, just joking!
GN Bernman is good for pre highschool
For multivariable analysis, you might check out my book ... The econ folks who took my course loved it and found it very helpful.
Why are we talking about pre-high school?
16:23
@TedShifrin amazon link?
@TedShifrin I'm at highschool
good stuff on fourier analysis btw
@TedShifrin Indeed, could you give us a link?
It's linked in my profile. :)
There are also 112 YouTube lectures that you might find useful for some things, @RScrlli.
oh okay, one copy for me :)
eeeevning
The course covered both computations and proofs, integrating linear algebra and multivariable calculus.
Heya @ÍgjøgnumMeg.
Well, it's morning to me.
16:25
Hiya @Ted :)
Ah good morning"!
I will check them out for sure @TedShifrin.
But no measure theory, @RScrlli. Just Riemann integrals (in more dimensions).
still morning ? where are u? hahaha @TedShifrin
California
@TedShifrin Seems very good book, easy language, plenty of mathematics and pictures which seems explaining everything in detail.
16:26
LOL, you rush to judgment, @Abhas.
it's 10:00 - 0:04 here
Ah, yes, India with its half hours.
@TedShifrin hehehe, it's still better than judging from the cover :P :)
@TedShifrin yep
@TedShifrin That's pretty advanced for my level :P
Indeed, although I had several high school students who took the course (after learning single-variable calculus in high school).
Ok guys I am leaving, thanks again @TedShifrin and I'll check your book and the videos!
have a nice day guys
16:33
@TedShifrin It's possible to take multivariable calculus course in high school itself. I'll be taking this November, after the single variable analysis ends at the school
@TedShifrin Right now, I need some good stuff on tensor analysis, can you recommend one?
I do not trust high school courses that get so advanced. Certainly in this country they are not good.
No, I don't know old-fashioned tensor analysis books.
@TedShifrin um? uh? I needed to learn about GR in physics, needed to learn tensors... Then, I'll attempt for QFT, if everything goes alright, right before december.
You're nuts.
@TedShifrin I think I'm strange that way
You can't do GR or anything like that without a solid foundation in multivariable calculus and some differential geometry.
16:40
@TedShifrin I have got a solid foundation of Multivariable calculus, at least required for high school, just don't have a rigorous idea of multivariable analysis for it. (not rigorous, just that much which is required for physics)
And linear algebra ...
Tensors are generalizations of matrices, so you actually need to understand some linear algebra and, in particular, the Jacobian matrix in multivariable calculus.
But I don't have books to recommend for you.
@TedShifrin Yes, I know that.
I am trying to show that the center of $GL_n(\Bbb{R})$ is $\Bbb{R}^\times I_n$. If $A$ is in the center, then $AB = BA$ or $B^{-1}AB = A$ for every $B \in GL_n(\Bbb{R})$. My thought was to take $B$ to be some combination of elementary matrices such that $B^{-1}AB$ is a constant diagonal matrix, but I'm not sure how to make that more precise.
16:45
@user193319 That is the wrong approach
You should take $B$ to be just a matrix with one nonzero entry and see what happens.
You need to start with a general $A$ and then conclude stuff about $A$ from picking good candidates for $B$
@TedShifrin GL, not gl
Oh, oops.
but same idea works, just with 1's on the diagonal
16:50
@TobiasKildetoft So permutation matrices?
those can be used too
but that was not the ones I meant
Oh, I see what you're talking about.
an involutary matrix is an isometry
17:29
0
Q: A problem in convex analysis

Rajesh DachirajuA family of positive convex functions $C_{\lambda}:\mathbb{R}^N\to\mathbb{R}$, with parameter $\lambda \in (0,\infty)$. Let $x_{\lambda}$ denote the unique minimizer of $C_{\lambda}(x)$ over $x \in \mathbb{R}^N$. Another positive convex function $ D : \mathbb{R}^N \to \mathbb{R}$ and a real value...

18:05
Hello! Is it true that for close enough, real, irrational numbers, their continued fractions are the same up to some $n$th element?
 
1 hour later…
19:05
"Show that homomorphisms from Z to any group G is in bijetion with elements of G"
can someone explain what this question is saying
@TedShifrin the obligatory xkcd for this is xkcd.com/927
 
2 hours later…
20:44
Let's do some math.
2
 
1 hour later…
21:54
Math, in the math room? How quaint!
hi
what s up @Semiclassical?
Give an irrational number, we can choose an interval small enough around it such that every point in that interval has the same decimal expansion up to some $n$th place right? There's a theorem (the name of which I can't recall right now), which says that each term of the continued fraction gives roughly ~1 decimal precision, and the worst case is generally with the golden ratio which for which we need something ~2.3 terms of the expansion to get an extra decimal digit of precision.
This would suggest what I said above is true, but we'd probably need uniform lower bounds on the number of terms required to get extra precision.
someone have some ideas about that?math.stackexchange.com/questions/3338403/…
none you can find any number of rational as close as you want of every irrational out there so yes this is true
yes but I'm wondering about that type of statement for the continued fraction expansions
the closeness in this case being the terms of the continued coinciding for some number of terms
Ah I guess the thing to note would be that adding extra decimal digits would only add terms to the continued fraction, not alter the previous terms
But that's not true, I just checked an online calculator and adding extra digits does change the last few terms
22:13
continued fraction expansions=Generalized continued fraction
Hi there, I'm trying to sketch the boundary $\delta M$ where $M$ is a subset in $\mathbb{R}^2$ consisting of all points $(x,y)$ such that $\frac{y^2-x^4}{x^2+y^2-1}>0$. How does one evaluate the inequality?
?
@none can you share your example?
Just a regular continued fraction, representing some irrational number in $[0,1]$.
Check out this website: http://www.maths.surrey.ac.uk/hosted-sites/R.Knott/Fibonacci/cfCALC.html
Type in 0.61 in the decimal section and look at the continued fraction, then type in 0.618 and check it again
the idea stills seems more or less correct, the number of $1$'s will increase as we get closer to the $0.618033 \ldots$, but it's not completely correct that adding extra decimal digits only extends the continued fraction
@schn i guess I’d split that into cases, namely inside/outside the unit circle
At which point only the numerator matters (and the direction of the inequality)
@Semiclassical Could you show where the equation of the circle is hidden in the inequality? I kind of see it in the denominator, but as a reciprocal and with -1 attached to it.
22:26
@schn if you're inside the unit circle, then $x^2 + y^2 < 1$, so the denominator is negative. If you're outside the the denominator is positive.
@none Got it. Thanks.
Here is the theorem I had in mind: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lochs%27s_theorem
ok then you have to look at it in reverse
take a continued fraction and remove the last number ==> you will likely stay in this 1 decimal of difference
the way the continued fraction are build is tricky and some early number will change in the continued fraction representation when you add decimal to the usual representation
22:42
I can't rely on a probabilistic/average result though, I need to guarantee that at some decimal precision, we obtain some number of terms of the continued fraction that agree. I'm willing to require huge decimal precision for even a few terms of the continued fraction to agree.
Maybe what I'm saying turns out to be false but I certainly hope not
but what are you trying to do?
Given $n$ and irrational $x \in [0,1]$, does there exist an $\epsilon$ such that for all $|x-y| < \epsilon$, the first $n$ terms of the continued fraction expansions of $x$ and $y$ coincide?
if you just wanna approximate a irrational use the non-terminating version of the Euclidean algorithm
I specifically want the statement about the terms of the continued fraction itself
not just approximating by evaluating the continued fraction
from wikipedia : Moreover, every irrational number α {\displaystyle \alpha } \alpha is the value of a unique infinite continued fraction, whose coefficients can be found using the non-terminating version of the Euclidean algorithm applied to the incommensurable values α {\displaystyle \alpha } \alpha and 1
22:51
does that answer my question? Maybe it does, but I don't quite see it.
It might be easier to do a simpler problem, like taking one of those two irrationals to be something simple
Say, the Golden ratio
Doing it for the golden ratio would actually be perfect, I'll try seeing if things are easier in that specific case
So that the problem becomes “how close do I need to be to the Golden ratio to be sure that the first n terms in the continued fraction are 1”
simply use this UNIQUE representation it will converge and thus satisfy your condition
(I’m not sure my simpler problem is easy but it seems more tractable)
22:56
semi this is only working for the golden ratio because ultimately it is all 1 but you are right
@rapasite I don't think this follows that directly from uniqueness, but I'll spend some time right now thinking about it and I'll come back with observations/comments.
it is not about uniqueness it is about you have a way to construct a continued fraction as long as you want witch converge to your value
the funny part is that maybe if you take a y closer to x the continued fraction will change a lot
21/13 = 1.6153846153846154 = [1;1,1,1,1,1,1]
34/21 = 1.619047619047619 = [1;1,1,1,1,1,1,1]
and now if you take the average
883/546 = 1.6172161172161172 = [1;1,1,1,1,1,1,2,1,1,1,1,2]
23:23
Ah sorry you emphasized the word UNIQUE I thought you were implying it followed from that. I see now that the algorithm for computing them can give a lot of insight, but it's still not that easy I think. At each step of the algorithm we want to get the integer part of performing some division, so the question translates to how these division are affected by increasing # of decimal digits
but yes thank you for pointing that out, the algorithm seems helpful
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