The Water Cooler

user381237

08:06

Hello everyone? I am creating a new Area 51 proposal called Desks and Workplaces. It relates to work desks setup and home office and desk setups as well! Come on over to post an example question or see if it interests you! area51.stackexchange.com/proposals/121363/…

Snow

08:43

If anyone is particularly insane, there's going to be two moderator slots for SO fairly soon.

Twyxz

08:54

Morning

Snow

Wotchya.

Twyxz

Yes.

Magisch

09:16

@Snow Probably gonna be 20+ candidates again, so eh

Snow

I only have 128 rep points on SO, so not gonna be me.

rath

09:34

Good morning chat people

@Snow you're not up for it, Snow?

motosubatsu

morning @rath

Snow

@rath I'd be laughed out of town....

Magisch

conventional wisdom and what people write on candidate nominations during the election suggests you should have 10k+ rep, daily review participation (ideally 20+ every day for at least a year), a known meta presence and be somewhat likeable to have a shot on SO

typically on SO there are at least 5-7 candidates meeting all of these requirements running

also people look closely at # of helpful flags (sometimes in the last year), type of helpful flags, recent meta & main contributions and moderation badges (editing, flagging, etc) in regards to the candidate score

rath

I'm somewhat slow on the reviews, I find them slightly boring :)

Snow

I have an election eligability score of 1 on SO.

Magisch

09:42

I think on SO to even nominate you need 5 different moderation silver badges and 3000 rep

Snow

And that's because of my "Yearling" badge.

Kilisi

10:01

I got more rep than that on SO, all for asking lame questions

Magisch

Kilisi the new SO mod incoming :D

Kilisi

hehe... I got 187 rep on SO

I can't code for crap

rath

@Magisch I second that. @Kilisi go for it mate!

Wouldn't mind seeing Joe as well

Twyxz

10:17

Joe on SO?

Are you thinking of TWP

I think the current conversation is about SO @rath

rath

Well, spot the guy who hasn't finished his coffee yet :)

yes I was talking about TWP

Twyxz

Hahahah found him @rath

rath

On another topic, I was mildly annoyed at the reception the 3000 lines question got

it's too easy to question the premise and everyone bombarded the comments with Jeff Attwood-esque comments, without actually helping the story along

all that question needed was some editing to get the frustration out of it, and all it got was massive frame-challenging

Nofel

morning

rath

good morning @Nofel

Kilisi

10:29

Na... it's not my style.... rules smules... etc,.

rath

That's why you should

you'll be like the renegade alcoholic cop who doesn't give a damn about the rules

Kilisi

rather do my own thing and make my own rules

yeah, that cop is currently serving jail time and servicing his 10 cellmates.... ahaha

mods are doing a pretty good job already all things considered

Nofel

10:52

hey @Kilisi hows ur neighbour

the one who bought his whole family, u were annoyed with them

Twyxz

12:02

@Snow What happened to the moderator eligibility checker?

Twyxz

12:31

Fattie's working his mouth as per usual

Love it

Mister Positive

Happy Monday Ladies and Gents

Wow this place is dead

Can't wait to vote...

[ENTERING SLEEP MODE]

Nofel

@MisterPositive yes it is dead expect few

@MisterPositive ur more in hibernation mode

Snow

@Twyxz Nothing. It's still there.

Mister Positive

12:51

@Snow Hodor. Glad your still here keeping this thing going..

Snow

Yeah, I'll be nominating myself at this rate.

Mister Positive

[ENTERING SLEEP MODE]

Kilisi

13:11

3 am and I'm listening to the wind and rain and foliage bouncing off the roof and walls and wondering if there's a cyclone no one bothered to mention, heavy rain is just about horizontal

with a bit of luck the neighbours shack will blow over and afford me some amusement.

Twyxz

13:24

@Snow I thought I favourited it hahaha

Snow

It's still there on the star gallery, at least for me.

Twyxz

13:36

Wahey my points went up by 3 haha

Richard U

14:03

I don't see candidates pounding on the door to run. Perhaps the mods could post something to reassure we don't have a repeat of last year. One former candidate left the site entirely, one was banned for five years, and one is still very bitter.

Twyxz

Hi @RichardU

Richard U

@Twyxz How are you this fine day.

Twyxz

Annoyed currently

Richard U

@Twyxz uh oh, what's wrong?

Twyxz

I attempted to close a trade 2 hours ago and I was told that it would be closed in the next hour. For a start, there's never delays on closing/opening trades in foreign exchange. Since then I've lost an additional £60 profits when it should've been instant

Because they're having 'technical issues'

18

A: How to deal with a colleague who makes personal jokes about my appearance?

By the sounds of it, John is just under-educated on your condition and genuinely is just trying to have a joke on with you. Personally I wouldn't try and look for new jobs but try talking to John. Pull him over for a chat again and say Hey John, I don't know if you know but I have psoriasi...

The latest comment...

Nofel

14:23

hello @RichardU howdy?

Richard U

@Twyxz ouch!

@Nofel. Hi

Twyxz

Yep, annoying. Does anyone have Telegram downloaded on their phones?

I hate when Fattie comments on my answers... because the comments never stop afterwards

Richard U

14:41

@Twyxz he's just trying to get a rise out of you. Take the advice of an ancient grandmaster troll {me} don't engage. The goal of a troll is to get a reaction, don't react, and they move on.

Nofel

@Twyxz Listen to what @RichardU has to say. his advice r golden for life.

Mister Positive

[ENTERING SLEEP MODE]

Nofel

[STOP REPEATING AND GO TO SLEEP]

Richard U

@MisterPositive I've got a new goal. I want my posts to be as close to zero, with as many votes as possible.

I'm proud of the =9/-9, but I'd rather have a =50/-50. That's my new goal

Nofel

@RichardU all my old post r all closed

I wanna delete them

Richard U

14:51

@Nofel why not go for the edit and reopen.

:D

that is far more fun.

Nofel

argh. I don't even remember the context and those were old jobs

Richard U

@Nofel Then don't worry. :D If you need any help with anything new, I can always help with an edit. I understand your intent pretty well, and can phrase things clearly. Never be afraid to reach out.

Twyxz

This question might get me a good start on tomorrows rep also haha

Mister Positive

15:07

@Nofel Fine. ;-)

Nofel

@RichardU thanks

Richard U

As an aside, I'm now putting caveats on my posts "this may not work for everyone" because I'm damn tired of people splitting hairs all the way down to the atomic level

Nofel

lol

Snow

@RichardU Or "This advice may not apply to all conceivable edge-cases"

Nofel

today lesson to myself. boss was talking to manager xyz. saying it doesn't look good on mobile etc etc. my monkey went off, "Oh ur job in trouble coz they r talking about u" then he asked manager "Can nofel do this", he said no, another flag in my mind.

when on break I told myself, not everything is about u

Richard U

15:12

@Snow If I posted what I REALLY meant, I'd get banned for six months, easy

Nofel

If u do not know backend, of course manager gonna say he doesnt know. don't beat the drum

my monkey was satisfued then

Richard U

@Nofel exactly. If someone says "can Richard sing soprano?" and then someone says "no", then it's just a statement of fact.

Focus on your talents, not your weaknesses.

@Nofel never judge a fish by it's ability to climb a tree, especially if you're the fish in question.

Nofel

yea, I gotta work on my talent to become more of a dev if I need extensions

but when they were talking, look at this page, and look at ours. our is bad

donno but it raise a plag that ur a front end guy and u did crap job

and u gonna get booted

Richard U

15:38

@Nofel here's some advice that was given to me, and it helped.

"when you're in a hole, don't look down, or you'll be frightened by the drop, don't look up, or you'll be discouraged about how far you have to go, just look for the next thing to grab to pull yourself up."

@Twyxz BTW, gratz on 10k! You get more cookies now

Nofel

15:54

@RichardU I intend to do bungee jump

the only way is down

Nofel

16:12

@RichardU when shld I press again for review

follow up*

Richard U

@Nofel give it at least another week, then again, be subtle. In the mean time, kick things into high gear. The more you do now, the more recent achievements you'll be able to mention in the review.

Nofel

16:27

@RichardU well I am and I did discuss this workplace.stackexchange.com/questions/128517/…

on friday

Nofel

16:42

@RichardU its funny how when u do not think about a thing, u take enormous steps but when u do think about u keep thinking before taking a step

e.g I got a car when I got to uk, lost job right after getting a car, and up and down my mom supported me to pay my bills etc

Richard U

@Nofel it's called "paralysis by analysis".

Nofel

now I want a car and I am afarid that if I loose job then what

at first time I never cared

Richard U

@Nofel just look at what's in front of you. Take care of it, then look at the next thing.

Hi @JoeStrazzere I hope you are well.

Nofel

@RichardU that what is the thing, cannot decide what is next

Richard U

@Nofel then write down a list, and roll some dice, pick whatever comes up... or write a random number generator and have one pop up

Joe Strazzere

16:46

@RichardU I'm okay. How about you?

Nofel

even my mum says do it. I will help u manage every month and so but I am afarid. I say I do not input in her insitute why shld I ask for her financial help.

another thing is to ask "what i am doing here why not helping my old mom grow and expand her insitite"

Richard U

@JoeStrazzere well, the dust is finally settling. Now that I'm not in crisis mode constantly, my doctors can finally get a baseline of what is going on when I'm not under intense stress

Joe Strazzere

@RichardU That's good

Richard U

@JoeStrazzere They seem to think I have bipolar tendencies (not full blown bipolar) and that seems to make sense.

Nofel

speaking of which, when I lost my first job, i had dreams of crash out of sky but couldnt make out until 3-4 months later I was ejected. now I has same dream and I am on my toes @RichardU

@JoeStrazzere howdy

Richard U

16:49

@JoeStrazzere how's the recovery going from the treatments? Things slowly getting back to normal for you?

@Nofel dreams are a distraction. Have goals instead

Nofel

@RichardU fun fact: many of my dreams have come true

Joe Strazzere

@RichardU I'm fine now. My treatments are complete - only periodic exams remain. Unfortunately, just when I finished, my Dad got diagnosed with inoperable stomach and esophogeal cancer.

Richard U

@Nofel so do mine, but in nightmare form

@JoeStrazzere Oh, goodness. I'm so so sorry to hear that about your father.

can chemo/radiation help him?

Joe Strazzere

@RichardU Yup. Well, he's lived a good life and is at peace with himself. Now all that we can do is help him live the rest of it comfortably. He's having radiation to try and reduce the tumors to make it easier for him to eat. But no cure unfortunately.

Nofel

@JoeStrazzere so sorry to hear that. what about homopatic?

homeopathic*

Joe Strazzere

16:53

@Nofel No. That's not in the cards

Richard U

@JoeStrazzere it's maddening. My brother participated in an immunotherapy trial. it didn't work on him, but when they perfect it, it's just going to be two rounds of chemo. One, with a drug to bond to the tumors, and a second to bond to the first. The combination of the two causes the body to identify cancer cells as a threat.

I hope it works. It would be nice to know his contribution meant something.

Joe Strazzere

@RichardU There are amazing therapies being developed these days. Making great strides for many. I feel very fortunate to have been able to take advantage of one of those myself.

Richard U

@JoeStrazzere glad to hear you could benefit. A friend of mine was saved by a new diagnostic. She had stage 2 breast cancer that was missed by a mammogram, but the new diagnoistic found it. She's cancer free now. Something like that would have saved my mother's life.

Joe Strazzere

@RichardU Nice story about your friend. Things are changing fast in the field. What would have been a terminal sentence in past years is often treatable these days. I'm very lucky.

Richard U

I know someone fighting lung cancer, and has been for 10 years. It is incurable, but slow growing, and he is very receptive to chemo. He goes in for chemo once per year, they beat it back, every year.

@JoeStrazzere we're near the point where cancer will be as manageable as diabetes. Looking forward to that.

Monica Cellio

16:58

@JoeStrazzere I'm glad to hear you're doing better! I'm sorry about your dad, though. Your family just can't get a break, it seems.

Joe Strazzere

@RichardU Yup. I met a few with similar conditions during my treatments. They come in for an infusion once per year then go on and live their life.

Richard U

@MonicaCellio I wasn't sniping, BTW. That was a serious question. This place has not been the same since the last election, and I'd like to see it recover.

Joe Strazzere

@MonicaCellio Thanks. These things happen. My mom passed away last year. My dad had adjusted well but still misses her a lot. As I say, he's live a good life and is at peace with whatever happens.

Later, folks.

Richard U

I would like to see some fences mended here, I really would.

Ignoring problems won't make them go away. It would actually be fairly easy to fix.

But it seems that it is being assumed that I have bad intent, and I'm saddened by that.

Nofel

@RichardU ur very valued

Monica Cellio

17:05

@JoeStrazzere later! It's good to see you here.

Richard U

@Nofel thank you, I'm glad I've been able to help you and others. I'd like to help this stack prosper.

I just find myself at a loss. There are real problems here, and I've seen sites fail before. I'd hate this to become one of them.

Monica Cellio

@RichardU the way you're approaching it feels very disruptive. It sounds like "this place is toxic am I right?!". I'd like to see more introspection and less finger-pointing, more encouragement of good things and less "it's not enough". For example, somebody (not you) came in here earlier and said "chat's dead"; this room has 160 messages today and nearly 1k for the week. That's not dead. But somebody says it and now we're talking about how bad chat is. Let's be constructive instead, ok?

And I'm not saying anything about motives; how can I know what's in somebody else's head? I'm acting on what comes out on the site.

Richard U

@MonicaCellio If this comes across as hostile, I apologize in advance, as that is not my intent.

when someone is upset about something, and they want to be heard, they are not always going to be the most polite or constructive. It's unrealistic to expect that they are. the less they feel that they're being taken seriously, the less polite they will be.

Nobody is particularly introspective, especially when trying to point out faults or suggest improvements.

Monica Cellio

@RichardU I don't see your message as hostile. I actually do know some people who are especially introspective in conflicts, constantly analyzing and stuff. (Sometimes that's paralyzing, too.) I think we humans often fall into the trap of assuming that others are like us in all the little details. And yes I know I'm susceptible too, as a human.

If something is upsetting enough that somebody feels it's not possible to be polite or constructive, it's far better to step back for a moment than to charge in. Take a deep breath, take a walk, consult someone you trust, do whatever it is that helps you get centered, and then you'll be better able to approach the problem constructively.

We all want the same thing: a functioning, constructive site.

I see stuff being stirred up on the eve of an election and I'm concerned that it'll torpedo the election. We're having an election because we need more qualified moderators. We don't need a shit-show of an election and people fighting for the coming weeks.

Richard U

@MonicaCellio I have a terrible time using nicities when I feel something is outright wrong. What adds to my frustrations(and I can't speak for anyone else) is when I see something that's wrong, I point it out, and then I hear about how I'm not being nice about it. The message I get from that pointing out the problems is worse than the problems.

Monica Cellio

17:16

That doesn't mean we all need to hold hands and sing Kumbaya. I had hoped that my rewrite of three other questions on the questionnaire would show a way to put concerns before the community without enraging people.

Richard U

@MonicaCellio the point of my last contribution was that people are still enraged from last year, not just me. It's just bubbling to the surface now. The reason being was that the issues from last election were never fully addressed.

Monica Cellio

@RichardU are people telling you you're not being nice but still addressing the problem you point out? Are they disagreeing that what you say is a problem is a problem?

Richard U

@MonicaCellio actually, I just feel like I'm being dismissed, and that there's no point in bringing things up. Then I get mad enough to bring them up agani

That's pretty much it from my perspective.

Monica Cellio

@RichardU people other than you? I see a lot of sniping and snark in the transcript of this room -- one of the reasons I rarely enter -- and fairly often it seems to be being driven by you. I might have missed things, of course. It feels like a small amount of stuff is getting amplified.

Richard U

@MonicaCellio I'm not happy, that's no mystery, and yes, others feel as I do and have contacted me privately. I speak to a few people offline. The difference is I speak up.

Monica Cellio

17:20

And I think we have a good community here, and I don't want us to lose that.

Could it be better? Yes, of course. I think it's been better at times in the past. But I hear doom and gloom while I see "needs some work".

Richard U

@MonicaCellio Well, here's something I'm quite experienced in. People see what they want to see. I've been identified as the villain, so people will see me as such. That's normal human behavior and I don't feel particularly persecuted, but that's the way it is.

Monica Cellio

@RichardU how one brings up a concern makes a huge difference in how people perceive it and respond to it.

Richard U

@MonicaCellio and I have terrible social skills that aren't going to improve. This is the result of 50 years of trying.

You should have seen me as a 20 something.

Monica Cellio

@RichardU so let me turn that back on you. People see what they want to see, and it's more comfortable if a problem is "other people are dismissing me as the villain" than if it's "I need to work on something".

Richard U

@MonicaCellio oh, of course I do

I'm well aware of that

But two things can be true at the same time.

Part of what fuels problems is that things are aired publicly, and resolved privately at SE.

So that adds to the impression that problems are being ignored.

Now, I know for a fact that they are not all being ignored, but I do know of some pretty deep problems which I will not air, as they were told to me in confidence.

I do have some discretion.

Monica Cellio

17:26

Are people a little more inclined to see your name on something and say "oh, that's just sniping"? Sure; I've been on your side of that elsewhere, too. But are people going to dismiss a dispassionately-presented issue just because it came from you? No, I don't think so. I know I don't, anyway. But yeah, I think people have a finite number of "goodwill points", and when you burn them people are going to be a little more cautious.

It doesn't mean we don't take the underlying issue seriously.

If it's presented as "I see this problem based on A, B, C", we can have a productive discussion. If it's presented as "you people are all meanies and stop attacking me with downvotes!", that's less likely to get traction. (To be clear, I made up that example.)

@RichardU you can always raise things privately if you want to. You can reach SE via the "contact us" link at the bottom of every page on the main site. You can reach moderators via flags.

SE can be slow to respond, and complicated flags can take time to untangle, but it's not going to /dev/null.

@RichardU SE could definitely do better about coming back with public responses. They can't always share details but that doesn't mean they can't say anything. We need to keep encouraging them to do that. (I was super-frustrated and hurt by the twitstorm this fall too.)

If there's a moderation issue that you think calls for a public response and one hasn't been forthcoming, please ask us. Yeah, we're not going to tell you why we suspended so-and-so or stuff like that, but if we're not closing the loop on important stuff, please let us know.

Richard U

@MonicaCellio I may reach out. I just thought on something I previously said. I may be seeing more problems than exist because of my experiences and may have gone a bit too negative.

We all, see what we are looking for, after all. Maybe I'm just getting more and more jaded because I'm looking for reasons to be.

Thank you for taking the time to hash things out with me.

Monica Cellio

@RichardU with all the frustrations you've been through, I'd be surprised if you weren't doing some of that. I hope we can work together to identify and address issues with less frustration all around.

And my coworkers are now waiting for me for lunch. Later!

Twyxz

17:56

Fattie likes to argue a point that he clearly thinks is valid but the rest of the stack thinks is invalid

He never seems to get the actual point

Richard U

18:38

@Twyxz He likes a row and plays devil's advocate. Don't engage and you'll have no problems. He'll run out of steam

-5

Q: Inappropriate Comments by Manager to Contractor

What are the actions to take if a direct manager makes inappropriate comments to a contractor? This is a right to work state, which means that an employee can be terminated at anytime without cause. Additionally the person in question is a contractor, which in my experience, if there is a minor...

Sigh.... I wish this wasn't getting closed. When did people start to think that running to HR with every little problem was a good idea? You can't go running to HR like you ran to the HS principal's office, or to the teacher after class.

Rory Alsop

19:02

@RichardU it's not getting closed because people think running to HR is a good idea. I certainly voted to close because it's off topic here. It would vary by company, culture, grade, personality, etc

Richard U

@RoryAlsop Sorry, I meant that as two thoughts.

Rory Alsop

@RichardU ah - okay. I understand :-)

Richard U

I mean that it's another example of someone thinking it's a good idea to run to HR.

Or, I'm sorry that was a poorly designed question, as it would have been a good opportunity to point out why running to HR over minor things is a bad idea

I posted a meta about that.

Rory Alsop

@RichardU A number of your comments were absolutely spot on - on a couple of today's posts regarding the habit of people to go to HR first. Many things are best fixed without ever going to HR

Richard U

@RoryAlsop One thing many people do not realize is that every interaction with HR is documented. If your file starts to get fat, it's not a good thing, even if you are in the right. If you report Bob, joe, Steve, Darren, and Earl, They will each have one HR contact in their file, you'll have five. Eventually, you will be seen as the problem if you are there too often

Mister Positive

19:14

Wow I missed a lot today.

will have to catch up

Pointy Haired Boss

19:53

1

Q: How to say "Don't abuse HR"

Yes, we all know about "HR IS NOT YOUR FRIEND" as a way of telling people that they may be getting more than they bargained for if they run to HR with their problems. But I think a better approach may be to find a way to tell people not to abuse Human Resources. As we all know: HR IS FOR Sal...

discussion

rath

20:05

@RichardU True, I've often challenged him in a single comment and left it at that. Others happily, and foolishly, pick up the thread when he replies. Quite entertaining to watch

I like Fattie, he has a fresh approach, but he tends to go over the top more often than not. But i guess this is a non-issue.

It's really his approach that triggers people, not what says or advocates

Richard U

@rath once I figured him out, I found him to be entertaining. He's what you'd get if Kilisi and I had a love child

rath

lol

I like that one

Richard U

He combines Kilisi's subtlety with my tact

Rory Alsop

@RichardU heh

rath

@RoryAlsop I remember you from Security and Cryptography. Nice to see you here as well

Rory Alsop

20:10

@rath I'm a chatty soul all over

Pointy Haired Boss

20:57

5

Q: 2019 Moderator Election Q&A - Questionnaire

In connection with the moderator elections, we are holding a Q&A thread for the candidates. Questions collected from an earlier thread have been compiled into this one, which shall now serve as the space for the candidates to provide their answers. We've selected the 7 positively scored submiss...

discussion featured election

3

Q: 2019 Community Moderator Election

The 2019 Community Moderator Election is now underway! Community moderator elections have three phases: Nomination phase Primary phase Election phase Most elections take between two and three weeks, but this depends on how many candidates there are. Please visit the official election page a...

discussion moderators election

0

Q: Double THE bug?

Is the double the pictured below a bug or are we rolling with it?

bug

Joe Strazzere

22:34

@Twyxz You really shouldn't assume you know what someone thinks. You can observe how they act and react, but you don't know what they are thinking.

Nicole

23:11

I see there's an election happening... good luck everyone 😊 I wish I had the time to mod again 😊

Monica Cellio

@Nicole hi! Great to see you again! I wish you had the time, too. (It might not require as much time now as it did back in your day. Just sayin'... :-) )

(Sorry to chat and run; I was on my way out when I saw your message. I'll be back later.)

Nicole

@MonicaCellio Aw thanks 😊 Good to see you too! This place is lucky to have you!

That's true, and maybe I'd handle the work load ok, but I'd probably not know enough of what's going on to have useful contributions to community issues that arise. I'm going back to school to study social psychology, maybe when I finish — in like 5 years 😉 — I'll have enough time!

les2

23:26

my mind is blown - i didn't know there was chat in stack exchange! hello, world!

Lilienthal

23:42

Hello @les2, welcome.

43

Q: Politely avoid/decline handshake due to arthritis and maintaining privacy regarding a medical condition

I "know someone" who has arthritis and because they are young most people never think of it when approaching her/him with a handshake. Sometimes a gentle squeeze is enough to bring tears. This person is also private about their medical condition, but shouldn't be subject to pain or that awkward d...

professionalism interviewing internship

Hmm, is it bad that I have never once considered not to shake someone's hand because it might hurt them regardless of their age?

I'd kind of assume that people who have an issue would simply tell me.

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