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12:49 AM
Where is everyone? I guess this is the disadvantage of being UTC-4.
 
1:42 AM
Maybe I'm slow too, but these questions are taking forever to answer...
cricket noises
 
 
2 hours later…
user116211
4:07 AM
Ahhhh... an early homework problem in elasticity. I didn't ask you to do my homework, please don't ask me to do yours. — Jon Custer 4 hours ago
 
user116211
kudos Jon ;))
 
6:16 AM
@pentavalentcarbon @Benzene We need answers!
 
6:36 AM
Is this looking like an unopposed election?
lol
I guess there's still time
 
7:01 AM
Food for thought
I just thought to myself that . . . what if the homework thing will never get objective?
I was thinking that we maybe should require proof of understanding of the underlying concepts, rather than effort.
I'm not sure . . . This isn't a curated idea.
 
7:13 AM
how could you proof that?
 
7:46 AM
@Martin-マーチン One of the ways of proving it is effort.
What if it's someone we trust to know the underlying concepts?
According to their contributions, I mean
I dunno, it just might be a stupid idea
Sometimes things occur to me that fly away the next minute.
So I document them here so we have ideas to consider.
 
8:25 AM
Do you want to nominate for the 2016 mod election? Do you have something to offer to the community? STEP UP!
3
 
8:59 AM
Does anyone have the std. electrode potential of perfomic acid HCOOOH? hard to find online
!!img/performic acid
 
9:18 AM
is there any example where an oxidizer oxidizes itself? what about under a catalyst?
i guess the decomposition of hydrogen peroxide could be an example
 
9:56 AM
@DHMO Did you check disproportionation?
 
10:09 AM
@Loong sure, thanks
what about my first question?
> Does anyone have the std. electrode potential of perfomic acid HCOOOH? hard to find online
 
 
1 hour later…
11:16 AM
@Rubisco haha, you'll realise I do exactly the same thing, just blurt out random thoughts when I think of them
 
11:30 AM
@Martin-マーチン Calm down, I'm working on it.
 
It doesn't seem like there is a hard deadline for when the Q&A is due, other than maybe before the election begins. Is that correct?
 
12:24 PM
@pentavalentcarbon MetaEd answered here about an hour before the election closed – and he was elected.
 
1:02 PM
Wow. I am not going to do that. Just haven't been feeling well. I'm probably 90% done.
 
user116211
Go @penta go!!
 
user116211
Slay the Questionnaire!!
 
@MAFIA36790 I guess I lied to you, huh.
Oh btw, I started to read some of the Physics.SE drama you brought up. I've never spent time there before.
Wow is that bad.
Even just on their meta I can feel the hot pokers.
 
user116211
@pentavalentcarbon Go to the election chat room to see some scattered drama.
 
After I finish my own Q&A and the work day is over.
I'll need a beer in my hand I'm afraid.
 
user116211
1:05 PM
@pentavalentcarbon !!beer
 
I saw lots of this "Ron Maimon"...
You probably know who that is.
I am glad I don't.
 
user116211
@pentavalentcarbon Oh missed that; why would he come in the picture? He is banned after all.
 
I thing I was going link-diving and found his name on a question about "why don't the experts answer questions".
When I was reading their questionnaire responses.
 
user116211
Ron is not at SE for over three years.
 
1:08 PM
I did see that but apparently the site and its community have a long memory.
 
user116211
Although he responded to the comments in his posts sometimes; but lately he is banned over the whole SE.
 
Hmm. I can't vote in their election but only one Q&A response truly impressed me. Another I thought was terrible.
 
user116211
@pentavalentcarbon Whose? ACM's?
 
@MAFIA36790 Indifferent about ACM's. Their nomination text was a too showy for me but the Q&A seems ok.
I would say my opinion falls in line with the current vote scores.
(as a totally uneducated outsider)
 
user116211
@pentavalentcarbon okay.
 
1:13 PM
Again...no idea if those are representative of the truth.
 
user116211
For me, ACM is the one who really knows what moderatorship is all about.
 
user116211
I know Jim; he is a funny but responsible chap.
 
user116211
No idea about tgp but he is quite active in meta.
 
I'll have to take your word for it.
!!coffee
 
user116211
1:16 PM
weird
 
user116211
coffee after beer ;P
 
@MAFIA36790 It's a little after 9 AM here.
And I'm actually drinking coffee, not the other one
 
user116211
Coffee sounds legit.
 
user116211
Not the other one at this time, for sure ;)
 
1:37 PM
crap, I'm not going to finish before my meeting and lunch and work
It will probably go it while everyone else is asleep.
Maybe that's for the best.
 
user116211
I'm awake till 3:35 am; I think I can catch your post.
 
2:03 PM
0
Q: Is it possible to generalize whether an organic molecule is chiral or not?

Pyro RecorcinolCan we generalize ON THE BASIS OF NUMBER OF CHIRALITY CENTERS if an organic molecule is chiral or not ?

Is it a cultural thing?
Like, is it just us that think capital letters are impolite?
 
@DHMO In India at least a lot of folks capitalize for emphasis waaaay too much
and use it for proper nouns and stuff
 
@ManishEarth there's just too many differences...
 
yeah
I find it infuriating
 
@ManishEarth eye-opening
 
meh
I'm okay with language differences that are consistent :)
 
2:08 PM
@ManishEarth people are distinct; that's the point of diversity
 
Right
I'm basically a tad annoyed when people pass off any random quirks as "Indian English". I get that language varies by region. I myself speak both the Indian and American dialects of English, and I know many of the differences. If folks from a region in india are mostly consistent about how the language is used, that makes sense.
Because the ultimate point of language is communication, and "errors" aren't errors when they're consistent
because they don't hamper communication, except sometimes when cross-cultural
 
@ManishEarth well... what about the ":-"?
 
hm?
oh, using :- instead of :? That's pretty consistent. Not everyone does it, but consistent enough to make sense
 
19
Q: Is it proper to use a colon followed immediately by a hyphen?

way0utwestI have seen some writing where people have a list or a figure in writing and they will write something like this: The information is provided in Image 3:- Is that correct? Is this a British style?

 
Like I said, it's consistent and the message gets across :)
So it's "proper" in India
 
2:13 PM
Right
 
But capitalization is done so arbitrarily -- folks capitalize for any random reason, and there's no consistency, so it loses all meaning and it just confuses the reader.
that's why it infuriates me :p
 
@ManishEarth well, I'm only seeing capitalization for emphasis?
Some capitalize the whole question, I've no idea why.
 
> Some capitalize the whole question, I've no idea why.
Exactly
It's more commonly used for emphasis and random proper nouns that they feel need to be capitalized
 
@ManishEarth it isn't inconsistent...
 
It isn't inconsistent on this site
 
user116211
2:17 PM
@DHMO They are trolls.
 
@MAFIA36790 not really...
 
I've lived in India for the past 8 years, it's inconsistent here :)
And I've seen it being inconsistently used online
 
user116211
@DHMO I know; most of them have no idea that is equivalent to yelling.
 
Anyway, that's why it infuriates me, at this stage I've seen it used in so many different ways that it has stopped meaning anything.
 
@MAFIA36790 sure
 
user116211
2:21 PM
@ManishEarth I must say many Indian origin users do write titles switching on the CAPS.
 
user116211
I, myself, altered such titles for countless number of times.
 
Hey @Manish
 
'ello
 
Is there any chiral compounds with more than 2 enantiomers but with only 1 chiral center?
 
@MAFIA36790 As I said before, it's coincidental. Indians are the biggest nation around here that happen to not care about correct notation and consistency.
 
user116211
2:25 PM
@Rubisco yep.
 
@Loong Few of the voters actually read the questionnaire answers, and it's even less possible that they change their mind because of them.
cc @Penta
 
user116211
@Rubisco O.o
 
I bet ya no one here will change their mind because of what I have written and you have not, and the vice versa.
 
user116211
ohh... okay.
 
The questionnaire gains more prominence on larger sites, where we get questions that potentially get different answers.
Ours don't.
 
2:30 PM
0
Q: How can I know Lone and Bond pair... in molecule

Fahad How can I know lone and bonding pairs in becl2?

Doesn't look like a British name to me
 
user116211
@DHMO what?
 
@MAFIA36790 The use of ":-"
 
@Rubisco I quite agree. However, the voters might be sceptical about a candidate who doesn't find the time to answer the questionnaire at all.
 
What were they called again? Dog bullocks?
 
@Rubisco yes
 
user116211
2:31 PM
@Loong I have so far seen no one doing otherwise.
 
19
Q: Is it proper to use a colon followed immediately by a hyphen?

way0utwestI have seen some writing where people have a list or a figure in writing and they will write something like this: The information is provided in Image 3:- Is that correct? Is this a British style?

 
@Loong if we're lucky, ONLY half of the voters will never open the questionnaire in a tab
 
@Rubisco I've opened it multiple times, does that make up for them?
 
@orthocresol That's not obvious. The formula for the number of views is not disclosed so it won't be gamed.
But people have a hunch that visits every, say, couple of hours might count as different.
 
I swear we have multiple answers saying that a molecule without $S_n$ axis is chiral, but none of them are duplicates of this frontpage question.
 
2:48 PM
@DavePhD Awww...that was a good answer! You didn't have to delete it.....even subsequent edits would've sufficed =*_*=
 
I've never actually seen him in chat.
 
user116211
@AaronAbraham You can't ping him.
 
Point stands... Nobody is investigating diazotisation of methylamine in 2010.
That's been done and nobody's going to reinvent the wheel
 
@orthocresol What about 2011?
 
@Rubisco If you continue on like this, I'm not voting for you.
 
2:51 PM
OK, that threat is . . . deafeningly serious
 
Haha, but seriously, yeah. Nowadays, organic chem journals write about some DFT investigation of some metal-catalysed cascade biomimetic synthesis of optimisation of 3-bromo-59-pyrazolyl-cyclohex-2,3-diene-2H-heptanoic acid.
If anyone tells me that that compound doesn't exist, I'm not voting for them.
 
@orthocresol In 3 million degrees in plasma.
With hot nurses dancing around, creating a magnetic field
 
@orthocresol you are a mod right ?
 
Wrong.
 
@9-BBN Yeah I am. Or I soon will be. evil laughter
 
2:55 PM
He is a seal!
 
If he was a mod, he'd have a blue name.
 
=^.^=
 
Like Loong
 
Like this: $\textcolor{blue}{orthocresol}$
 
Boo I don't have Mathjax on
 
2:56 PM
Is it 2,2-dichlorobutan-3-amine or 3,3-dichlorobutan-2-amine?
 
It is just because porphyrin had troubles with one of his comments here chemistry.stackexchange.com/questions/60336/… so if one modo can remove the ugly one it should be great
 
nice try :D
 
And the font is wrong
 
for him
:)
 
Mathsf is the closest you get
 
@Loong That's it, I'm not voting for you
@Rubisco You too
@pentavalentcarbon You too. I only vote for tea-drinkers.
 
I'm a tea-drinker you SEAL!
 
I'm a molecule and I'm slightly acidic because of my -OH group. So @pH13 is ruled out as well.
 
@DHMO 3,3-dichlorobutan-2-amine
 
@Loong so the suffix gets the lowest numbers and then all the prefixes are the same?
 
2:59 PM
@9-BBN I flagged it already. Someone will probably get round to it.
 
I don't remember the way for the robot to draw molecules there can someone tells me please?
 
@9-BBN !!img/performic acid
 
@orthocresol I flag it too :P
 
@DHMO in principle, yes
 
3:00 PM
!!img/2-methylphenol
 
@Loong in practice?
 
@DHMO thanks
@orthocresol your image doen't work ^^
 
@DHMO In practice, the rules have more than 1500 pages; so it's not always so simple.
 
@9-BBN I didn't want to generate a big image for no good reason.
 
@Loong I see, thanks
@Loong Is it proven that every possible molecule can be named with only one systematic IUPAC name?
 
3:03 PM
Even vitamin B haha
 
@9-BBN B vitamins is a class of vitamins
B1 is thiamine: 3-((4-Amino-2-methyl-5-pyrimidinyl)methyl)- 5-(2-hydroxyethyl)-4-methylthiazolium chloride
 
Choose one
 
!!img/thiamine
 
I was thinking to that youtube.com/watch?v=IHVWRZQWdD8
 
3:04 PM
@DHMO One and only one? Many compounds can have two or more names in accordance with IUPAC recommendations.
 
@Loong systematic IUPAC name
 
This is the name of a molecule lol
 
@DHMO inluding two or more systematic names
 
@9-BBN that's not the systematic name
it's just amino acids
 
Yes but you can transform it as well
 
3:05 PM
@Loong for example?
 
Bigger then
 
@9-BBN sure
 
Here you have some good things for nomenclatura
Much more than what you may will use in all your life
 
@9-BBN thanks
@Loong is there a system for naming single hydrocarbon aromatic rings?
Like, what would C10H10 be named?
 
C10H10 est la formule brute de plusieurs isomères. Alcènyne diisopropényldiacétylène, numéro CAS 5187-81-5 Dérivé du benzène à substituants non cycliques 1-butynyl-benzène, numéro CAS 622-76-4 2-butynyl-benzène, numéro CAS 33598-22-0 3-butynyl-benzène, numéro CAS 16520-62-0 1,2-butadiènyl-benzène, numéro CAS 2327-98-2 1,3-butadiényl-benzène, numéro CAS 1515-78-2, mélange des stéréoisomères Z-1,3-butadiényl-benzène, numéro CAS 31915-94-3 E-1,3-butadiényl-benzène, numéro CAS 16939-57-4 (1-méthylène-2-propényl)-benzène, numéro CAS 2288-18-8 1-méthyl-2-(1-propynyl)-benzène, numéro CAS 57497-13-9...
This is in french but we don't care it is approx the same
 
3:09 PM
@9-BBN thanks
it's [10]annulene then
 
@DHMO For example, N,N-diethylethan-1-amine, triethylazane, and (triethyl)amine are three systematic names in accordance with current IUPAC recommendations for the same compound.
 
!!tea
 
:( My favourite chemical
 
no hotlink lol
 
3:11 PM
@Loong what is N?
 
nitrogen
For amine nomenclatura it is a bit weird
 
@DHMO That's a locant like 1, 2, 3
 
!!img/N,N-diethylethan-1-amine
 
@Loong but what is it?
and how is there not one name for such a simple amide like this
 
3:12 PM
@orthocresol better attention seal your vote, so that no one changes it
 
@DHMO Since the nitrogen atom of ethan-1-amine has no atom number, the locant N is used.
 
@orthocresol hm... your pKa is 10.20
@Loong so N is only for nitrogen?
 
And O only for oxygen :P
 
@9-BBN no, you use oxy for that
 
or oxa
 
3:16 PM
@Loong so if the N is replaced by P... it would become P,P-diethylethan-1-xxxx?!?!?
 
It wouldn't be an amine anymore.
 
@orthocresol yes, i just noticed it
 
@DHMO yes, you could also have the locant O for an oxygen atom, or S for sulfur
 
@Loong what... so methoxymethane is also O-methylethanol?
 
What about o-phenyl-O-methylethanol ?
:P
!!img/O-methylethanol
 
3:18 PM
No result found.
 
It looks it won't work
 
@9-BBN That would be positively charged.
 
@orthocresol why?
 
trivalent oxygen, better be positively charged
 
@orthocresol I thought O means replace the H with the following
 
3:20 PM
@MAFIA36790 Yeah....I kinda noticed :( .....
 
Now we are there can someone tell me why P can have 3 or 5 bonds with atoms and be neutral ? or sulfur with 4 or 6 if i'mright
 
A hypervalent molecule (the phenomenon is sometimes colloquially known as expanded octet) is a molecule that contains one or more main group elements formally bearing more than eight electrons in their valence shells. Phosphorus pentachloride (PCl5), sulfur hexafluoride (SF6), chlorine trifluoride (ClF3), and the triiodide (I3−) ion are examples of hypervalent molecules. == Definitions and nomenclature == Hypervalent molecules were first formally defined by Jeremy I. Musher in 1969 as molecules having central atoms of group 15–18 in any valence other than the lowest (i.e. 3, 2, 1, 0 for Groups...
@9-BBN It is a complicated phenomenon...
 
@DHMO O-methylethanol would describe the structure of methoxyethane, not methoxymethane. However, you usually don't use O-substituition for simple alcohols, but it's allowed for carbohydrates.
 
@Loong I see
 
@orthocresol I LOVE tea!.......I have green tea in the mornings, I have tea (with milk) after lunch, I have tea with biscuits in the the evenings (or is it 'biscuits with tea'???) and I have tea before I got to bed! Also I love seals! And orthocresol is my favorite compound! Now you'll have to vote for me (Bwahahahaha-cough, cough.... hahaha!).
 
3:27 PM
@DHMO so that the same for sulfoxide and sulfone ?
 
@9-BBN yes
 
But it doen't not explain me why the lone pair would react
That's stange
 
@AaronAbraham you are also german?
 
@9-BBN because oxygen likes lone pairs a lot
 
@AaronAbraham Are you from East Frisia? Per capita, they drink more tea than the English, and they have seals. ;-)
 
3:30 PM
@9-BBN Hint: you only see those hypervalent molecules with extremely electronegative elements such as F, O, and Cl.
 
@pH13-YetanotherPhilipp What make you say that?
 
I guess no
 
Ahhhhhh about that....
 
@9-BBN ?
 
3:31 PM
I'm just a fan of von Braun and his....work......
Hence the island....
 
@DHMO a lot of organometallic may can be it too as well
 
@9-BBN for example?
 
So @pH13-YetanotherPhilipp where're you from? München like Jan?
 
@AaronAbraham hell no ... no one wants to be from bavaria, except bavarians
2
;)
 
user116211
3:34 PM
@pH13-YetanotherPhilipp flagged
 
But being Bayerisch is funnnn......
 
@MAFIA36790 as?
 
No...I won't flag it...
 
user116211
@pH13-YetanotherPhilipp Anti-Bavaria.
 
@AaronAbraham Bayerische what?
 
3:34 PM
Für Bavaria!
 
@DHMO I'm just thinking, I'm not putting things in box :)
 
user116211
@AaronAbraham Is it a state of Bavaria?
 
Alright then where are you from anti-Bavarian ;P
 
boxes
 
user116211
anyways, back to Kelley
 
3:36 PM
@MAFIA36790 going to start reading Dirac
 
@AaronAbraham one state more to the north
 
@ortho​seal is the 5d orbital involved in the triiodide anion?
!!img/triiodide
 
Silicon looks to have some great capacities
 
@9-BBN for example?
I don't think I have seen any hypervalent compounds with silicon
 
user116211
3:37 PM
@orthocresol Good! The first chapter is just amazingly crystal clear on quantum superposition.
 
I can see, it is titled "The principle of superposition" :D
 
@pH13-YetanotherPhilipp Thuringia?
 
user116211
@orthocresol Just read it; check the examples he gives and then elaborates.
 
@AaronAbraham yep
 
The Fleming–Tamao oxidation, or Tamao–Kumada–Fleming oxidation, converts a carbon–silicon bond to a carbon–oxygen bond with a peroxy acid or hydrogen peroxide. Fleming–Tamao oxidation refers to two slightly different conditions developed concurrently in the early 1980s by the Kohei Tamao and Ian Fleming research groups. The reaction is stereospecific with retention of configuration at the carbon–silicon bond. This allows the silicon group to be used as a functional equivalent of the hydroxyl group. Another key feature of the silicon group is that it is relatively stable due to the presence of...
 
3:37 PM
:O
 
SiH4; SiF4,2NH3
 
@9-BBN none of them are hypervalent
@orthocresol well... hypervalent intermediates... alright
 
@AaronAbraham the green heart of germany
 
Hexafluorosilicic acid is an inorganic compound with the chemical formula (H 3O) 2SiF 6 (also written as (H 3O) 2[SiF 6]). It is a colorless liquid rarely encountered undiluted. Hexafluorosilicic acid has a distinctive sour taste and pungent smell. It is mainly produced as a precursor to aluminum trifluoride and synthetic cryolite. It is commonly used as a source of fluoride for water fluoridation. Concentrated hexafluorosilicic acid is corrosive and toxic, but in everyday use, it is so diluted as to be less harmful. In aqueous solution, the hydronium cation (H3O+) is traditionally equated with...
 
................................................................................‌​........................................
 
3:39 PM
Are you happy now?
 
A little....(sniff).....
 
user116211
Although I must mention; it's not mathematically rigorous @ortho.
 
@orthocresol yes, thanks
 
@MAFIA36790 Oh man. burns book
 
Carbon can be hypervalent too :P
 
3:40 PM
@9-BBN ???
 
That's not a joke
 
user116211
@orthocresol don't do it ;P It's worthy to read Dirac's treatise.
 
@9-BBN I didn't say it is. Do you have any examples?
 
Yep let me check my data
 
@orthocresol :O ...... A BOOK-BURNER! Quick everyone, lets tie up the witch and BURN HER AT THE STAKE!
(Unrelated comment: Is o-cresol flammable by any chance?...)
 
user116211
@AaronAbraham That's unnecessary.
 
As crazy as it can be
 
@AaronAbraham Not according to the SDS.
 
@orthocresol SDS?
 
In SF6 the central sulphur atom has 6 ____ ?
@orthocresol I can't find the right word
 
After depends also if you think in gas phase CH5+ exists
 
@9-BBN still 8 electrons around C
!!img/methanium
 
No result found.
 
@DHMO electron pairs around it
 
.............
 
3:46 PM
@orthocresol but it has more electron pairs around it
if you consider 1s to be around the nucleus
!!img/CH5
 
No result found.
 
You "can"make CH5+ in solution with HSbF6 but well
 
 
Well, let's just BURN IT ANYWAYS!!! (Hold on guys, I'll get the torch and some gasoline.....if @orthocresol doesn't burn, we'll make it burn...)
 
@AaronAbraham But I'm reading the book, so if you burn me, you'll burn the book as well.
 
3:48 PM
Hmm......you have a point.....
But seals have to sleep at some point.......so THEN I'll burn ya!
Bwahahahahahahaha!
 
Thankfully I haven't told people enough information such that they can identify me in real life.
 
I'm standing outside your room right now.....
 
Hum well I used a wrong word
Shame on me
 
0
Q: Is the 5d orbital involved in triiodide ion?

DHMOQuestion Is the $5d$ orbital involved in the triiodide ion, $\ce{I3-}$? There are $5$ electron pairs around the central iodine. Background (Almost) all of the hypervalent compounds involve the most electronegative elements: $\ce{F}$, $\ce{O}$, $\ce{Cl}$. Also, the bonds involving the electro...

Another question from me since almost a month ago
 
@DHMO If I upvote it, would it make you feel any better?
 
3:55 PM
@AaronAbraham yes
 
........
That was.....quick...
Hiya Rubisco!
It's been a while since I saw my favorite enzyme....
@Rubisco (Psst...I'll vote for you too, Herr future Moderator...)
@DHMO Alright, take my vote and dissociate.....
 
@AaronAbraham covalent molecules do not dissociate
 

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