The Periodic Table

Cohen_the_Librarian

03:09

Hi guys, I've never posted in chat before, so I don't know if I'm doing this right. Anyway, recently a Cahn TG-171 Thermogravimetric Analyzer was donated to my school. We did not get a service or user's manual with it, and some of it still needs to be put back together. The manufacturing company was sold to Thermo Fisher, who do not have the manuals.

Any sort of information on the setup of this instrument would be appreciated. However, diagrams or pictures would be ideal.

4

Martin

06:00

@MARamezani It might be true, that a single user can be the reason for a suspension, but that usually is just a very short time frame, like a week or so. I believe in this case, there was much more going on. Of course the procedure is based on confidentiality, otherwise the system would collapse.

@ron Are you talking about

4

Q: Why does cyclopropane give bromine water test?

This question was in my exam and all I could tell was that it is related to high angle strain as the angle is $60^\circ$ in stead of required $109.5^\circ$. No book I have read mentions this. Also, what is the product formed?

@ron I think we both were a little too absorbed in our own theory, I was very new to the site, too. There is no need to apologize at all - I think I handled it not in a very nice way, too. But that's water under the bridge.

@ron I like it, how you spark new thought processes, usually coming from a complete other point of view, which is very interesting, as it broadens my perception.

I also have to admit, that I did not handle all discussions very well, especially in the beginnings. I might have come off rude or unfriendly to a lot of people. I think @MARamezani is right, we all have our bad days, our human days ;)

@Cohen_the_Librarian I really hope you get lucky, I'll star it, so that it shows up on the right column, maybe @MARamezani could pin it for a week or so... chat is surprisingly busy the last couple of weeks...

@ron @Nicolau @MARamezani I heard the story of the mathematics Nobel prize, which always made me chuckle, but I think it is just a nice little anecdote.

I would regard math as a tool for real sciences anyway ;)

MARamezani

06:53

Ahh! It's nice to start a day with seeing four messages from @Martin!

@Martin He seems very very hostile there! :}

@Martin Now I'm imagining your clash of titans...

@Martin And the other days we aren't human?

Martin

@MARamezani No ;)

MARamezani

What are we?

Chemicals?

Martin

Robots ;)

Functional machines

MARamezani

I'm a chair cyclohexane, even in my human days.

Martin

Batteries

like in the matrix

MARamezani

06:58

@Martin Oh! Let's go duck some bullets!

Martin

I like my cyclohexane with a twist ;)

MARamezani

And extra chocolate.

BTW @Mar I finally managed to set up my LaTeX compiler.

I installed TeXmaker though.

Martin

I thought I read you use overleaf...

well, congratz

MARamezani

It seems like TeXnicCenter and TeXmaker are two major thingies for windows users.

Martin

happy learning!

MARamezani

07:01

@Martin I do.

Martin

Yes i guess so

MARamezani

I always attempt to have anything offline too.

Internet isn't very reliable here.

Martin

as i said, i am a little purist, still typing every command my hand

MARamezani

@Martin Ooooof!

Martin

I understand...

Are you nerd enough to check into linux?

MARamezani

07:03

@Martin Oh, done! Pinned Cohen's message.

@Martin Well, linux isn't popular here.

Martin

@MARamezani *Two enthusiastically raised thumbs*

MARamezani

In fact, I don't know where I should go to get a linux.

Martin

@MARamezani Then make it ;)

MARamezani

Not that much of a nerd.

I'm learning programming.

Martin

Do you have an old computer around?

MARamezani

07:04

I'll tear MicroSoft apart.

@Martin Yes.

Martin

lol

Does it have an dvd drive?

MARamezani

@Martin Yes, kinda.

It has a place for floppy disks too.

Martin

LOOOOL

MARamezani

I now wonder if it turns on.

Martin

You can play around with that... just download a slim distribution like xubuntu.org and get started...

MARamezani

07:06

Ubuntu reminds me of Klaus.

Martin

I have a netbook, that i take on travels... it can't do a lot, but it's a nice typewriter... it does latex :D

Yes he used the "real" one

i guess he still uses the real one

MARamezani

Now I wanna make some fancy in-your-face stylish doc with LaTeX and throw it at my classmates' face.

Oooh!

Martin

Haha... good luck with that

MARamezani

Now Phillip, Jonsca, Ben and you have those shiny pundits.

@Martin I'm gonna make 45*45 tables.

Martin

I was very surprised, that i was the first to earn it

MARamezani

07:10

@Martin I was surprised too...No, not really.

You always make too much sense.

Martin

Well, thanks

hi @Freddy!

Freddy

Hola

MARamezani

Hullo Nightmare on the Elm Street!

Martin

brb, have to copy some things...

MARamezani

Later!

Freddy

07:12

2

A: Reduction of acids with borane

What is the mechanism of the reduction of organic acids with borane? Source: Henry Rzepa. Chemistry with a twist. Mechanism of the reduction of a carboxylic acid by borane: revisited and revised. October 16th, 2011. http://www.ch.imperial.ac.uk/rzepa/blog/?p=5114 DOI: 10.15200/winn.142795....

I don't know what's wrong with this

@Martin Bye

MARamezani

@Freddy I know.

It's gonna earn a bounty with the next upvote.

Sheesh!

I can't believe how confusing an ester and carboxilic acid's differences can be!

Freddy

I know it is as confusing as 2 downvotes

MARamezani

@Freddy Let me downvote that to add to confusion...

Freddy

@MARamezani I thought you were smart kid who can understand that. But my bad

;)

MARamezani

@Freddy But you've just shown the mechanism for an ester, so I'm 50-50 on upvoting.

It could be a little bit different from an acid.

Freddy

07:20

I tried for that but could't find it out! @MARamezani

MARamezani

@Freddy BTW, since you're an ELLer, find out != find

Unless,

you were really going to figure out the mechanism yourself.

Freddy

@MARamezani Do you really think I could make that mechanism myself? :(

MARamezani

@Freddy I meant that find out means to figure out the mechanism, not find it in the internet or so.

Freddy

@MARamezani I think we will be continuing it later. I want to discuss that mechanism more. But I need to go for lunch! :)

bye

MARamezani

Bye! And don't be that sad!

Freddy

07:29

Ups that was typo

MARamezani

Good!

Martin

@Freddy I can't tell why some people are confused by what you have posted. I think it is a good answer.

MARamezani

@Martin He showed the mechanism for an ester, not an organic acid.

Martin

It's the same mechanism...

MARamezani

@Martin In our meta's sandbox Klaus added a new answer.

@Martin Really? I didn't look at any of them.

As I was saying, @Klaus' taste of colors is awesome.

Martin

07:41

Lol... I saw that already, it's quite old....

I am still puzzled why blue does not work...

MARamezani

It's a conspiracy...

Hullo @santiago @MadScientist!

santiago

hiya!

MARamezani

How's your phisio something going?

santiago

very nicely!

how are ou?

MARamezani

Fine!

I'm trying to learn TeX, and TeX's trying to learn me, respectively.

Life is just as normal as it gets.

santiago

07:45

awesome! I see there has been some drama - thankfully that is over

MARamezani

Drama?

santiago

lol

Martin

muharrharr

MARamezani

This was a test to determine your skin color. Thanks for participating

santiago

lmao

MARamezani

07:51

@Martin BTW it's spring!

Martin

Yeah, it's getting hot

MARamezani

You promised you'll look less angry when spring comes.

santiago

it's autumn here

MARamezani

@santiago Exceptions not included.

Martin

The three seasons of Japan: cold rain, warm rain, awfully hot and humid

MARamezani

07:52

@Martin That is a very monumental affection display of Japan's weather.

-2

Q: Effect of hybridization on the dipole moment

Please explain the answer too. Thank you.

organic-chemistry homework dipole

Now I wanna go edit that post to:

> I DIDN'T TEIK NY SCEINCE CLASS. PLZZZZ HALP TNX BAI.

Dang!

@santiago has 135 suggested edits!

santiago

am a perfectionist

MARamezani

But I have 160 suggested edits.

santiago

catching up...

MARamezani

Of course, after 1k, there was no suggesting edits. My edits were applied immediately.

santiago

37 to go..

MARamezani

07:59

You can't reach me even if you want to.

Each edit is 2 reps.

santiago

have to write some more answers

MARamezani

You'll be having like 20 edits and then boom...You can apply them yourself.

Unless,

The site graduates.

santiago

true

bwahahaha

I am astounded by the arrogance of some who seem to think that we are here just waiting to pander to students too lazy to stretch their minds to complete their homework. — santiago 8 mins ago

MARamezani

Ahh! So I need to do some TeXing...

@santiago Very inspirational!

santiago

these homework leeches annoy me

MARamezani

08:06

They annoy everybody.

Including me, me, me, and me.

Martin

@MARamezani You forgot $\Huge\ce{Me!}$

MARamezani

Shtoopid me!

Martin

@MARamezani It is my personal experience...

MARamezani

08:42

@Martin BTW you used \ce! You mean I forgot methyl?

Martin

Good catch

i thought about that pun ;)

MARamezani

2

Q: Do only outer electron shells take part in forming chemical bonds?

Do only outer electron shells take part in forming chemical bonds? Or could an inner shell create a bond under some conditions?

physical-chemistry

Nice Q!

@Martin ya know the answer?

Martin

Haha... vtc... primarily opinion based ;)

What are electron shells

what are inner shells...

ohhhh better vtc too broad ;)

MARamezani

What are outer shells?

What is an electron?

What is a bond?

What is a question?

Martin

I suspect in some cases there would be contributions to chemical bonding from the inner shalls

MARamezani

08:49

What is the universe?

Martin

I question the use of questions to find answers.

MARamezani

@Martin Listening...

@Martin No you can't. That's Ben.

Martin

I have no fundamental solution to this

core orbitals do somewhat influence the valence orbitals, at least the closer ones.

just think relativistic effects

MARamezani

@Martin It was Jonsca actually.

@Martin Ah...So this becomes a Phillip question.

Oh, and his eigenvalues...

Martin

maybe...

MARamezani

08:54

@Martin Hmm... Is \fbox supported? To the sandbox!

It's supported!

Yay!

Now I'm gonna fill my answers with rectangles!

Martin

Be aware that fbox switches to textmode

MARamezani

Good point.

$\fbox{Good point}$

Martin

and i don't like boxes... if they don't add value to the solution i will remove them

MARamezani

You don't like MathJax abuse...I get it.

So I

will make sure I abuse it.

When you're not around.

Martin

$\bbox[red]{r^2d_2}\fbox{says no!}$

MARamezani

09:10

Who's that?

@Martin Hmm, which package does \bbox use?

Martin

I don't know.

found it in mathjax manual docs.mathjax.org/en/latest/tex.html#bbox

santiago

10:49

hmmm that's 2 of my questions that have been downvoted, quite random... ah well - looks like the random downvoter has struck again - lol

lol, the question that just got downvoted, was upvoted a short while later... so I am ahead by +3 rep...lol

Gowtham

the one you accepted just now ?

user223679

11:27

Why was @ADG suspended?

Just for starring messages?

Gowtham

only he knows , we can only speculate..

user223679

But he isn't suspended from chat, rather from Chemistry Stack Exchange. Doesn't make sense. Anyway, hello @Gowtham

Gowtham

@user223679 It was probably that + his comments in chat , again mere speculation..

user223679

You did give JEE right? @Gowtham

Gowtham

@user223679 hullo, ya dunno about how that works

@user223679 ya like 7 years ago ! dint qualify, my math too poor

user223679

11:32

What was it back then? iit-jee and AIEEE? @Gowtham

Gowtham

I just studied physics under my sister's colleague who was from KOTA. yes IIT JEE and aieee

NIT Trichy is an awesome place , so never tried to give jee again

user223679

And entry to NIT was based on? AIEEE?

Gowtham

@user223679 yes , jee and aieee were separate and had separate ranks too, aieee had a state and national rank too

user223679

How much did you score to get in Trichy?

ADG

this message is just to unping myself.

Gowtham

11:39

i dont remember my score , got 406 state and 16206 AIR... i dont even remember what was total marks lol !! i remember attending 66 Q's

user223679

Okay. Which branch did you get? @Gowtham

@ADG What do you mean by that?

ADG

just ignore.

Gowtham

i got ICE, meta, civil , production

i went with meta, needed quota for Mech, couldnt get it ,

ADG

embibe.com/100marks/News/jee-advanced-marks-vs-ranks

i get around 276

at average

user223679

Needed quota? @Gowtham

@ADG You can go to sleep then.

ADG

11:48

@user223679 in the sens? I can't get it.

user223679

You don't need to study anymore :)

ADG

@user223679 I wish for 300+

user223679

Okay. Then leave this chat and get back to studying.

Gowtham

@user223679 If i could have gotten OBC certi , i might have gotten mechanical. but couldnt get due to the bureaucracy here.

user223679

Are you happy with what you got? Or you wanted to go into CS or EE but couldn't make it? @Gowtham

ADG

11:51

@user223679 I'm "thak gaya" gave a 6 hrs test today

user223679

@ADG Were you suspended for starring?

Gowtham

@user223679 meh , I only wanted either mech or meta, so happy with myself..

ADG

@user223679 I wish not disclose since the message is improper to me, anyways i didn't cared so I put everything aside.

@Gowtham meta=meta.stackexchange.com

Gowtham

metallurgy, since we are discussing branches

ADG

@Gowtham I hate meta, then (not forming an opinion after you, already had it)

Gowtham

11:55

well metallurgy is pretty boring, material science on the other hand is the field of today and tomorrow

ADG

well i can say one thing, if i didn;t got Cs then my life ends there only.

user223679

Why? @ADG

Gowtham

what O.o you can always study CS in something other than IITs and still learn anything you wish to:P

user223679

Btw, you can get CS in a new IIT too.

ADG

well i wish to not waste my time with so,ething i'm not interseted in.

and i really want to have it.

it's my life and i get it only once, what would i do later, if i repented my mistake?

Gowtham

12:02

what languages have you learnt , try to keep an open mind .. i was like this when i was in 12th, I wanted aerospace /astrophysics .. but ended up in meta/matsci.. now i am doing masters in aerospace with a material science background.

Life needn't be black or white, some friends at college were doing mech/ece but were so good at programming/web designing better than many CS fellows.. So just try to have a open mind ..

user223679

Good advice @Gowtham

@ADG Do you do coaching?

ADG

@Gowtham i disagree

@user223679 stick to a single chat

well, yes

user223679

Where? @ADG

@ADG The discussion topics are different.

ADG

@user223679 nvm such things, aFAIk it's nothing binding

user223679

I don't get you @ADG

ADG

12:10

kuch farak ni padega, jitna main janta hun ispe koi rok nahi hai hai

user223679

So are you saying it doesn't matter whether one does some sort of coaching for JEE or not? @ADG

ADG

no it doesn't matter what you chat in chat (unless inappropiate)

@Gowtham explain him (You're better at)

user223679

Okay. Got it.

So where do you go for coaching? Or you don't. @ADG

ADG

allen

user223679

Hello @Mistergrave

ADG

12:17

@Mistergrave ?? unusual name ??

@Martin hello. have something to say? reading transcript?

user223679

@ADG Was I correct over there?

@ADG About those methods of solving?

Martin

I was just reading the last bits, but i don't have anything to add

ADG

@user223679 plz forget those methods because sometimes your mind works not properly and gives you very tedious ideas , example to solve $x+1=3$, you can solve it, but think that I wish to square both sides, isnt that be stupid, see that was what happened.

user223679

Ya but just so that I know something more about these stuff, can you just tell me whether they are the same or not?

ADG

@Martin since you have complete your edu, are you only researching? do you have a job.

@user223679 no, not same

Martin

12:28

I am doing a post doc right now

user223679

Which ones are same? Or are all 4 of them different?

ADG

@Martin when is it expected to end ? what are your future plans? are you comfortable asking my such questions?

@user223679 all are different.

user223679

Okay. And the best method is partial fractions? @ADG

ADG

@user223679 yes

woul dyou mind telling more about you @user223679

user223679

Thanks!

Martin

12:30

Well you can ask, but I cannot give a definite answer... that's how research works, you never know what's next.

Currently I plan to go somewhere else by the end of the year

or beginning of next

user223679

I am studying for JEE-ADV and I am not doing any coaching and I like Physics more than the other two subjects.

What are you researching about right now? @Martin

ADG

@Martin maybe why cyclopropane reacts with Br2/H2O :D

Martin

I am doing catalysis design with computational chemistry

it's tedious...

ADG

I suddenly began unhappy, got 25 rank with 244 marks in my class.

Martin

too many unanswered questions

ADG

12:34

@Martin sounds intersting use of computer

@Martin you kknow i can't answer and my answer aren't good?

Martin

computational chemistry is the applied theoretical chemistry

@ADG what do you mean?

ADG

@Martin nvm, ok comp. means some kind of calculation.

Martin

ok... yes, it's all about using software

i used that for quite a lot of answers

user223679

@ADG But 244 is a good score.

ADG

@user223679 i usually got 10-15 ranks. my rank has dropped.

maybe because i started to participate in stackexchange.

I'm not happy with 25

user223679

12:38

Yes. That might be the reason.

Gowtham

@Martin which software do you use?

ADG

@Gowtham are you serious here, he's a PostDoc Fellow :D

Gowtham

? I am just asking what software he uses O.o what there to be serious or funny about that...

I had a course on atomistic simulation myself , so just curious

ADG

@Gowtham because that would not be sucha common one and it would be very specific, anyways nvm

Martin

@Gowtham Gaussian 09 mostly

I liked turbomole better, but we don't have it here

I have to learn molcas, but it's quite complicated.

Maybe even gamess and molpro...

ADG

12:43

that's a lot

Gowtham

hmm ok , i used Materialstudio and reaxfff, have come across gaussian in lecttures, not about others..

Martin

Sometimes I can use AIMAll for analysis, but it's difficult because we only have one license

@Gowtham I see, molecular dynamics mostly, if i recall correctly

gaussian is probably the easiest to use and it is also the most common, so it's good to know

ADG

well does it stimulate a real life atoms?

Gowtham

no only virtual :P

ADG

can you create a virtual world in that

Martin

12:46

@ADG It depends what you want it apply on

ADG

@Martin I found two new plagiarised contents.

user223679

good bye guys

ADG

@user223679 GB

Martin

systems you can treat with programs have to be rather small

ADG

then it's pretty boring :(

Martin

12:47

@user223679 see you

the interesting things are all small

big chemistry is boring chemistry

Alrighty... time to get some food... see y'all later

ADG

14:07

@Loong seems like you've gone on an editing spree, :D

kram1032

14:25

So this probably isn't exactly a question you should ask on Stack Exchange itself - it's kind of trivia (Albeit trivia I actually need for an actual application right now). Thus I feel like it's probably better asked in the chatroom:

Gowtham

@kram1032 whatsup

kram1032

Given some triklinic crystal, what's the largest discrepancy actually found in nature between the lenghts of the three vectors of the unit cell

hi Gowtham

Gowtham

well i cant tell on the back of my head , but i will look and tell you if i found something

kram1032

(In my current implementation, I'm assuming that the shortest vector can be a 20th of the longest one. I'm not sure how realistic that is but I feel like it's an estimate on the conservative side)

thanks @Gowtham, that's nice

the shorter I can push it the better but if it's too short, I'll just exclude possible configurations

(I'm tasked to use a genetic algorithm to determine shapes of crystals given some potential function, but sometimes the unit-cell of an arbitrary set of vectors can become ridiculously skewed which likely isn't realistic)

(thus I'd like to weed out some insane cases so I don't have to evaluate them at all)

MARamezani

15:43

@santiago lol - even downvotes make you lol, lol!

@user223679 It's been discussed in meta.SE that a user suspension doesn't ban them from using the chat.

Gowtham

@kram1032 Found this . I suspect the factor can be 20, it could be 2 to 3 or maybe 5 .. but i think if you can look at all the data there , you will have your answer !

MARamezani

@Gowtham Hullo!

How's everything doing?

Gowtham

hi, had dinner , just reading stuff

MARamezani

I came back from the Gym, more dead than alive...

Gowtham

ha, I have never gone to a gym , I am probably too underweight and thin

MARamezani

15:48

@Martin Publishing...

@Gowtham Really?

Do you know your BMI rating?

I wanna compare you to my skinny friend

Gowtham

I am just kidding , but i am not that underweight, just skinny and not interested in gym, i like outdoor games and see it as fitness training

MARamezani

Well, I, more precisely was at the Kung fu temple. (Yes, we call it a temple)

Gowtham

hmm i thought i was 19-20 , but i maybe 18.5 or lesser ..

MARamezani

Heh. Not that underweight. My friend's BMI is 17.3.

Also, he almost floats in the air, specially when the wind blows...

Gowtham

hmm , My metabolism is just weird, i take lots of protein, just never get fat or muscles

@MARamezani ha

MARamezani

15:53

@Gowtham You consume it as pills or food, like meat and stuff?

Gowtham

usually the bean/grams , take chicken soemtimes.. no pills

am so close to 500 :<

MARamezani

500 kilograms?

:}

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