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00:00
Hmm, so I'm gonna say let's make the manifold compact and orientable. So let's say $f:M\to \partial M$ is a retraction and $\omega$ is an $n-1$ form on $\partial M$
compact with boundary :)
Do you want any hypothesis on that $(n-1)$-form?
Let's say it's a volume form
/at least its integral isn't 0, that'd probably break something
OK, good guess.
Hmm, well if we're gonna pull back via $f$, we want to use that it's a retraction
So if you pull back and then restrict to the boundary again you've done nothing
OK so far.
00:05
(I'm not sure how the terminology goes exactly here but I think of "pull back" as a verb and "pullback" as a noun)
I concur.
$\int_{\partial M} f^*(\omega) = \int_{\partial M} \omega$
And both are equal to $\int_M df^*(\omega)$
So I did
Right.
Hmm, I guess that's $\int_M f^*(d\omega)$
I'm not sure what that gets us
It gets us back to exactly what I was saying to JoeShmo.
00:07
Oh right $\omega$ is a form on $\partial M$
Yeah okay that works, sick
Pretty good, eh?
I like it
daminark what's the class?
I'm not taking a class on the stuff at the moment
He was just noticing what you and I were talking about, @JoeShmo.
00:08
Just that Ted mentioned using Stokes' to prove Brouwer, while I only saw proofs using homology/homotopy/Sard
ohhh. because that was suspiciously identical to the problem im working
Okay I'm guessing the cohomological interpretation of this is that if $M$ is an $n$-manifold and $f:M\to \partial M$ is a retraction, then take the inclusion $i:\partial M \to M$, then $H^n_{DR}(M) \to H^n_{DR}(\partial M) \to H^n_{DR}(M)$ where the first map is $f^*$ and the second is $i^*$
But the middle guy is 0
Well, the others are too for a manifold with boundary. That's not quite right.
does anybody know a good proof of poincares lemma that does not require homotopy? or at least very basic
Maybe you need the long exact sequence of a pair ...
You're parametrizing line segments, JoeShmo. You don't have to say the word "homotopy."
00:12
well, ok. a manifold is contractible if every(?) closed path is contractible to a point?
No.
That's just simply connected.
i made that up. nice to know it actually means something
The sphere is simply connected but far from contractible.
Contractible means there exists a homotopy such that at time 0 you get the identity map and time 1 you get the constant map
need to sort it out. the proof in the notes is unreadable
in particular, its written in broken english
00:16
JoeShmo, didn't you just take an algebraic topology course from Sylvain?
here's a calculus problem that showed up on my student's final today (adapted so no physics)
no. can't wait to take that course though
ohhh ... sorry, that was Antonios. My fault.
Too confuzling having multiple people from the same schools. ;)
there's another guy that used to come to these corners but doesn't anymore
Let $f(z)=(1+z^2)^{-3/2}$ and $g(z;\epsilon)=f(z)-f(z-\epsilon)$. For small $\epsilon>0$, find the value of $z$ for which $g(z;\epsilon)$ achieves its maximum.
00:18
"these corners"?
took linear algebra with him last semester. he's taking the two sequence topology this year
I hope $z$ isn't a complex variable, Semiclassic.
you know, online math forums..
Nah. Height/position along an axis.
(The last problem did something I hate and labelled the separation between capacitor plates as $d(t)=d_0\cos \omega t$...and then ultimately wanted them to take a time-derivative. so $\partial d/\partial t$)
LOL ... gotta love propitious choices of letters
speaking of Antonios
Antonios, have you and JoeShmo met IRL?
tbf, the point was that the electric field between them was $E=V_0/d$ and you needed $\partial E/\partial t$
errr no. Should I have
so you could just plug $d$ into $E$ and differentiate
but still
absolutely. im a riot.
00:21
yeah, you're both at NYU, Antonios.
There's that, too.
On that other one I'm just struck by the math trickiness of it
@JoeShmo grad? undergrad?
grad
for a final physics problem anyways
00:22
The algebra seems yucky offhand, Semiclassic, but I've not tried playing with it.
oh great. in math I assume?
masters
cool. Me too. gfauxpas is also in the program
00:22
with any luck, phd
Well, the trick (such as it is) is to note that $g(x;\epsilon)\approx \epsilon \left(\dfrac{\partial g}{\partial \epsilon}\right)_{\epsilon=0}$
although.. idk if it works out for me
Oh, I didn't realize GFauxPas was there too.
yeah he's actually in my top class @TedShifrin
gfauxpas is the other guy who "used to come to these corners"
00:23
Oh he never told me that, Antonios.
i know him irl
Oh, he still comes, JoeShmo. I just helped him a day ago.
what are your math interests @JoeShmo?
And then once you take that limit, you've got something which isn't bad to differentiate explicitly
topology/algebra
00:24
cool. I'm somewhere in that direction as well!
So it's not terrible. But I question it as a physics problem.
my email is aar460 @ ...
send me your # if you'd like
yeah, sure. did you take linear last semester with whats his face?
But all that wiggle wiggle approximation isn't going to be exact, Semiclassic. I'd rather do the approximations in the actual derivative. Let me try.
Oh, it's definitely not exact.
But they were told to assume $\epsilon\ll 1$
00:25
@JoeShmo I took the one-term with lisa hartung
Let me see.
nice. are you a phd student?
phd after?
definitely. a question of where more than anything
00:26
To first order I think it's $z=1/2+\epsilon/2$
nice. NYU is an analysis school, so there's not much topology/algebra variety..
kinda, I've been talking a lot with bogomolov. I had his algebra II course this semester
He's a powerhouse algebraic geometer.
The geometry/topology people are very good, just very few
tschinkel is also huge in arithmetic geometry
@TedShifrin he might end up being my thesis advisor
That's awesome.
00:28
I'm hoping to start getting into some hodge theory this summer
that is awesome!
I have a list of things to do first though.
@Semiclassic: Why not write down the actual derivative and then just Taylor expand (say to linear terms)?
In principle, it should come out the same.
oh, it definitely does.
But not good for a 2nd semester physics class ... or was this more advanced?
00:30
Upper division
i had taken tschinkel my first semester at NYU, (with no mathematics background in undergrad mind you). had to drop very quickly... went back with my tail between my legs, read some algebra
So in principle, it's more suitable
oh, then students should have the skills.
and ill be back .. :-)
of course, i've simplified things a bit to make it not so tedious to write
00:31
I had his course last semester @JoeShmo. He definitely teaches at a rapid pace. I was lucky enough to have had the grad course in algebra at my undergrad institution.
the real one was to find where the max value of...
So, it was a bit easier. But without background it would have been hard.
looking back it wasn't so bad
Antonios: Your undergrad institution also happens to be in the top 3 PhD programs ...
@TedShifrin I'm hoping to return :P
00:32
Really?
It's a strangely inhumane department in many ways.
Yeah, I loved it there. I needed to do a master's though, b/c I only had 3 semesters of math courses before applying.
there was just no way for me to juggle even basic algebra at his pace, taking analysis, and keeping a full time job
I think it's gotten worse since my days there.
$B(z)=B_1(z)+B_1(d-z)$ where $B_1(z)=\dfrac{\mu_0 I}{2a}\left(1+\dfrac{z^2}{a^2}\right)^{-3/2}$, subject to $d\ll a$
Oh, hell, Semiclassic .. what are five more parameters among friends?
00:33
I made a lot of friends there, though. Some of them are staying for PhD.
where is that? berkley?
I mean, it's just some extra constants out front
woah. why not straight to a phd?
00:34
so it's simple enough to map this version onto the one I wrote
Yeah, yeah.
I've lost interest.
But it makes it a lot harder to spot the thread
lol
@JoeShmo with my level of (in)experience there was no way I was getting into a decent place lol.
i'm more reinforcing why I think it's not a great physics problem, since in the form it appears as it's just hard to recognize it as a math problem
Maybe this fall I have a chance, though. Maybe not.
00:35
undergrad math?
Plus, the setting is therefore "consider two current loops with opposite orientations"
The problem with Berkeley is not so much getting in as getting support.
and I don't see what intuition you're supposed to have
They did a few things with the multipole expansion, but this is the opposite of that (deep inside a current distribution instead of far away from it)
@TedShifrin financial? or faculty
financial, although I dunno about how much more remote the faculty have become
00:37
Actually, huh.
I think here's a clever way to do the problem.
seems that the faculty are indeed somewhat reclusive in many cases.
The idea of the problem is to take two loops of current, with opposite orientations, and see the resulting magnetic field
and the issue is that the faculty that are not reclusive have many students lol
when I was there, some had 10 students and plenty had 0
00:39
Suppose I take the two loops as the ends of a very short, very wide cylinder.
I can then split up the lateral surface of that short cylinder into little rectangles
how do you juggle 10 students
If I imagine a little current going around each of those rectangles, then the superposition of them will just be the original two currents since the vertical edges will have cancelling currents
Well, one advantage of a large number of students is that they often can talk and work together
Why can't you just do Ampere's law or whatever without chopping it, Semiclassic?
thats the reason i gave my wife for getting a second dog
they can entertain each other
Ampere's law doesn't work here because there's not enough symmetry
You can do the Biot-Savart law, and that's how they got the expression for $f(z)$ I gave earlier
00:42
I was thinking of the ultimate curl form of it ... but ...
What I was trying to see is if there's a way to get to the approximate result (i.e. $\epsilon\ll 1$) without doing B-S
Never mind twice the expense, dog poop, and vet bills, JoeShmo.
And I think I just succeeded, since each little rectangle will have the same current. So I can approximate each like a little magnetic dipole
meh, overrated
the puppy year is the expensive year. otherwise they dont cost money
This sounds like a better physics approach, Semiclassic.
00:44
Agreed
My cats had some serious health issues, JoeShmo, so they costed.
it's probably overkill regardless
sorry to hear that. everything ok?
But I like that there's a physical interpretation of the $\epsilon\ll 1$ behavior
Long, long ago ... they're all dead now.
00:45
i mean the family dog had broken his leg too. and that cost a lump sum. but ordinarily that doesn't happen
time to review for cappell's "final" :P
how is that class antonios?
thats the sequence im looking forward to the most
ok the new proof of CH is much easier to understand
I never thought there would be an easy proof of CH
one thing I like is that it makes it obvious (to me) why the combined field you end up with in that limit behaves like $g(z;\epsilon\ll 1)\sim \epsilon z/(1+z^2)^{5/2}$.
A bit slow for my liking, in truth. On the flip side I had graduate alg top last year in undergrad. But, Cappell is a great lecturer, and I definitely gained some insight even if I already knew most of the basics @JoeShmo
00:49
the 5 was bothering me, and now I think I see it
That's coming from the derivative, Semiclassic. Not surprising.
sure, mathematically I agree
it just wasn't as obvious physically to me why it had to be like that.
Oh, wait. You left off a minus in the exponent.
I also moved it into the denominator :)
Oh right. "Never mind."
00:52
@TedShifrin do you not teach Cayley-Hamilton? I thought it's a very important theorem in linear algebra. sorry if i'm annoying you
It's not in my linear algebra course, no. It could have been, but one can't do everything. It fits a more advanced course, or more algebra-oriented course, just fine.
Proof of Cayley-Hamilton: $\det(tI - A) = f_A(t)$, so $f_A(A) = \det(AI - A)$
it just wasn't as obvious physically to me why it had to be like that. (in terms of dimensionful variables it's $g(z)\sim z/r^5$, and you can't distinguish $z$ vs. $r$ from dimensional analysis)
My proof would be by using density of diagonalizable matrices over $\Bbb C$ and continuity of the characteristic polynomial.
btw ted, would not mu = 2x . *dx be the volume form on the sphere? as per our discussion a few days back
00:53
But I can see how precisely that form would arise from the dipole result
@Daminark yes, it's very funny until you realize that there is an easy proof using exactly that idea, which I just learnt a few hours ago
Right, Demonark. That's like the totally wrong proof of Lagrange multipliers.
I've never seen that proof actually
@TedShifrin I found a proof that only manipulates the matrices
I first saw the proof above from Laci
00:54
without any analysis
@Daminark I can explain the proof to you if you want
There are classic proofs using the classical adjoint, using only matrices, Leaky.
He was like aight Cayley-Hamilton, and then he did the trick, and a few of us were just cracking up
@TedShifrin right, those kinds of proofs
We didn't realize it was false
We were just like, hyped up theorem and its proof was just lol
I saw a lecture by Vaughan Jones on Quantum Theory and von Neumann algebras and I want to learn operator algebras now lol.
00:55
Laci thought we realized we had been duped and he just said "Yup, they got it, what's wrong with this proof?"
I'll be honest, I forget how CH is usually proven.
He luckily called on someone else to answer but for a second my face probably looked something like 0_0
I think Artin has a permanence of identities proof.
@Semi I've seen two proofs. One is by proving it using diagonalizable matrices and then making a density argument, another I've seen in Hoffman and Kunze just does a bunch of matrix stuff
and i got very fascinated and shocked knowing that det(diag(A,A,...,A)-A) is the correct idea all along
00:58
nice. I could see the 'for diagnolizable matrices' part of it, but the density argument isn't one I ever remember
@Semiclassical because C is the wrong field to work over
bad physics habits, I suspect
or rather, the wrong topology
(χ(A) = det(diag(A,A,...,A)-"A") because χ(t) = det(diag(t,t,...,t)-A))
00:58
though tbf the main context physicists work in is hermitian matrices
where "A" is the matrix of matrices where the ij-th matrix is A_ij I
@Semiclassical well you want a topology with less open sets and closed sets
and in that case we can get a way with a lot of things
so the density can be easier to prove
so we want to prove that det(diag(A,A,...,A)-"A") = 0, working in the ring of matrices.
someone will probably prove me wrong, but I don't think I"ve ever seen a physics reason to care about Jordan normal form for instance
but this is really the wrong ring to work over, because it isn't even commutative
01:00
exponentials and Lie groups, Semiclassic ... Some physicists care.
so instead we look at the subring of matrices that can be written as a polynomial in A
(maybe in non-hermitian QM, but I maintain that that's not actually QM)
hmm, point
I call that commutative ring A'
we do like to work with unitary matrices at times instead
now let B=diag(A,A,...,A)-"A", we want to show that detB=0
from adjugate magic, adjB B = detB I
detB is a matrix, to show that it is zero we show that it is zero at each basis vector
we'll use some dank magic to extract detB e_j
staring at the identity adjB B = detB I, we see that detB e_j is the sum of the ij-th entry evaluated at e_i
i.e. we look at the j-th column, evaluate the first entry at e_1, second at e_2, etc, and then sum them all up
now we use the adjugate magic identity by looking at the left hand side, performing the same operation
01:03
@TedShifrin even there, though, I think you're usually taking exponentials of hermitian matrices in physics
look at the j-th column. evaluate the i-th entry (i.e. ij-th entry) at e_i. sum them all up.
the ij-th entry of adjB B is just Σ_k (adjB)_ik B_kj
but i'm probably forgetting something
so our sum is Σ_i Σ_k (adjB)_ik B_kj e_i
correction: we sum across the k-th row instead.
So we pick the k-th row, evaluate the first entry at e_1, etc, and then sum them up.
The RHS, i.e. detB I, is still detB e_k
The LHS becomes
Σ_j (adjB B)_kj e_j
= Σ_j Σ_i (adjB)_ki B_ij e_j
= Σ_i (adjB)_ki Σ_j B_ij e_j
= Σ_i (adjB)_ki (A e_i - Σ_j "A"_ij e_j)
= Σ_i (adjB)_ki (A e_i - Σ_j A_ij I e_j)
= Σ_i (adjB)_ki (A e_i - Σ_j A_ij e_j)
= Σ_i (adjB)_ki (A e_i - A_i)
= Σ_i (adjB)_ki 0
= Σ_i 0
= 0
so detB e_k = 0 for each k
so detB = 0
01:32
let's just check it. Let $A = \begin{bmatrix} a&b\\c&d \end{bmatrix}$. Then, $B = \begin{bmatrix} A-aI & -bI \\ -cI & A-dI \end{bmatrix}$. If $\operatorname{adj}(B) = \begin{bmatrix} P & Q \\ R & S \end{bmatrix}$, then $B \operatorname{adj}(B) = \begin{bmatrix} PA-aP-bR & QA-aQ-bS \\ RA-cP-dR & SA-cQ-dS \end{bmatrix}$. Pick the first column, and do that black magic, and we get $(PA-aP-bR)e_1 + (RA-cP-dR)e_2 = P(Ae_1 - ae_1 - ce_2) + R(Ae_2 - be_1 - de_2) = 0$
the website is wrong since the website considered adj(B) B instead of B adj(B)
ok the website is not wrong, it just uses a different convention, i.e. somehow it multiplies row vectors on the left.
01:56
@LeakyNun Heathens!
but they didn't specify it, and it makes it very confusing
Though I actually do do row vector multiplication from the left, e.g. $xA$ with $x$ a row vector
I suspect the author didn't know it
so I'm not sure what you mean
02:15
Suppose M is a compact, 2-dimensional, oriented submanifold of R^3\{(0, 0, 0)}.
Let omega := x . *dx. What are the possible values of the integral of omega over M?
omega is not a 2-form
o is that the hodge dual
what do you mean here
yes, hodge
omega is a 2-form
so, omega := x1 dx2dx3 - x2 dx1dx3 + x3 dx1dx2
02:45
@JoeShmo idk nothing comes to mind. is there a hint or something?
no. im trying to stick stokes into this somehow, but the dimensions don't work out
indeed, the conditions imposed on the manifold satisfy stoke's suppositions
this also almost seems to fit Gauss' divergence theorem
so M is an orientable hypersurface in R^3\{(0, 0, 0)} ?
we should be able to produce a normal vector to the surface
here's something sorta funny
i've been watching a lot of tetris world series videos lately...because distractions/internet
at the same time, I'm putting together this talk on the KPZ equation
another name for the behavior you get there?
sticky tetris
@Semiclassical dude controllers are impossiburu to use
(that loops, so i figured better to link it once)
@0celo7 amusingly, the tetris stuff I've been watching is all nes tetris
so the controller may be blocky, but it's not complicated :P
I mean specifically the right stick
my aiming skills have deteriorated so horrifically since I last played on a console
02:55
hey, just go back to nes. no stick, just a good old d-pad :)
03:40
a proud member of our mathematical community
Anonymous
03:51
@skull Do you mind if I edit that message so that the user name doesn't show up in a one box?
Anonymous
I hope not, since I just edited it. :-)
04:40
please do @snailboat :-)
Anonymous
Phew! I would have been in trouble if you had said no after I already did it :-)
04:52
nah, i should have reported it properly; sorry about that @snailboat
btw, what happened to chat?
I got the strangest error message about "an exception being an exception" :-/
Anonymous
05:16
@skull I'm not sure. Chat was completely broken, but they didn't post about it to their Stack Status Twitter account or web page.
05:33
yeah, that's not very user friendly of them
I have this exercise: Compute the integral $\int_{\gamma_r}(z-z_0)^n$, where $n$ is an integer not equal to $−1$ and $γ r$ is the circle $|z − z 0 | = r$ traversed once in the counterclockwise direction.
Why do we exclude $n=-1$?
05:54
I have this exercise: Compute the integral $\int_{\gamma_r}(z-z_0)^n$, where $n$ is an integer not equal to $−1$ and $γ_r$ is the circle $|z − z_ 0 | = r$ traversed once in the counterclockwise direction.
Why do we exclude $n=-1$?
Because the result you get when $n=-1$ is different than the result you get otherwise.
@Semiclassical I get integral value 0 when $n\ne -1$. What will be for $n=-1$?
To get a sense of why that might be so, note that the antiderivative of $z^{-n}$ is $\frac1n z^{-n+1}$ except for when $n=-1$
Just to check: How did you compute it in the $n\neq -1$ case?
06:05
its closed contour, so, it has to be zero
Why does having a closed contour guarantee that?
i am sorry, i should have checked more hypotheses.
The conclusion is actually correct, but if that premise were enough then you'd conclude the same for $n=-1$ (and it's not valid there)
What I'd suggest you think about is how you'd actually compute such an integral by hand
06:09
alright
Namely, you want to reduce it to a problem of standard real calculus
So you need to turn the integration into one that's over complex $z$ to one over some real variable
That requires you to parametrize your contour; it is, after all, just some 1D trajectory in the complex plane
So. How do you parametrize a circle of radius $r$ around $z_0$?
$e^{2\pi i r}$
That's in the right direction. But the 'angle' for what you've written would be $r$
What you instead want is some separate variable $\theta$ to serve that purpose
so, $e^{i\theta}$. (what's the necessary range of $\theta$?)
oh, so $re^{2\pi i \theta}$
note that $e^{i\theta}=\cos\theta+i\sin\theta$, and $\theta$ is 2pi-periodic
06:15
But there is still the center issue, right? center at $z_0$ is required
ok
Sure. Right now, you've got a circle of radius $r$ centered at the origin.
That just means you need to shift the circle by $z_0$.
so, $re^{i\theta}+z_0$
right?
thank you very much
Then $dz=i r e^{i\theta}\,d\theta=i(z-z_0)\,d\theta$
So what happens to the integral $\int_\gamma \frac{dz}{(z-z_0)^n}$?
06:18
ok
You'll want to have your final integral in terms of $\theta$ alone, I should stress
here theta goes from 0 to 2pi, right?
right
which means that, upon making the substitution, you'd better write the integration bounds in $\theta$ accordingly
So, $\int_0^{2\pi} \frac {i}{(z-z_0)^{n+1}}d\theta$
So, $\frac 1n(2\pi-z_0)^{-n+1}-\frac1n(-z_0)^{-n+1}$
Am i right? @Semiclassical
No. Like I said, you need to get everything in terms of theta alone before you integrate
also, the factor $(z-z_0)$ from $dz$ would cancel one of the $z-z_0$ factors in the denominator
06:34
3
Q: Visualizing Infinity discerning countable and uncountable

k.stmThis is rather a philosophical question. Although it uses topological notions, it isn't any precise mathematics, so maybe one cannot take it very seriously. Sometimes I try to picture an infinite set of points. Assuming that the space $E$ in which my visual imagination takes place is a simply co...

Technically if one can do so, they would have already well ordered the reals in the process
We can instead consider the question of making a faithful visualisation of a dense linear order. If there exists a picture (a configuration of points in $\Bbb{R}^2$) that can do that, we can use that to visualise many dense linear orderings including the reals
Hey, does anybody have an idea how to build a continuous staircase function using pieces of $x^3$?
there are many ways, I will just take the [0,1] section of $x^3$ and then join that indefinitely head to tail
Yean sure. I want to write it down mathematically and if possible not as a piecewise function though :/
but a staircase function is piecewise by definition, no?
I don't know?
06:42
it doesn't seem like there's anything particular about $x^3$ vs. any other $f(x)$ with $f(0)=0$ and $f(1)=1$
I thought it might be simpler than to use trig functions or so
a staircase function is basically the interval [0,1) raised in height by one for every integer, so it is made of countably many pieces
well, the trick you'd probably want to use is to write your final function as $x+g(x)$
then $g(x)$ will have to be a periodic function, and suddenly trig functions start to look pretty good
hmm
I need it for this
0
Q: For piecewise $\mathcal C^1$ path there exists a $\mathcal C^1$ reparametrization

philmcoleI want to show the following. Let $\gamma :[a,b] \to \mathbb{R}^n$ be a piecewise continuously differentiable path. Then there exists a reparametrization of $\gamma$ which is continuously differentiable. There was a hint provided which says that you need to "slow down" at the corners to mak...

well, since $\frac{d}{dx}(x+g(x))=1+g'(x)$, you can view $g'(x)$ as the x-dependent deviation from the original parametrization
so there's room for cleverness there
06:48
How do you mean deviation from the original parametrization? I thought this construction will be a function $[a,b] \to [a,b]$ which kind of slows down the input at certain points (where the steps of the staircase are).
the reparametrization is then the composition of this and the actual path
so $\gamma\circ f$ as the new parametrization
my point is that, if $f(x)$ is a staircase function, then $g(x)=f(x)-x$ is a periodic function
and when $g(x)=0$, then you recover the original parametrization
your path is then $\gamma(x+g(x))$, and $g(x)$ represents how much your reparametrization differs from what it'd be if it were just $x$
Got it. Do you think $f(x)=x+\sin(x)$ is any good?
I think it's a plausible idea, though you'd presumably want $\sin(\pi x)$ or some such
06:54
Makes sense! I'll try it out. Thanks
you might want to include a coefficient on the trig function as well, so that you can control how big of a deviation you get (it probably doesn't need to be big)

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