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00:00 - 15:0015:00 - 00:00

15:01
haha, no it's good advice. i should be studying for the next exam but i can't focus...i'm too angry with myself. hence i am here in this chat procrastinating.
i gotta go. feel free to email me if you want.
shit, i'm just gonna go work out. see ya later
ok, i'll probably take you up on that at some point.
15:22
@akiva part of the problem is that surface isn't well-behaved along the axes. it might help to ask mathematica to instead plot $x^2y^2+x^2z^2+y^2z^2-xyz-\epsilon$ where $\epsilon$ is some small value
mathematica or wolfram alpha
anyone have an idea what kind of math textbook might cover radial basis functions?
I suppose I'd be after more in-depth explanations of these equations: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radial_basis_function
i wonder how small you can make $n$ so that every element of $SO(N)$ is a product of $n$ rotations around a codimension 2 plane
similarly, how the same but with $O(N)$ and reflections. the answers to these are both no doubt known clasically
@woodrow well, the obvious thing is to look at the refs on that page. for example, i do see a whole textbook mentioned at the bottom
no idea how easy it is to get access to that, though
@MikeMiller is there any loss of generality in picking a specific codimension 2 plane?
i wouldn't think so, but
15:38
thanks, one of the pdfs is a good lead. RBFs seem to be pretty elusive, I guess it doesn't belong to a single math subject like calculus or something.
@Semiclassical how could you possibly generate $SO(N)$ by rotating only about the $xy$-plane?
that seemed confusing, yeah. i think i misunderstood what you meant
@Semiclassical Eh, the graph Wolfram Alpha gives is good enough. (By the way, it might look like it's bounded, but every point on the axes satisfies the equation. So, with a small epsilon, we end up with something approximating the bounded bit, plus six infinitely large tubes surrounding the axes.)
15:53
Unless epsilon is negative, in which case you get something like this:
the joy of deformations
I think that it's like an embedding on the projective plane into 3-space, but with self intersection
(when there's no $\epsilon$, and also ignoring the weird thing with the axes)
the term you want is immersion
15:59
it's not as nice an immersion as you might want; in particular it doesn't have transverse self-intersection
Max
Max
16:31
Given a matrix X - does there exist any relationship between the norm of this matrix and the adj(X) ?
specifically - is there any inequality between those two matrixes?
(or, in a speific case, the norm $C^0$
sorry, can you be more precise about what your norm is?
Max
Max
supremum norm
if you're working in a Banach algebra you have the inequality $\|AB\|\leq \|A\|\|B\|$, so take B=adj(A), so AB=det(A)I
supremum of what? the entries?
in that case you get the above inequality except stick an n out front of the RHS
Max
Max
that would limit the norm of the matrix by the adjugate - is there any inequality where the adjugate is limited by the norm?
17:31
urgh, I don't really understand the definition of the simplicial circle (S^1 as a simplicial set) as a "quotient" of Delta^1 by its boundary. There are 3 2-simplices and 2 1-simplices. What are the three face maps from the former to the latter? I see two obvious ones, i.e. the only two non-decreasing maps that collapse a certain couple of adjacent cells into one, but I don't see a third one
Hey @Semiclassical. I decided against going to that AT15 conference I mentioned. I have some family visiting during that time.
17:46
ah, that's too bad.
were you planning to present something?
looking at the simplicial identities I feel like it should be the constant map collapsing all to zero, but damn, that feels weird
18:11
I was confused. Forget what I wrote.
@Semiclassical no, just wanted to go for the Texas.
18:39
gotcha
@AntonioVargas working on anything interesting lately?
18:54
Is there a meaningful allegory for a graph $(\mathbb R, E \subseteq C_\text{urve}^0)$?
Where $C^0_\text{urve}$ is the class of continuous curves, not just functions.
Any thoughts on the uses of fractional calculus?
Is this the point where we stop using graph theory and start using topology?
Visually it's like a way to shrink a graph or something
@Axoren I have not seen such weird notation in a while
@SohamChowdhury It's technically a mistake. The vertex set should be some $\mathbb R^k$ and the edges are just curves that pass through only elements in the vertex set. I couldn't find a notation for the class of continuous curves, just the class of continuous functions $C^0$.
Having a continuous curve on only the real-line that doesn't pass through itself would simply be an interval.
19:23
@AkivaWeinberger You're right. Subdividing $1 \to 2$The number of paths from $x$ to $4$ is the sum of the paths from $1 \to 4$ and $2 \to 4$ minus the paths that pass between $1 \leftrightarrow 2$
In this case, there are 4 such paths that pass between $1$ and $2$, so we know there are $5 + 5 - 4 = 6$. Subdivision does not preserve paths.
19:46
hi
does "$P$ only if $Q$" mean the same thing as "If $Q$ then $P$"?
@user19405892 Rather, it means $P \to Q$.
Consider the truth table assigned to "$P$ only if $Q$"
So if I say "$P$ if and only if $Q$", that is logically equivalent to "$P$ if $Q$" and "$P$ only if $Q$"?
I've never thought of it that way.
$P$ if $Q$ allows $P$ without $Q$, correct?
@Axoren But really "$P$ only if $Q$" means the same as "If $P$ then Q"
$P$ if $Q$ means If $Q$ then $P$ so it allows P without Q
But it does not allow $Q$ without $P$.
19:52
correct
So then $P$ if $Q$ is equivalent to $Q \to P$.
And $P$ only if $Q$ is equivalent to $P \to Q$.
that's why we can think of $P$ iff $Q$ as If $P$ then $Q$ and If $Q$ then $P$
Therefore, their $\text{and}$ is equivalent to $P \leftrightarrow Q$
19:54
yup
You have your iff equivalence.
I've never thought of interpreting that sentence as logical operations before.
It's neat.
me neither until i learned of it
I am wondering though why $P$ only if $Q$ means the same thing as $P \implies Q$. Is it axiomatic?
Simply by observing the truth-table we find their equivalence.
So we can't really prove it by logical operations then
On the contrary, there exists a proof of correctness for truth-tables. That proof of correctness would show an equivalence between a series of well-formed formulas and a truth table. I don't know what it is, but it must exist. So we must be able to prove equivalence logically.
Truth tables are just easier for binary logical operations
$\pmatrix{P & Q & P \to Q & P \text{ only if } Q \\ 0 & 0 & 1 & 1 \\ 0 & 1 & 1 & 1 \\ 1 & 0 & 0 & 0 \\ 1 & 1 & 1 & 1}$
$\pmatrix{P & Q & Q \to P & P \text{ if } Q \\ 0 & 0 & 1 & 1 \\ 0 & 1 & 0 & 0 \\ 1 & 0 & 1 & 1 \\ 1 & 1 & 1 & 1}$
If you take their $\text{and}$, the only case allowed is $P = Q$
20:13
Consider the sentence "My dog is sad only if I did not feed her." @user19405892
In other words, the only reason for my dog to be sad is if I didn't feed her, and she's happy otherwise.
So, if she's sad, it must be because I did not feed her.
Hello @Axoren @AkivaWeinberger :)
@trilolil Yo
very short question
it is basic algebra
based on electronical engineering formulas
does anybody know how to get to the second step?
That's kind of all over the place. Can you restate the problem?
the problem is:
I was given the formula which I wrote at the top:
$$Z_{in} = \frac{Z_{L}'+ jtgkL}{1+Z_{L}' jtgkL}$$
and I am given that kL= 90degrees
The problem I have: I filled in those information but don't get to the seond step
(the part in green is what I tried and the part in pencil is what I should get)
20:21
What are $Z_{in}, Z_c, Z_L$?
those are constant values
What's their relationship?
respecitvely input impedance, characteristic and impedance
their relation ship is given by the first formula
$$Z_{in} = \frac{Z_{L}'+ jtgkL}{1+Z_{L}' jtgkL}$$
With the factor of $Z_c$ you've been excluding, right?
I don t know what u mean by "excluding" in this context
20:24
Shouldn't it be $Z_{in} = Z_c\frac{Z_{L}'+ jtgkL}{1+Z_{L}' jtgkL}$?
You've been leaving it out
Also, it seems there's a $\partial$ symbol in the original written formula.
yes sorry I meant what u wrote
there are no partial derivatives in this formula
it is basic algebra...
I can provide a similar but different example if needed
I see... your $j$'s look like $\partial$'s.
(which I "solved" succesfully)
ooh no yes those are just "j"
's
$$Z_{in} = Z_c\frac{Z_{L}'+ jtgkL}{1+Z_{L}' jtgkL}$$

$$Z_{in}(1+Z_{L}' jtgkL) = Z_c(Z_{L}'+ jtgkL)$$

$$Z_{in}\frac{1+Z_{L}' jtgkL}{Z_c} = Z_{L}'+ jtgkL$$
Does this lead anywhere, you think?
it needs to lead me to $Z_{in} = \frac{1}{Z_{L}}$
btw it is stated that kl = 90 degrees
and tg 90 = infinity
20:30
I don't think that matters one bit.
you need to apply this in some way
I ll provide you an example and you ll see it does
(cause this one needs to be solved in +/- the same way)
$$\frac{Z_{in}}{Z_c}+\frac{Z_{L}'}{Z_c} jtgkL = Z_{L}'+ jtgkL$$
almost done
one sec, I think u make it waaay to complex
here is given that kL=180 degrees
this is how simple it should be...
(i forgot to write the apostrophe on the sec, third and fourth line it should be $Z_{L}'$)
@Axoren ^
seems to be a litlle bit difficult for you?
Not really. I was distracted. If you're going to be doing it the other way, you need to respect infinities.
how should it be solved using "the other way"
could u show it?
20:43
$Z_c\frac{Z_{L}'+ \infty}{1+Z_{L}' \infty} = Z_c\frac{\infty}{Z_{L}' \infty} = Z_c\frac{1}{Z_{L}'}$
Finite terms are trumped as you approach infinity, so they can be ignored.
Ooh they are trumped ok
that could be it...
And since it's the same infinity we're approaching in both the numerator and the denominator, they cancel out.
tvm
yes I see what u mean
@Axoren @Axoren, so u are telling that as they are both appoaching the same infinity they can be Donalded?
Lol, I don't think you can build walls at infinity.
2
I've read that two groups of order $n$ are isomorphic if $\gcd(n, \varphi(n)) = 1$. How come this doesn't work for $\mathbb{Z}_{4}^{\times}$ and $\mathbb{Z}_5$? We have $\gcd(4, \varphi(4)) = \gcd(4, 2) = 2.$ But these two groups are isomorphic and of the same order.
I meant $\mathbb{Z}_5^{\times}$ and $\mathbb{Z}_4$
20:53
Your criterion probably means "Any two (abelian!!) groups of order n are isomorphic iff gcd = 1". For n=4, you learned there are multiple abelian groups of order 4.
21:15
me just now: goes back to laptop, sees conversation, scrolls back up and looks at link, "oh hey impedance matching!"
(not really impedance matching, but eh)
21:51
@r9m Hi, long time no see.
22:06
any lovers of integration in ? I see math.stackexchange.com/questions/1703659/… which looks pretty tricky!
 
1 hour later…
23:20
from the wikipedia article on hyperbolic geometry: There are at least two distinct lines through a point P not on a line R that do not intersect R, where all lie in one plane. This means that there are through P an infinite number of coplanar lines that do not intersect R.
I don't see how the latter statement follows from the former unless we say something like "two straight lines intersect in no more than one point" any hints?
@Simplex: For me, it is easiest to make the argument directly from any one of the models of hyperbolic geometry. But what they must intend is that all the lines through P "between" the two known lines not intersecting R will likewise not intersect R.
hi @Karl
How're you doing, @Karl?
Staying busy, though primarily with philosophy this semester.
Ah, right, you told me you were seriously philosophizing.
23:31
Didn't expect to be working on three papers simultaneously, but here I am.
Ah, yes, that's a problem with literature, history, and philosophy courses ... or a good thing, depending on one's viewpoint. I actually loved writing literature papers, especially in French.
Yeah, I sincerely enjoy writing philosophy papers.
Cool :)
I don't think I have access to any paper I've ever wrote.
I threw out all my high school and college papers that I had kept for decades ... when I sold my house and dramatically downsized.
"I've ever wrote"? Guess you didn't done wrote much in English :)
23:37
I aint
Oh, and hi, @PVAL :)
Good night @MikeM
hi @Mike @Ted
23:38
what's up with you, master of undefinedness, @lopata?
I'm finally reading Gunning's proof of uniformization even though I have other things to do.
@lopata
Ted: I was trying to derive the fact using only Euclid's first 4 axioms and the assumption that there are at least two such lines. I do see how it follows easily once the idea of betweeness is established though
@Simplex Elaborating on Ted's idea, perhaps construct a circle centered at P, intersect it with those two lines and iteratively take midpoints between two of the intersections (have to make the right choice here)
I m good thanks
still can't divide by 0, everything is still fine
23:40
@MikeMiller I'm a giving a talk in a seminar monday which is a practice for my candidacy which I've prepared about 10 minutes of so far.
Well, a certain amount of irregularity is tolerated, but not too much.
@PVAL, have you not given lots of seminar talks already?
I have
So you're experienced at talks ... just having stage fright like Semiclassic because of the occasion?
I'm not experiencing stage fright
just procrastination.
yeah, often procrastination is rooted in ....
23:41
Ah, experienced at prepared talks
this one is supposed to be prepared, too, @Karl :)
@PVAL: Abandon what you said you were going to talk about and ramble about something unrelated.
if I add 10 random numbers, that are in a range, then do modulo of that range, will the result be random?
I think Mike likes rambling.
There is some worry though as I haven't given a talk to any senior faculty.
23:43
@TedShifrin Hah, one of the keys for the continuation of procrastination.
Oh, no senior faculty have attended any of your previous talks, @PVAL?
Ya
I've had postdocs come a few times, but never any faculty.
Abouzaid and Kragh have a new paper on the arXiv today. It's straightforward enough that it could be worth talking about.
My first year in grad school I had half a room full of big-name professors, so I got used to it in a hurry.
IMO it's such an obvious idea its a marvel nobody wrote this a decade ago.
23:44
if I add 10 random numbers, that are in a range, then do modulo of that range, will the result be random?
I'm not good enough at knowing what "random" means to answer that, @lopata.
mh, arbitrary if you prefer
or pseudo random generated number
They actually prove as a corollary that for manifolds of dimension at most 3, the cotangent bundles are symplectomorphic iff the manifolds are diffeomorphic.
@lopata it should cause problems as sums toward the middle overlap more than sums at the end points. modding by something likely won't help
They only mention that this is true for lens spaces as a corollary. I wonder if I should email them that it's generally true.
23:46
lKarl, what do you mean?
@MikeMiller Are there other interesting cases?
@lopata: The sum of independent normal random variables is again a normal random variable, so ... sure.
will it fall more likely on the middle?
Like cases where it isn't already clear from homotopy invariants
That's the most obviously interesting case, but there are other cases.
It just sounds sexier if you say all 3-manifolds.
23:47
Oh, I see what Karl's saying. Think of rolling several dice.
So you're starting with uniformly distributed random variables?
@lopata {1,2,3} add two numbers 2=1+1, 3=1+2, 4=1+3=2+2, 5=2+3, 6=3+3, 4 is hit twice
I see
Then the distribution of the sum is, yeah, a triangle with a peak in the middle.
@MikeMiller Are there other cases though where $M$ is not diffeomorphic to $N$, but $M\times \Bbb R^3$ is diffeomorphic to $N \times \Bbb R^3$
It really matters what the probability distribution is to start with.
23:49
I'm a little bit afraid of emailing them to say that since it seems like it might be insulting.
why would I know that
oh I see your point.
Aren't there lots of "stably diffeomorphic" examples?
Well "most" 3-manifolds are determined by their fundamental group.
Iirc as long as your prime defomposition doesn't have a lens space piece you are.
Or maybe not. W/e.
Likely it was stated in the way it was due it being a well-known open conjecture.
@MikeMiller Going on this idea. Generate a random paper and give your talk on it.
23:56
@Karl why don't the modulo changes nothing? and what if we count 0 as lowest value like {0,1,2} ?
mod 3
Hm, I haven't thought about it.
if there are 3 possibilities for each: 0=0+0+0 mod3 = 0+1+2 mod 3 ...
so I think the final number will still be random and not fall on any high or low or mid position more likely
0=0+1+2=2+1+0=....=1+1+1=
1= 0+1+0 ...etc I think the chances are equal
when starting from 0
I think you're right on that, @lopata. Basically, @Karl, it's now an abelian group and you have additive inverses.
Ah, right
ok nice
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