The Nineteenth Byte

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00:25

CMQ: Do you have a question you think was underappreciated (in terms of votes/# of answers/etc.)? If so, tell me which one, and I'll be happy to give it a try, see if a new answer can draw some more attention

Adám

Q: Implement Multiplicative Fuzzy Logic

Inspired by this excellent challenge (from which the bulk of this text is blatantly duct-taped) – and my highschool philosophy project... I define the following operators: Fuzzy Conjunction a ×F b is a × b Fuzzy Division a ÷F b is a ÷ b Fuzzy Negation –F b is 1 – b Fuzzy Disjunction a +F b i...

caird coinheringaahing

@Adám Does "extend the language of your choice to include the notation." mean that I can define 4 functions that take the necessary arguments and return the correct results?

Wezl

I generally like interpreter questions, they're the part of programming that appeals to me

caird coinheringaahing

@Wezl I both like and dislike most good interpreter questions, as my go-to language for golfing is Jelly :/

Adám

@cairdcoinheringaahing That'd only be valid if you can get the required infix syntax into your language. Otherwise the whole thing becomes rather trivial.

Redwolf Programs

00:37

I'm thinking about redoing my dotcomma interpreter challenge, I ended up deleting it for some reason but I think it'd be an interesting challenge

caird coinheringaahing

@Adám I think I've got a Jelly answer that should work, let me know on my (incoming) answer if not

Adám

Will do.

Heh, we need a "Sandbox for proposed answers"…

caird coinheringaahing

00:49

@Adám Should be posted

Adám

Looking at it already.

@cairdcoinheringaahing I'd say it is almost acceptable. Can you insert some string substitution preprocessing before you eval-as-Jelly? Then you can actually use ×F etc. in the code.

caird coinheringaahing

@Adám Shouldn't be too hard, I'll get on that

Adám

Cool

caird coinheringaahing

@Adám Given that it's getting late here and that Jelly hates 2-letter substitution more than I expected, I might have to give it a proper go tomorrow. I'll delete my answer until I get it tho

Adám

01:07

No worries. I hope you're having fun at least.

caird coinheringaahing

@Adám Oh, bending Jelly to my will is always fun, until I realise I've been copy-pasting the F character the entire time :P

Adám

haha, yeah, that's just a normal F.

caird coinheringaahing

Well, it's disgustingly hacked together, but it works :D (editing + undeleting now)

Adám

Disgustingly hacked together? That's the spirit we all want to see!

caird coinheringaahing

I'm including my old version because I quite like it (and it almost meets the challenge spec), but I'll use my disgusting version for my score :)

@Adám Kinda weird question, but can we take input with a trailing space?

Adám

01:25

@cairdcoinheringaahing That's an interesting question. I've also not specified internal spacing, though all my examples have a single space between tokens. I guess I'll allow it, though I can't imagine it takes a lot of Jelly to append a space, does it?

caird coinheringaahing

@Adám It's +2 bytes in Jelly, so not a massive issue if not, but every byte helps :P

Adám

@cairdcoinheringaahing Added explicit rule about spacing, and also that you can use _ for minus if you're using Jelly.

caird coinheringaahing

@Adám Oh yeah, I did kinda assume _ was allowed, but thanks for making it explicit :)

caird coinheringaahing

02:03

@Adám Still disgustingly hacked together, but now 13 bytes shorter than an hour ago, I've undeleted my answer :P

Adám

Upvoted, but ugh, Jelly needs regex support.

Bubbler

Well, if a regex does the job, you just wouldn't use Jelly.

Adám

And if a regex does part of the job?

Bubbler

QuadR...?

Razetime

i feel like regex wouldn't fit in jelly's style of doing things

Adám

02:12

@Bubbler That's just for specific tasks in golfing, and only uses regex as preprocessing too.

@Razetime Could pretty much be implemented as in APL, no? Last two links would make the pattern(s) and the transformation(s)

Razetime

@Adám yeah but it's just gonna be another two byte builtin which only makes string based tasks less interesting

caird coinheringaahing

@Adám that’s something that’s been hit hard by Dennis’ hiatus. There’s been a PR for regex atoms since 2018 that was being worked on

Adám

IC.

Bubbler

02:30

(the QuadR port of APL answer happens to be 21 bytes)

Adám

@Bubbler That's very elegant. Post it!

Bubbler

It works great and handles multiple test cases just fine, except that it can't handle newlines in the input properly

Adám

@Bubbler Right, but for the "try all test cases" link, you can use ⍎⍤1⎕FMT⍵

9 hours later…

Razetime

11:33

CMQ: What is the longest Jelly answer you have seen/written?

Just saw this one

Lyxal

@Razetime my longest jelly answer

A very space consuming 14 bytes

Lyxal

11:48

@cairdcoinheringaahing is it too late to answer the cmc?

caird coinheringaahing

12:05

@Lyxal Not at all, but I’m kinda busy today, so I’ll take a look when I can :)

ngn

12:30

@fomin i'm thinking of mounting a second attack on your challenge

if only i knew how to dfa an nfa, the dfa could be used to generate its language

3 hours later…

Anush

15:39

I know how to do that :)

I think there was a challenge on NFA to DFA too

@ngn ^^^

caird coinheringaahing

16:34

@Adám Do we have to handle regular negation, or can we change the -500 test case to 0 - 500?

Adám

16:49

@cairdcoinheringaahing No, negation isn't on the list of required functionality.

caird coinheringaahing

@Adám Ok, good. Now I just need to find a way to remove another byte so I can tie with QuadR :P

Neil

17:57

@ngn the cheesy way to convert nfa to dfa is to have 2^n states where each DFA state is a sum of powers of 2 of the states that the nfa might be in at the time

Adám

Any way to golf this HTML/CSS/JS?

ngn

@Neil right, that can work. for this challenge it's easy to construct of an nfa with 3*(n+1) states, where n is at most 16. so bitmasks can fit in 64 bits.

John Dvorak

18:15

@Adám all I see is the default template

ngn

@Adám rm " around attribute values where possible

Adám

@JohnDvorak What? Isn't it populated with some HTML?

ngn

@JohnDvorak try reload. i got the default template the first time too.

John Dvorak

... how does that (fail to) work?

font:monospace should work?

Adám

Nope.

1 hour later…

Anush

19:18

@ngn How did you get in with the automata?

ngn

@Anush i'm still struggling :)

Anush

Ah.. Is it the conversion to DFA that is the problem?

ngn

@Anush i have a dfa (not necessarily correct) already. now i'm trying to count the possible outputs without generating them.

but i'm getting fewer than expected for "obenquillo" :(

Neil

@Adám can you get away with onload or at least onloadend instead of onreadystagechange?

<code><input style="font:inherit" is slightly shorter I guess

Anush

@ngn ah. Can you try it with the empty string?

Neil

19:25

join`\n` ("template string")

Adám

@Neil No.

ngn

@Anush it prints "1"

Anush

If it doesn't work for that you know you are in trouble :)

@ngn that's bad

It sounds be 95 + 95*95

Neil

huh, why not, need to support IE9 or something?

Anush

I am talking about the number of strings within edit distance 2 of the empty string

Neil

19:28

(side note: is the result HTML, if not, use innerText)

ngn

@Anush i got so carried away with these automata, i forgot what challenge i'll use them for :)

Neil

with(new XMLHttpRequest()){...} might save some bytes

Adám

Ooh, "with" exists. Nice.

@Neil Actually, it does. Something had gone stuck.

ngn

@Anush +1 for the empty string itself, i think

Neil

well that's all I can think of offhand

Adám

19:34

@Neil Such golf, very hack.

ngn

@Neil @Adám are the parens after new XMLHttpRequest required?

Adám

@ngn Apparently not :-)

ngn

@Anush now i'm much closer but still missing some

Anush

20:11

@ngn :)

ngn

@Anush can you give me another test case?

Adám

@Neil Thank you so much. You inspired me to even more golfs.

2 hours later…

Anush

21:57

@ngn does the empty string work now? You could try the single letter a. I can make some more complicated ones in about 12 hours

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