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00:04
@FernandoMartin HAY
@FernandoMartin I was computing a Smith normal form.
The explanation by Jacobson is pretty nice.
I'm still missing the last exercise from Alicia's guide
@FernandoMartin I'm missing the last two.
The second to last one is quite cool
I can't make sense of the last one
00:06
@FernandoMartin Let me see.
@FernandoMartin Ah, it's from AM
Sigh, how can I make W|A compute a normal form?
You can't, I think
@robjohn I have Mathematica. How can I make it compute a Smith Normal Form?
@PedroTamaroff Hmm... Let me look up what that is :-)
ComputeSmithNormalForm(M);
@EnjoysMath For realz?
00:10
you kno wha I say in?
mon?
te-mology, wha is dat ol abowt?
@FernandoMartin Nah, too much work. =D
wtf, you have to include the SmithNormalForm package for it to work? That's BS.
It should be "compute teh smith normal form of M, biatch!" and it knows what to do...
But let's just keep coming out with more crappy software I guess
00:14
@PedroTamaroff Even MathWorld doesn't say how to use Mathematica to get Smith Normal Form...
@PedroTamaroff However, consider this
Well, If I did nothing incorrectly the SNF of $\begin{pmatrix}6&2&3&0\\
2&3&-4&1\\
-3&3&1&2\\
-1&2&-3&5\end{pmatrix}$ is ${\rm diag}(1,1,1,22)$
Someone wanna give it a try? =D
@PedroTamaroff did you try one of the packages listed in that post on Mathematica?
@robjohn No, I'm too lazy to do that.
Plus Mathmatica didn't launch.
Greetings folks
What's up this evening (or day, depending on where you are?)
@PedroTamaroff Mathematica gets $\mathrm{diag}(1,1,1,610)$
00:27
@robjohn Yikes.
00:37
I'm reviewing for a combinatorics final exam in two days... can anybody confirm or deny whether my understanding of this is correct?

Using a generating function, find the number of ways to pick 6 balls from four different piles of 3 balls.

So I've got the generating function to be $(1+x+x^2+x^3)^4$, and I'm looking for the coefficient of $x^6$... I've determined this to be

$${4\choose 1}{5\choose 2}+{9\choose 6}$$
I can't think of any way to verify if this is correct, sadly. The problem seems too complex (or I'm just forgetting how) to use the standard multipilication and addition principles.
@agent154 Note that $1+x+x^2+x^3=\frac{1-x^4}{1-x}$
Then use the binomial theorem on $(1-x^4)^4$ and powerseries for $(1-x)^{-4}$.
@PedroTamaroff Yeah, I did use that. I skipped a lot of details when typing out my question just to be brief. I got

$$h(x)=(1-x^4)^4\cdot\frac{1}{(1-x)^4}$$
So the first part expands to

$$1-{4\choose 1}x^4+{4\choose 2}x^8-{4\choose 3}x^{12}+{4\choose 4}x^{16}$$

where the second part expands to

$${r+3\choose r}x^r$$
Then I found the coefficient to $x^6$ to be $a_4b_2+a_0b_6$ where $a_i$ comes from the first part, and $b_j$ comes from the second.
So, I end up with ${4\choose 1}{5\choose 2}+1{9\choose 6}$...
@agent154 And that is wrong?
(I didn't work out the problem by myself.)
I don't know if it's right or wrong. I'd like to find a way to verify this using another method that makes sense, or if somebody can tell me if that's right. I'm trying to think of how to do this without using generating functions (such as just using the multiplication and addition principles) but I can't think of how to do it. It's been too long
@agent154 Give me some minutes, I am doing something else.
@agent154 OK, so we want to solve $k_1+k_2+k_3+k_4=6$, where $0\leqslant k_i\leqslant 3$. Agreed?
00:55
@PedroTamaroff yes
@agent154 As you said, this is the coefficient of $x^6$ in $(1+x+x^2+x^3)^4$.
correct
As I said, this is the coefficient of $x^6$ in $(1-x^4)^4(1-x)^{-4}$.
Now $(1-x^4)^4=\sum_{j=0}^4\binom 4j (-1)^jx^{4j}$.
And $(1-x)^{-4}=\sum_{n\geqslant 0}\binom{n+3}3x^n$.
Since we want the power to be six, there aren't many choices left.
What are they?
@Pedro: Are you up for some proof-checking? Only if you have time/want to
@agent154 So, I am getting a minus sign there.
That is, $\binom 93-\binom 53\binom 41$.
01:00
Well, the only non-zero terms that are less than or equal to 6 are ${4\choose 0}x^0$ and $-{4\choose 1}x^4$
OK, I think I had the right idea but forgot the minus
@FernandoMartin YAS-.7
That makes sense then. Thanks for helping me see that.
I want to see that $V(P)$ is irreducible for any prime ideal $P$ (irreducible meaning $V(P)$ it's not a union of two proper closed subspaces)
@FernandoMartin I'd prove the converse.
So if $V(P) = V(I)\cup V(J) = V(I\cap J)$, then we have $P\subseteq I\cap J$
01:03
@FernandoMartin Union was product.
That should help?
where $I,J$ are ideals
$V(I)\cup V(J)=V(IJ)$.
$V(I\cap J)=V(IJ)$
@FernandoMartin Aha.
I just want to see if you can spot a mistake since there's some hypothesis I did not use
01:04
@FernandoMartin OK.
anyway, by the prime avoidance lemma we have (wlog) $P\subseteq I$
and we have $I\subseteq P$ as well, so $I=P$, so $V(I)$ was non-proper
OK.
@FernandoMartin From $V(\mathfrak p)=V(\mathfrak a\mathfrak b)$ we get $\mathfrak p=\sqrt{\mathfrak a\mathfrak b}$
This means that $\mathfrak a\mathfrak b\subseteq \mathfrak p$.
@FernandoMartin Can you write out the details there?
Yes
Ahhh, I'm silly
@FernandoMartin What did you do?
What I wrote is correct
01:07
Then why are you silly?
the exercise asked me to prove that $V(P)$ was an irreducible component if $P$ is a minimal prime
I never used minimality
but an irreducible component is a maximal irreducible subspace
that's where one uses minimality
Everything's good now
But I did nothing. Hehe.
Sometimes the problem gets clearer when you explain it to someone else
01:11
True.
01:21
Hello
Anybody alive ?
Why prime nuber are not dynamical ?
@PedroTamaroff I don't know if Mathematica will give the invertible matrices.
ok becouse y can not devide it. but what about double number 3 / 1.5?
@MR.ABC never better
01:25
@robjohn That's not important.
@PedroTamaroff It would be to check the answer.
@robjohn Ah, but I don't keep track of those.
never better ?
why i need to use natural numbers ?
@PedroTamaroff Yep. Mathematica's answer checks out.
simple questions no answers ?
01:34
:D
@robjohn Let's give it another try.
What do you get for $$\begin{pmatrix}3&-4&1\\2&0&5\\3&1&1\end{pmatrix}$$
?
@PedroTamaroff 1,1,65
@robjohn Good, me too.
=)
I understand how this works, but I am failing to fill in some details in the proof.
=D
@PedroTamaroff I will have to see what it is about SNF that keeps it from being the SVD. The SVD is a diagonal times an invertible matrix on either side.
but now is dinner time.
BBL
01:45
@robjohn In SNF you want the diagonal to be a chain of divisors.
$d_1\mid d_2\mid \cdots$.
01:58
@robjohn Oh, I think Jacobson was using the same symbol for a possibly different thing. SIGH.
02:49
@TedShifrin Jacobson's explanation of the algorithm to get Smith's normal form is good enough I can work out some matrices, but not good enough to get a satisfactory proof.
He leaves out some details.
03:28
Well, @Pedro, put them in! :) It is decomposition of finitely generated modules ...
Hey @TedShifrin
You're up late on a school night
if we define multiplication of cosets of K simply as product of group subsets, and prove its closed ( provided K is normal ), we don't need to prove that the multiplication is well-defined .. But now if we define the multiplication of cosets uK and vK as uK o vK = (uv)K we don't need to prove its closed ( since we assumed it is ), but we need to prove its well-defined ? is that how it works?
maybe i should better phrase
Given a group G, and K a subgroup of G.If we define multiplication of cosets of K simply as a product of group subsets, and prove its closed ( provided K is normal in G ), we don't need to prove that the multiplication of cosets is well-defined ..
But now if we define the multiplication of cosets uK and vK as uK o vK = (uv)K we don't need to prove its closed ( since we assumed it is ), but we need to prove its well-defined ( provided K is normal in G, or eqvalently ,the kernel of some homomorphism?
Is that how it works ?
04:20
TL:DR
Plese ask one question at a time
sounds like you have it close to right tho
I think youre prose falls within an open ball of the set of all prose on that topic
05:10
@Sawarnik, hi!
Do you know python?
@Sush Hi.
No :(
@Sush Why do you think so!
Very nice! You are a great sociologist!
coming....
how long you been researching him@Sawarnik? :))
@Sawarnik, please come soon!
@MR.ABC, i am alive. are you?
been researching, bean researching@Sawarnik
05:36
@Sush Back!
@Sawarnik, DO YOU SPEAK HINDI IN HOME?
I DO.
@Sush ho sakta hai! it can be a good code language here :)
@Sawarnik, YAHEE TO!'
@Sush Don't you use Gujarati?
I USE, but u know everyone in Gujarat also knows Hindi!
@Sawarnik, where does hawk study? in cmi?
05:39
@Sush Giving the exam for ISI Kolkata.
Haha! please do write about me!@Sawarnik, i will give you full marks!
@Sush Gah, you are a tough nut.
@Sawarnik, so he commits that he is undergrad in maths! Is he preparing for masters?
haha!
Hathoda mar or tod de nut ko!
No, no, he is going for bachelors!
@Sushi First of all, are you a he or she?
@Sawarnik, hemale.
05:42
@Sush Oh :(
@Sawarnik, :)
@Sush Why is your name Sush?
I will have to ask my parents!@Sawarnik
@Sawarnik, to Hawk uske bachelors wale saal barbad karega?
@Sush It sounds like Sushi anyways, but I like saying Sush! Sush.
Sush and sush, you will get success.
05:44
@Sush ?
or, Sush and Sawarnik, you will get success.
@Sawarnik, hawk ne robjohn se kaha tha ki vo barely undergrad hai. To, wo fir se isi me undergrad kyu karega?@Sawarnik
@Sush He is not!
Till now!
Misunderstanding.
Ok! so he is in 12th class, right?
@Sush Ji haan.
Who cares about those little middle school problems so much, and he has a lot of free time.
@Sawarnik, haha! He might be a teacher in Sarkari school!
So much free time + free mid day meal!
05:49
@Sush Sarkari schools in America are quite different though :)
Ya, joking.
@Sushi What is your age?
21
just eligible for marriage :-)
@Sawarnik, Modi aane vala hai!
Our English is ok, that's enough.
Yours ok, mine noke
Is he very famous in Bihar?
@Sawarnik, no, i do not think you will be sued for IDIOT word!!
@Sawarnik, i think modi is very good candidate, as he has really developed Gujarat, all outsiders, come here just because of booming economy of Gujarat!
05:58
@Sush I have heard that social factors are still very poor.
Our district was ruined by earthquake and now it is powerhouse! just because of good governance.
Ok, so you are in Kutch.
I think u are talking about post Godhara riots and malnutrition, right?@Sawarnik
@Sawarnik, yes, you are interested in GujNews, right?
@Sawarnik, after the riots when i went to Delhi, everybody told me that Guj. is hell. But now things are completely changed.
@Sush Are you interested in geometry?
no
r9m
r9m
06:03
@Sush Aha !! :P Hello :)
@r9m, hi
@r9m, are you in CMI?
r9m
r9m
@Sush nope
@r9m Then?
@Sawarnik, what does that suggest?
@r9m Please, please, please tell now!
06:06
@Sawarnik, why are you so afraid of everyone? I think every chatting human being is our friend.
:14966118 No, I will leave you. I will trouble you in your dreams! Or you have the solution :P
@Sush ok.
@Sawarnik @r9m
Did both computers ring?
I don't know :P
i know :Q
:R
:S
:T
:U
r9m
r9m
my speakers are on a vacation to hawaii .. IDK
06:10
IDK
means
@r9m then u shud say no.
r9m
r9m
@Sush I dont know
$No\in\{No, Yes\}$ but $IDK=\phi$
3
@r9m Bcoz i said IDK, that means mine computer rang, so if it did or not on you, that would be the answer.
Haha, logical Sawarnik
06:14
@meer2kat No, it was "disappointingly desperate" finale.
@Sawarnik, we have contributed so much removed stuff!
@Sush Yupee.
@Sawarnik, @r9m, bye, wasted enough time for today.:"?!@
Bye :)
Should I spam today?
Ok Bye, @Sawarnik, I am ♂, are you ♀?
This is the HW for today.@Sawarnik
CU AGAIN, HERE, on chat, next time!
06:17
@Sush The problem is we both are the same.
CU.
Should I spam today?
r9m
r9m
@Sush time is wasted either way .. so chill :P
@r9m Chillllllllllllllllllled!
r9m
r9m
@Sawarnik chennai is boiling right now :P .. lol chill
@r9m patna is being put into the cauldron :P
r9m
r9m
anyway .. gtg .. bye
06:22
bye :)
Should I spam today?
06:44
How do I solve this?
0
Q: Solving difference equations using generation functions

DanielUsing generation functions solve the following difference equation: $$ a_{n+1} - 3a_{n+2} + 2a_n = 7n ; n\geq0; a_0 = -1; a_1 = 3. $$ How do I go about this? I don't really get difference equations

08:15
Is it on topic to ask for methods to solve questions fast?
It would be off-topic to ask how to solve them slowly :-)
imo
08:35
In calculus, what does the question mean by For each sequence $${a_n}$$ find a number r such that $$\frac{a_n}{r^n}$$
has a finite non-zero limit.
$$a_n = (5 + 5 ^ n)^{- 4} $$
r=
08:49
Morning all! Could you please check the correctness of my answer (the 3rd post) here? Thanks!
09:43
@andy not sure I am at the right direction, but well,
We look for such r that when n-->infinity, that phrase will be a finine non-zero number.
In the case you posed,
r=1/2 would suffice. I think.
You just build up the phrase and look for an r that will do the job.
Apparently it won't suffice.
But well, $r=1/5^4$ will do, it seems.
Though I can't figure out why r=1/2 won't do.
10:24
Should I spam today?
10:35
@Sawarnik Hi.
@A̷n̷d̷y̷ Your picture is simple and good.
@ParthKohli Hi.
11:03
@KhallilBenyattou Hi.
@Sawarnik Good morning!
I almost forgot I had this tab open from last night.
Thank the lord for desktop notifications!
I'm going to have a go at the remaining integrals that @Ted left me :)
Ok :)
11:18
@Sawarnik How've you been? :)
@KhallilBenyattou Not good. I ve been just wasting time recently.
Haven't we all? :P
I've got 4 exams coming up mid-june and I've hardly prepared for them *sigh*
@KhallilBenyattou Which exams?
STEP I, STEP II, Further Maths 3 and Physics 5 :(
@Sawarnik Have you heard of those before?
I'm guessing you've heard of the first two. They're pretty popular.
@KhallilBenyattou I have heard of some STEP. Not the others :)
@KhallilBenyattou Are you on FB?
11:25
@Sawarnik Yep :)
Gotch ya.
@KhallilBenyattou What is the answer of avatar integral?
$$ \displaystyle \begin{aligned} \int \dfrac{\text{d}x}{x - \sqrt[4]{x}} & \overset{u=\sqrt[4]{x}}= \dfrac{4}{3} \int \dfrac{3u^2}{u^3 - 1} \text{ d}u \\ & \overset{f=u^3 - 1}= \dfrac{4}{3} \int \dfrac{\text{d}f}{f} \\ & = \dfrac{4}{3} \log | f | + \mathcal{C} \\ & = \dfrac{4}{3} \log | u^3 - 1 | + \mathcal{C} \\ & = \dfrac{4}{3} \log | x^{3/4} - 1 | + \mathcal{C} \end{aligned} $$
@TedShifrin
Wolfram gets $ \frac{4}{3} \log ( 1 - x^{3}{4} ) + \mathcal{C} $.
Is it just a different form?
@Sawarnik
The integral above is pretty similar. You'll need a substitution that'll remove the radicals and leave you with a rational function.
11:40
@KhallilBenyattou Ok :)
@KhallilBenyattou A quick question for you, prove:
$$\displaystyle{\int_0^1 \frac{1+x^{30}}{1+x^{60}} = 1 + \frac{c}{31}}, \qquad \text{where } 0 < c < 1.$$
${}$
Back, I'll give that a go @Sawarnik
@KhallilBenyattou Are you doing?
11:58
I'll give it a go now, @Sawarnik.

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