The Bridge

Dragonrage

05:51

I was watching a video on a new game that was in open beta that seemed interesting, but like halfway through i just had to stop because the person playing the game was tilting me too much

like, several mechanics were explained, and one crafting/merging one that was pretty integral to the gameplay loop was just ignored after being used once

Memor-X

06:13

Polygon: All the biggest announcements from PlayStation’s new State of Play

tldr;

- FFVII Rebirth, Spiderman 2, Helldivers 2 and (Blue people) Avatar trailers
Honkai coming to PS5 (ooo, they best get in before they get slugged the install fees lol)
- DLC for Resident Evil 4 and Tales of Arise
- QWOP-like walking sim called Baby Steps
- Foamstars Beta
- new colors for the console and controllers

Kotaku: All The Trailers From Nintendo’s Mario-Stuffed September Direct

tldr;

- alot more than Playstation's

just the stuff that stands out to me

- Mario VS Donkey Kong
- Spy x Family game
- Super Mario RPG
- Princess Peach: Showtime
- SaGa Emerald Beyond
- Unicorn Overlord
- Bandle Tale (new League of Legends spin-off. more single player is always good)
- on the same brand, Song of Nunu's got a release date
- talking about release dates, Eiyuden Chronicle: Hundred Heroes has one aswell at last
- Eastward Octopia
- Wargroove 2
- Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door

a few of those i already know or suspect will come out to PC so the switch release dates/announcements hopefully translate to PC aswell

Tales of Arise from what i am hearing is in a similar vain to Tales of Graces f's Linage and Legacies and comes out early november

so i guess i'm fluffing about in Final Fantasy XVI for another ~2 months lol

Final Fantasy VII related

1997 - Emotional Ending Scene, Saves game, Pops in Disk 2

2024 - Emotional Ending Scene, Saves game, waits 4 more years to Start "Disk 2"

oh there is a part of me that's smiling at this notion

odd bit of news however is that Rebirth is only going to have a 3 month exclusivity

like doesn't mean it'll be on PC in 3 months after it's PS5 release though wont surprise me that they would want to capitalize on non-PlayStation sales since one thing i kept reading about Final Fantasy XVI was that it's potential was stifled because of the exclusivity (then again IGN seems to think that it should have also made up for the failures of Mavel Avengers AND Forspoken which really fuck off)

there is no way in in hell i'm playing Rebirth on PC in 2024 if it does come out. i'ld likely only be just starting Trails of Cold Steel 3 by then and i still have Trails into Reverie and The Legend of Nayuta. and that's just Kiseki, i still got other series on PC too. will likely be getting Rebirth on PS5 to play on weekends

SPArcheon

07:48

@Memor-X yeah... continue to believe that...

@Memor-X About Unity, I remember reading something about antitrust&co getting involved

since trying to apply a posthumous installation fee on previous releases is probably illegal

That said, time to ask on Laws.SE.

Dragonrage

@SPArcheon would be vaguely surprised if it hasnt already been asked

SPArcheon

@Dragonrage can't see any

Dragonrage

08:04

huh. well enjoy your likely HNQ rep if you ask it

Nzall

08:21

@Dragonrage Doing that right now

SPArcheon

08:40

@Dragonrage I fear you seriously overestimate Law.Se traffic.

Nzall

actually, never mind, I struggle to properly get the problem into words

Dragonrage

09:22

@SPArcheon low traffic sites actually have some extra stuff to push stuff on HNQ. if you are able to get enough views/interactions, pushing onto HNQ isnt too bad on low traffic sites, and once there, the title would likely do the rest

SPArcheon

@Dragonrage tried my best, open to suggestions for improvements

0

Q: Unity, installation fees and retroactive unilateral pricing changes

Recently Unity changed the pricing policies for its popular gaming engine that will become operative on Jan, 1st 2024. The change introduced what has been defined as "installation tax" by many news outlets. References: blog post announcing the change, FAQS on Unity site As expected this caused a...

contract-law

Dragonrage

09:50

@SPArcheon Im not super familiar with exactly how law.se runs their site, but it might be worth popping over to their site's main chat room (if they have one/it is active) and asking for feedback on improving the question. alternatives would be meta or asking a mod from the site for help

SPArcheon

@Dragonrage already moving in those areas.

Chat is quite desert, so I am trying looking into meta.

Dragonrage

my only suggestion would be formatting the last part a bit more to make the core question a bit easier to find. I think the background/etc is fine, just needs something to delineate "Hey TLDR (how) can they do this?" from the rest of the question a bit more.

Nzall

I agree, I'd rewrite the last bit so that the core question is clearer

Also, I'd add a tag to indicate you're interested in multiple jurisdictions, because I think Law.se expects a tag indicating jurisdiction

Dragonrage

i potentially could think of more things, but i am tired and going to sleep. I'll look at it again after I wake up.

Memor-X

12:02

@SPArcheon it's going to be emotional whatever you think the plot will be

because the next best point to cut for Part 3 would have been the end of the Whirlwind Maze after Meteor is summoned. game end with Cloud's fate being unknown, the WEAPONs all awakening and then after the credits Tifa looks out the window in Junon and sees Meteor

so to end at the same sport as Disk 1 did in the original, they are cooking something for the Forgotten Capital whether they main plot is still same same or not

Nzall

Do any of you have recommendations for an MMO mouse? As in a mouse with a bunch of thumb buttons that I can rebind

Memor-X

Razer Naga maybe? i see people on discord talk about it and i'm a sucker for customization. though neither seems cheap

https://www.razer.com/au-en/gaming-mice/razer-naga-v2-pro
https://www.razer.com/au-en/gaming-mice/razer-naga-trinity

Nzall

@Memor-X I've considered that one, and it's actually not that bad here in Belgium. 60 EUR for the Naga X, 80 for the Trinity and 110 for the Pro

Memor-X

@Nzall oh wow that is way cheaper than what the site shows. like for Pro i'm seeing $319 in AUD and it's about $180 if i paid that EUR price

Nzall

I actually almost bought the Pro last night but I was dissuaded at the last moment because someone said the swappable panels break easily

SPArcheon

12:21

@Memor-X I think you may not even be able to consider the original plot as a reference

I expect the thing to diverge A TON.

Memor-X

so far from the trailers it hasn't deviated the main beats

SPArcheon

@Memor-X I am pretty confident the trailer has already shown an huge deviation.

Memor-X

not really

SPArcheon

@Memor-X innocent whistling

Memor-X

- Cloud and Sephiroth fighting what looks like the Materia Keeper could fit during the parts they skipped over during the flash back.
- the doctor talking about the Black Capes being SOLIDERs suffering from degradation adds to the existing lore, more so if they happened to be G-Types as Hojo mentioned in the first one.
- Yuffie being with the gang at Gold Saucer or how Costa del Sol has Segways doesn't really deviate anything
- Zack handing the comotose Cloud to Kyrie doesn't exactly mean anything at this time other than further muddle what Cloud claims to know about his memories

Nzall

12:33

@Memor-X Wasn't there a huge debate about the ending of Part 1 and whether it signified a major departure from the original game?

Memor-X

@Nzall yeh and that's still up in the air but there's not enough information to say if thing really have changed or if it's just a red herring

Fredy31

@Memor-X The big thing you skipped is FZero 99, which is chaotic but a load of fun

Ronan

My understanding is that the original FFVII plot is "fate" that they may or may not succeed in fighting against in the remake, so regardless the plot of the original matters for the remake, even if the events don't happen the same

SPArcheon

@Nzall they decided to ignore a list of about 100+ proof that Aerith has knowledge of the original plot... I think this is called denial :P

Memor-X

@Fredy31 saw that though not too interested really, more so going by what the product page says

SPArcheon

12:44

@Ronan Right now I think that they will cause a big "Chrono style" mess.

Memor-X

> The F-ZERO 99 game is available only to active Nintendo Switch Online* members.

Ronan

@SPArcheon Having knowledge of fate doesn't guarantee that they'll succeed in altering it though, my assumption is that despite their efforts most of the biggest plot points will still end up happening in some form or other

SPArcheon

@Ronan You noticed the Stamp at the end?

Ronan

@SPArcheon I only know the original Chrono Trigger plot so I'm not sure what you mean by that

@SPArcheon I haven't seen the new trailer yet

SPArcheon

@Ronan the end of the first game

Ronan

12:45

@SPArcheon You'll have to remind me then

SPArcheon

@Ronan They go out of their way to constantly put Stamp the dog under the player nose, going as far as using Barret as a tool to mention Stamp multiple time when insulting Cloud

then.. in the last scene...

Ronan

Oh the mascott?

SPArcheon

it is no longer the same Stamp.

And the guide... it has to call out on that.

Ronan

As in the graffiti changes?

SPArcheon

Ronan

12:49

So they've hopped universes essentially

SPArcheon

The left one is the one you see al the time, the right one is the one in the scene with Zack.

Memor-X

except that one of them is set back years ago

ignoring that Shinra is a Business and can rebrand their mascot

SPArcheon

@Memor-X Except the ultimecia guide also.

Ronan

Oh yeah, the Zach scenes would have been flashbacks, so they could have rebranded

Memor-X

@SPArcheon you're going to need to quote that because i havn't seen it

@Ronan and there's still a long way between than and the game's modern day

hell even if Zack shows up in the modern day i ain't going to take it at face value he's alive because Zack was close to Aerith, and Jenova is known for taking the forms of loved ones to lure them into it's traps. who better to target Aerith than her boyfriend

Ronan

12:53

My prediction is there's going to be a big moment where they think they've averted fate because it doesn't play out how it's predicted, and then after they let their guard down something happens that brings everything back in line, but in a slightly different form

SPArcheon

> Interviewer: The ‘loyal dog Stamp’ makes many unexpected(?) appearances (alongside the route you need to go down, after a certain event with XXXX on a snack bag, etc.), was this planned from the start?

Toriyama: Stamp was actually an important motif and planned from the early development. (...) When XXXX appears, please pay attention to how the dog breed of Stamp becomes different.

first....

a second point, calling out again on the fact there is no explanation for the change.

Ronan

It could be a time period thing too, if Cloud is thinking something is happening currently, but it's actually a flashback to something that "happened" to "him", and you can tell by looking at the stamps

Memor-X

@Ronan yeh because in the first trailer for rebirth they showed the Whirlwind Maze and Cloud among the other Black Capes gathering for the Reunion. not sure where that might fit if it ends at the same point as Disk 1 of the original game

SPArcheon

@Ronan there is a plethora of oddities behind the game. Red herring everywhere. I can elaborate if you wish... but it will be LONG. So, if you want to move to a separate room just tell me. Or you can skip.

Memor-X

@Ronan yeh because in the scene the Whispers "containing" Midgar was happening both during the Highway Chase with Cloud and during Zack's fight. one could think that maybe Zack was outside of Midgar at the same time Cloud was leaving but the different breeds of Stamp are to tell us that during Zack's fight, the Whispers were containing Midgar for some other reason

Ronan

13:00

@SPArcheon I'm not saying it's not odd, but literally the original was all about unreliable narrators/memories, so I'd be wary of taking anything at face value

I'm also not saying your theories are wrong, just that there are many options

Memor-X

but there are people who are trying to make it more complicated because Tetsuya Nomura is involved and he was involved in Kingdom Hearts

Ronan

It's definitely going to be convoluted no matter what

Memor-X

infact even in XVI people were trying to claim that the plot was too complicated (because it had the Active Time Lore function) and it because of Nomura despite him not being involved in anyway

Ronan

The issue with 16 was that they called it "Active Time Lore" rather than just "glossary"

Memor-X

actually it has a glossary aswell

SPArcheon

13:07

@Ronan The point is that some thing are not unreliable at all. And they are literally playing with the expectation that someone dies ... a little to much to not be suspicious

see the last ours posts... Probably you didn't saw those yet.

Memor-X

the Active Time Lore is just a a means to show relevant entries to that scene from the glossary you can see in the middle of a cut scene

SPArcheon

first one, refuses to elaborate on the scene, says "fans dying"

Memor-X

sorta cool when you encounter someone Clive remembers but you don't and you can just look it up

Ronan

@Memor-X Yeah I know, it's a good system, but by giving it a fancy name people thing it overly complicated

SPArcheon

Then you have Nomura again confirming it ends there

> Final Fantasy VII Remake showed the story up until the escape from Midgar, but what point does Final Fantasy VII Rebirth take us up to?

Nomura: We have mentioned this a few times before, but the order in which you can explore the locations is not the same as the original Final Fantasy VII, and there are some shifts in the order. For example, Wutai, one of the major locations, is not part of the route in Final Fantasy VII Rebirth and will be visited in the next one. Although there are some changes in the order of the locations, the locations depicted in this title extend up to "The Forgot…

Ronan

13:10

@SPArcheon But either the characters avoiding that event from happening, or failing and it still happens, both work with that message. So we don't know anything

SPArcheon

@Ronan Look, I have a personal theory that the game is a revenge to a revenge, but that is something most would just consider an headcanon so I won't annoy you with that.

That said, I would find it pretty "meh" if the second game destroyed the idea of "changing fate" the first one made

Ronan

I'm not sure what you mean by revenge to a revenge

@SPArcheon I'm 99% sure they'll still play with that idea yeah

SPArcheon

@Ronan probably better that way, let's just say I still think someone had is own agenda with the original FF7, cerberous retconed someone else game and now is about to get the same thing times 10

Ronan

@SPArcheon Oh you mean out of universe revenge?

SPArcheon

@Ronan yes.

Ronan

13:17

Yeah I could see that

I'm a sucker for stories about stories, so I'm looking forward to seeing what they do with this either way

Memor-X

@SPArcheon what did Cerberus retcon?

SPArcheon

@Memor-X Not Dridge of Cerberous

Ronan

Normura famously doesn't believe in retcons, the amount of work he did to explain why Micky didn't have a shirt at the end of kingdom hearts 1 is testament to that

SPArcheon

@Ronan That is kinda my point. Also Nomura, the one that simply put Aerith in the game without ever explain how she would be there.

Memor-X

@Ronan *looks it up* holy crap he wasn't wearing one

i never noticed that before. i think because he's more in silhouette there and the next time you see him (and not under a hood) he has a shirt i must have super imposed him having a shirt in my memories of that scene

Ronan

13:33

@Memor-X He wasn't in the first game other than that silhouette, so they didn't consider his design that much

SPArcheon

@Memor-X sorry, my bad. It is Cerebus.

tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/CerebusRetcon

Ronan

And then when he was in the sequels they made him have a shirt because it looked weird, but rather that just retconning the design, when the do a flashback they specifically add a scene where he loses the shirt

@SPArcheon That doesn't help me understand what you're talking about

SPArcheon

> One of the side effects of Cerebus Syndrome is that some gags from the early part of the story may no longer seem to fit the more serious tone of later portions. There is however a way to make these early funny elements consistent with the rest of the story: giving them a Cerebus Retcon.

Ronan

Yeah, I don't know how that applies to FF7

SPArcheon

@Ronan Disclaimer: it is long and many will claim it is made up or a rant.

in Sugarcube Corner, Apr 17, 2020 at 7:34, by Derpy

You see, back in the SNES era, little before the PS1 came... Squaresoft still claims that two games came from similar sources, to the point that sometime there are rumors that cut elements from one where reused in the other.

yet, personally I am much more inclined into believing this than accepting things like the "always planned from the start" and "it started as a detective story".

Ronan

13:47

I have no idea what you're saying

SPArcheon

@Ronan Shorter version. Chrono and FF7 were developed as parallel games with a similar premise, yet they go opposite directions. One is about "you can change fate", other is "Aerith dies, everyone dies"

later, a specific someone took control of Chrono Trigger sequel and first thing he did was retcon the ending, killing everyone offscreen and replacing the character with more than 40 no personality guys.

Ronan

Sure, I don't know how a cerburus retcon has to do with that

SPArcheon

@Ronan line above, posted at the same time

Ronan

Oh I've never seen anything from chrono cross

SPArcheon

turned the sequel in something that barelly has anything to do with the original in mechanics, feels, and places.

Yuuki

13:58

just a reminder, guys:

Today is Friday in California

►

SPArcheon

That one is one of the key figures in the original FF7 too, and the one who wanted Chrono to stay dead in Chrono Trigger (thus undermining the whole meaning of the game)

Ronan

I disagree with your assertion that the ending of FF7 is a sad one. You save the world, you're just not around on a long enough timescale to see it

SPArcheon

@Ronan please, don't make me look again, there is an official interview that confirms that the ending implies humanity still disappeared.

So you saved the world, but the "parasite" still died.

Ronan

@SPArcheon The world is saved, there's life. Specifically against genova's aims

SPArcheon

Imagine Chrono Trigger with the same ending: world saved, humanity extinguished.

Alas, the point is that I fell that now the roles may be reversed.

Aka is will be Nomura having "fun" removing the death someone was so fond off.

That is what I meant by "revenge"

Either way, hopefully this game will end my need to wonder.

If they go the same route, I know it is not worthy to invest in chapter 3

if they change the thing, I will have another good game in the future and probably the FF7 I wanted to play from the start.

So, in a way I win either way.

That said, if she dies again... they are a pretty big can of ye oldie bastards :P

Memor-X

14:11

@Yuuki meanwhile it's 10 minutes into Saturday on the underside of the world

11 minutes into Saturday lol

SPArcheon

The amount of herrings they dropped to a different outcome is huge, starting from the old 10 minute japanese commercial for the first game

Ronan

I think "change fate, everyone lives" is too simple, and Nomura is incapable of writing a simple story

SPArcheon

@Ronan I didn't say the story will be simple. I said I expect Aerith to live this time.

Memor-X

i reckon that in the huge time gap between the end of Dirge of Cerberus and the final scene in the original game, the Whispers obtain some goal that isn't to humanity's benefit. so the future visions we see that repeat what we already know (Meteor Fall, Nature reclaiming Midgar) might be a lie of omission

SPArcheon

@Ronan If I have to bet on a plot, I would say that Zack has been "pulled in" because the "parallel but different" plot will still have Aerith "not playable" but for another reason.

I expect Zack to be alive in this sequel because some time shenanigans, but ending up opposed to Cloud.

I already said that to Memor, but she doesn't agree that much.

Imho, and alive Zack would be the best tool in Sephirot/Jenova/Genesis/PapaSmurf/whateveryouwanttocallthem

- Overlaps Cloud memories, both as a motive to see him as a fake and to point him as fake to his friends
- Is the original boyfriend of Aerith, has motives to hate Cloud if she dies

Now, figure Sephiroth showing him some images from the scene with Cloud attacking Aerith at the materia temple, followed by dead Aerith from the original.

Guy thinks fake Cloud went nut and killed her, fights him as a result.

May take away Aerith at the end of the game.

and there you have it again, same result, but a different outcome.

it is also worth noticing that this sequel seems to add combination moves (see trailer).

Will they really lose the opportunity for Double Onmislash in game 3?

Unionhawk