Language Overflow

CowperKettle

17:01

I wish you all the best at the exam! Study harder!

Come back in the summer and report stellar results.

Maybe interstellar even.

M.A.R.

Thank you

Best of luck to you too

CowperKettle

(0:

I'll go and translate some (0:

M.A.R.

Hey, what's the greatest achievement a translator and a biker can achieve?

CowperKettle

Earn enough for a living (0:

And translate some poetry

Damkerng T.

Poetry is important!

> Poetry is the spontaneous overflow of powerful feelings: it takes its origin from emotion recollected in tranquility.

Jim Reynolds

17:10

Poetry is the taste of a grape enveloped in whispers of the heart

Damkerng T.

Nice!

M.A.R.

Oooh, ''Fences'' seems like a nice movie.

I expected ''Collateral Beauty'' to be nice, but critics say otherwise.

''Assassin's Creed'' disappointed.

Damkerng T.

@M.A.R. Oh! I had a hunch that it could be disappointing when I saw its poster!

M.A.R.

@DamkerngT. Why?

Damkerng T.

It tried too hard to look cool.

M.A.R.

17:18

That's a very wise outlook

But might end up cynical.

Oh, ''why him?'' doesn't seem to be as interesting as I depicted it

Jim Reynolds

17:32

@Færd Yes. I saw Memento when it was released, so don't remember too many details, but it worked better intuitively for me. I like the end of the first paragraph here: rogerebert.com/reviews/memento-2001

CowperKettle

Can one write "The delivery should include all necessary documentation", meaning by "delivery" all the stuff that will be delivered: the main piece of equipment, the auxiliary tools, etc?

I thought of "The delivery package should include" but isn't "package" a small box? Thus I dropped it.

yubraj

17:52

From Cambridge grammar today -Even and comparatives

We often use even with comparative adjectives and adverbs to add more emphasis:

It is six years since U2 played in Belfast in 1987 on their world-conquering Joshua Tree tour. Since then they have become even bigger and richer, and their concerts even more popular.

[talking about a footballer]

Frank played well last season and this season he has played even better.

Is "even more/better are like further more/better as 'even' is emphasizing on further ahead of something?

Jim Reynolds

@yubraj Cannot understand your question

V.V.

18:13

Good evening.

@M.A.R. how are you?

Anonymous

@yubraj You have to learn how to use punctuation properly.

CowperKettle

@V.V. he is studying hard (I hope)

> All measuring instruments that come with the equipment should permit their verification/calibration in accordance with the (?) applicable Russian rules and regulations.

Officialese is the taste of bullshit enveloped in whispers of applicable rules and regulations.

yubraj

18:28

I mean is 'even' means te same as 'further' ?

CowperKettle

@yubraj We can't say "further better"

yubraj

Further more/better/worse

CowperKettle

The general sense is that "he could have played at the same level, because that level was already good" --- but! -- he did some extra stuff, and played even better

yubraj

I think in "even more/worse/better", even means 'further'

Why to use 'even better' ? Is it it was better before but nw he has played more better than previous?

CowperKettle

"even" means something like "in addition" (when this addition was not required)

yubraj

18:34

So I was saying "further" -further more

CowperKettle

I asked my sister to buy me an ice-cream cone. She bought it, and even unwrapped the top for me.

And then she asked: why do you need an ice cream cone at minus 27°C?

And I replied: this is only an example sentence for the StackExchange chat.

yubraj

"In addition" .....ok

Damkerng T.

I guess even is one of the defining words.

Let's see if I guessed right...

Yes, it is.

pu-kumamoto.ac.jp/~rlavin/resources/wordlists/LDV.html

My point about the mentioning of defining words is that I think it's probably better not to try to understand even as a new word, but try to learn it as if it were a word in your first language.

I tried to come up with a good explanation what even means, and failed.

Which means that even is very, very close to my first language.

yubraj

In English Grammar today- even adverb (EMPHASIS)

B1 used to emphasize a comparison:
The next 36 hours will be even colder with snow showers becoming more widespread.
Any devaluation of the pound would make it even more difficult to keep inflation low.
More examples

Thesaurus: synonyms and related words

even adverb (MORE EXACTLY)

used when you want to be more exact or detailed about something you have just said:
I find some of his habits somewhat unpleasant, disgusting even.
She has always been very kind to me, even generous on occasion.

Damkerng T.

(Compared to words in my first language and words in English.)

yubraj

18:49

Even colder/more/worse/better. ...........etc

V.V.

used to show that something is surprising, unusual, unexpected, or extreme:

yubraj

Does it mean more than "more/better/worse/colder".....etc ?

Damkerng T.

Not really.

yubraj

Oh

V.V.

Not more but with these effects

Damkerng T.

18:53

Let's try to paraphrase it (note that this doesn't mean that we should always paraphrase every even the same way):

> Original: She has always been very kind to me, even generous on occasion.

> Paraphrased: She hasn't just always been very kind to me. She's also been generous on occasion.

V.V.

Let him give examples and see what isn't clear

Damkerng T.

But the paraphrased alternative sounds bland. It doesn't feel like her generosity is unique/surprising/extraordinary in any way.

> Paraphrased with even: She hasn't just always been very kind to me. She's been generous on occasion, even!

yubraj

t sounds like 'not only. ...but also

Damkerng T.

You could think of it like that, sort of.

But it's even more than not only ... but also ...

CowperKettle

Would it be okay to call the instruction coming with a pharmaceutical sterilizer chamber owner's manual or is that term only appropriate when a thing is sold to a physical person and not to a company?

yubraj

18:58

How is it even more than 'not only. ..but also'?

Damkerng T.

@yubraj The tone. The shade of meaning. The shade of something surprising.

CowperKettle

@yubraj nice description: it emphasizes a comparison

Damkerng T.

@CowperKettle I suppose it's okay, if it's for the owner!

yubraj

Ok

V.V.

@CowperKettle not user's?

yubraj

19:01

But its meaning is just like "not only. ..but also' ? Right ?

Damkerng T.

They're in the same direction, I'd say. Yes.

But they're not exactly the same.

Like purple and violet. They aren't the same.

yubraj

Because "even" is adding extra information, It also seems like 'in addition to'

Damkerng T.

Yes, you could say that.

(I suppose even is like magenta. It's brighter to me!)

@CoKoder Welcome to the room!

Oh, today's the last day of Winter Bash, right?!

yubraj

Thanks.....@dem @cwp

Damkerng T.

My pleasure!

CowperKettle

19:09

@DamkerngT. what if the manual includes isntructions on operation and on maintenance of the sterilizer unit? O_O Would it be okay to write Operating and service manual, I wonder.

Those official formulations knock me for a loop

yubraj

I need to sleep...Good bye ! See u

CowperKettle

Shubh ratri, Yubraj!

Damkerng T.

@CowperKettle I think so. (I think operation and service manual is probably more common, at least in telecom.)

CowperKettle

@DamkerngT. thank you!

Damkerng T.

@yubraj Have a good sleep!

@CowperKettle Sure! :D

1

Q: Is 'ex' of 'extinct' pronounced differently from that of 'exactly'?

This question below is from my English book exercise: Choose the word whose underlined part is pronounced differently from that of the other words a. exactly b. exist c. exhaust d. extinct (Because I couldn't underline the part of each word in this post, I made it bold) After tr...

pronunciation

I'm pretty sure this is tricky to many learners.

Because the unreleased /g/ and unreleased /k/ have no sound!

We can only hear the sound of the vowel before the /g/ or the /k/ in a given syllable.

Oh! I should document this, too ...

> Communicating through Vague Language: A Comparative Study of L1 and L2 Speakers

I wonder if my guess is more correct.

I don't think that the reason that the Chinese use lots of less than a lot of is because the language is insensitive to the distinction between countable and uncountable nouns.

I think it's because a lot of is easier to pronounce (than lots of) by native speakers of Chinese dialects.

Jim Reynolds

19:25

@CowperKettle User's manual

Damkerng T.

@JimReynolds Hmm... do you mean that owner's manual is incorrect?

Or it's just your preferred choice.

Mick

@DamkerngT. Operation and Maintenance Manual is more usual. Service Manuals are normally designed for field service engineers (engineers who service equipment on customers' premises).

Damkerng T.

@Mick Sounds like the common choice is different in each field!

Mick

Could be.

Jim Reynolds

19:47

@DamkerngT. I think it is more modern, and that is because it recognizes that a user is not always an owner

Damkerng T.

nods -- I think I've seen both, used almost interchangeably, especially when the user and the owner are likely to be one and the same.

Jim Reynolds

Agree

Though I would say there's a trend toward user's

Damkerng T.

Probably. I'm not sure. I guess you're right.

user2684291

21:35

"Why must you capitalize the first word of a sentence?" ~ "You don't have to; it's just convention." What's the difference between "a convention" and its uncountable variant? When would you prefer the first, and when the second?

Would the countable version sound stronger or more assertive, as though they're introducing the term "convention" as well as providing the explanation?

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