The Nineteenth Byte

Dannyu NDos

00:09

The existence of the surrogates was a mistake.

l4m2

00:33

Anywhere like bad UTF8 string?

Bbrk24

00:53

thank you lldb very cool

Unrelated String

03:56

Why does Microsoft To Do detect “now” as a datetime for automatic reminders

Please remind me of the thing I’m writing down literally right now

Unrelated String

05:33

...really good question
My gut says I'm slightly above you in terms of recent performance, but... neither of us have been active that much lately LMAO
And whole career you're slightly above me

Aside from the very top it feels like most Jelly users are on pretty equal footing :P

emanresu A

It's about the same with Vyxal. I don't get outgolfed in it much but I'm not sure if that's because I'm competent or because I'm pretty much the only one still consistently using v2

Redz

@Bbrk24 I admire this person who put so much effort into creating a whole network of programs just to keep his Slack window safe from others

like that's a whole new level of dedication

Themoonisacheese

08:00

@Bbrk24: you copy the VM locally. that's like, a headline features of VMs.
now sure you dont have the password, but i'm willing to bet that his VM doesn't have bitlocker enabled, which means you can get a bootable tool to enable the local Administrator account and reset his windows password, enabling you to log in with his username, launch slack and not his other programs

you may also try to copy a snapshot of the running VM so that it's already logged in, provided it doesn't time out to the lock screen

also consider: slack in the browser on his mac may already be logged in, or if your workplace uses SSO, you could install slack on his mac, and press the "log in with sso" button without knowing his password

to me all of this reeks of too much defense in one area to appropriately cover the others, i'm sure he's good at making toy viruses on windows but i doubt he's great at opsec

Themoonisacheese

08:35

What's the current consensus on interpreters made after a challenge was posted?

emanresu A

Always allowed

Themoonisacheese

what if i'm making it specifically for the task at hand? like it's not a 0-byte interpreter for the challenge (quite worse actually) but the foundation goal of me making this is to improve scores at these specific tasks

emanresu A

If it's designed to solve a specific paradigm of challenges it's fine

Themoonisacheese

okay cool

i just now realized what i'm writing won't be able to do integer addition nor primality checking

fuck

emanresu A

That's obsolete

Has been for ages

Themoonisacheese

08:41

oh

essentially i'm writing a toy compression algorithm

emanresu A

I figured

Themoonisacheese

because just pasting the target output of kolmogorov complexity into lzma and calling it a solution isn't really fun

emanresu A

And yeah that's perfectly fine

att

09:21

@emanresuA come join me in mathematica

emanresu A

So like... ConvenientButExcessivelyLongBuiltinFunctionThatHappensToPerformTheTaskAtHand[#2,47,#1]&?

att

only sometimes

emanresu A

beautiful :p

att

the part about not many other consistent users is relatable though, which is probably partly why i’ve been revisiting my older answers more

Neil

09:42

@Bbrk24 only when they're killed? so, you could just suspend all of their threads? (not possible with default tools though)

Themoonisacheese

10:02

language idea: trivial mathematica substitution with reduced name length for builtins

emanresu A

so sledgehammer but worse

(sledgehammer's arithmetic-coded mathematica)

rydwolf

10:23

tfw you sign your email with "sincerely," but don't have a signature block yet so that's just the end of the email

rydwolf

10:39

I think my conclusion four weeks into this hardware security class is that there's no hope for us

Bbrk24

11:32

@Themoonisacheese SSO uses three factor authentication at my workplace

not only do you enter your login on the website, it then pings an app on your phone, which asks you for a passcode that it displayed on the computer screen, and then your fingerprint or Face ID

@Neil Now there’s a thought! The hard part is identifying which programs to suspend though, and if I can’t do the suspension in PowerShell that might be an issue

In theory I would only need to suspend one of them if I could figure out which one is the one eating keyboard input

att

@emanresuA sledgehammer loses the fun of the operators though

Bbrk24

If I could identify its PID and if he has git bash installed (neither of which is a given) I could use kill to send it SIGSTOP or SIGTSTP, right?

Themoonisacheese

i think so yes

imo your best bet is stealing the VM wholesale though

Bbrk24

11:47

given how much storage space that would require and how little time I have, I don’t know how feasible of an option that is

I can’t copy an entire Windows machine in two minutes, can I

Themoonisacheese

depends on how you copy it and the write speed across the network

Bbrk24

Also, here’s a thought I just had: He probably only mimics the name of system processes, not the priority. Is it possible to use that to my advantage?

Themoonisacheese

also: you can identify processes by their CWD (windows is harder but possible i think) which menas you can filter out "svchost.exe" instances that were not launched in c:/windows/system32

Bbrk24

! thanks for the lead

Themoonisacheese

i think almost all of modern windows runs at normal prio unfortunately

Bbrk24

11:51

This is Win10, not 11

Themoonisacheese

they are functionally identical for these purposes

also consider: Get-Process | ? { $_.Path -eq "D:\Program Files\Java\jdk1.8.0_331\bin\java.exe" } | Stop-Process

Neil

@Bbrk24 I don't think git bash supports the kill command

Themoonisacheese

finds all processes launched from the path in question and kills them, and critically doesn't kill other processes

you just have to find said path

Bbrk24

What about filtering by the location of the executable itself? He might have faked the name in the processes table but he can’t fake the executable being in System32

The "details" panel in Task Manager also shows a "description" field

Themoonisacheese

@Bbrk24 yes, that's exactly what the PS snippet i posted above does

Bbrk24

11:57

Ah okay

Could you do "starts with" rather than "is"?

? --help and ? /? both just return with no output

Themoonisacheese

? is a filter

Bbrk24

Get-Help cannot find the Help files for this cmdlet on this computer. It is displaying only partial help.
    -- To download and install Help files for the module that includes this cmdlet, use Update-Help.
    -- To view the Help topic for this cmdlet online, type: "Get-Help Where-Object -Online" or
       go to go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkID=113423.

Themoonisacheese

Get-Process | ? { $_.Path.StartsWith("path") } | Stop-Process

can also do enndswith etc

Bbrk24

Thank you!

Themoonisacheese

i will die on the hill that if powershell wasn't a microsoft product it would be the dominant shell in all modern linux distros

Bbrk24

12:00

I just tried Get-Process | ? { $_.Path.StartsWith("C:\Users\bbrk2\") } with no Stop-Process on my local machine just to see if it worked, and instead I got the same error hundreds of times

You cannot call a method on a null-valued expression.
At line:1 char:19
+ Get-Process | ? { $_.Path.StartsWith("C:\Users\bbrk2") }
+                   ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    + CategoryInfo          : InvalidOperation: (:) [], RuntimeException
    + FullyQualifiedErrorId : InvokeMethodOnNull

Themoonisacheese

mmh

does thesame thing happen if you launch powershell as admin?

obviously that wouldnt work for this but just curious

Bbrk24

Kind of

I got a few actual results and about a dozen errors

Handles  NPM(K)    PM(K)      WS(K)     CPU(s)     Id  SI ProcessName
-------  ------    -----      -----     ------     --  -- -----------
   1787      86   154328     154196      81.14  18924   1 Discord
    200      12    14964      24024       0.05  19004   1 Discord
   1981      72   597252     282356     511.45  19108   1 Discord
    337      20    24088      45704      21.11  19120   1 Discord
    275      17    16472      64872       2.30  19712   1 Discord
   1674     110   620520     500124   2,610.55  20144   1 Discord

Here's the actual results that didn't error

Themoonisacheese

wierd

Get-Process | ? { ($_.Path -notlike $null) -and ($_.Path.StartsWith("path")) } | Stop-Process

would at least get rid of the errors

ah, apparently Path isn't populated by default and discord specifically is one of the few that does ( probably because electron)

Bbrk24

So that approach won't work

value1

whats going on

Themoonisacheese

12:08

Get-Process -FileVersionInfo| ? { ($_.FileName -notlike $null) -and ($_.FileName.StartsWith("path")) } | Stop-Process

might also not be populated but it's an alternative

Bbrk24

Get-Process : Cannot enumerate the file version information of the "svchost" process.
At line:1 char:1
+ Get-Process -FileVersionInfo| ? { ($_.FileName -notlike $null) -and ( ...
+ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    + CategoryInfo          : PermissionDenied: (System.Diagnostics.Process (svchost):Process) [Get-Process], ProcessC
   ommandException
    + FullyQualifiedErrorId : CouldnotEnumerateFileVer,Microsoft.PowerShell.Commands.GetProcessCommand

I did see some actual results but also dozens if not hundreds of these

Of course the actual results were Discord again

ProductVersion   FileVersion      FileName
--------------   -----------      --------
1.0.9164         1.0.9164         C:\Users\bbrk2\AppData\Local\Discord\app-1.0.9164\Discord.exe
1.0.9164         1.0.9164         C:\Users\bbrk2\AppData\Local\Discord\app-1.0.9164\Discord.exe
1.0.9164         1.0.9164         C:\Users\bbrk2\AppData\Local\Discord\app-1.0.9164\Discord.exe
1.0.9164         1.0.9164         C:\Users\bbrk2\AppData\Local\Discord\app-1.0.9164\Discord.exe
1.0.9164         1.0.9164         C:\Users\bbrk2\AppData\Local\Discord\app-1.0.9164\Discord.exe

This table... doesn't have PID. That's unhelpful

Themoonisacheese

> Using this parameter is equivalent to getting the MainModule.FileVersionInfo property of each process object. When you use this parameter, Get-Process returns a FileVersionInfo object System.Diagnostics.FileVersionInfo, not a process object. So, you cannot pipe the output of the command to a cmdlet that expects a process object, such as Stop-Process.

bruh

microsoft moment

Bbrk24

Alright I have to actually go to work now but this has been insightful

Themoonisacheese

if you can, do try the version without -fileversioninfo, i think it might still list all process he owns and if he launches them by hand he probably does

Bbrk24

he said he does because they don’t automatically launch on boot

Themoonisacheese

12:15

that's still not a guarantee but no way to know until you try

(but I still suspect he's not being truthful about this, and in fact has used other tricks to hide, say, a single process)

Themoonisacheese

13:05

i really should have seen that one coming

turns out designing new compression algorithms is hard

who would have thunk

The Empty String Photographer

@Themoonisacheese *thought

!!!

Themoonisacheese

tonk*

HNQ moment

rydwolf

14:28

people make a big deal when I put razor blades in candy but they've been putting toothpicks in sandwiches as long as I can remember. what gives?

6

I used to think the terms hackers in action movies use were unrealistic but you could probably have pulled half this paper I'm reading out of one and it would sound about right

> Here we propose a different
method of breaking such systems, by transmitting timing
information backwards in time to a Non-Transient Reorder
Racing Gadget (section 5.2) via cache state. It is presented
here not only as a user of the reorder racing/magnifier gadgets, but also because the attack itself is generated via a
custom racing gadget,

And that's without the italics for emphasis on "backwards in time" and "itself"

rydwolf

15:36

wait shit I read the schedule wrong and read the wrong paper

Simd

17:07

CMC There are 7 inequivalent 2 X 2 binary matrices where equivalence means permutations of rows or columns. Write code to list them all

value1

print(["them all"])

Simd

@value1 :)

The Empty String Photographer

Hello value1!

value1

Hello The Empty!

Neil

17:43

@Simd Charcoal, 13 bytes: ⪪⪪”)∧←›υ7”²¦²

Simd

18:33

@Neil cool! Can you explain how it works?

Neil

18:45

it takes a compressed string and splits it twice resulting in a 7×2×2 matrix which is then implicitly printed

Simd

oh you hardcoded it!

I should have gone for 3 x 3 :)

OakBot

19:13

OakBot Online.

rydwolf

Just missed a phone call from the NSA

emanresu A

@OakBot Friendly reminder that bots are not allowed in TNB. If this says anything else I'm kickmuting it

Ginger

19:34

this is the bot that showed up in the vyxal room a while ago

it has the amazing ability to join any chatroom on the site if someone tells it to!

okay, got it to leave

user

20:23

Wait how?

Even without a superping?

@Bbrk24 Is this level of security actually needed? Given that your workplace is fine with people leaving their computers unlocked?

Simd

@rydwolf Your only chance!

Bbrk24

21:44

@user Apparently last time he just did the mouse moving thing and someone got around it with keyboard shortcuts, so he made it as impenetrable as he could

user

21:59

No I mean 3FA

Bbrk24

Oh, we're just using the MS Authenticator app which seems to require the two-device-code thing and the biometric thing by default (unlike Google Authenticator, which is just a code.)

ATaco

That weirdly feels like 2+2FA

Your 2FA needs 2FA

DLosc

22:30

Yo dawg, I heard you like 2FA, so I put some 2FA in your 2FA so you can 2FA while you 2FA

Sandbox Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Draw an ASCII-art diagram of an S-expression Given the input (* 2 (+ 3 4): /\ * /\ 2 / /\ + /\ 3 / 4 Given (* (+ 3 4) 2): /\ * /\ /\ 2 + /\ 3 / 4 (I'll add a bit of a specification soon, but I don't want to overexplain things. It should be pretty intuitive)

noodle person

23:24

What does this mean?

I've seen it twice now

Ginger

same

chat has dementia I guess

noodle person

I thought for a moment it was some sort of rep privelege I just unlocked but there's nothing tied to 9,400

lol

Ginger

wait, have you never seen that before?

noodle person

no

Ginger

ah :p

you broke 10k network-wide reputation a bit ago, which makes you eligible to view spam flag reports in chat

noodle person

23:27

Hm

Ginger

I dunno why it's doing this though

noodle person

Okay, probably won't be using that but good to know

Ginger

it's part of chat's moderation system

whenever a spam/offensive flag is raised 10k-rep users vote on whether it's valid or not

if enough say it's valid the user gets auto-suspended (iirc)

noodle person

also Ginger I hate to break it to you but I currently have 11.5k rep and you have 11.4k

and as we all know bigger number = better person

Ginger

it's joever

ATaco

23:29

Damn, I need to improve my morality score.

noodle person

lol

Bbrk24

@noodleperson I've seen it about four times

today

noodle person

Think I should ask mother meta?

Bbrk24

I checked it a couple hours ago to see if someone had already asked and I didn't see anything

noodle person

I saw it twice today

It hasn't been asked I checkedx

Oh right I came here because

Bbrk24

23:33

then go ahead

noodle person

Okay, asking

Ginger

my money's on flags getting handled quickly and the client not noticing

or maybe the server just doesn't tell the client when flags are handled...?

Bbrk24

@Ginger For a while I saw it every time I clicked refresh

lyxal

It's a known issue

Ginger

if I'm recalling my deep chat arcana correctly flag updates go over the websocket

noodle person

23:40

@lyxal Oh? I just posted my question

lyxal

Been happening for a while and was a discussion point in TL

As well as CHQ

noodle person

Well, now it's been officially addressed publicly, I suppose.

1

Q: Why are these spam/offensive chat flag bubbles appearing when there are no flags?

Why are these spam/offensive flag bubbles appearing in chat when there are no flags? This has happened to me twice today, and it hasn't just hit me - at least two other regular chat.SE users have experienced it. Obviously this is not a critical bug, but it's probably worth bringing attention to.

lyxal

4

Q: Flag notification showing continuously in chat when there's no chat flags

The flag notification has been sitting in all the Stack Overflow chat rooms for some hours and there's been no chat flags in that time. The other moderators can also see this. I went into a chatroom on the Pets site and cannot see a notification.

bug chat flags moderator-tools notifications

Post from 2019

Bbrk24

According to that post it was fixed back then

noodle person

Sure, but at the time it was resolved with no discussion

I'll edit a link to it though, thanks

Edited

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