The Nineteenth Byte

Mauris

08:11

@Dennis: What was your quiz submission that got recognized as Clip supposed to be?

Dennis

@Mauris Pyth.

Mauris

Woah

It was nice and misleading. :)

New Main Posts

08:42

3

Q: Can you reach this number by doubling and rearranging?

Inspired by this question on Math.SE. Starting with 1 you can repeatedly perform one of the following two operations: Double the number. or Rearrange its digits in any way you want, except that there must not be any leading zeroes. Taking an example from the linked Math.SE post, we can reac...

Dennis

Why are you doing this to me? I have't even recovered from your last challenge...

Martin Büttner

:D

I figured after 48 hours some people might want to get back to golfing... if not, feel free to keep working on the quiz ;)

Dennis

There's at least one submission I have to do yet.

Speaking of which: A "file flag" such as awk -f would count as a standard flag and be allowed, yes?

Sp3000

@MartinBüttner Can you please drop a comment on the MetaGolfScript one? :(

Martin Büttner

@Dennis yes, I'd say so

Dennis

08:45

Perfect. Thanks!

New Sandboxed Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Redecorating PPCG code-golf popularity-contest javascript Challenge You must design a Stack Snippet or Bookmarklet which improves the theme of this question. Further Information You don't have to worry about the mobile site, just what people on a desktop or laptop see. You must only change ...

Beta Decay

Art contest or not?

Martin Büttner

@Sp3000 like so?

Override header: invalid. — Martin Büttner ♦ 33 secs ago

(there's a longer comment before that ;))

Sp3000

Thanks - I didn't want to comment because I felt I'd express myself badly again.

Martin Büttner

09:05

@BetaDecay it seems way too broad, imo

New Main Posts

1

Q: The hue of a color

You are given the RGB values of a color. Your task is simple: to calculate the hue, in the simplest definition. Say the channels with highest, middle and lowest value are X, Y, Z (which are either red, green or blue) and their values are x, y, z. The hue of this color is (h(X)-h(Y))*(1 + (x-y)/(...

code-golf

Martin Büttner

@Sp3000 any clue about my quiz answer from yesterday? :)

Beta Decay

@MartinBüttner Hmm I'm trying to think of ways to limit the scope...

Martin Büttner

also, I'm pretty sure I would get the largest number of votes, and the least number of bytes with a single submission:

$('.beta-title').remove()

Sp3000

@MartinBüttner I remember seeing an esolang with lots of pipe chars, but other than that, not yet. They could be red herrings for all I know

Martin Büttner

09:12

:)

Sp3000

btw is there a limit on how version specific an answer can be?

eg Python 2/3 is definitely fair game, but say Python 2.2 or something

Martin Büttner

I think that's fair

provided an interpreter/compiler is still available for that version

Sp3000

Hmm k, thanks

Martin Büttner

09:29

@Optimizer You seem to be assuming that I think soft-linking the snippet actually has a benefit. ;)

Optimizer

> I'm no longer sure this is a good idea

Martin Büttner

Yeah, I didn't have any reason to object to it before, because it seemed useful to be able to "remote update" all the snippets in use with one local change, but my point is I don't think that's actually desirable.

Optimizer

bug fixes and non-breaking changes are desirable

what specific thing you are talking here ?

Martin Büttner

I don't even know. I was considering to make a few cosmetic changes like allowing links around language names and adding override comments, but I don't even know how to tell if it would break anything. it's impossible to check all the affected answers.

Optimizer

you have to check just one

as all must be using the same format..

Martin Büttner

09:37

they obviously aren't, though

undergroundmonorail

09:50

yo did my question show up in the hot network questions list? i don't even think it's particularly good but it's attracting a lot more answers than i expected and a disproportionately high number of them are from people brand new to ppcg

i cant' think of another reason that would happen

Martin Büttner

yes it was on the hnq (don't know if it still is)

undergroundmonorail

weird

"parse this string and perform one of two simple math operations on it" is not how i feel like this site should be represented haha

Sp3000

Sometimes simples ones are a nice break

undergroundmonorail

i definitely agree and i think i've said things to that affect in the past, but imo the really interesting ones are the ones that require a bit more thought and i wish those were the ones we showed off to the world. though i guess simpler often means more answers quickly which is likely what the hnq list is based on

Sp3000

btw @MartinBüttner apologies, deleted one of my answers just so you know

undergroundmonorail

09:55

i type in all lowercase to make it look like i don't care but i'm on a phone that aggressively autocorrects everything i type so keeping everything lowercase is actually a fair amount of work

Sp3000

Yeah after a while number of answers/answer scores becomes important

Martin Büttner

what was wrong with your answer?

Sp3000

I felt that it bends the "interpreter available" rule a bit and didn't want to spark a debate

Mauris

qsort(s,read(0,s,99),1,"YXZQQQ\x8a\x00*\x02\x0f\xbe\xc0\xc3")

I like this. (The trick is shinh's, or some other Japanese golfer, I think, not mine. :()

It's like a lambda for your C! In x86 machine code!

Beta Decay

10:40

Is this Pyth code:

=YkK@Q0J@Q1Vr0lK=TNVr0lJIq@KT@JN=k+<KT>JNI>lklY=Yk))))Y

A valid answer for this:

3

Q: Simple portmanteau with longest overlap

I've been using a library called Djangular recently, which integrates Django and Angular. After a while I thought 'Wouldn't it be fun to programmatically generate portmanteau?' Here are some examples (e.g. testcases): Django + Angular -> Djangular Camel + Leopard -> Cameleopard Spoon + Fork ->...

code-golf string

Equivalent Python 3 code

Martin Büttner

11:08

argh, the comments on the feature SE blog post :(

PhiNotPi

11:20

@MartinBüttner I'm worried that the language quiz will break my record for most answered thread.

Martin Büttner

@PhiNotPi you've still got more than twice as many answers

PhiNotPi

PLQ has, however, been gaining answers at a ludicrous speed.

Martin Büttner

I feel like it's slowing down but it might be the time of day.

Sp3000

11:53

Was trying to test a string sorter by feeding it "Hello", then spent the next few minutes trying to figure out why the string wasn't sorting

5

isaacg

@BetaDecay That is some of the least idiomatic Pyth I've ever seen.

trichoplax

@Sp3000 It took me an embarrassing number of seconds to realise why that's funny

Beta Decay

@isaacg Haha sorry, it's me thinking of stuff and looking it up in the character reference

Kind of hacked together with duct tape if you wish ;)

isaacg

Sure, sure.

Beta Decay

12:10

@Dennis What did you use to encode the ??? program into the image?

aditsu

12:44

@BetaDecay probably gangsta brazenness and crystal meth

Martin Büttner

12:54

100 answers \o/

Optimizer

badge?

Martin Büttner

nope

that wouldn't even make sense as a badge (on any other SE)

Beta Decay

Who's the hundredth answer?

Martin Büttner

you are

fun fact: this is the point where the snippet may or may not break

I was never able to test the pagination of the API

Geobits

Leave it to BetaDecay to break things :D

Beta Decay

13:00

Woop woop

Martin Büttner

I think it would be the 101st answer that breaks it

Geobits

I really don't get some of the feedback on the "Hello, World!" proposal. Nobody said anything about Mandelbrot in every language, despite being basically the same thing.

Martin Büttner

^

or the quine challenge

or really any other code golf... I could have just not said anything about accepting, not accept anything, and nobody would have thought about it twice :D

Geobits

Yea, it seems like a really arbitrary distinction to try to make.

Next time don't use the magic "catalog(ue)" word :D

Optimizer

@MartinBüttner oh, I thought u made it to your 100th answer. But I guess even that has no badge

Martin Büttner

13:09

nope, only 100 questions

Optimizer

on separate days

Martin Büttner

yes

Geobits

That Mandelbrot was the second golf I did here (the first is terrible and shouldn't count :), and I learned quite a bit from it. I did it specifically because it encouraged entries in lots of languages.

Optimizer

and I have tested the pagination in my original code, which your snippet is based off.

Martin Büttner

yeah, but I've changed it a bit, and this one also interleaves comment fetching with answer fetching, so I might have broken it somewhere along the way

Optimizer

13:11

maybe

New Meta Posts

13:27

We're getting a new moderator: Cast your votes!

15

Optimizer

13:47

there goes 2 wasted badges

@MartinBüttner why did we not conduct an official election like Anime and Manga is doing right now ?

2

New Sandboxed Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

SETI (search for extraterrestrial life) In this code golf challenge you will search for signs of life. Specification: Your program takes a sequence of exactly 225 characters, each either 0 or 1. You return as output a single bit, either 0 or 1. The goal is to distinguish between two kinds of ...

Geobits

I didn't even know beta sites had that option. Nice.

Optimizer

or in other words, why are we electing a pro-tempore mod, when Anime and Mange is electing a normal mod ?

I'd say that overall, our stats are better.

they have higher visitors/day which leads to more questions, but that's the only better stat

Peter Taylor

@Dennis Yes, children raised in a multilingual environment tend to take a while to separate the languages out. I've got a book on the subject, but I can't remember who I've lent it to.

Sp3000

@MartinBüttner If we get bored enough we could do esolang-of-the-week: Bounty for the shortest Hello, World! in some esolang :P (not sure how many people would bother)

Martin Büttner

14:13

@Optimizer we were told that formal elections are still strictly tied to graduation

@Optimizer what badges?

Optimizer

@MartinBüttner which seems like not the case anymore

@MartinBüttner Caucus and Constituent

Martin Büttner

are you sure the A&M isn't in the process of graduating?

Optimizer

then the real question is, why are they and why we aren't ? :)

Geobits

I searched their meta but didn't find an announcement-type post.

Optimizer

17 mins ago, by Optimizer

I'd say that overall, our stats are better.

Geobits

14:15

I'd expect something there if they were graduating.

Martin Büttner

@Optimizer because this is PPCG...

Geobits

People Play Computer Games?

Martin Büttner

@Geobits there seem to be some posts that assume they are graduating though

Optimizer

link?

Geobits

@MartinBüttner I saw those, thought it was odd and assumed just jumping the gun, kinda like our icon proposal posts.

Optimizer

14:18

that one was jumping a whole sniper

Martin Büttner

@Geobits that is something that could in theory happen without graduation

Geobits

Sure, the whole site theme could theoretically be changed without graduation (and they're talking about it on big meta), but I didn't see any meta.anime posts "assuming graduation" besides those.

If you have a better one I'd be interested, but from everything I can tell they aren't officially graduating any more than we are.

Martin Büttner

13

Q: Are we really ready for graduation?

It's been announced that this site will graduate. That's great news and it's a testament to the hard work that our community has put into maintaining quality content, especially given how this site could have turned out. Looking at the Area 51 metrics, all the numbers are pretty good. While there...

discussion vote-to-close

also, I think the graduation backlog has been published somewhere, I keep forgetting where... maybe on CR?

Geobits

Huh. That's a long damn backlog. I thought it was 6+ months, not 17+.

Martin Büttner

31

Q: Tracking Graduation Progress

Moderator Note: This question has been identified a number of times as being a candidate for migration to Meta.SE - the main meta site. This question is really about tracking Code Review's 'probable' spot in line, and is not a general purpose all-beta-site tracking system, thou...

discussion beta-progress

it is

Geobits

14:23

I guess that explains the election, then. They're graduated, just not themed.

If that list is right, Biology seriously skipped ahead in line :D

Optimizer

I don't understand, even I can add an answer to the CR meta post. Infact, the Anime and Manga answer (meta.codereview.stackexchange.com/a/3919/69340) just likes to a question asking whether they are ready or not.

No SE team involvement at all.

Sp3000

@BetaDecay "If only Python had brackets... Would be so much easier for golfing... sigh" Waitwhat?

Optimizer

something like meta.blender.stackexchange.com/questions/700/… should be present for Anime and Manga

ProgramFOX

@MartinBüttner Why does your comment suddenly show "anon" as OP?

Geobits

@Optimizer It is a bit odd, but it's worth noting that Shog9 answered the anime meta post, and didn't correct/deny the "it's been announced" bit at all.

Martin Büttner

14:37

@ProgramFOX I was disassociated from the answers. maybe that automatically affects the comments as well

ProgramFOX

Oh, I see.

Martin Büttner

@Optimizer I found this: chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/6697?m=12179914#12179914

Optimizer

what is that first link ?

Geobits

6-8 weeks?

Optimizer

yeah

Martin Büttner

14:39

an explanation of the significance of 6-8 weeks

Geobits

It's a meta joke. Means "at some point".

Optimizer

so there is actually no announcement post as such.

Geobits

No, it means more "it will happen, but the time is currently not pinned down".

Martin Büttner

that message was posted by one of the mods. I'd assume he wouldn't make that up.

Geobits

> Definition: The time estimate given "off the top of my head" when the Stack Overflow team has only a vague idea of how long a task will take because they have little-to-no formal scheduling or even a list of tasks.

Martin Büttner

14:41

also what Geobits said... Shog would probably have commented on it if the "It's been announced that we're graduating" was just made up.

New Sandboxed Posts

14:54

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Magic: the Gathering Combat Golf Magic: the Gathering is a trading card game where, among other things, players play cards representing creatures, which than attack the other player, or defend against the other player's attacks. In this code-golf challenge, your program will be in the place of ...

Geobits

Coincidence that @Rainbolt popped up in the user list when an MTG sandbox was posted? ;)

Martin Büttner

I was just gonna ping him when I saw he was at the front of the user list :D

Rainbolt

I clicked "Rejoin Favorite Rooms". Had no idea honestly. (So yes, coincidence)

Geobits

Nicely timed then.

Rainbolt

Upvoted before I even read it. Now I'm going to read it.

3

Optimizer

15:08

@Geobits also does similar, but for downvotes

Rainbolt

@isaacg Are you in here?

isaacg

Yep

Rainbolt

You may not want to totally mimic actual Magic, but here's how combat really goes:

You declare attackers. Opponent declares blockers. You got that much in your challenge

Optimizer

actual magic is a real thing?

Rainbolt

You declare a blocking order.

Then when it comes to deal damage, you have to assign at least lethal to the first creature in the blocking order

isaacg

15:14

I know, I know.

But we're assuming both players play optimally, so the distincition isn't relevant

Rainbolt

Okay. I figured you might be simplifying for the challenge

Geobits

Then you suddenly remember why you abandoned the game fifteen years ago.

isaacg

It's pretty clearly not optimal to have any damage distribution that can't be done as a blocking order.

Rainbolt

In your challenge, I think I agree

isaacg

Right. In magic generally, there are situations where almost anything is optimal

Rainbolt

15:18

Sometimes I declare a blocking order, and then the opponent pumps the first guy in the blocking order, leaving me wishing I could change my blocking order or assign less than lethal to the first guy.

Other times he blocks with a creature that is detrimental to him, and I wish that I could assign less than lethal to it.

Geobits

15:29

"I came across this App..." <- Odd coincidence that your username here matches the developer's name in the Play Store? This looks suspiciously like spam/promotion. — Geobits 1 min ago

Question: Hey guys I found an app that I totally didn't write. Does it work?
Self-Answer: Yes!

Rainbolt

I signed up for pokgear.com and I must say, all my problems have been solved. Not only can I battle with my Pokemon in the online arena, but I got million dollars too!

Geobits

I signed up for pokgear.com and got a real live Pokemon!

He makes $8215 per week from home!

Dennis

@MartinBüttner Is there nothing that can be done about Foo? It would have worked for a lot of answers that have been cracked already. Errors goes to STDERR, so even programs with runtime errors produce the correct output.

Martin Büttner

@Dennis I don't think we should do anything about it. It's a legitimate language and it's not too hard to protect against it.

Dennis

I suppose. Oh, well, the second crack I get for free then. ;)

Sp3000

15:39

There's a reason why I didn't want to scare everyone away with Foo :/

Dennis

Doorknob started it!

:P

@BetaDecay A hex editor and a lot of patience. ;) I've enlarged the color palette and placed the ??? source code in the unused colors.

Peter Taylor

I suppose that technically there must be a correct interpreter somewhere?

I.e. I can't say "According to the spec this works even without a REPL, so ignore the fact that the only interpreter which existed before the challenge started is a REPL"

Martin Büttner

so I've been running my reference solution for the double/rearranging challenge up to 1,000,000. grouping the numbers by amount of digits, I get some interesting stats:

digits   reachable   ratio      max_distance

1        4           0.444444   4
2        10          0.111111   12
3        436         0.484444   26
4        5558        0.617556   25
5        57868       0.642978   26
6        589516      0.655018   28

@PeterTaylor yeah, I thought that's the usual policy.

isaacg

Looks like its converging to 2/3

Martin Büttner

well it can't exceed 2/3

it's interesting that it approaches it though

gotta head out for now

Peter Taylor

15:53

It's a shame, but ah well.

Sp3000

Why is maxdist for 4 less than for 3 o_O

Rainbolt

16:06

Testing just created Bug #66666. I have a bad feeling about this one

Martin Büttner

@Sp3000 you don't need to take the long paths through 3 digits to get to 4

The maximum is only for the numbers with that many digits, not up to.

Sp3000

16:27

@isaacg Were you going to make that meta post on too trivial?

Optimizer

@Rainbolt 666 is bad, 66666 is not.

@Sp3000 basically, 4 digit numbers are easy to approach to.

Sp3000

I just don't see any obvious intuition why

Optimizer

3 digit numbers contain 666

trichoplax

There are more 4 digit powers of 2 than 3 digit powers of 2, and each can be rearranged in more ways (even accounting for all the 4 digit ones containing a zero)

Geobits

Might have something to do with 128 vs 1024 (the fastest-to-approach in each). All permutations of 1024 (discounting the leading-zero ones) can be shuffled or doubled and still be four digits. Any permutations of 128 starting with 8 jump into four digits if doubled.

trichoplax

16:33

@Geobits Your suggestion makes so much more sense than mine lol

Geobits

They go hand in hand I think :)

trichoplax

I'll go with that...

Optimizer

... hand in hand..?

trichoplax

hands have digits...

Geobits

Sorry, appendage in appendage (I keep trying to be llama-sensitive, but it's hard).

Optimizer

16:34

hands are human too

trichoplax

Not everyone is represented by their avatar. I'm not really a scene made only from spheres.

Dennis

@AlexA. I was expecting you to crack this one:

Geobits

Sure, sure, but IIRC Optimizer has explicitly said he's a llama on several occasions.

Dennis

6

A: The Programming Language Quiz

???, 344 bytes, cracked by jimmy23013 Here's a hexdump of the file: 0000000: 47 49 46 38 37 61 0d 00 0d 00 85 13 00 00 00 00 GIF87a.......... 0000010: 00 00 c0 00 00 ff 00 c0 00 00 ff 00 00 c0 c0 00 ................ 0000020: ff ff c0 00 00 ff 00 00 c0 00 c0 ff 00 ff c0 c0 .....

trichoplax

@Geobits Judging from the typing speed, I estimate at least 3 llamas, and probably more like 8 or 9.

Geobits

16:40

Infinite llamas at infinite keyboards?

trichoplax

LDDOS

Geobits

If he is multiple llamas typing to maintain speed, I'm pretty impressed by the thread scheduling.

trichoplax

Fairly impressive. They struggle with capitalisation though

Geobits

Alternatively, he could have a modified keyboard (think like a floor mat), and he's just a really fast tap dancer.

trichoplax

Since there's silence from @Optimizer, I'm going to assume you are not far from the truth

Geobits

16:44

Might be resting his legs after that last burst of dancing.

Optimizer

don't mind me. please continue, this is hilarious.

Geobits

I finally get it. He's not just any llama:

2

Optimizer

I dont get it

Geobits

Nothing to do with typing. Just drama.

Optimizer

the below two lines

Beta Decay

16:51

@Sp3000 Oh haha I meant curly brackets. So you don't have to waste so many bytes on indentation

aditsu

@Geobits yes, this is @Optimizer's keyboard: youtube.com/watch?v=3l-mRWtBGsA

Optimizer

@aditsu except, I am twice as better

Vioz-

Would "Sexy twin cousins" be an appropriate challenge name? :P

Optimizer

twin cousin?

Vioz-

As in the cousins are twins

Geobits

16:56

@Vioz- Yes. Of course yes :D

Optimizer

"Sexy" sounds the most decent part of that title

Geobits

@aditsu I like how he makes it looks so casual. Most crazy DDR players I see have a much more rigid look to them.

aditsu

@Optimizer right, 4 legs youtube.com/watch?v=EroHSva3kDA

Geobits

That's the same video.

aditsu

sorry, fixed

Optimizer

17:01

they are so bad

Geobits

I always had more fun with Taiko anyway :)

aditsu

youtube.com/watch?v=X-aOoC4C0FM better? sorry, it's filmed with a potato

Beta Decay

Top the range potato

aditsu

w00t!

Geobits

Should mount a GoPro in a potato and walk around with it.

Beta Decay

17:12

That would be pretty awesome

But potatoes are expensive these days :P

Geobits

True. Especially suitably big ones. Most potatoes I see in the store are pretty runty lately.

TheNumberOne

Has anyone tested if grc's answer works in Alphuck ?

Beta Decay

Come on, Alphuck anyone?

Geobits

Anyone? You must be young.

Vioz-

@TheNumberOne There's only 2 j's in his answer. You'd need 13 to be able to print out all the characters.

aditsu

17:19

as simple as that language is, I don't think I've seen a working interpreter

TheNumberOne

@aditsu github.com/PoroCYon/bfc

aditsu

@TheNumberOne couldn't get that one to work

Beta Decay

Someone should design a program which takes a Trivial Brainfuck Substition program and, given the output, converts it back to normal Brainfuck

TheNumberOne

??? probably wouldn't work :) the " and ' would mess it up.

Alex A.

??? is objectively the best language ever created. I am not biased on this issue.

aditsu

17:24

there are a few bf derivatives I wanted to try, but several interpreters all refused to work

Alex A.

@Dennis I don't understand how you made ??? into a picture like that. :O

@BrainSteel Did you see how Dennis made ??? into a picture?!

Dennis

It was pretty much the other way around. I took a picture and ???-fied it. :)

Alex A.

How you do dis

aditsu

5 hours ago, by aditsu

@BetaDecay probably gangsta brazenness and crystal meth

Alex A.

@aditsu hahaha what??

Optimizer

17:31

@MartinBüttner since you are here - treating an image's text content as source is a bit of grey area .. any opinion ?

Alex A.

It's really more of a Gary area than a gray area.

Optimizer

bad attempt to a forced joke

Alex A.

Ouch :(

You punched me right in the feelings.

Optimizer

@aditsu they might be dancing good and all. but are they hitting the correct arrows at the right time ?

@AlexA. birds don't feel.

Geobits

Says the soulless llama.

Optimizer

17:35

drama is my soul

aditsu

Geobits was right..

Geobits

You say that like it's unusual :P

aditsu

@Optimizer I didn't get it either at first

Optimizer

if now u get it, please explain

@Geobits is down right correct

aditsu

bah, enough with the drama

Optimizer

17:40

:/

PhiNotPi

Well, I'm losing the mod election by a mile. :/

Alex A.

@PhiNotPi We're all going to lose to Dennis anyway. :P I saw that coming in the nominations.

FWIW, I do think you'd be a great mod and I thought your nomination was very thorough and well put together.

5

aditsu

you're not doing as bad as Beta Decay (although his avatar is really asking for it)

7

Geobits

Meta post related to earlier election conversation.

trichoplax

Your fake graduation announcements just keep getting more realistic

4

Geobits

17:54

What do you mean "fake"? It clearly says we're graduating in September.

:D

Optimizer

@Geobits it just got more realistic recently only..

Geobits

Design-Independent Graduation is on for early September!

Nothing fake about that.

Optimizer

not for us

its not mentioned that its for us too

Geobits

It's on big meta, so affects all sites :P

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