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9:10 AM
@Drathora That is exactly what I showed above
@Knight That is exactly what I showed above
:-)
@Knight look at the right side of what I posted above
 
That is true, but I felt that breaking it down like this would help Knight to reason about it more easily.
 
@Drathora Not saying there is anything wrong with explaining in detail. I've done it a lot of times in chat. I've also done it in one go. Sometimes it's easier to see the whole thing at once. Not sure which is the case here.
sometimes it's good to have both
 
9:34 AM
I am here
Will take time to read it
 
Alright, just ping me and I'm happy to discuss it
 
$f_{n+1} f_{m}$
this was bugging me
why multiplication
I was stucked here
exactly here
multiplication didn't make sense
 
If you think about it, for every path to $n+1$ there are $f_m$ paths to add to our "list"
So take a path $p$ from $1$ to $n+1$. Then if there are $f_m$ ways from $n+1$ to $n+m$, then there are $f_m$ paths from $1$ to $n+m$ that have $p$ as a sub-path
Or if you prefer "begin with $p$"
And since there are $f_{n+1}$ unique paths $p$ to $n+1$ we can choose, that means that the total number of paths that go through $n+1$ is equal to the multiplication
Since for every $p$ we add $f_m$ paths to our list, and there are $f_{n+1}$ paths that we could have chosen as $p$
 
It is making sense I grasp the idea now
Vaguely grasping but It is right
pretty sure
I get it now. Let's say you got take unique path from 1 to n then since there are n+1 to m possible path so you multiply it I get it!
Thanks dude!
 
Yup, no problem
 
10:14 AM
@robjohn Yes sir I can see it. Thanks for that :-)
 
 
3 hours later…
1:01 PM
Hi i need some help
I have the following question: Consider one vector of responses x taken from a population following Np(µ,I) where µ is known to satisfy µ'µ = 1. Find the maximum likelihood estimator of µ.
 
1:18 PM
@talisa is this for an examination?
You are not the first person to ask about this particular question in the last 2 hours.
 
oof
 
That being said, this is multivariate, so what is the first thing you think of when you are asked to maximize (or minimize) some multivariate function with a constraint on one of the variables? @talisa
Other asker mysteriously deletes their question and asks a new one on the same topic (multivariate analysis). Definitely seems like an online exam.
 
1:37 PM
I also got a completely unsupervised online exam next month
very epic
 
flag the question i guess? @anakhro
 
I did.
 
ok, I was trying to find it to flag but couldn't
 
The asker deleted the duplicate question.
Asked another one.
So unless you can see deleted questions...
 
I can, not sure if there's any point in flagging them though (or if you can even do that)
 
1:42 PM
It's on the stats.stackexchange.
 
already gone
 
ahh i cant see deleted ones on stats.SE sorry. only maths.SE
 
Yeah.
@Thorgott yeah, that was the duplicate question.
Maybe that works.
cached google version
 
yup i see it
created a stats.SE account to vote up the answer sot aht the question cant be deleted. Got "Thanks for the feedback! Votes cast by those with less than 125 reputation are recorded, but do not change the publicly displayed post score."
 
@anakhro Oh my god! After such a long time
 
1:48 PM
@Knight hey
 
Can someone help me with this? It’s been one month that’s Wikipedia is showing something like this for equations (tap to display)
 
Hola Knight.
 
for the dude's next question i mean stats.stackexchange.com/questions/475945/…
 
@anakhro Hola
 
1:51 PM
@Knight is your phone out of space...?
 
@CalvinKhor Haven’t you slept?
 
@Knight nooope
 
@CalvinKhor Yes :-)
Wow Cal! You got it by sitting their in Malay
 
that seems to be the reason i found on google, make space and it might begin to work
 
I think iPhone videos are too large, even a 2-minute video is quite large
 
1:52 PM
lol
 
Hello all, any interesting problems (not for exams) hereabouts?
 
@FranklinPezzutiDyer what field?
 
@CalvinKhor Doesn’t matter. They’re all connected anyways. :)
 
@Knight use the icloud thing maybe, or get some app to help you clean up photos/videos maybe
well I'm trying to solve some harmonic analysis questions......?
I know one answer using Besov spaces but I'm trying to get a more elementary answer
 
Okay I will talk to clouds
 
1:55 PM
lol
user image
2
 
@CalvinKhor What’s the question? I don’t know much about HA but I’d be interested to give it a shot
 
@CalvinKhor hahahahaha
 
@FranklinPezzutiDyer If $Rf$ is the Riesz transform of $f$, where $f\in L^2\cap C^0$ and $f$ has the modulus of continuity $\rho$, then $Rf$ has modulus of continuity $$ \tilde \rho(r) = C \int_0^r \frac{\rho(t) }t \ dt + Cr \int_r^\infty \frac{\rho(t)}{t^2} \ dt $$
This implies a solution to my question here - math.stackexchange.com/questions/3418691/…
I posted slightly more rambly about this in this chat room -> chat.stackexchange.com/rooms/19167/modern-abstract-analysis which we can use if anyone wants to discuss further, no one else seems to care that the room exists
 
yea its for an exam
were really struggling
i didnt know someone else was asking it
if anyone can help it would be appreciated
 
I don't want to help you do an exam, sorry
 
2:03 PM
savage hahaha dw
 
good luck
 
cheers
 
@CalvinKhor Damn, I definitely don’t know enough about HA to answer that
By the way, did you guys know Springer is giving away a ton of free textbooks?
(on account of COVID-19)
I recently went on a gleeful downloading spree and thought some of you self-learners might be interested
 
@Balarka finite length modules are precisely those that are both Noetherian and Artinian
 
haha @FranklinPezzutiDyer i had to try :) thanks anyway
@FranklinPezzutiDyer yes I did, already downloaded some :)
 
2:25 PM
@talisa at least you are honest, I guess.
 
If I have two expression with their error bounds given, what would happen if I would divide them?
 
I don't find anything wrong in asking for help, whether it's for an exam or something else. If the material in the test was actually in the notes and I hadn't studied or done further research that's understandable. But it wasn't so I tried my luck haha
Thanks anyhow
 
$a_1<A<a_2$, and $b_1<B<b_2$. Then $\frac1{b_2} < \frac1B < \frac1{b_1}$ so $$\frac{a_1}{b_2} < AB < \frac{a_2}{b_1}$$ @Knight
assuming $a_i,b_i,A,B>0$ anyway
 
Oh okay!
 
The nature of stackexchange makes it very easy to get answers without doing any of the work. On this principle I think it's bad to consult it as a reference for classwork, let alone examination. To your benefit, you asked in the chat where the culture is a little bit more about assisting rather than spoonfeeding (though not much better).
 
2:33 PM
I remember I couldn't out joke anakharo by saying "fork-feed" me
 
........obviously that should hvae been $\frac AB$ in the middle lmao @Knight sorry
can't edit it now
 
you want $0<a_1,0<b_1$, of course
 
sure yeah lol
 
@CalvinKhor lol
 
in Zm the zero ideal satisfies the definition of 0+0=0 and 0 is in <0>
but its not prime because Zm/<0> might not be integral domain if m is not a prime
ohh never mind
5*4=20 is in 0but not 5 or 4 in Z20
 
2:53 PM
Hi @Balarka
 
hey
I need to figure out some probability fast
 
Are you certain?
 
So I got curious and looked up the proof that e=2 implies virtually cyclic from my old ggt notes
It's pretty neat and short, want to hear it?
 
@AlessandroCodenotti yes.
 
Maybe later?
 
2:54 PM
$\mathbb{P}$
 
Thanks, I'll def get back to you in a couple hours
 
@Thorgott $\mathbb{RIP}$
 
In formal logic, is a proposition a statement which has a determined truth value, or is it merely something that can be said to be true or false, but not both.
I remember in my first class on logic it was "a statement with a well-defined truth value", but this seems like a definition which can be interpreted in various ways.
 
I know a random metric on a graph when appropriately scaled converges Gromov-Hausdorff to some some deterministic shape, and now I have a sequence of random metrics on a specified graph converging weakly to another random metric, and now I want to take "fiberwise Gromov-Hausdorff limit" after scaling and see what happens at the limit there
I am getting totally confused by symbols so I will just try to write it in words like this lmao
 
2:59 PM
formulas are just syntactical objects built following some rules, to talk about their truth value you want a model
 
With that in mind, @AlessandroCodenotti, if your model does not prove something true or false, then is it a proposition?
For example, CH with ZFC. Is CH a "proposition"?
Assuming, ZFC has a model. :P
 
Yes, but note that once you fix a model every assertion is either true or false
CH is a statement in the language of set theory (a syntactical object), the truth value of CH (a semantical concept) can change between models
 
Oh I see. So because you'd be forced to choose a model where CH is true or false.
 
Let's look at a simpler example, the language of groups has the symbols $1,\cdot$, where the former is a constant symbol and the latter a binary function symbol
So formulas in this language are things like $\forall x\exists y(x\cdot y=1\land y\cdot x=1)$
 
I'm following.
 
3:05 PM
The formula $\forall x\forall y(x\cdot y=y\cdot x)$ is a formula, because it is written down following the "grammar rules" telling us how to put together a formula, but it is true in some models and false in others
But once you fix a group it is either commutative or not
 
Indeed, makes sense.
So in your opinion, would propositions be strictly semantical and distinct from their formulaic identities?
 
I think that "things that can be assigned a truth value" is not a bad intuitive description, because that's what we want to do with them after all
 
So in that way, a formula--it's a proposition because we can (when given a model) determine its truth value?
 
 
1 hour later…
4:39 PM
I've just found out that there is highschools in USA that teaches multivariable calculus (among the others)
How is that even possible
I've finished math undergrad in croatia last year. We have multivariable calc in 2nd year in both semesters. One for differentiating other semester for integrating.
And those 2 subjects are one of the hardest generally
both to pass and to learn
Now I'm wondering how can a 17 year old actually attend something like that ?
Considering the fact you need to have a relatively good knowledge in real analysis on the first hand
 
I don't think it's as rigorous
 
I suppose so. But still, from my perspective , I was mindblown when I read about it
 
@domocar1 it's also worth mentioning that (multi and single variable) calculus courses are not actually the pinnacle of mathematics. It's mostly just mundane computations and methods, not requiring knowledge but just rote skill and repeated practice.
With that in mind, it's unsurprising that they could teach it to a high school student.
 
I see
 
isn't calculus the name reserved for the unengaging computations and analysis the name for the actual mathematics
 
4:49 PM
Not historically so. :P
But definitely how it is seen in modern days by pure mathematicians.
 
Calculus is soft math, analysis is hard math
Whenever proofs crucially use thinking in terms of inequalities, it is hard
Many analysis statements are in this sense soft, because there's rarely any inequality-thinking inside the proof. Uniform limit of continuous functions is continuous is soft
The inequalities aren't fundamentally inequalities, they are just "how much blah is close to blah". For crucial inequalities, the sign $<$ is not important, but the distinction between "$x < y$" or "$y < x$" is.
 
huh
can you give an example of what you mean
 
^
 
The Markov inequality and spinoffs (Chebyshev, Chernoff) are hard inequalities to me
It's important how tightly you can bound tails of random variables
Lot more quantitative than the $3\epsilon$ trick
Albeit as much elementary
 
mate you've been doing too much probability
 
4:59 PM
i struggle man i struggle
Look my point is you can just prove $f_n \to f$ uniform, $f_n$ continuous implies $f$ continuous without writing down a single inequality
$f(x)$ is very close to $f_n(x)$ is very close to $f_n(y)$ is very close to $f(y)$
so $f(x)$ is very close to $f(y)$
Done!
You cannot write down a qualitative Markov inequality
$\Bbb P(|X| > a) \leq \Bbb E|X|/a$? Huh?
 
you can't just replace inequalities by saying "very close to" and pretend you've proven the result without inequalities and you know that
 
No I think what I wrote is literally the proof. Rest is language
I am saying inequalities are used more than as a language in various contexts, that is what I call "hard analysis"
 
Seems extremely vague.
 
Shrug.
 
The "very close" to argument you gave earlier is different from situations where you need bounds (like squeezing). Those things needn't necessarily be close, but one dominates the other.
Howdy, a @Balarka, @anakhro, @Thorg
 
5:04 PM
Yeah, agree with @Ted
 
Hi Ted!
 
Arthur Mattuck (emeritus at MIT) wrote a nice little analysis book, and his whole thing was to do proofs with $\approx_\epsilon$ rather than inequalities.
 
Wow I should read that
 
Very elementary.
But he was a masterful pedagogue.
I learned a lot about teaching from him.
 
5:06 PM
There's a book called Asymptopia by Joel Spencer and Laura Florescu where I picked up a lot of hard analysis
it's some undergrad math series
 
Never hoyd of it.
 
It's basically a probability book, they do concentration inequalities, large deviations, ...
 
@TedShifrin does it in some way resemble non-standard analysis?
 
language is integral to doing mathematics, because proper definitions are and the way you define uniform continuity is in terms of inequalities (don't mention uniform spaces)
 
No, @anakhro, not at all.
 
5:07 PM
@Thorgott I think your understanding of mathematics is just different from mine
 
But he is basing the usual estimates on the philosophical difference Balarka and I were drawing. It is more intuitive and more accessible than a Rudin-type course.
 
Which is fine really, but I don't agree with any of what you said
 
might be
 
I agree with Balarka that the notion of uniform continuity/convergence can be stated verbally with no mention of inequalities ... This is not true of all estimates in analysis.
I used to draw "epsilon fences" when I taught limits and analysis ideas. Granted, there's an implicit inequality when you stay within the fence ... but to stay within the fence everywhere at once is an intuitive notion.
 
yeah. there's a reason students struggle more with sequences and series in Rudin than uniform continuity etc later on
i know i did
 
5:11 PM
There's more trickery in sequences and series.
 
but regardless, whatever you could reasonably call hard analysis will include more than quantitative inequalities and I don't see any reason to draw the line between soft/hard analysis at how you are using inequalities
 
@TedShifrin yeah that's also true
 
Isn't the definition of hard analysis something about inequalities?
 
Yes
 
Estimates, at any rate.
A lot of "soft" analysis is linear algebra in disguise :)
 
5:14 PM
wait, is "hard analysis" a separately defined thing?
 
I can give an elaborate example right now because I am trying to prove $\lim \mu_n = \mu$ for some constants $\mu_n, \mu$ and my proof is breaking up into two clear parts: $\limsup \mu_n \leq \mu$ and $\liminf \mu_n \geq \mu$. The first is "soft" in the sense that it follows from measure theoretic thinking. The second is turning out to be hard and I'm in dismay
 
in that case, disregard me
 
@Thorgott There's a post by Terence Tao (I haven't read it in detail)
 
cause I was thinking "soft" and "hard" in the everyday sense
 
5:15 PM
I think measure-theoretic is still "hard," a Balarka.
LOL @ "in dismay"
 
Yeah it depends on the context but I promise I'm using easy measure theory
Gotta get dinner, seey'all
 
Bon appétit.
 
@Thorgott goes to show that language still matters at the end of the day. :P
 
Language definitely is crucial in mathematics. My observation is that at elementary levels (starting with little kids and going through middle of undergraduate) the people who struggle the most struggle because of language.
 
which is why we should state everything in terms of logical formulae in order to avoid confusion :p
 
5:19 PM
The problem is we dont think in terms of formal logic
Thats not how brain works
 
Are you still here?
 
Sort of lol
 
Everyone, stop talking about math so that Balarka doesn't starve to death at his computer.
 
He's supposed to be eating dinner with his family!
 
of course not, I'm being facetious
I get what you mean now looking at the Tao article, though
 
5:22 PM
@TedShifrin in your experience, how do Ph.D.s usually choose topics for their theses? In particular, how much does the thesis supervisor dictate their chosen topic?
 
That varies a lot depending on adviser and student.
Some students come up with their own questions after reading articles, etc. Often advisers will suggest things to explore.
In my case, my adviser did suggest the topic. In the case of my one PhD student, I directed her to certain things after she'd read some articles.
 
Is it relatively rare for the student's topic to diverge from the main supervisor's research interests? On the level of, say, the supervisor being interested in Poisson geometry, and the student pursuing a topic in low-dimensional symplectic geometry, or something like that. Kind of like, still in the same "subfield" classification, but different flavour, tools, and problems.
 
@TedShifrin Hi sir. Are u free?
 
Generally, the adviser should be qualified and know the field and what's known and reasonable to work on.
@Bhavay: Just ask.
 
Thanks Ted.
 
5:26 PM
Bela Bollobas did a PhD under Frank Adams
 
Also, when people ask if you are free, you are supposed to inform them you are now requiring a fee of $40/hr of help.
 
That's a good way to generate revenue.
 
The maximum number of points on circle with rational coordinates whose centre is given by $\sqrt3,0$.(No radius is given)
 
This needn't be just for me. Everyone can talk with you about it.
What have you done?
 
@BalarkaSen Although that was his 2nd PhD on some functional analysis thing just to get a job in US because he left Hungary. He was already famous for extremal graph theory
I'm sure Adams enjoyed this oddball student amidst his homotopical crew
 
5:31 PM
Stuck on the first step. assumed : any point on circle can be given as $\sqrt3+R\cos(\theta) , Rsin(\theta)$
Now i need R to analyse this question further .
 
I don't think the trigonometric parametrization is helpful. Think more about the equation $(x-\sqrt3)^2+y^2=R^2$.
 
I get $x = \sqrt3 \frac{+}{-} \sqrt{r^2-y^2}$. What next ?
 
That's not so helpful, I guess. But if $x$ and $y$ are rational, what does that say about $R$?
Hmm, maybe not obvious.
 
Do u think the question is incomplete ?
 
So, if $R=\pm\sqrt 3 + q$, we get one rational point on the $x$-axis.
 
5:44 PM
what is q ?
 
A rational number, chosen obviously so $R>0$.
Given any rational point, it's on some circle centered at the point. Can there be more than that one?
So the rational point determines $R$. Now can there be a different rational point? What does the algebra tell you?
 
@TedShifrin I don't understand how do we get 1 rational point on x axis if we assumed $R=\pm\sqrt 3 + q$.
 
$\sqrt3+R$ or $\sqrt3-R$ (depending on sign) will be rational, $y=0$.
 
Have u assumed y to be 0 here ?
 
Yes.
I said on the $x$-axis, right?
 
5:47 PM
Yes.
 
At any rate, the final answer is TWO.
 
is q the point i.e (q,0) what i will substitute in the equation of circle ?
 
Yes.
Huh?
You're right. If you take $R$ rational and $x=\sqrt3$, then you get two points.
No, you get zero points, because $x$ is irrational.
 
Ohh!
 
I suggest you expand the algebra and think about what terms are rational and what terms aren't.
 
5:55 PM
I have another question.
Number of points on circle $2x^2 +2y^2-3x=0$ which are at a distance of 2 units from point (-2,1)
 
So what have you done?
 
Telling..
I calculated the radius :3/4
Centre :3/4,0
Distance of centre from point : $\frac{\sqrt{137}}{4}$
 
Probably not relevant.
 
I was thinking that this maybe boundary type question, where if minimum distance is less than 2 there will be no point on circle that will lie at a distance of 2 unit.
 
What's the point on the circle closest to $(-2,1)$?
Yes, exactly what you just said.
 
6:02 PM
Actually a small calculation mistake on my part , Dist from point to the centre is coming out to be $\frac{\sqrt{53}}{2}$
 
Aha. Your distance to the center is relevant.
Are you sure?
 
oops no earlier one was correct.
 
OK, finish up. I'll be back in a few minutes.
 
Now distance of centre from point -raidus >2 instead.
 
Yup.
 
6:09 PM
Which suggests that points can lie on circle. But how many ?
 
Huh?
 
That was the minimum distance right ?
 
And it's bigger than $2$.
 
Shouldn't it be smaller than 2 ?
 
I don't know what you're saying.
 
6:11 PM
It's bigger than 2 , How does it prove that other points can lie on circle at 2 units from that point ?
 
Draw a picture.
I hate to say it, but you're not thinking.
 
Sir suppose that distance come out be smaller than 2 , will we still get same answer ?
 
Of course not.
 
Here is what i am thinking , the minimum distance from the point (-2,1) is greater than 2.
So far good ?
 
So what does that mean?
 
6:16 PM
My question is that was the $ minimum$ distance from point (-2,1) , aren't there points on the circle that will be equal to 2 ?
 
You are not understanding the words you're typing.
 
I am not sure where i am going wrong ?
 
The point on the circle that is closest is more than $2$ units away. What does that mean about all the other points?
 
AH! they will be further greater than 2.
 
Yup.
I still say pictures help, too.
 
6:23 PM
Thank u for ur time.
 
You're welcome.
 
6:44 PM
Hi @TedShifrin
 
Hi @Michael
 
How are you?
 
Still kicking, and you?
 
Not bad. I have been busy helping organise an online conference that started today. A bit relieved. Might even have some time to do math.
 
Oh, that's exciting. Conference on what?
 
6:48 PM
Geometry and Topology of (Almost) Complex Structures
Or Geometry and TACoS for short
 
Oh, cool ... probably lots for me to learn. ... Are you serving virtual tacos for lunch?
 
We have four talks out today which are (vaguely) under the title of "cohomology and characteristic classes of (almost) complex manifolds"
Unfortunately we don't have the funding to provide lunch :)
 
Are you producing some sort of proceedings?
 
I don't think so. It's a series of talks every month for as long as we have the energy to do it.
The videos will be kept on YouTube though
 
Very good. You might recommend one or two of the best to me :)
 
6:58 PM
I wouldn't want to play favourites, but depending on your interests, I'm sure there's something you'd like.
 
OK, you can tell me the weblink at some point.
 
Wow, Demailly, no less. Cool.
 
Yeah, definitely a big get
 
When is ODE taken in the US? Do you get any other experience with differential equations before that? I've heard that it's after calc 3 and sometimes its own course or lumped into Calc 4.
 
7:13 PM
I used to teach some ODE in calc 2, actually. But, yes, a separate course after calc 2, typically.
 
Interesting. The reason I ask is that both of my friends graduated without running into it. One majored in CS and the other in Civil Engineering. They did Calc 3 but no ODE.
Figured that'd be something that would be inevitable. Both took linear algebra though.
 
Right. Not required for those majors. But required for most engineering and physics, etc.
 
Makes sense. I can't imagine that a typical civil engineer is doing differential equations. But for CS, I can imagine that linear algebra is imperative.
 
If you want to do graphics programming. Otherwise, not really.
And there are packages used so that you don't even need to understand that much linear algebra to use them.
 
I really find it interesting how different education systems tackle math. What speed they learn things, etc. And what they prioritize.
I'm not fluent in any programming language, so I was just thinking about how matrices might be conceptually very useful in programming.
 
7:19 PM
CS at my school required like Calc II (not MV) and one semester of Discrete Math and that was it.
 
But I could easily be wrong given that I am not a programmer.
He took discrete.
 
At UGA they stopped even requiring calc 2.
Made me livid.
Just one calc and discrete math, as I recall.
 
I was mathematically illiterate for a long time, but I've been working my butt off to learn these things. MIT's OpenCourseWare and KhanAcademy have been invaluable. Having two friends that serve as tutors is nice too.
 
Oh Ted, just saw that you answered my question yesterday, "RREF doesn't guarantee that a system is maximally simplified, since different assignments between variables and columns yields different RREFs, correct?" with "Incorrect. Renumbering the variables and changing the columns of the matrix is a different matrix." I'm aware of this; what I meant to ask was, suppose you start with an underdetermined system, pick an arbitrary assignment from variables to columns, simplify via RREF, and convert
the result back to system form. Are you guaranteed that the result is maximally simplified, or could you get a better result by repeating the entire process with a different assignment between variables and columns?
 
What does better result mean? You may end up with different pivot variables, but no difference in "quality" that I know of.
You can have different parametrizations (i.e., basis) of a vector space, but there's nothing "better" or "worse" that I know of.
 
7:35 PM
I suppose more terms cancelling, more $1$ coefficients, the things that make algebraic equations nice to work with.
or nice to interpret the real world systems they represent
 
Nah.
The column space doesn't depend on the ordering. So the span of the pivot columns will be the same, no matter which pivots you end up with.
 
okay, makes sense
 
7:52 PM
@TedShifrin Who cares about multiple integrals?
 
Single ones, you mean? And series?
 
Oh, that was calc 2?
 
Yes.
 
For what did they stop requiring it? PolySci might get by without...
 
CS
Poly Sci requires no calc at all.
 
8:12 PM
Hi @Ted
 
Hi, demonic Alessandro.
 
 
2 hours later…
9:46 PM
Good evening. Somebody to know the reason of two downvotes for my question?
2
Q: When is it possible to use complex analysis for solve the integrals?

Sebastiano"Is there a criterion, a clue that makes me think that certain integrals can also be solved through complex analysis and how to solve them?" When I can't solve an integral, I use the numerical methods. Thank you all very much.

 
Anybody know what this is called? $xyz=1$
 

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