The Bridge

GodEmperorDune

17:00

i gotta say, i love it when canadians are more familiar with american law

Unionhawk

Even nonrevocable licenses can usually be revoked over behavior like pdp. So even in that case this prob would have been okay.

Tweeted by MrRyanMorrison on September 12, 2017 at 4:29 PM

MBraedley

@Frank I don't read that as a binding and complete contract

Unionhawk

Don't we just have words on a FAQ

Frank

@MBraedley That's a good point.

But let's take a different tack: let's plays are fair use.

Kevin van der Velden

That has not been proven in court

Unionhawk

17:01

Usually not

Frank

Which are a valid defense for copyrighted works.

MBraedley

17 mins ago, by MBraedley

@Unionhawk Indeed. One would be covered under commentary, the other under transformative works. The latter doesn't tend to receive the same generous fair use considerations as the former.

Unionhawk

Reviews are, sure

Let's Plays aren't reviews

Frank

They are not reviews, no. But at the same time, they are a unique transformative work. At least, that's how I'd see it.

It'll be interesting to see if either side wants to take that to court.

But back to the legal abuse: doesn't revocation require informing the holder of said revocation before taking action?

Kevin van der Velden

> A derivative work is transformative if it uses a source work in completely new or unexpected ways

I don't know if a let's play falls under that

Playing the game and commenting on it is perhaps not completely new or unexpected

Frank

17:05

Even if the license isn't a complete contract, it won't sit well in court for fire watch for arbitrary revocation on a whim.

MBraedley

Even if it does, it doesn't necessarily grant fair use.

Unionhawk

Yeah I don't think a judge will rule "dude has a webcam and screams a lot over unmodified footage of the copyrighted content" is transformative

Since I assume he plays firewatch exactly how he plays horror games

probably

Frank

@Unionhawk easy defense. Show another let's play beside your own. Its completely different.

Unionhawk

Is it though

Completely

Kevin van der Velden

@Frank That is not relevant to if your let's play is transformative under fair use

Frank

17:06

@Unionhawk I can't tell if you're agreeing with me or not.

Unionhawk

Besides yeah the comparison point is the original work

Frank

@KevinvanderVelden No, its back to my original argument.

Unionhawk

Not some other guy doing basically (but not exactly) the same thing

Frank

@Unionhawk No, but it demonstrates the transformative aspect rather well.

Kevin van der Velden

@Frank the unique transformative work one? Or another that I've missed

Frank

17:08

@KevinvanderVelden Oh, I thought you were referring to a different message.

GodEmperorDune

IANAL splaining bridge best bridge

Frank

No, that's part of the fair use argumentm

Kevin van der Velden

@GodEmperorDune I can't wait until leonord french does a thing on it

Unionhawk

In any case the devs have the high ground Annikin

Kevin van der Velden

Oh wait, he has a thing:

DMCA Abuse over Pewdiepie N-word - What?

►

Frank

17:09

Let's plays don't have any precedent as fair use, no. Bit I have a strong feeling that no publisher wants to test it and possibly lose.

Kevin van der Velden

Here, an actual copyright lawyer on this case

Frank

@KevinvanderVelden I'll have to watch that when I get on WiFi.

MadMAxJr

Can we just hit PdP with a rolled up newspaper and yell "GROW UP ALREADY" at him?

Kevin van der Velden

I'll summarize it when I've watched it =p

Frank

@MadMAxJr This, I totally agree with.

Kevin van der Velden

17:10

@MadMAxJr Can we skip the newspaper and start with the cluebyfour?

Frank

I'm not saying what he did should defended to the last bastion.

MadMAxJr

I want to shame him not injure him.

Frank

Just that Firewatch's actions were wrong.

MadMAxJr

Maybe make him do some community service for being a jerk.

Kevin van der Velden

@MadMAxJr hmmmmm

Unionhawk

17:11

@MadMAxJr I mean I'll do it

MadMAxJr

I mean if you need to injure him name an XCom rookie after him and charge him at the center of a patrol.

Unionhawk

Firewatch DMCA's are legal, Devs can easily destroy YT channels, and the law isn't how you want it. LISTEN HERE! https://headgum.com/robot-congress/robot-congress-46-pewdiepies-dmca-dilemma

Tweeted by MrRyanMorrison on September 12, 2017 at 3:46 PM

(haven't listened but VGA is my go-to for any time this happens)

Frank

@Unionhawk Techdirt is usually mine. From my understanding, DMCA takedowns of this nature are not allowed, on several aspects.

Kevin van der Velden

@Unionhawk Alas, I can only watch one thing at a time

Frank

Granted, I haven't checked to see if they've done anything on this case yet.

Unionhawk

17:14

Most of the single target takedowns that have happened over the last few years have been reviews

Which have been fair use reversed for the most part

Kevin van der Velden

@Frank both VGA and leonard french are actual attorneys, for legal things I generally prefer listening to actual attorneys over news papers =p

MadMAxJr

Glad I don't watch PdP. I prefer watching lovable dorks who make me feel better about myself.

Unionhawk

@MadMAxJr He's the dumbest person on youtube and I don't understand

Frank

@KevinvanderVelden Can't argue that. I definitely respect Leonard French.

Kevin van der Velden

@Unionhawk children of 8

Unionhawk

17:16

ugh

and he's teaching them how to do advanced casual racism \o/

Kevin van der Velden

Yes \o/

MadMAxJr

I'll stick to Markiplier. As far as I know he hasn't murdered anybody or been too mean to anything.

Frank

Man, I really want to get back to gunpla. Sadly, its all packed away, and my focus right now has to be renoing my new place.

Avery

dammit

MadMAxJr

I have a stack of 8 kits I need to work on too.

murgatroid99

17:18

I'm listening to the Leonard French video, and he seems to be saying that the DMCA takedown notices are false/unjustified

Frank

@MadMAxJr What do you have in the backlog?

MBraedley

@Avery Yep, you're probably going to have to regen your key pairs.

Yuuki

From what I recall, people in this room weren't nearly as accepting of Nintendo DMCA'ing LPs a few months ago.

Avery

@murgatroid99 ryan morrison says the opposite

it's interesting.

Frank

@Yuuki They are a very controlling company.

Kevin van der Velden

17:20

Yes, Leonard's point seems to be that there is a licence (see firewatch's website) and as such they can't restrict that

Avery

@MBraedley I've just switched to https which fixes my stuff

murgatroid99

@Avery Between them, I think I'd tend to believe the copyright lawyer on the subject of copyright

Yuuki

And while I understand that PDP did something morally repugnant, I'm trying to sidestep/ignore the "but he's a racist" part of the argument.

Frank

I love Nintendo, but they need to get with the internet times.

Unionhawk

Yeah that's the only sticky part of the thing

Kevin van der Velden

17:21

@Yuuki we're wondering about the legality of it, we (or at least, I) still hate that it's happening

@Avery damnit your new avatar is confusing

MadMAxJr

@Frank Dendrobium, Sazabi (old kit), Sazabi (new kit), MG Kampfer, Crossbone, MG RX-78, MG Zeta, PG Zaku, and MG Sinanju

Avery

@KevinvanderVelden get rekt or smth

fredley

Meanwhile, in $40

Frank

@MadMAxJr The only overlap we have is the MG Sinanju.

Avery

but yeah don't think that it'd be confused with anyone's pics

Frank

17:23

I just picked up an MG Providence from the only freaking gunpla shop in Halifax.

MadMAxJr

I bought him on the sole basis that it's a mecha with officer dress uniform decor.

Frank

@Wipqozn and @MBraedley need to step up their gunpla game.

MBraedley

So I haven't laid out my full opinion yet. Should LPs be protected by fair use? Probably (of course there will be edge cases). Given that the current fair use state of LPs is unknown, was the DMCA used inappropriately? No. Can I still be upset at Nintendo for basically threatening to do this en-mass? Sure.

MadMAxJr

I've got a HobbyTown USA about 4 blocks over that carries new releases and odd mixes of older kits.

Kevin van der Velden

Lol, Leonard French and VGA were discussing their differences and seem to say they agree

Frank

17:25

@MadMAxJr ...Actually, I think I have two MG Sinanju. Won an MG special set last year, so my backlog is a little on the huge side.

Yuuki

@Frank Oh, I saw an anime goods shop while I was in Montreal and they had a bunch of gunpla kits that I took pictures of for you.

Arperum

@Avery It's weirdly between @frank and @Yuuki for me somehow. Which is weird.

Avery

mine has yellow-ish background

and has a huge hair so

Frank

@Yuuki We're just passing Montreal, actually.

Arperum

@Avery I don't notice that in the tiny image/my screen.

Frank

17:26

No time to stop; gotta punch it to Ontario today.

MadMAxJr

@Frank Considered buying the IBO box set because apparently the Barbatos Lupus in there is a unique US only kit.

Frank

@MadMAxJr Hmm. I have an XM Raiser waiting for me when I get back.

Kevin van der Velden

@Avery I'm not confusing you with anyone else, I'm just not linking it to you

Yuuki

Avery

@KevinvanderVelden ah, well, that'll probably change in time as I'll keep this icon

MBraedley

17:28

@MBraedley Nintendo was a "Can they do this? Yes. Should they do this? No." situation.

Kevin van der Velden

Yes, but for now you are awful

Yuuki

Hmm... it seems I wasted a bunch of space at the top that could've fit more gunpla kits.

Avery

@KevinvanderVelden :success:

Kevin van der Velden

I should have said, "Yes, but for now you are bad" so I'd have a 6 word sentence of all 3 letter words

MadMAxJr

Really need to watch Thunderbolt Gundam. Still in the process of finishing IBO. Mobile Armor was bonkers.

Yuuki

17:29

Also, I found Canadian Ted Cruz while I was in Montreal.

Frank

@Yuuki I have several of those. The massive box on the right, the one to the left of it, on the Hi-Nu, and the one in the top left.

MBraedley

@Yuuki Ted Cruz is (well, was) Canadian already.

Unionhawk

@Yuuki isn't that just ted cruz

Yuuki

Sorry, Quebecois Ted Cruz.

Unionhawk

I'm pretty sure that's just Ted Cruz

like 63% sure at least

MadMAxJr

17:31

No, this Cruz is 20% larger than the regular Cruz, as per Quebec law.

Yuuki

I need confirmation from other Canadians (cc @Frank @Wipqozn @Ash @MBraedley)

MBraedley

@MadMAxJr That joke will go over so many heads.

StrixVaria

@MBraedley I got it.

Yuuki

I did a Google search. Something to do with pints?

badp

FINALLY

WORK CALLS WHILE I SURF

MadMAxJr

17:34

Quebec has French as their national language. All signage that contains english must contain the French wording in a larger format.

badp

THE FUTURE IS HERE

MadMAxJr

So everything in French in Quebec is bigger.

MBraedley

@MadMAxJr I think the law was (at least partially) struck down, but that was how it was enacted.

Yuuki

Ah.

MadMAxJr

So I can only assume French Ted Cruz rises out of the ground like Kraid in Super Metroid.

Tim Stone

17:36

3

SaintWacko

I like that "All day battery" is one of their big selling points

Tim Stone

THE STRUGGLE IS REAL

badp

@TimStone thankfully my mobile keeps reminding me that I've got to jump out of work for a 5k every day at 11am

Oh of course you've got to pair your watch to the apple wireless bud things

Finally, Apple TV

Tim Stone

Who among us doesn't have an Emmy these days let's be real

badp

now with all of the Ks

Tim Stone

17:42

Only 4 of them, pssh

Unionhawk

@TimStone There's like 500 emmy categories

badp

CINEMATIC QUALITY

ALL 24 FRAMES PER SECOND

SaintWacko

shudder

badp

man I am gutted I missed the Jobs tribute

Unionhawk

Like, did you know that there was "outstanding achievement in interactive media" as an emmy category? Because neither did I but Westworld won it

badp

17:43

oh wow hdr does so many more colours than a gray-scale picture

SaintWacko

omg you guys better pixels!

badp

Finally better screensavers

Let us enjoy 4k content being streamed on a 720p stream or something

SaintWacko

@badp Right?

badp

Stunning

SaintWacko

Maybe it looks better in person

badp

17:46

They have already shown journos 8k displays

How is a journalist supposed to give a fuck

Ok I guess the free upgrade from HD to 4k for purchases is cool

such buy in

SaintWacko

@badp Yeah, that is nice

badp

I'm in a audience in the NL and people are like "wow maybe we're one of those countries"

lol people choose what game to watch based on score and time left

Unionhawk

lolno

badp

That is how real sportsball watchers really do behave in the real world you know?

"My team is playing but this score line speaks to my heart"

fredley

@TimStone May I tweet this?

SaintWacko

17:49

@badp Well if your team's not playing, yeah

At least LadyWacko does

badp

@SaintWacko what

I mean if you're really bored?

SaintWacko

@badp She just really likes college football

Tim Stone

@fredley I mean I just stole it from the Ars liveblog so you do you :P

badp

Oh wow another videogame live stream

this is so wondzzzzzzzzz

fredley

@TimStone Fifteen Million Merits

MadMAxJr

17:52

Apple is showing a game?

Yuuki

Binging with Babish: Szechuan Sauce Revisited (From Real Sample!)

►

2

cc @Unionhawk

badp

Oh man

iPhone this early?

SaintWacko

oh my god the hyperbole

I simultaneously despise and am in awe of the Apple marketing department

They've managed to convince people that they invented the smartphone

quartata

wuh

badp

REVOLUTIONARY, IT'S GOT A THINNER BEZEL

Tim Stone

17:58

It's nice that it's aerospace-grade aluminium though so it'll hold up when you chuck it across a room

badp

We never had the technology before iPhone

It was just not possible

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