Language Overflow

Cardinal

18:07

sawasdee khrap

Why the answer has been deleted:

0

Q: How to refer back to the just mentioned subject?

I wrote: Syntactic parsing is a basic task in natural language processing and the grammar plays a crucial role in this ??. First I would like to know how to fill the gap (??). I thought of "regard", "respect", "task", "ground", or nothing and just "this". Second I don't know if I should u...

BTW, I was thinking to one of @StoneyB's comments

TIPS

@Nihilist_Frost But how can you possibly make a subordinate clause mean that without rendering it ungrammatical?

Cardinal

He use a verb "extract into"

TIPS

@Cardinal You're still using this ungrammatically.

Nihilist_Frost

@TIPS I wasn't referring to subordinate clauses specifically.

Cardinal

I am struggling to know what it means?

TIPS

18:09

It's much better if you never use "to" at all.

@Cardinal *what it means

Cardinal

@TIPS I seeeeeeee

:D

Nihilist_Frost

I was talking about adding clauses that I'm explaining into my explanations as demonstration

TIPS

@Cardinal Where is Stoney's comment?

Cardinal

@TIPS yes, I see, I make this mistake every now and then

TIPS

@Nihilist_Frost You're too fancy

Damkerng T.

18:10

@Cardinal The only answer is still there, I think.

Nihilist_Frost

@TIPS lol

Cardinal

The answer has been deleted :(

@DamkerngT. There were two answers

CowperKettle

Evening, Cardinal!

TIPS

@Cardinal If it sticks, you'll run into some trouble with it. Quit using it.

Cardinal

I think @Fumble Fingers had answered

Nihilist_Frost

18:11

tf:dr I wrote the clauses in question into my explanations

Damkerng T.

@Cardinal Oh! I can see only one!

Cardinal

@CowperKettle Hi Cop, good evening

CowperKettle

> Interleukin 17 (IL17A) is a pro-inflammatory cytokine, which is the homodimeric glycosylated polypeptide with the weight of 20-30 kDa, and is produced by the subtype of the activated T CD4+-cells (Th17-cells).

Cardinal

@CowperKettle Is this English?

:d

CowperKettle

@Cardinal Yes, and quite nice English. Only the articles are a bit off, but the meaning is 99% clear.

Articles are so hard to get right..

Cardinal

18:13

There are several words that I haven't seen before

CowperKettle

kDa?

That's a weight unit.

Cardinal

"homodimeric glycosylated polypeptide"

CowperKettle

homodimeric = consists of look-alike dimers.. no, wait.

Damkerng T.

My style: Interleukin 17 (IL17A) is a pro-inflammatory cytokine, a homodimeric glycosylated polypeptide weights 20-30 kDa produced by a subtype of activated T CD4+-cells (Th17-cells).

CowperKettle

> Interleukin 17 (IL17A) is a pro-inflammatory cytokine, a homodimeric glycosylated polypeptide weighing 20-30 kDa and produced by a subtype of activated T CD4+-cells (Th17-cells).

Nice, Dam!

Damkerng T.

18:16

Hmm... maybe I need a 'that'.

Yes, or weighting!

Cardinal

@TIPS I see, I should do so

TIPS

@CowperKettle Yes, that's what it's intended to mean.

CowperKettle

@TIPS - thank you! I thought that maybe it was a dimer consisting of two lookalike parts.

Cardinal

{ the very familiar question} Shouldn't it be:
and **it** produced by a subtype of activated T CD4+-cells (Th17-cells).

Damkerng T.

Ah, my version doesn't have and. But and should be okay there, too.

@Cardinal It would be ungrammatical with it.

TIPS

18:25

@Cardinal No, the subject of the sentence you're referring to is empty.

Cardinal

nods

That topic can be really tricky

I mean, I know that "and" can be used to relate two independent setences

TIPS

@Cardinal Yes, but that is irrelevant.

Cardinal

BUTTT, the fact is there are some cases in which the subject is left out

Damkerng T.

Basically, what I did was turning a clause into a noun phrase.

TIPS

Ellipsis in Persian is almost as prominent as it is in English, hence I never really had any problems with it. You shouldn't either.

@Cardinal *left

And this is called "ellipsis".

@DamkerngT. Teach me thy tricks!

Damkerng T.

18:28

Oh, you sure already know it!

Cardinal

@TIPS What about the case when we want to emphasize on something?

TIPS

@Cardinal That is, what, emphasis.

What else should it be called?

Cardinal

@TIPS What is the verb elide ?

@TIPS I talked about "and it" in "Persian"

TIPS

No common verbs to my knowledge. Not in this sense.

Nihilist_Frost

@Cardinal it means to omit sounds or words

Cardinal

18:30

@Nihilist_Frost I see, thanks

TIPS

@Nihilist_Frost I believe he meant "what is the verb? "Elide"?"

Nihilist_Frost

@TIPS if that's the case, FML

Cardinal

@Nihilist_Frost :)))

Nihilist_Frost

@Cardinal FML = F*** my life

Cardinal

I knew that

Damkerng T.

18:32

Phrase of the Day: snake in the grass

TIPS

Damkerng T.

(Just heard it on TV)

TIPS

@DamkerngT. I've heard this before.

Cardinal

I meant what is the verb describe the process of ellipsis similar to "omit" or "leave out"

Damkerng T.

@TIPS Noice! :P

(That's my British accent.)

TIPS

18:34

@DamkerngT. And now you've officially moved to Australia.

Damkerng T.

Haha!

CowperKettle

> IL17A is mainly produced by activated Th17 cells, constituting a separate subtype of T-helper cells (CD4 +)

Do we change the position of a frequency adverb in a passive sentence?

Because it's a passive construction, the adverb goes after the verb?

Cardinal

I think adverbs usually follow auxiliary verbs

CowperKettle

I believe "mainly" should go after "produced"

Damkerng T.

Hmm... I guess is mainly produced by is more common than is produced mainly by, but both should be okay.

Cardinal

18:38

However, I think that changes the focus of sentence, IMHO

CowperKettle

> IL17A is produced mainly by activated Th17 cells, constituting a separate subtype of T-helper cells (CD4 +)

Cardinal

"is mainly produced" is more common to my learner ears

CowperKettle

NGRAM

Damkerng T.

No real difference!

CowperKettle

I favor my version.. but too tired to ask a question on main site

Damkerng T.

18:41

Oh! The BrE and AmE charts look different!

@CowperKettle is mainly produced by is much more common in AmE!

(if Google Ngram is reliable)

CowperKettle

@DamkerngT. Bloody Yanks!

Damkerng T.

:P

CowperKettle

(0:

They vitiate our language!

Damkerng T.

What? You mean the American language? :P

CowperKettle

(0:

Cardinal

18:45

I do not know why I can imagine" is mainly produced by activated" faster than " is produced mainly by activated".

TIPS

@CowperKettle Dunno why I read that as "bloody tanks!"

Cardinal

@TIPS Russians are in love with Tanks

TIPS

@Cardinal The adverb hinders fast comprehension. This is a regular practice of examiners.

@Cardinal I thought that was Swedes?

Cardinal

@TIPS I see

@TIPS I have no idea

So, when we want to refer to a thing that already mentioned in the previous sentence, we must omit the subject.

Damkerng T.

???

Cardinal

18:52

Considering two sentences related by a coordinating conjunction

e.g., and

TIPS

FYI, @Dam @Snail @Arau @Cat @Jim @Cowp english.stackexchange.com/election/4

Damkerng T.

@TIPS Hah!

Catija

@TIPS I know ;) :P

TIPS

@DamkerngT. I think we began a course on ellipsis.

@Catija Then you should've told me earlier than you know.

Catija

Actually, I almost mentioned it in here just now.

TIPS

18:53

But then slipped

Catija

I just found out about... 10 minutes ago.

Damkerng T.

Hi, @Catija!

Catija

Hi!

Damkerng T.

I thought mods were permanent!

TIPS

@Catija Wow, too slow, mod hippo

Cardinal

18:54

Hi

TIPS

@DamkerngT. They are. Only new ones will be added.

@Catija Hai

Damkerng T.

@Cardinal "Must omit" is too strong.

Catija

@TIPS You move slowly when you're two weeks away from birthing a baby.

Cardinal

What does "Catija" means

@DamkerngT. I used it delibrately

TIPS

You stay a mod unless you literally disappear for six months, or resign. @Dam

@Catija Oh. My. God!

Damkerng T.

18:55

@TIPS I see.

Cardinal

since "that is ungrammatical" was too strong

TIPS

I suddenly turned into "!" mode.

Damkerng T.

@TIPS :-)

Catija

@Cardinal It's sort of an intentional misspelling of the Russian/Eastern European version of Catherine... which is my given name.

Damkerng T.

@Cardinal that is ungrammatical where?

TIPS

18:56

@Cardinal Ellipsis is not the case in your example.

You don't just have the subject ellipsis'd, but also the auxiliary "is".

If you add "is", your instance would be grammatical.

Cardinal

"{ the very familiar question} Shouldn't it be:
and **it** produced by a subtype of activated T CD4+-cells (Th17-cells)."

TIPS

37 mins ago, by Cardinal

{ the very familiar question} Shouldn't it be:
and **it** produced by a subtype of activated T CD4+-cells (Th17-cells).

I believe.

BTW @Cat congrats and all.

Is it a boy?

Damkerng T.

I don't think that's grammatical. At least it's very awkward.

Cardinal

@Catija It is cool

Catija

@TIPS Thanks :D and yes.

TIPS

18:59

@DamkerngT. It's grammatical, but semantically not working.

"It", referring to IL17A, does not produce something, but is produced in cells.

Cardinal

I thought "produce" can be an intransitive verb

TIPS

How is that relevant?

Cardinal

and it produced, no leaving out

TIPS

Your "produced" is in passive.

It really is "is produced", but "is" is omitted as it's been repeated in the previous clause.

Damkerng T.

@TIPS Grammaticality should consider the intended meaning, too, IMO.

Cardinal

19:02

@TIPS I see your point

Damkerng T.

> OKAY: Sonny is a robot, a brand new robot working for Mr. Pip, manufactured by US Robotics.

TIPS

@DamkerngT. Yes, I was wrong.

I was in the middle of pointing it out.

Damkerng T.

> NOT OKAY: Sonny is a robot, a brand new robot working for Mr. Pip, it manufactured by US Robotics.

> ALSO OKAY: Sonny is a robot, a brand new robot working for Mr. Pip, a robot manufactured by US Robotics.

TIPS

YES

I LIKE ALL-CAPS TALK

Damkerng T.

:D

TIPS

19:10

ALL-CAPS SMILEY!

Cardinal

... working for Mr. Pip, it started to malfunctioning since last night

What about that?

Damkerng T.

That would be a run-on sentence.

Cardinal

nods

TIPS

"to malfunctioning" IS DEFINITELY UNGRAMMATICAL.

OH WAIT, PERHAPS A RUN-ON SENTENCE.

Damkerng T.

I stopped at started. :D

Cardinal

19:12

@DamkerngT. I thought It is a P.v

Damkerng T.

P.v?

Hmm... Participle verb?

Cardinal

yayyy

like admit to

TIPS

YOU CAN'T FORCE THINGS TO BE THINGS

@Cardinal THAT'S PSEUDO-GRAMMAR

Cardinal

@TIPS does run-on sentences have something with Caps-on-sentences ?

Catija

"I listened to malfunctioning speakers all day."

TIPS

19:15

PERSIAN ANALYSES ARE MUCH DIFFERENT FROM ENGLISH'S.

@Catija THAT IS NOT THE SENTENCE IN QUESTION

OK done with all-caps for a day.

Catija

@TIPS Chill! Just saying that it's possible.

TIPS

Stay tuned in for tomorrow's shouting.

@Catija Chills

For two weeks, I'll do whatever @Catija tells me to do.

Catija

:D Yay! I have control!

Cardinal

... working for Mr. Pip, it started malfunctioning last night

Catija

@Cardinal You can't use "since" that way.

Cardinal

19:18

What about that

Catija

"... it has been malfunctioning since last night." OR "... it started malfunctioning last night."

Cardinal

I see @Catija

TIPS

@Cardinal No.

Still doesn't work well.

Cardinal

@Catija I edited that

TIPS

What are you? "It"'s merchandiser?

Cardinal

19:20

@TIPS :)))

Catija

See... but editing just makes me look crazy. I'm going to wait four minutes to respond so that you can't edit before you read my answers.

Cardinal

I am a noob learner

Damkerng T.

> NOT OKAY: Sonny is a robot, a brand new robot working for Mr. Pip, I love it!

> NOT OKAY: Sonny is a robot, a brand new robot working for Mr. Pip, it loves me!

Cardinal

@Catija Ah, I am sorry for that

Catija

Mostly I'm teasing :D

Cardinal

19:26

Oh I forgot to put the coordinator conjunction "and" :|

Sonny is a robot and it started malfunctioning last night.

Damkerng T.

That's fine. :-)

Cardinal

I am really out of ease, at the moment. :|

If you look to the first question you will see that I asked the question on the promise that "and" can link two sentences

33 mins ago, by Cardinal

"{ the very familiar question} Shouldn't it be:
and **it** produced by a subtype of activated T CD4+-cells (Th17-cells)."

I though "produce" can be an intransitive verb at the moment

Similar to "form"

TIPS

Again, that is irrelevant.

Cardinal

@TIPS do you mean that "by" make us use a passive structure?

TIPS

No, the auxiliary "is" is.

Since when do you passivize using a preposition?

Cardinal

19:35

What should I do If I do not want to use "is" after that "and"?

Catija

Well, it won't mean the same thing but if you omit "by" it's grammatically correct... "... and it produced a subtype of ..." But if it is the product, then you need to say "is produced".

TIPS

@Cardinal Now I need to find the original sentence.

Damkerng T.

1 hour ago, by Damkerng T.

My style: Interleukin 17 (IL17A) is a pro-inflammatory cytokine, a homodimeric glycosylated polypeptide weights 20-30 kDa produced by a subtype of activated T CD4+-cells (Th17-cells).

Cardinal

@Catija I was thinking to the same thing

Damkerng T.

My first revision wasn't grammatical. CowperKettle fixed it, but he added and. (I didn't notice this and at first.)

1 hour ago, by CowperKettle

> Interleukin 17 (IL17A) is a pro-inflammatory cytokine, a homodimeric glycosylated polypeptide weighing 20-30 kDa and produced by a subtype of activated T CD4+-cells (Th17-cells).

Cardinal

19:40

I was thinking to intransitive verbs similar to "form" and "shape" at that moment

Buttt, that "by" is the bottleneck.

Anonymous

@Araucaria Oh! I thought you said phonemes.

Anonymous

My brain, it is not a top-of-the-line model.

Damkerng T.

@snailplane Hehe! Same here!

Catija

@DamkerngT. Yes, that looks like a good phrasing to me.

TIPS

@snailplane I was about to make a systematic approach at the problem, but Stoney's wit stunned me.

Damkerng T.

19:42

@Catija I personally wouldn't use and there, but I think it should be okay.

Catija

@DamkerngT. ... depends... should there be a comma after "20-30 kDa"?

Where's the original sentence source?

Cardinal

@Catija In a Kettle's mind

@CowperKettle

Damkerng T.

To be honest, I was thinking between adding a that and fixing it with participle.

2 hours ago, by CowperKettle

> Interleukin 17 (IL17A) is a pro-inflammatory cytokine, which is the homodimeric glycosylated polypeptide with the weight of 20-30 kDa, and is produced by the subtype of the activated T CD4+-cells (Th17-cells).

^Original.

Catija

Yeah, so with the comma, then the "and" makes sense... because you're ignoring that intervening phrase...

Cardinal

What is "^" called in English? I refer to it as power !:)

Catija

19:47

> Interleukin 17 (IL17A) is a pro-inflammatory cytokine and is produced by the subtype of the activated T CD4+-cells (Th17-cells).

@Cardinal caret... which is technically French but we use their word.

It's pronounced like the vegetable "carrot".

Cardinal

@Catija Thank you Catija

Catija

Whoops, misspelled it :P

Cardinal

4 minutes is too much for a native.

Catija

@DamkerngT. "that" wouldn't be a bad idea, though.

@Cardinal As a mod, I can edit stuff forever :P I don't have a time limit.

Cardinal

@Catija ha ha ha, I forgot that, I see =))

Damkerng T.

19:50

:D

Catija

> Interleukin 17 (IL17A) is a pro-inflammatory cytokine that is produced by the subtype of the activated T CD4+-cells (Th17-cells).

Though, to be honest, it's all really technical, so I'm not even sure what it means. :P

Damkerng T.

The problem is I wanted it to be concise, so I turned the latter part into an appositive.

Come to think of it, my first revision is probably fine as is.

TIPS

@Catija Ugh, urrrgh, I am NOT burning

Damkerng T.

> Interleukin 17 (IL17A) is a pro-inflammatory cytokine, a homodimeric glycosylated polypeptide weights 20-30 kDa produced by a subtype of activated T CD4+-cells (Th17-cells).

(If we read it as a that is omitted.)

Catija

@TIPS With jealousy?

TIPS

19:54

I said, I'm NOT burning!

Cardinal

what about this :
polypeptide weights 20-30 kDa **and** produced by a ...

Damkerng T.

I think it's more about style. Usually, I wouldn't use and in my appositives, unless it's at least three parts.

Cardinal

nods

Damkerng T.

(Even when it has three parts, I probably don't use and, anyway.)

TIPS

@Cardinal It isn't wrong.

I like postmodifiers way more too.

Damkerng T.

19:56

> He was a great man, a writer, a teacher, a father, a leader, an inventor, an innovator, among other things.

Anonymous

@DamkerngT. I want and there.

Damkerng T.

I think so (after finished it!)

Anonymous

Asyndetic coordination isn't wrong, though.

Damkerng T.

I probably shouldn't've added "among other things".

Catija

> Interleukin 17 (IL17A) is a pro-inflammatory cytokine, a homodimeric glycosylated polypeptide with a weight of 20-30 kDa, that is produced by a subtype of activated T CD4+-cells (Th17-cells).

Damkerng T.

19:59

Ah, that's probably a different sentence from mine!

I mean, it sounds like "produced by" is for the cytokine.

I read it as "polypeptide is produced by". (I don't know if my understanding is correct or not, though.)

Cardinal

nods

Damkerng T.

Have a nice chat, everyone! o/

Cardinal

BB

o/

Cardinal

20:39

Catija

That's a lot of pillows.

Cardinal

Could you see the image? I could not see what I am uploading

sounds weird

The Great Depression. Flour companies learned that many poor mothers used flour bags to make clothing for their children and began selling their flour in different decorative colorful bags, USA, 1930s.

@Catija Those are floor bags :/

> Astronauts Donald Slayton and Thomas Stafford, the participants of the ’’Soyuz-Apollo’’ program, learning Russian, 1974.

You will find several rare photos here:
http://brightside.me/article/20-rare-shots-that-will-turn-everything-you-know-about-history-upside-down-94005/

Some of them are really astonishing.

> A coat sale in Copenhagen, 1936.

Araucaria

21:41

@StoneyB That's a good one. What's the 's' though?

StoneyB

22:08

@Araucaria His

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