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00:50
@Jan @NotWoodward thanks for the explanations. It makes sense, I just haven't had to think in terms of pure chemistry for a long time. If you're reacting chemical A with chemical B in the presence of catalyst C, you want to make sure the molarities match up, and since the same reactant can be used in multiple different reactions at different concentrations, it could be 3.5X in one experiment, and 17.6X in another.
01:20
Ok, I gotta find something to downvote, stat -- my rep is in a really, really bad place...
Jan
Jan
You’re rep’s real good, man =D
Although the leading 6 is off-putting …
user228700
Hi, everyone :-) I have a very quick question;
user228700
Jan
Jan
sp^2
user228700
Isn't that ^ correct?
user228700
01:24
What, how?!
Jan
Jan
Allyl anion.
user228700
It's bonded to 3 atoms and has one l.p so its steric number is 4. Hence, sp^3.
Jan
Jan
But having an sp^2 configuration allows for a pi system with the double bond, because then the lone pair is in a p-orbital.
user228700
Hang on, so how was I supposed to figure that out? .__.
user228700
Um..?
Jan
Jan
01:30
Sorry. To me it’s obvious.
=C
user228700
Was it obvious from the time u started learning this stuff..?
Jan
Jan
No, but I don’t think I had to care back then.
user228700
Ohk.
user228700
01:44
In some compounds, we can make a $\pi$ bond even if the l.p.s are in hybrid orbitals. Is there a neat (as opposed to messy af attempt at drawing it out) way to figure out when this is the case and when the l.p must absolutely be in a $p$ orbital, not the hybrid orbital?
user228700
@koolman: Hey. U around?
@Kaumudi.H hii
user228700
Can u help with this order of stability:
user228700
user228700
(The first one, directly below the heading "General stability order")
02:02
@Kaumudi.H you can see it comparing the resonating structures
user228700
So in general, the resonance effect factors into the stability of a compound more than hyperconjugation does?
@Kaumudi.H yes
user228700
Hmm, OK, thanks!
04:29
@Mart, did SE just tweak the homepage so that the rep of the last-active person is shown along with what they did?
05:13
I think it's always been there.
@hBy2Py Do you mean this?
05:37
Pretty sure ortho is right
06:04
@orthocresol Thank you~ Can't believe I missed that
06:24
Now I just can't grapple why two users decided to ask the same question at once.
06:51
@DSVA Oh, and I'd guess that with methanol, the expected product is the anisole.
Never seen NaCN, it's always CuCN.. and no idea about the Na2SO3/Cu.
 
4 hours later…
10:41
The cresol family is complete. Also @metacresol what your previous username?
 
1 hour later…
11:42
@orthocresol Yeah, that's it. Probably it always has been that way, but for some reason it jumped out at me last night.
I'm not a fan of showing reputation, actually
I kinda like this... usually when a 1 rep user has done something on a highly voted/viewed question, it deserves attention
Oh, oh, that's true.
12:29
you can also see by the fact that you don't really realise it's there that it's something you don't really notice unless you look for it
I notice it and I think it influences votes more than it should. There's always the argument that a high rep user is more likely to provide a good answer but I think that if I can't judge the quality of the answer without looking at who posted it, I shouldn't be voting on it.
12:45
I started to be really picky about answers of high rep users and a lot more lenient about answers from low rep users...
13:13
@Martin-マーチン I see your point; sometimes I think "this user should have known better how this site works". Mainly, however, I am picky when reading highly upvoted and accepted answers (irrespective of the user).
 
2 hours later…
15:27
In the jungle, the mighty jungle, the meta feed sleeps tonight …
@Martin-マーチン Yes, either lots of good attention, or lots of bad attention.
@Martin-マーチン There's more than one 'subjective axis' to evaluate an answer on, though. There's "familiarity with site practices," there's "level of education/knowledge of the poster," there's "scientific accuracy of the post, on whatever level of knowledge," ... (@Loong)
Unrelated, @Mart / @Loong (/ @ortho): is there any exposition of how the different flags work "under the hood"?
Looking at this Meta.Math post:
14
A: Should gibberish posts be flagged as abusive or just downvoted and deleted?

arjafiRegardless of any "official stance", I feel that the most important point to keep in mind when faced with these posts is given in Shog9's linked answer The important thing to remember here is that when the post clearly means nothing, you shouldn't be wasting too much thought trying to deciphe...

@hBy2Py I quite agree.
It quotes a Shog9 post elsewhere about a motive for choosing "rude or abusive" because enough of those will autohammer the post.
Is there anywhere I can read up on the different ways the site handles the different types of flags?
15:37
Like this?
229
Q: What are the “spam” and “rude or abusive” (offensive) flags, and how do they work?

KipWhen flagging, there are two special case options: spam and rude or abusive. What is spam, and when should I flag content as such? What is considered offensive, rude or abusive content? How does the spam flag differ from the rude or abusive flag? What is the effect of these special flags? When ...

but we're human, so we are part of the problem ;)
Or is this something hidden behind the veil except for 10k+ users / mods
@Loong Yep, exactly -- just for all the different kinds?
Incidentally, you guys should probably stop answering these questions of mine right away, and instead say "Stop bothering me and go search".
It's so much easier to ask than to figure out a search...
meh.
when you have a living dictionary, there is no reason to use the index anymore
@Martin-マーチン As long as it's not onerous for you to find them.
I don't want to just transfer my search effort over to you.
Teach a man to fish and all that.
That's actually a quite useful application for chat; and searching Stack Exchange can be frustrating.
15:40
you've learned the power of delegation
well there are a couple of topics that come up with some frequency, so you know the answer... in other cases, i would sent you away ;)
@pentavalentcarbon One can only honorably delegate when one is in a sufficient/appropriate position of authority for it.
btw why do I feel like I owe you something?
Did I promise to send you some results or something?
@pentavalentcarbon Still waiting on your h5cube compression timings.
Mine are all updated with idle CPU times.
aaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhh
15:45
Trends make a lot more sense
it won't take long so I should just get it over with tonight, otherwise I'll keep making excuses
I did a quick (loaded-CPU) check of decompression -- h5cube is really bad cf. gzip and bzip2.
Which version should I use, latest GitHub or PyPI?
pip install h5cube
should be v0.3
15:47
@hBy2Py Makes sense, though - RLE decompress is bound to be gobs faster, whereas h5cube has to actually think about all the numbers.
What's RLE?
I spent a bit of time optimizing, though... the version at the tail of v.decomp-speed is > 3x faster.
@pentavalentcarbon 'run-length encoding'
Pretty sure that's what gzip and bzip2 are?
Ah, no
They're more advanced than RLE
Ok. I don't know much about compression implementations.
Which cube file should I use?
The one that I used the first time, model.spindens.cube?
<nod>, I don't have a preference
Just something pretty big, at least 150^3, probably
Ok, if I didn't send it to you I can, it's 43 MB uncompressed, and I think mine tend to be 120^3?
15:51
Send me an .h5cube, compressed with default parameters. :-)
Should be down around 8MB.
-rw-r--r-- 1 eric users  43M Aug 24 20:18 model.spindens.cube
-rw-r----- 1 eric users  13M Dec 12  2013 model.spindens.cube.gz
-rw-r--r-- 1 eric users  15M Aug 24 20:12 model.spindens.cube.tar.gz
-rw-r--r-- 1 eric users 8.5M Aug 24 20:17 model.spindens.h5cube
-rw-r----- 1 eric users  46M Dec 12  2013 model.spindens.orig.cube
How did you know?
~5.5x filesize compression on my 250^3 test case with default params.
Assumed similar performance.
Neat. Can you post the link to the spreadsheet one more time so I don't have to go back through chat history?
@hBy2Py It's up here.
d'oh thanks
15:54
I slipped the link in with an edit.
Ok. If you don't mind, I'll make a duplicate of this first sheet and modify that directly.
Sure, I'll give you edit permissions....
wait
I just saw that
I can make my own, it's fine
No, I don't mind you editing - just want to be able to share it w/o random people editing
Do you access GDocs through your Pitt email?
If not, email me from whatever address you use.
too many damn accounts...
ok
15:57
Always
Invite should be on its way
@pentavalentcarbon Interesting that tar adds 2MB to the filesize.
I can't remember what the deal is with that
Makes sense, though -- since it's a single file already, the tarball is just overhead.
I am also perpetually annoyed by this Google Drive sign-out garbage
16:03
Tarball helps with multiple files, especially lots of tiny files; not much on already-monolithic ones.
@pentavalentcarbon Yeah... I really don't like that I can't sign out only one G account. Have to sign everything out, then log back in on the ones you want.
I think Google Drive is terrible for almost everything but there aren't good alternatives
From what I've seen, the simultaneous editing is pretty flawless, and the interface is about as clean and fast as one could expect for content-rich documents.
I've had interactive chats with other people before in spreadsheet cells
But the handling of other files leaves much to be desired
And no Linux client.
Still better than Box and Office 365, which is what we have at school.
@pentavalentcarbon ? You mean other than just direct-browser editing?
No Google Drive desktop sync client is what I mean.
So, you can store "normal" files in your Drive if you so choose, like Dropbox or Box or OneDrive.
16:11
@pentavalentcarbon Ahhh, gotcha.
<nod>, I've never used it that way. Leery about installing direct-system-access cloud clients.
You're probably right to be, but I've got so many stupid computers and files and it's just UGGHHHHHH
the organic chemists would never understand
@pentavalentcarbon Agreed, the convenience factor may start to overweigh the security concerns for me, before much longer
Am getting close to that point w.r.t. getting a smartphone.
I probably mentioned already that I miss not having one despite all the "convenience".
It's another place for stuff to collect and email to appear that you don't want to read...
@pentavalentcarbon I would try to hold out on setting it up to get email.
There's a conference I go to every year... the updated session info is only available on the meeting app.
So, w/o a smartphone, I'm blind
Directions and traffic are the other big thing.
Good points.
16:20
Other than that, I'd primarily want to just keep using it for calls and texting... I'm sure my usage'd creep, though.
Having the calendar and reminders/todos sync is very nice.
@pentavalentcarbon <nod>, could see that. Having everything in Outlook on my work computer is usually good enough for me, though.
I travel so little. And, when I do, I'm usually at a meeting where I'm fully occupied there and any calendar events are non-time-critical.
Ah. I guess I use calendars for home + other stuff in addition to school/work.
Same for todos and reminders.
The few home reminders I need I just use GCal for.
I keep a daily backup of my Outlook .pst files on my thumbdrive I carry around -- if I need to check my work events, I just pull it over to our laptop.
Ok, maybe we need to drag you into the 21st century.
16:30
I am very proud to be a late adopter, thank you. ;-)
Jan
Jan
I realise I’ve started downvoting a lot more since the meta call to vote o.o' Is that a bad thing?
@Jan Not if the technical content of the posts is poor.
Actually, I think we need more downvoting and less VTC-ing.
"low quality post" flag does not mean "wrong"
it means "poorly written; unreadable" (or similar)
^
The ideal action is to edit, of course.
@orthocresol But that's only possible when there's enough of a germ of the poster's idea to actually work with.
Jan
Jan
Oh, with quite a few new posts I see, downvote and VTC.
16:37
On my part if I close something I don't bother downvoting. I know that I said that it's a good idea to do so so obviously I haven't been following my own advice.
@Jan The more I see, the more I think that the two actions should often not be taken simultaneously.
Up/down votes are an expression of one's opinion of the technical content/value of the post.
VsTC are an expression of one's opinion of the non-technical content/value of the post
(save for duplicates and off-topic)
@orthocresol What is the official SO stance?
Don't think there's one.
Jan
Jan
> Veni, vidi, suffraga fermandi, suffraga deorsum.
(Pretty sure that’s terribly wrong Latin but I tried.)
I came, I saw, suffragettes ferment, suffragettes dory?
I think the suffragettes would take umbrage at your translation, @ortho
@orthocresol Quick search of meta.SE doesn't turn up much that seems directly relevant.
Jan
Jan
16:41
I’ll admit I didn’t look up to close
I figured suffraga meant vote, and one of them was downvote
Jan
Jan
Should be meaning I voted (past tense)
Jan
Jan
However, I’m utterly confused why veni, vidi, vici looks like that but the Wiktionary declension table told me to have an a at the end of that one ô.o
@Loong Monty Python → Insta-star
@hBy2Py Yes. I think for the most part, voting behaviour is left to the user to decide.
which is why I feel that I might have messed up that meta post a bit, by specifying how to vote.
16:46
@Jan The -i is the perfect tense verb ending.
suffraga is probably a noun, 'vote'
fermandi is more likely the past-tense verb
deorsum is what bothers me...
Might be some goofy supine construction or something.
Jan
Jan
That was a translation of down on Wiktionary ;)
hehehe
Jan
Jan
suffragavi would have been my verb form of choice, then.
Completely misread that table O:)
Well, never had Latin is my excuse ^^
@Jan I took three years in high school -- all that's left in memory is a general sense of what endings have what grammatical meaning. Vocab is gone.
@orthocresol And as long as the users differentiate the good and the bad posts, it doesn't really matter if they use upvotes, downvotes, or both. Of course, using both kinds gives a stronger signal.
Jan
Jan
16:52
@Loong Ah good, so I can treat good posts with downvotes and vice-versa. Brb reversing all my votes =)
I must say, I've gotten lazy with voting again.
@orthocresol I've tried to stay in the mindset that if I find a question worth reading all the way through, then it's worth an upvote.
For answers, they have to add something new to the content of the overall 'discussion'.
Any answers duplicating content in others that pre-existed them, generally don't get my vote.
1
Q: Enable automatic line-breaking for SVG output

LoongThe MathJax configuration for the HTML–CSS output processor includes the option linebreaks: { automatic:true }. When using this output processor (right-click on any MathJax formula → Math Settings → Math Renderer → HTML-CSS), long display-style formulas look like this: However, this option is ...

If I click on a question I don't close the tab without either voting or leaving a comment.
You are a mod now, @ortho
There's some sense to that.
16:55
I feel like I can't figure out how to phrase that.
Yes, it is a side effect of moderation :p
Jan
Jan
@pentavalentcarbon I click on too many meh questions that aren’t bad enough even for my new quick-to-trigger downvote reaction .__.
@Jan Your correlation coefficient shouldn't be negative.
3
@Jan Yes. Same. I click on lots of questions, if it's not egregiously bad, I just move on.
I often find it hard to disentangle "this is a poor question" from "this is a good question asked by someone who is just learning chemistry"
@Jan I find I don't want to downvote everything, which I why I started commenting.
But I haven't been on much lately, too busy.
Lost my 96-day streak to get Fanatic :<
16:58
Commenting or editing is always much better than a silent vote
@pentavalentcarbon UGH.
That's with a daily iCloud-synced reminder to visit the site.
Jan
Jan
@pentavalentcarbon I tried to get fanatic on meta, and although I’m practically positive that I was online on all of those days there are ‘days missing’ D=
Probably the best way is to leave a tab open to Chem.SE and Meta.Chem.SE on every computer you use?
I do, but if you don't refresh them...
17:00
Dunno how active the site interaction has to be in order for it to work... ah.
Jan
Jan
But I shut down computers when I leave them …
It’s practically a click or two that’s enough.
hmm, my work desktop's only be on for 5 days, usually I go a whole month between reboots
15
Q: Interaction with the site on the app should count towards Enthusiast/Fanatic

MakotoIf I do any of the below, which would normally constitute "activity" on any Stack Exchange site (including mobile): View my profile Vote on any question or comment Visit one or more questions ...then Stack Exchange considers me to have "visited" the site. If I do any of the below on the mobi...

1 hour ago, by Loong
That's actually a quite useful application for chat; and searching Stack Exchange can be frustrating.
Maybe it just wasn't meant to be.
Like how I'll never get a 300 in bowling or play music in tune.
@pentavalentcarbon I fell a few days short of Fanatic on Math.SE (I was in a compulsive badge mood, ok? stop judging!)
It was really demoralizing.
17:08
¯_(ツ)_/¯
Yeah, it actually does kind of suck, but...nothing I can do about it.
@orthocresol got my Oxford interviews tomorrow !
@MichaelHarding All the best!
Thank you
Any last minute advice?! Ahaha
@pentavalentcarbon Really annoying how you have to escape the backslash there.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Jan
Jan
17:11
@ortho I was about to edit that post! D=
I'm sorry. I've said this too many times to various people, but SE really should have something to deal with concurrent edits.
@hBy2Py GAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
@orthocresol Doesn't it disable the edit button if someone is currently editing a post?
I didn't realize that was the problem
(at least sometimes?)
17:13
no, it doesn't
@MichaelHarding Hmm... not really.
Don't sweat it.
@orthocresol From what I've gathered up until now, they're not as bothered if you get the occasional thing wrong - it's literally to see if you're teachable in a tutorial
Term's finished now hasn't it?
Yup. That's right. And yes, it's vacation now
Jan
Jan
Thankfully, you left me some stuff to correct =D
Oh, I only removed the caret in the title, which was irritating me.
Between reading four NMR books and typing group theory tables, I don't have much time left for real edits.
(and playing games)
Jan
Jan
17:17
How do you read four books; a line each?
About right. I pretend that I'm reading four books to make myself feel more productive.
6
Jan
Jan
Much like I was pretending to do my acknowledgements today.
@orthocresol My bedside table has at least five books on it, along with a small pile of journal articles. A desk across the room has a stack of magazines and JOM issues that I need to get to.
Jan
Jan
But at least I went through Loong's corrections, discarding some and incorporating others.
I asked for an expensive textbook last Christmas that I still haven't opened
Jan
Jan
17:21
Just say it's expensive enough to be two Christmases worth of a present. (Maybe adding in a birthday in-between.)
There have been a lot of books I've bought that, turns out, I was more excited about the prospect of owning, rather than actually reading.
I probably won't open it until after I graduate, then I'll have time...
Jan
Jan
Isn't that the purpose of books? Put them on a shelf so you look intelligent and can fish for compliments?
5
@hBy2Py I fell into the same trap. As I soon discovered, when you have to shift stuff 10911.35 km across the world, owning books is not that great a thing...
@Jan AHHH! Well, that explains my taste for ones with the old-fashioned covers and gold-embossed spines!
2
@orthocresol Mmph. Indeed.
Jan
Jan
17:25
Also I personally feel that they look beautiful. Much like figurines. Another sset of pointless things just there for the looks.
Having them just sit there makes me feel stupid though. "I'd be smarter, if only I ever opened you!"
I have some hope I'll eventually read parts of some of them, at whatever point my active pursuits swing back in their direction.
Jan
Jan
Just open a random one each Sunday; problem solved.
e.g., my full set of Herzbergs should be handy if/when I ever get opan fully functioning.
Jan
Jan
I should get a job as consultant …
17:27
I tend to read my RSS feed on Sunday since I don't do it during the week...
etc.
Jan
Jan
=D I knew it was a good idea. Unfortunately, many people have had the good ideas before me … Like these guys:
Also, I’m off. I’m going to pretend I’m thinking about my acknowledgements in the sauna o/
I'm going to pretend to sleep.
Going to pretend to each lunch.
17:32
Going to pretend to get to work.
cue Loong changing the room name
 
3 hours later…
20:25
@hBy2Py How did you decide on the format of your commit messages? I need a best practices or something just to read what other people think.
20:46
@pentavalentcarbon Worked my way into it over time.
Good enough for me.
The all-caps leader on the first line is always one of a small number of codes I have in my head
The rest of the first line is usually pretty useless.
Everything else is just a bulleted list under each of the all-caps categories from the first line
Ultimately, it shows up nicely on GitHub. :-P
That's because the "enforced" limit of ~70 characters sucks (for the summary line).
So that's basically what I already do, ok.
@pentavalentcarbon <nod>
Thus, I try to stick to
CATEGORY/OF/CHANGE: Location of change(s)

CATEGORY:

 * Thing one
 * Thing two

etc.
 
2 hours later…
Jan
Jan
22:25
> cue Loong changing pretending to change the room name
Fixed that for you ;D
Oh yes I'm the great pretender
Pretending I'm doing well
My need is such I pretend too much
I'm lonely but no one can tell
Jan
Jan
Queen @Loong henceforth, is it?
@Loong Stop pretending that you're pretending :D
@Jan Yeah, I was thinking about the Freddie Mercury version; however, the song is much older.
Jan
Jan
I’m not even old enough to remember the Queen version, so … ^^'
22:33
Probably not as groundbreaking as the I Want To Break Free video.
Jan
Jan
25
Q: Is there a downside to going multiple days without sleeping?

Leon7CWhile adventuring and completing side quests, I'd realized I'd gone days without stopping to rest and cashing in my experience (thanks to those nighttime hunts). My party has started complaining of being tired and looking forward to a good night's rest. Are their conversations just flavor or are ...

Hands up if you thought this was about gaming around the clock. o/
23:20
@Jan I initially thought that the question was about keeping awake real human players. Now I know that they are not. The amount of detail in games these days is amazing.
Jan
Jan
@QuantumAMERICCINO Exactly what I had been thinking when reading the title. And then I was like ‘wait …’
What games do you play @Jan?
or used to?
Jan
Jan
All those that I don’t have time for thanks to choosing chemistry =C Like I love JRPGs especially the PS and SFC Final Fantasies and I also rather enjoy the extremely-long-duration economy or monarchy simulators (Settlers II =D). And then some more random, shorter platformers, the odd Zelda game, Action52 (Mega Drive version; deserves a special mention), …
Gotta point out that this is a great game!
25 minutes left to gain 10 rep to be half-epic o.o *holding my horses*
23:37
The epic hlorohydrin badge?
Jan
Jan
That was an intermediate en route to ripostatine, not to my molecule though ;)
Jan
Jan
23:59
Looks like today’s not my lucky day =C

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