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3:26 PM
We'll get started in about 30 minutes.
Thanks @RebeccaChernoff!
Great can't wait have about 5000 questions to ask each candidate...
now if i could only spell
@RebeccaChernoff Is there a format for this? Or just a free-for-all discussion about various things?
@Oli free-for-all, mayhem-for-all (;
3:42 PM
some of us don't cope well with mayham....
coping with mayhem is probably a requirement for the job :)
that is why i am not running for election
Are George, txwikinger and dustyprogrammer joining us?
3:58 PM
@GeorgeEdison might not make it. Not sure about the rest of them
Hello, hello, hello! (:
how is everyone?
4:01 PM
@TheX excited about the upcoming session (:
Welcome to the Ask Ubuntu Town Hall Chat
We're just here to get to know the candidates a bit and ask any questions that may help with voting in the election.
The format is open, feel free to ask your question(s) unprompted, however please try to let the candidates answer any previous questions so as to not flood them.
Candidates, please use the reply feature so that questions and their answers are linked together.
When a question is asked, I'll star it, please help me star as well - and save your stars for questions
This will put them in the starred list on the right and make them easy to find.
As before, I will be creating a digest version of this town hall after it is completed. This digest will take the form of a question on Meta, containing all the questions asked as well as their answers, for easier reading.
and what @Josh said (:
With that, I think I've got all my initial messages, so does anyone have a question to start us off?
How much time do you anticipate spending on the site? How much of that would be "moderating"?
There's a system message up on the site so we may get some stragglers joining us. (:
Oh, missed one!
The candidates I see here are: @MarcoCeppi, @Oli, and @StefanoPalazzo.
4:06 PM
You all have about a minute before I stop waiting and just start dumping more questions in here :)
@MichaelMrozek Because of my position at work I'm on the internet about 18 hours a day. Of that time the AU site is open about 90% of the time (as many of our current chat users might know). Moderation is taken as an "on need" basis. I don't specifically set time aside to moderate the site but when something requiring moderator attention is brought up I plan to address it at that time (to my best ability)
@MichaelMrozek I typically spend a few hours over the course of a day (split from ~8am-12am). Sometimes it's less than that (I do have a job that needs my occasional attention) and sometimes on a slow-work-day, a lot more. Not sure I can answer the second part other than to say: as much as needs doing and as much as I can spare.
What do you as hopeful candidates envision for askubuntu.com in the future?
@MichaelMrozek I'm usually checking the site throughout the day, perhaps about four to six hours of real activity, I anticipate no change in that
@TheX More of the same, really. It would be nice to have some new question-closing options so we can push users to the right place and some features to tease helpful information out of users... But really, I think as a community we've already shown ourselves to be helpful people that can turn their efforts to solving most problems. More of that, please. Edit: I haven't really answered that from a moderator perspective but moderators and answerers ultimately have the same aim: to help people.
4:10 PM
How would you deal with a user who produced a steady stream of valuable answers, but tends to generate a large number of arguments/flags from comments?
@TheX I know there is talk of making askubuntu.com into ask.ubuntu.com as well as transitioning the current Q&A site for Ubuntu (LaunchPad Answers) to here. I hope to help facilitate as much of that movement as possible. While I love LaunchPad I think the LP Answers section is less than adequate compared to what SE has done here. I also hope to bring more attention to this improved chat software over the current use of IRC. In addition to promoting the continued high quality we've seen here.
A diamond will be attached to everything you say and have said in the past, including questions, answers and comments. Everything you will do will be seen under a different light. How do you feel about that?
@TheX Eventually, I hope we'll become the Ubuntu Support platform, such as we are for Ubuntu One at the moment. This will be a great mix of real world problems and basic question. I want to help the site run great, to enable this.
@MichaelMrozek This is a tough one to tackle. High quality users are the reason we have a successful site. Leave public sign posts that this argumentative (and ultimately disruptive) behavior isn't favored and remind them of the Ubuntu CoC which touches on how to act civilly while still voicing an opinion.
@MichaelMrozek I would try to talk to them. Most often, they'll just be slightly mistaken about the scope of the site, and a nice chat will resolve such conflict. As the wikipedians say: Assume good faith (and sometimes, assume no clue).
4:15 PM
@MichaelMrozek As a Pro Tempore Mod the Diamond is already attached to my name. My previous actions reflect my current actions which will ultimately reflect any future actions if re-elected
@MichaelMrozek If it's at the level where it's a problem, a discussion with them is the only real option. From that, if they feel there's something that needs to be discussed, I'd prompt them to start a thread on meta. They're helpful people, they'll see reason. Discussion helps everything.
Candidates, what are your thoughts on the new "Everyone Can Edit" policy? Are you in favor? How has the system been working (where you have seen it) so far?
@MichaelMrozek I make a special effort to be confident about everything I post here. I am perfectly happy for all of it to be viewed very critically, and if I'm wrong about something, made a mistake or just talked nonsense, I'm always happy to be corrected or shouted at. I didn't ever post anything I should be embarrassed about on this site, as far as I know. :)
@Josh I like it up until allowing anonymous edits. I believe that if you feel inclined to propose an edit you should at least sign up for an account to have your participation recorded. I think the Everyone Can Edit (ECE) Policy is a great idea to help take the weight of editing off those 2k users while focusing on the highest quality of questions and answers.
@MichaelMrozek Honestly, I think it would diminish the perceived value of my score slightly... But I would know it just helps me get the site working better. In short: I'd be proud of it.
4:17 PM
As many of you know, we like to have fun in the chat room sometimes, and even while commenting on questions, current moderators have been lenient about getting after people for various things, that would not fly on ubuntuforums.com or even the IRC channel. I feel this is important as it makes users feel that this is a open and hospitable place for all users. Will this continue to be the case?
@Josh It works. I've pushed through several edit recommendations and have rejected one. There's scope for abuse but it ultimately means (almost) anybody can help improve the site.
@Josh From all of the edits I've seen so far, It's been working brilliantly! Edits are of high quality, and I approve about 90% of them. My opinion is guided by how i perceive it to work, and for that reason, I'm completely in favour of the new policy.
what happened to garbagecollector?
@TheX I think we can afford to be slightly more lenient to the off-topic in chat because it's very much an additional service. Posting something like that in the forums or IRC interrupts the support flow. But ultimately, I think we should be striving to uphold the Ubuntu Code of Conduct here.
@TheX Some goofing around has been had in the chat room and I think that's the best place for it to occur. Like comments - the chat room is really a "2nd class citizen". As long as the conversation and comments aren't insulting or negatively toned they are fine. If something becomes offensive or quiet obviously "troll attack" it shouldn't fly.
@dustyprogrammer Isn't that you?
4:21 PM
@TheX Yes. A bit of banter doesn't hurt anybody, And I never saw anything in the AU chat that I would deem offensive. We aren't all that lenient, it's just that chat work very well if we allow 'off topic jazz'. It's a nice place to hang out, and it'll stay that way
As a moderator you'll have a "super vote", where your vote to close is very powerful - how do you feel about this and will it affect about how you currently vote to close?
@MarcoCeppi claps for a good answer
Do you have any plans/ideas for promoting the site to, and through the community at large?
@JorgeCastro I can imagine it affecting my voting, yes. I'll probably be much more careful about edge cases, but I'll also have the ability to deal with clear cases much quicker. I think it's positive.
@JorgeCastro It means I'll have think to see if the question could otherwise be rescued... But that's something I already do. Voting to close and Closing outright demand the same mentality. But if I'm not sure, it's easy enough to ask for support from the other users either by watching the votes or asking in chat.
4:26 PM
@JorgeCastro The super vote has changed the way I vote and now questionable closes I typically pose in the chat room or watch for how many others vote to close. I prefer coming in as the "nail in the coffin" rather than being the first to vote and close (as those judgement calls have proved wrong in the past for me)
@TheX Ask Ubuntu is everywhere I can put it - Email signatures with the email account I associate with Ubuntu - My Ubuntu Forums signature - and recommended to all the people I know who use Ubuntu or who I install and maintain Ubuntu with. I think we can expand more into the social sphere and the Ubuntu sphere with getting more teams to sign on to the idea of using it as a primary place for community support.
@JorgeCastro I think it's important to note that I don't think I'd shy away from the opportunity to close something if I really thought it needed closing. Leaving it on the site for others to flag or close it doesn't help the site. Closing it and waiting for the OP to improve the post (they can still edit) and then re-opening it is much healthier than leaving it open for people to post answers to ambiguous questions.
@TheX Tons of them of course :) Aside from promoting the site myself, I'd like to talk to projects and people about it. The Ubuntu One model is working great, and I want to help getting more projects on board in the same way.
Speaking of, how do you guys see AU's role in the rest of the ubuntu ecosystem?
@TheX My plan is pretty simple: Make the site awesome. When people can see we're the real deal (as they already do) they choose us over the rest.
@MarcoCeppi i knew i liked you :)
dustyprogrammer is garbagecollector!
fyi guys
4:31 PM
@JorgeCastro Pretty invasive at the moment. We overlap a lot and there aren't any easy answers on how to fix that (or even if we need to). We're helping lots of people and that is good. We just need to make sure our efforts don't hurt those with more underlying responsibility (eg we need to make sure bug reports end up on the trackers).
@JorgeCastro Similar to my answer prior - I think Ask Ubuntu can quickly become the new LP Answers a better community tightly knit around getting questions answered. In addition to opening up alternative methods for support (possibly via the SE Chat software) and becoming the place for community support - like a stronger more awesome and unified goal oriented platform hybrid of Ubuntu Forums and LP Answers (the best they have to offer with the cruft removed)
I have an issue about questions being reasked
I dont see much of them being closed as duplicates
we tend to just answer the questions at hand
i agree is better
but what do you guys think?
@JorgeCastro Exactly, we do have quite some overlap with other support channels, but we also have a chance to better integrate with things such as the bug tracker. It's certainly an area where there's room for improvement. Since I know pretty much how all of the other support channels work, I believe I could help out placing us in the greater community, so that we work together with the rest of them.
The following is a two part question I love using askubuntu.com to ask questions and get support, but more importantly it has been an outlet to allow me to give back to the community answering questions that I can with my limited knowledge of Ubuntu, or linux as a whole, coming from and working in a Windows world.
How do you plan on encouraging newer users to Ubuntu, and the site to continue to ask, and answer questions, even if they may not be the best, or most enlightening questions/answer, but perhaps more of a learning experience for these users?
@dustyprogrammer Merging answered duplicates is always going to be a big problem but we can make things easier on ourselves: get to the dupes faster and edit/tag questions so they're found by would-be dupe posters before they post. But it's just a way of life.
4:37 PM
@dustyprogrammer I'm only a 10k+ user on AU for a few days, and since then, i have a much easier time (due to the tools) finding those dupes and closing them. As a moderator, that'll be even more efficient, because of the super-ninja vote I can use on easy cases. Now, on the other hand, I have to disagree: I think we're working very well to close dupes quickly. If there's a specific post you like to see closed, you can always come and talk to me and us about it. It's a great help
@dustyprogrammer I think the policy of forward closing and if possible forward merging has been working (closing the less 'higher-quality' question as a duplicate of the better one) since the newer question typically has higher quality and better investment by the OP meaning it'll make more sense for users. Catching the obvious poor quality duplicates and closing them earlier will help prevent these from becoming a common practice.
@TheX I always make an effort to check if a user is knew, gauge their competence regarding ubuntu, and - always - make them feel as welcome as possible. Even if their question or answer isn't great. Leading by example has worked very well in the past. If they make a mistake, I'll explain it, and they usually turn out to have great fun using the site. Without naming names, there were a few users who had trouble understanding the site, and are now awesome contributors we couldn't live without.
kk sounds good
@dustyprogrammer I agree by the way, time of posting shouldn't be the only consideration when it comes to closing one post or the other as a dupe
thats what i was getting at :)
4:42 PM
@TheX There isn't a non-organic way of getting new users to interact other than making their experience here as pleasant and helpful as possible. For moderators, this means making sure they understand what we expect from a question or answer before taking action. As I said in my promotion answer earlier, the better we can make the site, the more people we'll have using it. Just as people do with IRC and the Forums, new posters will occasionally stumble in and start answering something they see
do you guys think there is a place for customization of ubuntu on AU. I feel that would help bring another crowd to AU as well as user to ubuntu
since that was what initally drew me here
just an observation -- It seems like there is a design bias towards answering questions first, because of the possible rep increase.
@dustyprogrammer What kind of customizations?
@dustyprogrammer As long as these questions are about customising Ubuntu, i.e. in the scope of the FAQ, they are very welcome indeed.
How do each of you feel about pursuing Ubuntu membership and abiding by the Leadership Code of Conduct?
4:45 PM
@MarcoCeppi well theme customizations, system customizations gui stuff
Because of the mix of user sophistication in AskUbuntu, is there anything else that can be done to encourage good citizenship -- i.e., voting, duplicate question checking, not being an asshat, etc.. What are your views on my premise and (if it follows) possible solutions.
@JorgeCastro how much does it cost?
@jgbelacqua Of course... But what would you have us do? Fine people who post in dupes? The real problem comes from people being able to post duplicates in the first place. That's the problem we need to try and solve.
@dustyprogrammer it's free
@Oli respect
@JorgeCastro sign me up
4:46 PM
@jgbelacqua I would argue that those get high rep because they are very readable, in contrast to a wall of (possibly very informative) text. This is, in my opinion, a great way to make your answer easy to understand and nice to read. They deserve every upvote :)
@JorgeCastro I've been considering membership since I hit 10k and I confess I haven't seen the Leadership Code of Conduct. **googles**
@JorgeCastro I've thought heavily about becoming an Ubuntu Member. However, I realize while I put a lot of time towards Ask Ubuntu and have a few projects in LaunchPad I don't contribute enough to have such a nice status of Ubuntu Member I'd rather increase my contributions directly to the Ubuntu project before weighing my membership application on "Moderator of Ask Ubuntu". I have signed the CoC and agree to the Leadership CoC as it is aligned with my views prior to joining AU
I'm in the process of becoming a member, and I've signed the Code of Conduct ages ago :) I think it's been a great tool in forming a community that works towards the same goal. It also makes people aware of possible issues of communication.
I want to see a culture where the very active users of AU become members of the Ubuntu project.
@dustyprogrammer I think there's a place for it on AU but I don't personally have a vested interest which is why I don't ask questions about it
We've got about 10 minutes left, so we've got time for a few more questions. If you're planning to ask a question, speak now or forever hold your peace! (;
4:51 PM
@JorgeCastro To further the point - if AU becomes more intertwined into the Ubuntu community I would consider it a lot more.
Hehe, it seems like in each THC when I give the 10 minute warning, I kill the conversation. ):
@RebeccaChernoff Nooo! :P
@RebeccaChernoff It was slowing down anyway :-)
everyone is thinking harder
Think harder...quicker? q:
4:53 PM
@JorgeCastro As for the Leadership CoC, I'm fine with the conduct element but I'm, honestly, slightly more hesitant about the parts that suggest I tug the party line. I'm an honest person. If I see something I don't like in Ubuntu, I'm not sure I could (or would want to) censor myself if asked about something directly. I'm not saying I'd be disruptive on purpose but hopefully you can see the crossover and the differences.
I have had fun, and think it is great that the community at large gets to choose their leaders... good luck to each of you!
I don't see what tugging the party line has to do with it?
@JorgeCastro I thought about this carefully before signing: There is nothing in the Code of Conduct that prevents me from speaking my mind, even on very controversial issues.
@JorgeCastro In that case, there isn't a problem =) I read the section on "Respecting Ubuntu Processes and Principles" more cynically than perhaps I should have. My fault for being British, I guess
4:57 PM
hah, +1 on the "my fault for being British"
@oli, funny, you don't sound british.
I'd like four candles please
Alright, we're just about out of time.
does anyone else think the FAQ might need to be expanded to help new or old and confused visitors?
4:58 PM
Thank you so much to @RebeccaChernoff for putting this on and the SE Team for their hard work on this amazing platform!
Question (after @jgbelacqua's): Final thoughts from the candidates please. (:
@jgbelacqua I think the FAQ could be a little bit better, but it's a difficult problem and we need to think carefully before messing with it, it's a very important page.
@jgbelacqua As moderators we have the power to expand some sections of the FAQ - I think a meta thread with ideas would be the best start for this
@jgbelacqua I'm sure our remit and functionality will change in time, so yes. Thankfully the entire community is pretty good at catching early mistakes people make and helping them into the right way of doing things.
good, thanks.
5:00 PM
what is the process of removing a moderator from office if he/she goes rogue?
@TheX Tranq darts, no?
Jeff and Joel in a Jurassic Park style jeep...
@thex ooh, that's a good one. maybe for meta.stackoverflow?
@jgbelacqua i'll put it on there
@thex hilarious and also relevant
@RebeccaChernoff Final thoughts: Good session. Not only have I liked the questions but I've liked the answers that other people have given. Whatever the outcome, I think we're in good hands. Ps: thanks for hosting it!
5:03 PM
@TheX At anytime any member can contact [email protected] to report misconduct or concerns (as well as using the meta.stackoverflow site)
@TheX We send in the unicorns. You don't want to mess with the unicorns...
@RebeccaChernoff My final thoughts: If you vote for me, I'll be here to talk to you, I'll be considerate and consistent. And if I make a mistake, I'll correct it quickly. I wouldn't have nominated myself if I didn't think I'd be able to make a difference, and AskUbuntu is a great opportunity for us to build a prototype community support platform. The best of them all. Let's do that.
@RebeccaChernoff snort . I mean <unicorn snort>
first time in this election I made an effort to advertise myself, hehe :)
thanks, candidates!
5:04 PM
I've said it many times before, but I will say again: good luck to all the candidates and as always, THANK YOU @RebeccaChernoff FOR YOUR DEDICATION AND HARD WORK FOR OUR COMMUNITIES!!!
@RebeccaChernoff Good luck to all candidates and whatever the outcome I'm hooked on AU
woo, thanks everyone!
@jgbelacqua join the general room real quick please
I will be creating a "digest" of this Town Hall. I will update this answer with a link to it, and will post details here. Should be later this afternoon.
@RebeccaChernoff This has been great, thank you very much for making it happen, and for the brilliant organisation and planning. great stuff
A summary of this town hall chat will be posted, @Josh has taken that over and is doing a great job with that, so major kudos to him!
5:05 PM
Thanks to @MichaelMrozek for his help with the digest version!
@RebeccaChernoff why thank you :-)
@RebeccaChernoff @Oli @JorgeCastro @MarcoCeppi @MichaelMrozek @Josh @TheX Thanks for the great chat. It was a nice experience.
@KaustubhP thank you...
Thanks to all that participated. So concluded. (:
So say we all.
Hi there
5:07 PM

 Ask Ubuntu General Room

Normally: General discussion around Ask Ubuntu, Ubuntu & offic...
I'm going
3 hours later…
8:21 PM
@MarcoCeppi I think I missed your answer (if it existed) to:
3 hours ago, by TheX
How do you plan on encouraging newer users to Ubuntu, and the site to continue to ask, and answer questions, even if they may not be the best, or most enlightening questions/answer, but perhaps more of a learning experience for these users?
@Josh Editing and commenting to help guide users to our high quality standards. Leading mostly by example
Thanks! I'll include that
@Oli I think I missed your answer to the following (if it exists):
3 hours ago, by dustyprogrammer
do you guys think there is a place for customization of ubuntu on AU. I feel that would help bring another crowd to AU as well as user to ubuntu
2 hours later…
10:09 PM
The town hall digest is available:
Q: 2011 Moderator Election - Town Hall Chat Digest

JoshThe following is a "digest" version of the 2011 Moderator Election Town Hall Chat . The format, as described on Meta Stack Overflow, is one answer to this question for every question asked in the Town Hall, containing all the candidate's answers to that question. To view the digest chronological...

If anyone has corrections, please notify me in here, on the question, or in the Town Hall Discussion Room, and I will address them ASAP. Thanks!
1 hour later…
11:29 PM
@Josh I missed it. I added it to the post as a comment.
@Oli I just saw that. Works for me!
There was another one where the first part of my answer was missing so I've edited that post.
If you prefer @Oli you can answer here
That way I will include your answers in the exact same format
Up to you
It's okay as a comment.
@Oli Easier for me :-)

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