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03:01
@JoKing Whoa, interesting. Is it possible to modify it to work if the numbers are equal, or would that need a completely different approach?
I guess this works for +2 bytes
I still don't understand how @JoKing deals with the final 0 for printing
you don't have to output a zero at the end of the output
wait what?
Ohhh - when it terminates, it outputs? I stoopid
BCMC: Given a list of unsigned integers, output the first one and discard the rest.
Are they split by zeroes?
03:06
@emanresuA ye
Yep
@DLosc I think this is possible without collectors
I'd like to see that
I don't think so, but I could be wrong
@emanresuA i doubt it
Actually never mind :P
BCMC: Given a list of unsigned integers, subtract one from the first and add 1 to the last.
03:13
separated by zeros again?
@Steffan they are always separated by zeros
ok i dont know a thing about bitcycle lol
I have 7 bytes but a 6 might exist
@Steffan see this for example: dloscutoff.github.io/Esolangs/BitCycle/…
go through step by step
i mean i understand that but...
that just takes input, sends it eastward, and outputs it
03:16
look at the actual bits
it should be 10110111
@Steffan I'd recommend skimming the chat from the beginning of the LYAL on--we've meandered through most of the core concepts of the language
man collectors are way too complicated for me, i can only do the simplest stuff with them
@emanresuA I've got 8 bytes
Ah--was this what you had in mind?
damn how do u guys think of this stuff
Some of it is experience. For that one, I knew a collector would be needed for the "add something to the end" part, because otherwise you can never delay a bit long enough to guarantee you're adding it to the end of a stream and not the middle.
So my first attempt was "put a 1 in collector A; discard the first bit of the input and put it in collector B; put contents of collector A into collector B; output collector B."
03:23
yeah, collectors arent very intuitive to me
Then I realized I didn't need collector B, since I was just outputting all its contents anyway.
cant really make sense of when collectors open and when they close and all that
thats my main issue
@emanresuA 18 bytes not comfortable with how big the printing section is
@AidenChow they open when no bits are left on the field, with priority going to the earlier letters
- Whenever there are no bits on the playfield, at least one collector opens.
- All collectors that have the same letter open at the same time.
- The earliest letter that has a collector with some bits in it is the one that opens. B will not open until all A's are empty, C won't open until all A's and B's are empty, etc.
so the ? always outputs bits first if it still has any right
and all collectors are closed
is that how it works
03:28
Yes, ? sends out all its bits before anything happens with the collectors.
plus all the bits on the playfield at the start
@JoKing nice, now do factorial :P
ya ok the collector stuff make a little more sense now, but i think itll take a while before i gain an intuitive sense of when and when not to use it
0
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Number BasherEQSS: Encoded Quick Speakable Sdrawkcab Sdrawkcab Written Sdrawkcab Written Sdrawkcab is simple: you reverse the word. Example Program: def written_sdrawkcab(x): return x[::-1] So it's that easy, right? Wrong -- Spoken Sdrawkcab In spoken Sdrawkcab, it is different. Take the word different. Does...

03:36
bcmc: add 1 to every num in unsign integer list (bonus: sign integer list !!)
@SandboxPosts Any advice? Thnx. Sorry if disturbing.
@NumberBasher just add some example test cases directly into the post body instead of pointing ppl to run the example program themselves, its more convenient that way
also all the reference programs are lacking indentation, may want to check that out
@DLosc :| what was wrong with mine
why wasnt it working for some even nums
1 hour ago, by DLosc
@AidenChow -4 => 01111 => 0111 => outputs 01 = -1
@DLosc I've got 16 bytes for this one
Aaand it's time for me to go to bed. It's been fun!
03:44
wat, i didnt realize u could end program with @
i should really read the docs more carefully...
welp, im gonna see if i can find a really, really simple challenge that i can try in bitcycle
i dunno if i've ever used @ lol
BCMC: Reverse the input
@JoKing damn even simple stuff like this that can be done super easily in other langs seems impossible in bitcycle
yeah, i'm not even sure how to approach this one
oh damn ok
I might have an idea
03:52
damn
smart
oh man i missed most of LYAL
cuz idk how it works lmao
You might want to set it to like 1k tps
@des54321 it pretty much just started
i was busy playing Lord of the Rings Online
03:53
like a few hours ago
bitcycle huh? this language seems to make brainfuck look easy to code in
@emanresuA wait it not reversing for me
@AidenChow Ooopssss
Never mind, I didn't check the input
@des54321 lol except idk how to code in brainfuck either
so both are equally hard for me
Yeah wow this is ahrd
03:59
github page says it turing complete, means it can reverse input right
@AidenChow OK, I'll run my code later
0
Q: What I think about Esolangs, Part 1

Number BasherWhat I think about Esolangs, Part 1 What are esolangs Well, good question. There's no exact definition for it, and there is no quantitative measure. For your reference, this is what esolangs.org said: https://esolangs.org/wiki/Esoteric_programming_language But why on Earth use or create an esolan...

@DLosc 17 bytes
@NewPosts In brainfuck, a "simple" program of printing the current cell takes exactly one byte
@DLosc trying some of the earlier BCMCs, got 12 bytes for this
could be 11 bytes if some undefined behavior worked differently
is the @ actually necessary
04:11
for it to only output 1/-1, yes
wait no its not what am i thinking
facepalm
:O wrote some tests for Vyxal and they passed
i feel like i would love if the visualization interpreter also had some way of visualizing the contents of collectors
BCMC: Given a bit sequence of even length, output the first half
Oopss
I accidentally got python to calculate 2 ** 2 ** 32
im currently trying to figure out how to multiply in bitcycle
i feel like i need to split out the two numbers and put them into two separate collectors, but I cant quite figure out how I can switch which way bits go on the first 0
04:25
You can have two input devices
@des54321 uhh its right here... dloscutoff.github.io/Esolangs/BitCycle
oh wait
collectors
nvm
ooh another llang made by DLosc...
bitcycle sounds interesting
@des54321 u can also have two ? sources simultaneously so u dont have to worry about that
just enter one num on one line and the other num on the next line
oh lol emanresu already said it
ooooooh
how did i miss that
@des54321 nice, 8 bytes is possible tho ;P
04:41
I think i have managed to come up with the minimal possible bitcycle solution for Shortest Code to Produce Infinite Output
 !
 ~<
1A^
Nope
0v
>~!
oh shit, good one
oh man i was so hooked on using the collector, i forgot i could just reverse the bits back at the dupneg
although, mine does produce output twice as fast as yours :P
For three more bytes I'll give you exponentially growing output
(append newline space ^)
oh god, thats horribly wonderful
Or, for one more byte, hyperspeed but not exponential:
0~~
!~~
... nvm had it at 1k tps
04:48
yeah, thats the same speed as my one, 1 bit every 4 ticks
Idea: [fastest-code] bitcycle
  !
0~~!
!~~
  !
0V
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~!~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
idk how fast this grows but i think it grow pretty fast, idk tho
1 bit outputted every tick
@AidenChow now thats just an unnecessarily big dupneg bomb
@des54321 lol 4 different outputs
04:53
CMC: Print 420
definitely not optimal,,, but it works
ಠ_ಠ
dang i was thinking of doing the same thing lol
Reverse bitstream (ungolfed): Try it online!
05:00
@Sisyphus dang, how does that even work
@Sisyphus What the what how nice
wait actually how does that work
Basically it repeatedly prepends a bit to the bottom B collector. Then it has some logic to start outputting stuff if the top B collector is empty.
How do you prepend a bit to a collector?
05:05
@emanresuA aha, each pair of dupneg instructions serves to double it?
Sorta. There's 21 at the top, the first two pairs double and the rest *5
[Try it online!](https://tio.run/##S8osSa5Mzkn9/19BoUxBwYbLXsEpxjGOywnI/v//v6GBIQiBMYQwBAA "BitCycle – Try It Online")
will repeatedly prepend a bit to the bottom `B` collector
se formatting sucks
Ohhh... are you emptying all the bits from the B collector, inserting another bit than putting those back?
yeah
the tricky part i think is then figuring out when to start outputting those bits
05:13
@emanresuA nice, thats very satisfying
Multiplication: Try it online!
@Sisyphus what the how do u think of this stuff
Is there any way to run the visualising as fast as possible?
set it to 1 million lmao
05:17
no idea how to do division though. yet
repeated subtraction
@Sisyphus joking posted a program to do mean here, u could prob look at that
i guess i haven't figured out subtraction
my reverse code is 25 bytes not sure why it doesn't work on TIO
completely different from what yall have been doing here, this (not very golfed) counts upward forever
05:21
@AidenChow Done
@JoKing This gets stuck in an infinite loop for longer inputs :(
Holy shit I'm going to take a test bye guys...
It seems feeding a collector into itself is never safe for arbitrary length inputs
@Sisyphus oops, i'm currently looking for a fix + golfing
05:34
when in doubt, add more collectors
my favorite thing about bitcycle is the unavoidable fact that how fast a program runs is linked to how big the numbers its handling are
I guess an interesting bitcycle program would compute 2^n for n input
05:52
heres my (not super golfy) multiplication program: dloscutoff.github.io/Esolangs/BitCycle/…
isn't the plural "Amogus"
06:09
Um god damn it got only 92 on my grammar test I should have got a 94 but I clicked the wrong answer...
06:21
@JoKing hahaha
0
A: Circular chained compound

PyGamer0flax, 21 bytes Ň" #"i˜ZŻ≠⌜ŻF₎⍴⊂µ¬W1⍪ Not happy with the byte count...

another flax answer done..
i can probably do better but i am too lazy to :P
why the downvote :/
idk, not me tho
@hyper-neutrino what happened to your pfp?
06:28
i just swapped it to see how it'd look
i don't like it
yeahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
what the
it looks pretty bad
7 hours ago, by lyxal
Okay who turned on @hyper-neutrino's dark mode? I know it was one of you nerds mucking around with browser extensions again. :p
06:29
^^
although it doesn't help that it's the same purple
a lighter purple might work better but it would still look like shit on the chat theme
change it back :P
just waiting for gravatar to update it back
06:29
@UnrelatedString especially for people like me with dark mode for chat
also yes I received both people pinging me about my pfp I was just ignoring all of them
imagine not directly uploading to your stack exchange profile :P
@hyper-neutrino gravatar? Why tf didn't you use imgur?
what a nerd smh :p
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
ngl @hyper-neutrino's pfp and @lyxal's pfp look kinda similar
06:31
they really don't
they really don't
mine has tones of blue and yellow
hyper's is just purple and black
and an entirely different shape
that too
not that you can tell the shape of hyper's very well
06:32
also, I don't have a border
but there's at least slightly more black in the top right than elsewhere
no actually
i mean, when theyre 20x20 pixel squares on my screen, two mostly dark squares look the same
^
just like most of the letters in their names
which i couldn't read if i tried
lyxal looks like "lчмal"
hyper looks like something in armenian
@UnrelatedString My poor x got turned into an M this is so sad
Alexa, play despacito
06:37
@lyxal "desspa kito not found."
after the little exchange i had about today's heardle i am now compulsively pulling up a mashup
@PyGamer0 that's not how you pronounce it
it's spanish
i know
(dos + thres = des) des pa sito
i don't know how alexa could have gotten the correct textual representation then failed to find results
and it's surprising but not impossible for it to then be read back wrong
is there a language that can print "Hello, World! " using only the charcters contained in "Hello, World! "?
for the clearest definition of joke language, lenguage is excluded
06:40
define "joke language"
what is considered a joke language and what isnt, like is an esolang a joke language?
hq9+ is... special
it's pretty clear what the intent was before the trailing space was edited in
i'm going to define joke language as a thing that isn't a language
60
Q: What are programming languages?

Ingo BürkOften, answers to questions asking for "programs" or talking about "programming languages" utilize things like sed, awk, … in order to get around having to write an actual shell script. Therefore, a question comes to my mind: What qualifies as a programming language? Sure, ultimately the OP ca...

so yeah there's a handful of trivial examples where the literal string will produce itself, and length-encoded languages are in a similar boat, but as for actually writing a program with those characters meaningfully, that's a real good question
@NumberBasher ... thinks in Vyxal
nope, vyxal can't do it
for a stretched definition of "meaningfully" it's probably possible in that one ais language based on substrings that occur exactly three times
06:46
@NumberBasher I think backhand can do it, assuming you're including the quotes in the second half of your question
well, you could always do it with unary :P
@JoKing erm you can't use double quotes let me edit that
i cant edit it
whatever
btw who can teach me Jelly or give me a link to a tut?
I don't understand the "integer" part of https://github.com/DennisMitchell/jellylanguage/wiki/Tutorial
i think theres a jelly chatroom
there's no "integer" heading so it might help to know what exactly's tripping you up
if im not mistaken
06:49
an integer is a whole number
also yeah come over to jht
" 3.1.1 Number literals

 Jelly Hypertraining

Practice your Jelly :) Rules and stuff are here: golfingsucces...
i forget if you need to request access or not but i'm an ro iirc so i can let you in
i need to
we can probably just disable that
06:51
ive never really took a deep dive into learning a golfing lang, they always looked hella confusing to me with the amount of builtins and other stuff that they have
@AidenChow me too
piet with the ascii-piet encoding we came up with when it was the LYAL a few weeks ago comes suprisingly close to being able to print "Hello, World!" using only the characters in it
@des54321 wait really, thats interesting
havent used piet in a while tbh
unfortunately, the colors you have access to (red, dark red, light green, dark magenta) dont actually let you access the outchar command
you can push all of the codepoints necessary, and even output them as numbers, but you cant convert them to chars
06:54
@des54321 sad
creates asii piet 2.0 to change the encoding of the colors
if you had access to any one of tfvki on top of those letters you could do it
@des54321 i think ascii piet existed before the lyal
@des54321 Oh and make it case sensitive ;-)
@AidenChow that's why you go through the basics of the language tutorial and work your way up to using more complex stuff
07:16
0
Q: Haplololololololology!

Steve BennettHaplology Haplology is a linguistic term: the omission of one occurrence of a sound or syllable that is repeated within a word, for example probly for probably. For this challenge, it means specifically, replacing any sequences of two or more letters that are repeated two or more times with jus...

 
1 hour later…
08:17
yay i revived this chat
someone help me give some advise
-1
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Number BasherEQSS: Encoded Quick Speakable Sdrawkcab Sdrawkcab Written Sdrawkcab Written Sdrawkcab is simple: you reverse the word. Example Program: def written_sdrawkcab(x): return x[::-1] So it's that easy, right? Wrong -- Spoken Sdrawkcab In spoken Sdrawkcab, it is different. Take the word different. Doe...

0
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Number BasherPalindromic Powers Powers We define an important power as a number that can be represented as \$ x^y \$ where \$ x ≥ 2 \$ and \$ y ≥ 2 \$. Palindrome We define an important palindrome as a number that is the same written forwards and backward, and is greater than 10. Thus, the last digit must not...

Thanks
@NumberBasher please at least let your proposals sit for a while before spamming them in chat
3
 
2 hours later…
10:07
in flax, 2 mins ago, by PyGamer0
CMP: flax community ad?
10:19
Community ads are bizarre
As soon as you try to find ome, you can't.
10:38
Ikr
A whole year and I've never seen any of the ones we voted for
And I even disabled my ad blocker to see if I could see them
Did prosus disable them when they acquired the network?
11:02
(set tps to 1k and wait)
11:56
@emanresuA where is tps?
ok i am back after hwt :-)
are there any python Code Golf Tutorials?
315
Q: Tips for golfing in Python

moinudinWhat general tips do you have for golfing in Python? I'm looking for ideas which can be applied to code-golf problems and which are also at least somewhat specific to Python (e.g. "remove comments" is not an answer). Please post one tip per answer.

12:12
fleoflfoelf
Wish me luck, for I am venturing into the land of WebPush
good luck
dayum people are still answering the ukrainian flag challenge
@lyxal erm I actually forgot to say I saw that one
I saw both
I saw both
._.
Sometimes I now golf my programming homework and frustrate the teachers :-)
Github Copilot is REALLY bad at golfing ;-)
12:19
You can edit messages...
I thought they didn't send out because it was telling me my internet connection was lost
@Ginger I know
is lambda supported with no-param funcs?
I was trying to golf down
def s():
 for a in range(1, 10):z=500-a*a*-~a/2;print(a,z,a**3+z)
whoops i forgot to delete that space in 1, 10
thecodelesscode.com/case/170 Ah, good ol' Murphy's Law
Wdym
It struck me odd why // doesn't return an int
12:49
0
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Number BasherIs it a good chord? Definition of a chord: We define a chord as three notes together. Definition of a note: We define a note as a number between 1 and 7, inclusive. As in music, we define 1 as do, 2 as re, 3 as fa, etc. However, the note names are not important. They will not be included in the q...

If there's anyone tell me what's the American time right now? I think there's no one active
you can google it
yah the progblem is i'm not sure if it is accurate
08:57 AM
@NumberBasher if you mean no args yes: lambda:1
@NumberBasher hmm its 6:28pm here..
10:58pm here
12:59
@NumberBasher presumably its 7:30 something pm for you
@lyxal hmm why do you stay awake that late?
Because my bedtime is midnight
11pm is just too early for sleep
9:02 for me now, in china
*pm
I CANT WAIT TO SEE THE PYCON REPLAY
any tips ingolfing down
`s=lambda x:[print(str(z:=int(500-a*a*-~a/2))*0+str(a),z,a**3+z)for a in range(-x,x+1)]
s(10000)`
?
sadly no multiline markdown in se chat..
@NumberBasher i got no tips
does s(1e4) work?
13:04
btw you can use python2 but if you do you gotta remove the good walrus
Sometimes I now golf my programming homework and frustrate the teachers :-)
Github Copilot is REALLY bad at golfing ;-)
@BgilMidol em how do i say
@NumberBasher VTC as dup of earlier message
Aug 26, 2021 at 4:57, by emanresu A
v ( I agree with the message posted after this one)
it gives the output but then raises an error
well errors are usually ignored in golfing
but actually its part of my programming homework
i am trying to frustrate the teacher
@NumberBasher umm why?
i frustate my friends by golfing in java ::p
13:08
And sometimes nbot with golfing but this
def               M_a_I_n ():
    for a   in range  (1 ,10)  :
      X=  1000  -a   *a*(  1+  a)
      print   (a  ,X/  2, a** 3+X /2)
not yet
I am sending this as my homework:
def               M_a_I_n ():
    for a   in range  (~x +1,x +1)  :
      X=  1000  -a   *a*(  1+  a)
      print   (a  ,X/  2, a** 3+X /2)
that's some spicy indentation and spacing you've got there
PEP8 is smiling...
13:10
@NumberBasher that is the best code i have seen /s
I mean it's not golfed
just some "normal" code right?
hahaha lol
It's out of date, but nicely interactive.
yeah i noticed
@Romanp agree
 
1 hour later…
frickin' chrome thinks rsnbatwpl is arabic >:|
did ya publish it yet
0
A: List of bounties with no deadline

Seggan50-100 rep for posting a good fastest-code challenge I like fast code. I even made a golflang that specializes in fast code. However, in my opinion, there are too few fastest-code challenges. We need more! Now that I have a bit more rep to wield, I decided to make this bounty. The challenge needs...

@Seggan Almost
@NewBountiesWithNoDeadlines ure late

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