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00:13
@Chris'ssis What's marvelous?
I slept only for an hour.
@ParthKohli Hey
@Chris'ssis See you in your dreams.
 
1 hour later…
01:34
@BalarkaSen Hello again.
 
1 hour later…
03:00
Hi all
@mixedmath hey there...
ah, imagine seeing you here
@mixedmath yeah, you look familiar somehow.
I was thinking about this question, and it's one of those questions that I can't quite set down
but don't really know what to do. But it seems like maybe it's something up your alley
03:25
@mixedmath I wonder if he meant that $\sum f(a_n)$ also converges absolutely. I'm not sure if it's relevant, but if that's not required to converge absolutely, maybe things get messy.
I like this question.
yes, I like it too
i wonder if that implies continuity at 0?
duh, rather obviously so
completely unhelpful
 
1 hour later…
04:50
\o
05:39
\o|
shine on me baby... cause it's rainin... in my heart
Is it a good rain?
06:31
Morning
06:47
Morning @Ilan
07:01
Morning Everyone
Morning Balarka
Have you got through those probability problems, @Studentmath?
@IlanAizelmanWS What does similarity mean?
Ah, so it's just checking whether those two are in the same conjugacy class.
@BalarkaSen Yup, you start by checking the characteristic polynom first, and if they match, you also need to check the geometric multiplexing if its $^?$ bigger than 1.
hard to explain in english :(
07:15
Looks pretty complicated, though I understand what a char poly is - I have done a bit linear alg,
isn't conjugacy left invariant when considered modulo some integer n?
Geometric multiplicities are beasts. Never had to go through that.
In general, I think determining conjugacy classes in any group is pretty tough.
@BalarkaSen Well, checking similarity isn't complicated. I just wanna make sure I did that correctly. laters!
@IlanAizelmanWS Later.
Monday - Tried to prove a theorem, Tuesday - Tried to prove the theorem, Wednesday - Tried to prove the theorem, Thursday - Tried to prove the theorem, Friday - Theorem turned out to be false.
07:36
Hey @G.T.R
Morning @BalarkaSen
07:48
Greetings
Morning @Chris'ssis @seaturtles
@BalarkaSen I meant geometry is cool. Look at that:
Let $F$ be the middle of the line segment $[GH]$ in the triangle $ABC$. Prove that
$$AF^2+BF^2+CF^2=3R^2$$
(I recommend a vectorial approach)
@Chris'ssis I don't know. I don't find it fun, by the looks of it.
@Balarka Yes, most of the issues were actually with my bounds over the double-integrals. I really need to be more careful there, giving too loose bounds ends up with false results. @Ilan checking
@Chris'ssis Is that another contest problem?
07:52
@BalarkaSen No, it's just an usual problem.
Ah. OK.
Do you know what moduli problem is, @Chris'ssis?
@Ilan I haven't check your computations, will if you want me to. But it's true - if they don't have the same polynom, they can't be similliar, as they don't have the same eigenvalues.
Two matrices are similliar <=> they have the same eigenvalues!!
Remember that and everything else will make sense
@BalarkaSen I heard some of it.
@Chris'ssis Can you give me an example of moduli problem, in some simple cases?
@Studentmath the converse is very wrong
07:54
@G.T.R I was wondering that
@BalarkaSen web.math.princeton.edu/~kollar/book/chap1.pdf. You can learn some from there.
that > was accidental
And now I can't edit..
To clarify, they are similliar *only if* they have the same eigenvalues,
They can't be similiar if they don't have the same eigenvalues.
They may or may not be similliar if they have the same eigenvalues.
That's right, right?
@Studentmath yes
Haven't forgotten too much then.
r9m
r9m
@Chris'ssis hi .. :) we can use $AP^2+BP^2+CP^2 = 3PG^2 + AG^2+BG^2+CG^2$ I guess ..
08:02
@r9m Hi :D
r9m
r9m
@Chris'ssis is $G$ the centroid and $H$ the orthocenter ?
@r9m Exactly.
@r9m btw, did you see my last integral (candy) that evaluates to $\pi \log(2) ?$
r9m
r9m
@Chris'ssis ya :D .. I haven't found an idea yet (I'm working on a problem on the main :-) )
@r9m Have you found some ways there?
@Chris'ssis No, I already know what it is.
I am simply asking if you know a good example.
08:13
@r9m OK
r9m
r9m
@Chris'ssis however the thing inside the integral looks familiar (if I'm not confusing with something else) :D ... IDK (I have to fiddle with it to know)
@Chris'ssis Fun stuff, in any case. Have you read that?
@BalarkaSen Some of it.
@r9m Similar to what? Let me know if you are aware of things I don't know of ... :-)
@Chris'ssis Great scott, you know algebraic geometry!
@BalarkaSen Not really.
r9m
r9m
08:17
@Chris'ssis 'aware of things I don't know of' .. could there be a thing like that ? :D ;)(except ofcourse you don't know my name :P )
@r9m :-)))))))))))))) I laugh out loud. That was funny! :D
r9m
r9m
lol
@Chris'ssis have you seen Daniel Fischer's solution to my problem here ?
@r9m No. Ah, I'm sure you have something simpler ...
Indeed (similar approaches).
r9m
r9m
@Chris'ssis I danced for a whole minute there after I saw we had similar approaches :P lol
@r9m lol :-) It might be the natural approaching way.
r9m
r9m
08:26
@Chris'ssis You are the experienced one here .. I'm just a kid :) (I can dance :P )
@Chris'ssis But there are pretty elementary examples of moduli problem, which can be understood without any advanced stuff. For example, this elementary and relatively easy) problem arise from hyperbolic geometry : Can you draw a circle from a point in the xy-plane that doesn't intersect the y-axis?
@r9m I'd also like to see "a solution that uses a combinatorial approach".
@r9m Snakes! That's some solution!
r9m
r9m
@Chris'ssis maybe its just silly of me to think of that .. just because the expression has some $\binom{n}{k}$ and possibly has a combinatorial interpretation .. might not mean the divisibility has some combinatorial meaning too :)
Its a NT problem after all .. :|
@r9m @BalarkaSen is the best one to answer that.
08:32
@Chris'ssis Answer what?
4
A: Prove that for $n$ and $m$ integers: $ 3^mn \mid \sum\limits_{k=0}^{m} {\binom{3m}{3k}}(3n-1)^k$

Daniel FischerLet us denote $$A_m = \sum_{k=0}^m \binom{3m}{3k}(3n-1)^k.$$ Writing $z = \sqrt[3]{3n-1}$ and $\rho = e^{2\pi i/3}$, we find $$3A_m = (1+z)^{3m} + (1+\rho z)^{3m} + (1+ \rho^2 z)^{3m}.$$ The sequence given by $$3u_k = (1+z)^k + (1+\rho z)^k + (1+\rho^2 z)^k$$ satisfies the linear recurrence...

Oh, nononon, I am (usually) bad at olympiad problems.
@BalarkaSen Is that an olympiad problem? @r9m is it?
@r9m I am curious : what's the motivation behind this one?
r9m
r9m
@Chris'ssis possibly .. a junior asked it to me .. I am still not aware of the source .. he won't tell .. :| (he puts me through testing problems some times :P )
08:36
I usually stay out of problems which appear from thin air.
r9m
r9m
@BalarkaSen I can't ... he's my student after all :P
@r9m Hahaha, good for you.
@r9m Are you a professor? :-)
r9m
r9m
@Chris'ssis come on (I'm 20) and UG student (I give tuition to a 10th grade boy .. :P)
@r9m :D
Am I the only one on this chat with no background in mathematics? Gezzzz
08:39
@Chris'ssis Did you do that problem?
@Chris'ssis No. Welcome to the club.
@BalarkaSen I didn't attend it yet.
@Chris'ssis Try it!
@BalarkaSen I have some series to do now ... (maybe some other time)
@Chris'ssis Fine. But it was really easy. Wouldn't have take no time to you at all.
But, if you're in hurry, no problem.
@BalarkaSen My geometry problem above is very easy too ...
08:42
@Chris'ssis Not for me =D
And the pathetic fact is that the problem I gave you was hard to me too.
hmmm, I'd feel so nice to have a large blackboard on one of my walls ... (to write my stuff there)
@BalarkaSen You said it's easy. :-)
I have been trying hard for weeks on a galois theory problem. No progress. sigh
@Chris'ssis Easy to you, not to me. =P
08:54
I am much more of an algebraist than a geometer, if any of them. I can't do geometry without some algebraic intuition.
@Chris'ssis Well, actually this one is easy, a modified version is hard.
Shall I spill the beans, or do you want to try?
@BalarkaSen Spill all beans. :-)
brb
You are given a point at the xy-plane not in y-axis. Take any point at x-axis not in y-axis.
Now join those point togather.
And find the third point on the x-axis by joining the dissector with it. Draw the cricle and you're done.
In fact, you have infinitely many such circles. Moduli problem in it's simplest one-dimensional case asks you to classify all such circles.
Interesting.
It is. And the connection with hyperbolic geometry is understood as this
09:02
In the Poincare model, of course, where all the axioms of Euclidean geometry are satisfied except the 5th postulate.
There are infinitely many parallels to a straightline that can be drawn from a given point, i.e.
@BalarkaSen What did you use to make that drawing?
@Chris'ssis Nothing. I borrowed it from wiki.
Klein model is intuitively better understood, though. Take an open disk and the straightlines be the straightlines inside the disk. It's easy to see that this model satisfies all the axioms, except Playfair's.
Just shared some nice stuffs. OK, I gotta go.
09:41
Pachelbel - Canon In D Major was the tune in the starling flock video :)
10:06
hello
I have a smaal question i have that $i: \mathbb{Z}\bigoplus\mathbb{Z}\rightarrow \mathbb{Z}$ what is $\ker i$ ?
Thank you
@Vrouvrou depends what the map "i" is
you can't just ask for the kernel of an undefined letter
that's meaningless
also, $\oplus$ is to $\bigoplus$ what $+$ is to $\sum$... nobody writes $1\sum1=2$.
10:53
true :P
11:20
@G.T.R that was played at our wedding.
@Chris'ssis That is very similar to an answer I wrote yesterday
@seaturtles Need help.
@seaturtles that's unfortunate... the symbols $\oplus$ and $\bigoplus$ only differ by size.
@Vrouvrou you do realize that there is no unique kernel, don't you? All you have is a map $(a, b) \mapsto c$ for $a, b, c \in \Bbb Z$ and the map can send anything to pretty much anything.
@seaturtles I guess they have to be separated by context
@Vrouvrou the question is what is $i$? it's not sensible to talk about kernels if there is no homomorphism. what kind of homomorphism is it? group? ring?
11:49
@DanielF
@BalarkaSen ?
@DanielFischer Can you help me with some field theory?
@BalarkaSen Maybe. But I'm not an algebraist, so it's quite possible that I can't.
Can embedding be from a set to some subset ? like from N to Q but the function will be the identity function ?
@DanielFischer Well, all algebraists are currently out of town, so I grabbed you. Am I right in thinking that there is a unique galois extension of $\Bbb C(X)$ with given galois group?
What I want is to prove the uniqueness, by the way, not the inverse galois.
11:54
@BalarkaSen I'd have to flip a coin. No idea, sorry.
@DanielFischer Booo. OK.
cool renderer @robojohn
@kuhaku I don't get your question.
Algebraist : What's a set? What's a subset? What's N?
Everyone got the joke?
not me
I haven't gotten to Algebra yet so no
12:02
@skullpatrol Algebraists always think about groups and subgroups, so he doesn't get what's a set. We almost never work with N so that doesn't make sense to him too.
I am not sure about the function so I removed it. Usually, we call it "map" and function draws continuity stuffs.
I would think that the idea of a "set" as universally found in all of math...
...in fact it is taught to preschoolers.
@skullpatrol Of course.
Making sets interesting is the goal of group theory.
Also, isn't a group a kind of a set ?
12:09
@kuhaku Set equipped with a binary operation, associative, identity, inverse. So yes.
Hm.. Last I checked, N to Q isn't a set to its subset.
@BoniTea haha.
$\mathbb N\subset \mathbb Q$ no ?
Are you asking whether the only function in N with an extension to Q is the identity function?
btw the word "set" has the the most definitions in the OED
12:11
@kuhaku "set to it's subset". N is a subset of Q, not the other way.
I asked if embedding can be from one set to some subset of another set
so "context" is everything
oh we can edit! chat of the future
within 2 minutes
nice nice
12:14
@skullpatrol Should be extended to 5.
Like SE comments.
@kuhaku So.. whether "an embedding g from one set X to some subset Y of another set Z" is possible?
@BalarkaSen agreed.
@BoniTea yeah
@kuhaku An embedding is injective. So, I would say that is not true in general?
For example, if Z is a proper subset of X, it just isn't going to happen.
@mixedmath thanks for pointing out that question. I caught on to the answer just as I was falling asleep, and luckily remembered it when I woke up.
12:26
@BoniTea, I see, I'm asked to show there's embedding in two ways between $\overline{(0,1)}$ and $\overline{[0,1]}$
but the open interval is a proper subset of the closed
@kuhaku I've only see the bars used as closure and conjugates in relation to sets. And neither makes sense here, I think.
Oh.. I messed up then xD I was thinking about finite sets.
Embedding certainly is possible here.
bars = overline I assume
@kuhaku Right. So what does it do to the intervals?
the overline means it's an order type, like I explained here: math.stackexchange.com/questions/822839/…
So you need to find an embedding the preserves ordering?
12:35
yes
I think
Would shrinking the closed interval work?
I don't know, I don't think that I understand how embedding works
As I understand it, an embedding is just an injection that preserves some useful properties.
So.. an injective homomorphism?
So basically, you want a function [0,1] --> [a,b], where [a,b] is a subset of (0,1)?
12:57
@BoniTea so maybe $f(x)=\frac {x}{1+x}$ ?
Then f(0)=0 which isn't in (0,1).
yea...
Didn't you have the answer in your question? "Every interval [a,b] is isomorphic to [0,1]".
you mean the straight line function ?
If a "straight line function" means what I think it means, then yes.
13:05
$f(x) = (b-a)x + a$ but when a=0, b=1, it's just the identity function and we have the same problem with $f(0)=0 \notin (0,1)$
Then make 0<a<b<1.
oh
are you sure it would still be embedding ?
It would be a one-way embedding.
okay, thanks!
@DanielFischer I was able to prove that non constant complex polynomials are closed maps. How would complementing help to prove that they're open maps?
13:19
@G.T.R Since they usually aren't injective, I don't think that complementing would help much here. Just look how the map locally looks like, the openness is an easy consequence of the local form.
@robjohn I just saw it.
I'm watching right now Simona Halep - Maria Sharapova game.
@chris'ssis who's winning now?
@G.T.R 2-0 (first set) so far ... (it's just the beginning :-))
Ouch. A break right from the start.
I knew it's tennis just from the names
13:29
Damn that was great
@DanielFischer locally, it looks like a constant, and minus this constant it looks like zero. So WLOG I may look at what happens around the zero of a polynomial...
@G.T.R No, locally it looks like a constant plus $(z-z_0)^k$ - almost.
@chris'ssis
@G.T.R 2-2
13:44
@G.T.R clopen maps?
@chris'ssis
@G.T.R Wait, it's just the beginning ... :-)
@chris'ssis the tall one strikes it real hard
@G.T.R Indeed.
@G.T.R Do you speak German?
13:56
@JasperLoy nicht fließend aber ja
@G.T.R I am always trying to decide between learning French and German. Which should I choose if I can't learn both?
@JasperLoy German, because the grammar isn't as bad as French. But ask @DanielFischer as well
@JasperLoy French, because the grammar isn't as bad as German. Besides, French has nicer sound, and better food.
I am also trying to decide between France and Germany as the place to be born in my next life.
@JasperLoy I don't think that's something you can decide.
14:02
@DanielFischer Well, perhaps if I will it strong enough, it will happen that way.
@DanielFischer did you forget how awful French verbs are?
@G.T.R No. But I also know how awfully German sucks.
@Chris'ssis I haven't used $\mathbb{Z}_5[\sqrt2]$ very often.
@chris'ssis
@Chris'ssis where is the game being played?
14:05
@robjohn Eurosport (LIVE transmission from Paris)
@JasperLoy Executive summary: Two people tell you how bad their native language is. a) believe it, b) take your pick anyway.
@DanielFischer do you like Sauerbraten btw? (not the game)
@DanielFischer I think I will watch more French and German movies to decide, lol.
@JasperLoy That's a clear win for France. Not even remotely the same league.
@G.T.R :D
14:08
Why those two?
@G.T.R So-so. It can be good, if the person making it knows how, but most of the time it's not. So I recommend caution.
14:21
@BoniTea It's a long story.
@DanielFischer My favourite German movie is Sommersturm, lol.
@JasperLoy Never heard of that.
@DanielFischer It is a movie about gays, lol.
14:41
@DanielFischer If you ask Wolfram Alpha for the Laurent expansion of $f(z) = \frac{\log (\frac{1+z}{1-z})}{z\sqrt{1-z^{2}}}$ at infinity, it says that the leading order term is $\frac{\pi}{z^{2}}$. But when you ask it to compare $f(z)$ and $\frac{\pi}{z^{2}}$ for values of $z$ such that $|z|$ is large, the values always differ in sign. Is there a reason for that?
I'm going to propose it for a contest (don't use any software for this - if you wanna have fun) $$\int \frac{1}{(e^x-1)(e^{x+y}-1)} \ dx$$ What is the fastest way?
@RandomVariable As a guess, it chooses different branches of the square root. But why, I cannot guess.
@robjohn What's that stuff?
Oh, this? Cool.
I don't think @Chris'ssis have studied fields, have she?
14:59
Hey everyone!!! How u guys doing? ;)
@chris'ssis
@BalarkaSen I attended that stuff in high school ... (last year)
@Chris'ssis Now, c'mon, fields aren't taught in high schools!
pretty much everything would be high-school math then.
do you mean to say you studied it yourself in high school, @Chris'ssis?
@BalarkaSen I mean it was taught in my class, last year, but I didn't take too much interest in it.
@Chris'ssis I don't believe that field theory is taught in high school class.
Are you sure?
15:04
You should see some problems in abstract algebra we did in the last year.
@Chris'ssis Wow. Romania is pretty advanced.
@G.T.R I'm only eyes there ...
@Chris'ssis Tell me about it.
@BalarkaSen I'm watching right now Simona Halep - Maria Sharapova game.
@Chris'ssis To hell with the game, I am interested in Romanian educational system now. =D
What book did they use?
15:07
@BalarkaSen I also did pretty advanced differential equations in the last year.
You should see a textbook. (you know, I might say anything here, but you need to see things in my books ...)
Diff eqns are fine, they are taught in here too.
I'm dying here watching this absolutely crazy game ... (Gezzzzzzzzzzzzz)
@chris'ssis
@DanielFischer When I did the calculation by hand, I restricted $\arg(1+z)$ to $- \pi < \arg(1+z) \le \pi$ and $\arg(1-z)$ to $ 0 \le \arg(1-z) < 2 \pi$ so that the branch cut would be on $[-1,1]$. Doing that, and being careful with signs, I got the leading order term to be $- \frac{\pi}{z^{2}}$. But I imagine different choices will lead to different expansions.
@G.T.R It's simply insane what happens there. :-)
15:11
@Chris'ssis Well, you haven't sent me any textbook.
I thought Dummit-Foote was standard.
@BalarkaSen I didn't find one yet.
brb
@RandomVariable Switching the branch of the square root gives a factor of $-1$, changing the branch of the logarithm gives a multiple of $2\pi i$ in the numerator. So the $z^{-2}$ term can be $$\frac{(2k+1)\pi}{z^2}$$ for any $k\in\mathbb{Z}$.
@Chris'ssis How much finite group theory did they teach you people?
Lagrange? Sylow?
@DanielFischer I was trying to show that the residue at infinity was zero. So the constant in the numerator didn't even matter.
@RandomVariable Well, it's an even function.
15:22
I'm about to die here ....
@Chris'ssis Why?
YEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
Off to a meeting. Back in 3-4 hours.
@G.T.R :-))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
@chris'ssis
15:24
@Chris'ssis no messing up chat with dead bodies...
@robjohn OK :D
@robjohn Says who?
What of the zombies?
I need to go too. Have to figure out a problem in Galois theory I have been doing for weeks.
r9m
r9m
@Chris'ssis I root Maria Sharapova :P .. is the game over ? (I'm up from a nap .. ) or is it still going ?
15:25
Oh, BTW, they don't in any chance teach you people galois theory, do they, @Chris'ssis?
@BalarkaSen Yes, it is there but I don't know the extend to which they teach you this. (I forgot ...)
@Chris'ssis I don't think so. Galois theory is undergrad, AFAIK.
No way they teach that much stuffs.
@BalarkaSen I buy soon some new textbooks that appeared this year and I'll inform you.
@r9m It's 1-1 (set) :-). It's simply madness here.
@r9m Check the integral above without using any software. Let me know if you see a brilliant way (I wanna propose it for a contest).
r9m
r9m
@Chris'ssis wait .. I'll go and capture the TV from my bro .. brb :P
@r9m OK :-)
@DanielFischer An even function can't have a $\frac{1}{z}$ term in its Laurent expansion at infinity but it can have other terms of odd powers?
@RandomVariable No, an even function has no odd powers in its Laurent expansion.
OK, gotta goes.
@DanielFischer The expansion Wofram Alpha gives does have odd powers. The second term is $-\frac{2i}{z^{3}}$.
Odd.
Argh, I forgot the constant term from $\log (-1)$.
So we have $$\frac{\pi i}{z\sqrt{1-z^2}} + \text{ even}$$
@RandomVariable ^^
And we get odd powers from the odd first function.
Hmm, wait, no.
The other way round, the first term is even, the second odd.
Sigh.
15:43
@BalarkaSen Let $G$ be a subgroup of $3$ elements of the multiplicative group of non-zero complex numbers with $a, b \in \mathbb{C}$. Compute
$$\prod_{z\in\mathbb{G}}(a z+b)$$ (problems you often meet during high school)
@DanielFischer Don't worry about it. This is probably the first mistake you've made in like 4 years. :)
$$\underbrace{\frac{\pi i}{z\sqrt{1-z^2}}}_{\text{even}} + \underbrace{\frac{\log \frac{1+z^{-1}}{1-z^{-1}}}{z\sqrt{1-z^2}}}_{\text{odd}}$$
@chris'ssis a subgroup with 3 elements is sad
@G.T.R I only gave him an example of problem from abstract algebra we did in high school.
I didn't even know what abstract algebra is in high school.
15:54
@DanielFischer Someone asked about showing that $\int_{0}^{1} \frac{\log (\frac{1+x}{1-x})}{x\sqrt{1-x^{2}}} = \frac{\pi^{2}}{2}$. So I extended the interval of integration to $(-1,1)$ and integrated around a dogbone/dumbbell contour. That's where this comes from.
@RandomVariable I see. Do you happen to know whether substituting $u = \frac{1+x}{1-x}$ would lead anywhere?

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