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20:00
@MikeMiller do you think it is interesting: If $X$ is connected and every point in $X$ is a cut point, and $Y\supseteq X$ is a compact space with $\overline X=Y$ and $Y\setminus X$ is connected, then $Y$ has no cut points.
@Miksu How can you have done Galois theory with so little group theory?
I think very interesting
I've read only little bit of it so that I get the main idea. I wouldn't say I understand it well or anything
@Miksu It's probably a good idea to learn algebra on the large more carefully, if you like it
you get 1 million dollars
20:03
Sure
Try Artin, "Algebra"
Thanks. I'll try to get my hand on it
thanks @MikeMiller
@ForeverMozart "Don't be a dick"
I guess he does not find it interesting
He always ignores me cause I asked if he was famous yet and he got upset
20:05
Mike left the chat 16mins ago
@ForeverMozart There is a delay before the identicon vanishes.
lol ok
well sorry Mike
You seriously think somebody would get mad if you ask them if they're famous yet?
I think it annoys him
but I could be wrong
20:09
No. Last I checked Mike does not have delusions of grandeur.
If one responds to every message they get, it can take up a heap of time. If one responds to say they are busy, it may lead to pleading etc. Noone owes anyone a response, and I don't think it's rude.
@Miksu I really like Artin because it goes all the way from linear algebra to group theory, then covers a bunch of Lie theory and representation theory that I never learnt, and then finally to field and Galois theory (which includes a short detour on algebraic geometry and Riemann surfaces too)
I think you'll like it because it's not just an intro to algebra, but an intro to mathematics
Lots of fun stuff
I have delusions
Wow. I just checked university library and there's no copy of that book there... I live in quite small city and we have only one university where you can't study for math major.....
You should be able to get a copyleft out of libgen or some such
Make sure to get second edition
20:12
Hi @Daminark
Hey @Daminark
Hey guys!
('-')/
@BalarkaSen Ok, thanks. But there is a copy of Lang's Algebra in the library. Do you know if it's better or worse? It would be easier for me to get..
@ForeverMozart lel
Wait why is that on scientificamerican?
@Miksu Lang is probably going to be a very slow read
Since the exposition is apparently super tight
Finally finished my notes on representation theory by the way
20:14
I have heard bad things about Lang
Now to see how many typos I start finding
But you can try it, probably
@Tobias nice! Could you send them over actually?
@Daminark Sure
@BalarkaSen Got it!
Wait sorry it double sent from my phone and baleeted both
Or that, that's convenient too, thanks!
I should probably put it the same place I have put my various other notes, but it seems like I may not be able to update them there (I was not able to update the algebra exercises to correct the errors found at least)
Actually in algebra we've just hit the Sylow theorems, finally. We started them today and will finish them next time
hello :D
20:18
Those notes don't need the Sylow theorems at all, except for a single exercise near the end.
I am trying to understand a proof for a cauchy sequence. It would be really great if someone could help me a bit.
How does the author exactly come from the third to the fourth line here?
(Yes, I see it is the geometric series)
Makes sense, yeah, the main connection I've seen between that and Sylow so far is a theorem I proved as part of the "applications" bit of my paper that a group of order $p^n$ is isomorphic to a subgroup of $UT(n,p)$
And even that just amounts to saying that $UT(n,p)$ is a Sylow p-subgroup of $GL(n,p)$ by counting, at which point you're just like okay, p-subgroups are contained in Sylow p-subgroups, and they're conjugate
@Miksu IIRC you said you were in highschool? I wouldn't recommend using Lang as a primary text just yet. It's a bit tough.
For what it's worth, we're officially using DF now, which is an amazing book
Even Nyquil can't beat its sleep-inducing power
Ugh, I hate Dummit-Foote
@Daminark lol
20:28
I think D&F is quite good, actually. I agree it can be boring at times, though.
If nothing else, it's clear and comprehensive.
Dummit and FOote
I first learned what I know from Herstein and a few papers by Keith Conrad, which I've found to be quite fun but not comprehensive enough. Artin is supposed to be good for seeing algebra as part of a bigger picture but apparently introduces the topics strangely. DF drags much too long but is understandable and has a lot
I've heard some people praise Aluffi, which tries to integrate a categorical mindset. It's possible that without having seen algebraic topology (which gives a motivation for functors and the like because you actually need to juggle structures), you may find it a bit boring. Hungerford is supposed to be dry but more compact than DF. Maclane a bit longer but less dry
@Miksu that's about all I can say, hopefully that'll help with search? Or maybe I've made the choice harder, who knows?
Lang is actually a nice read once you've understood a lot of the concepts, because he does a great job of tying in algebra to other fields of math and giving a glimpse ahead. On the other hand, his second (and final) example of a monoid in section 1 of chapter 1 is the homeomorphism classes of compact connected surfaces. This is indeed interesting, but not great for people starting out.
hello
How does one call the form: $(\sqrt(x)+ \sqrt(y))^2 = 1 $
@ForeverMozart I just sort of pop in and out. You would have a much better idea if that’s interesting than me - I don’t have much intuition for those sort of spaces like you
20:42
It is just a simple (amusing?) result.
like if you take the real line
as $X$.
and then $Y$ as the circle $S^1$
see?
I have a question about Sobolev spaces that's kind of dumb. It's not a well defined question necessarily, just something I don't understand
Hey @ZacharySelk. Nice to see you here.
@BalarkaSen thanks!
I was reading a paper and it introduced a Gelfand triple $H_0^1 \subset L^2 \subset H^{-1}$. I don't really get what's going on, or why we need to introduce $L^2$. I've seen this in a few different situations but I don't get what exactly is happening
@Antonios-AlexandrosRobotis Alright
@Daminark I think I'll just go with Artin :D
But thanks for all of you you who helped!
@ZacharySelk The key point is that those two (outside) Hilbert spaces are dual, but under the L^2 inner product - not their own natural inner product
Of course considered with its own inner product a Hilbert space is self-dual
20:58
@MikeMiller $H^{-1}$ is the dual of $H_0^1$ wrt $L^2$ inner product but $H_0^1$ is dual to $H_0^1$ wrt $H_0^1$ inner product, right?
ok
The $L^2$ creates a new dual space
Quite right
Frequently the “natural” inner product is the L^2 inner product anyway
No funky fourier transforms, just a good old fashioned integral
yeah
so we introduce $L^2$ because we like the $L^2$ inner product better than the $H_0^1$ inner product
Hi everyone.
I need advice on a combinatorics-CS question about permutations. Anyone has a touch for those?
@ZacharySelk That’s what I’d say
I mean basically we want to be able to integrate but parts when we write down an inner product :)
Can we say the following about the following lemma? So here conformality means that the map preserve the "figure essentially" it doesn't distort it in anyway. So, we expect for the elementary domain to be transformed into elementary domain. As elementary domain we can think of it as simply connected domain, i.e things without holes. Let D be subset of C be an elementary domain and
$\phi : D \rightarrow D^*$ be a globally conformal mapping of D onto the domain $D^*$. We suppose its derivative is analytic. Then $D^*$ is also elementary domain.
is my intuition correct?
21:10
0
Q: Primary Ideal in a PID

user193319 Let $R$ be a PID. An ideal $P$ in $R$ is said to be primary if $ab \in P$ and $a \notin P$ implies $b^n \in P$ for some $n \in \Bbb{N}$. Show that $P$ is primary if and only if $P = (p^n)$ for some $n \in \Bbb{N}$ and some prime element $p \in P$. Here is my attempt: Assume that $P = (p...

@MikeMiller Thank you, I think this makes sense
@MikeMiller your familiar with this ?
Anyone can give advice on a deranged permutation question?
I don’t know what an elementary domain is
The assumption that phi is a conformal mapping means phi is analytic, infective, and has nonzero derivative; the assumption you make after that that its derivative is analytic is superfluous
@MikeMiller are you free? I have a question
21:23
I’m popular today
Not really but go for it
:)
in Taut foliation of a closed 3 manifold, can we find a closed curve which intersect each leaves only at one point
@MikeMiller is it always possible. I can't think of an example where it is not true.
@MikeMiller It is a domain (i.e connected open set) such that for any analytic $h : D \rightarrow C$ we have that it has a primitive i.e $F$ such that $d(F) = h$.
I do believe this is true. If $\gamma$ hits a leaf $L$ at $p$, comes back and hits again at $q$, you can chop everything off till the path from $p$ to $q$, do a waterfall construction to get it to hit $L$ only once
I think something like that should give you a transversal which globally intersects every leaf once
Every leaf, exactly once? I am skeptical
I think you can get one of those criteria but not both
@BalarkaSen then can you grantee that it will hit all the leaf?
21:32
@AnubhavMukherjee It will hit all the leaf, and it will hit $L$ once. I guess I don't see the global thing, and Mike is skeptical which is not a good sign usually
@Adeek in that case yes, and it follows from the chain rule
@BalarkaSen Yes, I am talking in a global sense.
1
Q: taut foliations and the existence of total transversals

Manfredi MaggioreA codimension one foliation $\cal F$ on a smooth manifold $M$ is taut if every leaf of $\cal F$ meets a closed transversal (i.e., a simple closed curve that is everywhere transversal to the leaves of the foliation). Is it true that a taut foliation admits a closed transversal $\gamma$ that meets ...

Maybe try getting Calegaris book
Oh yeah that is true. If every leaf admits a transversal, it's taut if everything is compact
Yeah I understand the proof, so I guess the reason this is true intuitively is that simple connected sets are sent to simply connected sets ?
21:34
The reason it's true is because you're stating some holomorphic criterion and a conformal map is the same thing as a holomorphic map with holomorphic inverse
I see
but it is not saying anything about the number of intersection points.
@BalarkaSen we need compactness aswell
@Anubhav It's saying if every leaf admits a transversal to it, then the whole foliation admits a transversal. Now the thing would be to see if the construction preserves intersection number of the original transversal in contrast to the total transversal
Because then you could use my construction
@AnubhavMukherjee Yes, but maybe something adjacent that's not quoted does. I dunno!
21:38
which says every leaf $L$ admits a transversal $\gamma$ to it s.t. intersection number of $L$ and $\gamma$ is 1
btw, this seems a nice book. thanks everyone
Say $\mathcal{F}$ is the foliation on my compact fold $M$. To each leaf $L$ there is a transversal $\gamma_L$ through it. Because $M$ is compact, you can choose a finite collection of transversal $\gamma_k$'s s.t. every leaf is transverse to one of them.
So say $M_k$ is the saturated subset of leaves transverse to $\gamma_k$
These exhaust $M$, i.e., $M = \bigcup M_k$
If $L_{ij}$ is a common leaf between $M_i$ and $M_j$, and $\gamma_i$ and $\gamma_j$ hits it at $p$ and $q$, do the waterfall construction to graft them togather
This should give you a global transversal
It also clearly hits every leaf once!
@BalarkaSen can you please explain wthat do you mean by waterfall construction?
Look it up in Candel-Conlon.
what's the book name?
It's not a name I cooked up; it's the official terminology for the construction
@AnubhavMukherjee "Foliation I"
ohkk
@BalarkaSen no online cpy is available
can you please explain the construction in short here?
Ok, assume $M$ is an orientable manifold and I have foliated by codimension 1 leaves. $L$ be a leaf
I definitely got online copies on libgen :p
21:51
I'm scared of using that :P
Suppose $\gamma_1$ and $\gamma_2$ are two paths with $\gamma_1(0) = p \in L$ and $\gamma_2(1) = q \in L$, coming from two different sides of $L$ ("sides" make sense because $L$ disconnects it's tubular nbhd)
NO PIRACY :p
construct the waterfall pls
YES, then you can take them very close
and re join them by a diagonal
Consider a path $\gamma_3$ from $q$ to $p$ lying fully on $L$. So this gives me a path $\gamma_2 * \gamma_3 * \gamma_1$, which is tangential to $L$ but transverse everywhere else
21:52
and omit other parts
Just tweak it so it gets transverse to $L$
which you can do because the tubular nbhd restricted to $\gamma_3$ is trivial
and you're done
yes, I was trying to make a simple closed curve
can you make it a simple closed curve?
what simple closed curve? $\gamma_1$ and $\gamma_2$ are random paths out of/into $L$
the point of the waterfall construction is to graft them to a transverse path going throygh $L$
yes, that I can see
but now how do you manage the intersection number here (in the original problem)?
i just grafted a lot of transversal to leaves which intersect the leaves they do intersect with intersection no. 1
grafting doesn't change intersection number
so the final thing has intersection no. 1 with everybody
21:58
Wait..I just lost you..let me read your whole construction once more
anyhow i gotta sleep now. i'm pretty sure all of this is in Candel-Conlon somewhere
bye for now
bbye
good night
are you in bangalore now?
Hello
Is this a good place to ask questions about permutations?
@BalarkaSen how do you know that there are no other point on the leaf where those curves can intersect on the surface?
do you assume all $\gamma_i$ intersect at a single points to the leaf?
In that case it is true
But how do you ensure existence of such a curve
?
22:30
@Mathein hey
Hi
How's it going?
Everything's alright, how about you?
Everything's great. Algebraic number theory is lots of fun
Would a question with the title How can I use this data to find optimum input parameters for algorithm performance? be a good suit for this site?
Awesome! I'd have taken it this spring but the guy teaching it is... apparently not good
Oh by the way, I've been wondering something
22:33
Bear in mind, the alg is written, I'm just trying to find the best input parameters based on analysis of the data.
("been wondering" for the past 3 minutes)
So, I talked to my algebra prof, since we're set to finish the Sylow proof this Friday and thus we'll have 4 classes open to just do stuff with
He said he had in mind some subset of either talking about finite subgroups of $SO(3)$, mobius transformations, group presentations, or simple groups of small order, but that he'd be open to requests
Given that I've already done the proof that the smallest non-abelian simple group is $A_5$ (and it's the only one of order 60), I may lean away somewhat from the last one, but which of these topics strikes you as particularly interesting?
Or do you have other things you think would be worthwhile to request?
Do all the students in the class know some linear algebra? If so, then a short intro to representation theory could be really cool
People definitely are supposed to know linear algebra going in, I think.
I don't know much about finite subgroups of $SO(3)$. Group presentations are very useful for doing stuff like fundamental group computations
Interesting, is it that you can read a group presentation more easily off a space?
22:40
I mean if you want to actually compute the pushout of two groups in a Seifert-van-Kampen situation, you usually want to use generators and relations
@BalarkaSen thanks. I think I can construct such things.
And you can do fun stuff like showing that every finitely presented group is the fundamental group of some space
Ah, yeah
Möbius transformations are really cool, although they are more a complex / geometry thing rather than purely algebraic
I think you could sorta use that fact to show that you can't classify 4-manifolds, right?
22:44
I don't know enough about 4-manifolds to answer that
you can also use Möbius transformations to prove that $PSL_2(\Bbb Z) \cong \Bbb Z/2\Bbb{Z} * \Bbb Z /3\Bbb{Z}$
where $*$ is the free product
that was a fun exercise in Aluffi
@Daminark I care quite a bit about the finite subgroups of SO(3) and SU(2); that should be a fun talk
by quotienting it gives many examples of spherical 3-manifolds
Ah, nifty
0
Q: Commutative ring conjecture?

mickLet $A$ be a commutative ring where every element has a multiplicative norm $N$. So if $a,b,c$ are in $A$, such that $ab = c$ Then $ N(a) N(b) = N(c)$ ( So $N$ is a multiplicative homomorphism ) Let $B$ be a commutative ring. Usually we take $N$ to be integers. But When $N$ is defined as ele...

Anyone ?
23:04
Hello
Does anyone have any resources for compactness? Any good pdf's or class notes that have exercises/explanations?
sometimes, there's a man
any1 here?
ok there's one
I'm barely here
my chamomile tea has me sleepee
i put some honey in it
yum yum
cia man
23:47
Here's something interesting I saw earlier
It connects to computer vision
> All the shapes on the left panel follow a rule. All the shapes on the righthand panel break that rule. Question: What is the rule?
While it's a very easy question to solve, current algorithms for computer vision completely fail at that task.
And yet it might be necessary to recognize certain objects.
The implication seems to be that, if we want to build better computer vision algorithms, we need an architecture that can solve the above sort of problem.
(When I wrote "current algorithms", I meant the state-of-the-art, such as deep neural nets)
(These are called "Bongard problems")

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