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00:15
what's the meta consensus on "ex post facto" meta consensus? e.g. here, a meta was made ~2yrs after an answer was made. it was valid and accepted by the community at the time. should it be forced to comply with a standard it predates by such a duration?
00:51
@ConorO'Brien I thought it's in effect until a new consensus is made explicitly, like the flag problem
Anonymous
@flawr It's not finished? It seemed pretty finished to me.
Anonymous
@AdmBorkBork Actually, 13 bytes: `+`*(;l1&@)I_
Anonymous
@ConorO'Brien It depends. Sometimes, we allow the consensus to apply retroactively (e.g. I/O methods, allowing implementations created after the challenge to be competitive), and sometimes we don't (e.g. standard loopholes).
Anonymous
01:06
IMO we should always apply changes to consensus retroactively unless there is a compelling reason not to, and the community has decided not to apply the change retroactively. We really could use a better system for managing changing consensus...
01:29
0
Q: Generate an RSA key pair

MegoGiven a positive integer \$N >= 3\$, output an RSA key pair (both the private and the public key) whose key length is \$N\$ bits. The RSA key generation algorithm is as follows: Choose an \$N\$-bit semiprime \$n\$. Let the prime factors of \$n\$ be \$p\$ and \$q\$. Compute \$\lambda(n) = LCM(p...

01:51
I'm trying to come up with a system to prevent copying text (or at least make it significantly harder). I had some ideas like inserting random invisible garbage between each letter that only appears after you strip formatting, anyone know if I can pull something like that off with html/css?
That sounds evil.
It's in the name of preventing piracy
Many attempts to prevent piracy have that in common.
Another thing they have in common: They usually wind up hurting legitimate users, but do nothing to prevent piracy.
@Dennis What, being evil? :P
Yes.
01:58
Basically, my friend translates Japanese light novels into English and posts them on his site. Automated content scrapers take them and post them onto other sites, which we're trying to prevent.
How about a scanned PDF?
Anonymous
@Quintec OCR is easy nowadays
With "email for the raw text" or something
We don't want to images because that definitely harms regular users. Especially those on mobile devices.
@Mego We're still hoping it's hard enough that no one will bother to run ocr and then check for typos on our tiny site
Not that it's any of my business, but is he legally allowed to translate those novels?
02:00
@Mego Forcing OCR eliminates at least a third to a half of scrapers, I would say
Another option is a simple login for a free to create account
What about blind people? They rely on the unformatted version.
Yeah, so i guess either create account logins for the site, or use captchas?
Anonymous
@Dennis Depends on the location. In many places, translations are treated as derivative works, and therefore could infringe upon the original copyright.
@Dennis Technically not, but Japan doesn't have the same laws as the US that say you have to actively defend your IP, so they just sent an email saying they'll leave us alone as long as we don't charge money for access and stuff
The publisher also has other works that have official English translations that we link to so they're ok with it
So far what we've been doing is inserting garbage in <div style="display:none">s which fools scrapers that just curl the HTML and parse it but not people that go to the site and select all the text and press ctrl-c
I still recommend either 1. captchas or 2. accounts
02:14
@Dennis Hey, can I make a bot that leverages TIO to process programs?
02:26
@AddisonCrump Sure. It's not like a gain anything from people visiting the website.
02:41
I just discovered reCAPTCHA v3 is out
Actually just last week
Advanced Security, Ease of Use, Unavailable in China.
Uses fancy machine learning to give a score from 0 to 1, probability a user is a bot.
Presumably so you can give a reCAPTCHA v2 to only those with a low score
Oh no
I fail reCAPTCHAs all the time, I don't know if that's a blurry storefront or a surfboard or the belly of a whale shark, okay?
Reddit is great
03:31
@Quintec No this is a good thing
v3 means the site can check if you're a bot or not while you get to do literally nothing
03:48
@Pavel Try using an SVG.
i think that would stump most scrapers, even if the svg in turn was just doing regular <text>
That's actually a good idea
you also probably would get better control over layout
and i still think it would be selectable -- it just wouldnt show up in the html when you scraped it, provided you used an <img> tag and didnt include it in-line
@quartata TIL I know nothing about the svg format
Been trying to get "foo bar" to render for a while now
i have a post ive wanted to make for 2 weeks now and i cant because GMod crashes immediately on startup
so i guess ill just eat some french fries
0
Q: All different functions

l4m2For functions \$f, g: \{0,1\}^n \rightarrow \{0,1\} \$, we say \$f \sim g\$ if there's a permutation of \$1,2,3,...,n\$ called \$i_1,i_2,i_3,...,i_n\$ so that \$f(x_1,x_2,x_3,...,x_n) = g(x_{i_1},x_{i_2},x_{i_3},...,x_{i_n})\$. Therefore, all such functions are divided in several sets such that, ...

03:57
I can actually select the <text> element but it's invisibnle o_O
whats your svg look like
are you sure its invisible
and not getting cut off because you put it too close to the top of the screen
heres an example to try
<svg xmlns="http://www.w3.org/2000/svg">
    <style>.hi { font: italic 18pt serif; }</style>
    <text x="100" y="100" class="hi">Hello</text>
</svg>
Oh yeah that works
I think the x and the y specify the bottom corner of the text.
So if you had it at 0, 0, it would be cut off.
Yeah that makes sense
04:14
does anyone here know how to do unit tests using D's dub thing? dub test doesn't work no matter where the unittest blocks are
Have you tried dub step? [Muffled ayy heard in the distance]
I actually tried that before I got the pun XD
04:48
heh
 
1 hour later…
06:13
1
Q: Transformers in Disguise (Cops' Thread)

Jo KingThe robber's thread is here The cops task is to write a full program that, when given an input of itself, outputs a finite deterministic string. If the program is given a different input, it should return a different output. Rules: Submissions consist of Language name If any flags are use...

1
Q: Transformers in Disguise (Robbers' Thread)

Jo KingThe cop's thread is here The robber's task is to find a program of size equal to or less than the cop's program, which, when given an itself as input, produces the same output as the cop's program. Additionally, even if a cop's answer is provisionally marked Safe and has been revealed, you can ...

06:40
0
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Shieru AsakotoShould this identifier be suggested? code-golfdecision-problemstring Introduction In Android Studio and other IDEs there are code completions to assist efficient code insertion (especially when the names of the classes or methods are so verbose), like the one in the image below. There are sli...

 
2 hours later…
08:27
0
Q: Worded Calculator

Vedant KandoiTask Write a program that takes a string as input and outputs the result of the expression. Rules The input string will be worded and not numeral. There will be no parentheses. Order of calculation will be divide,multiply,subtract then add. For same operations, the calculations must be done...

09:17
@Mego I think it might be still a little bit too technical, I'm thinking about how to explain it in a little bit less mathy terms.
Maybe adding an example that shows the evaluation of these sums step by step.
@Riker this must 🐝 one of the best askreddits!
 
5 hours later…
14:09
1
Q: Parentheses sequences in lexicographical order

Luis felipe De jesus MunozChallenge Taken from here and also here An n parentheses sequence consists of n (s and n )s. A valid parentheses sequence is defined as the following: You can find a way to repeat erasing adjacent pair of parentheses "()" until it becomes empty. For example, (()) is a valid parentheses...

 
3 hours later…
16:53
2
Q: Smallest Integer DIsk

Pavelgolfers! This challenge is about finding the smallest disk that contains some given points. This is made somewhat tricker, however, by the fact that in this challenge, the disk's coordinates and radius must both be integers. Your input will be a list of points with integer coordinates x and y. Y...

17:06
@J.Sallé only the last one is wrong
Found a couple typos, if you don't mind me pointing them out: "This is made somewhat trickier..."; "...represents the disk's center and R represents its radius..."; "...and there must not exist---s--- such a disk..." — J. Sallé 44 secs ago
@EriktheOutgolfer those are the changes
ah, alright then
in the original it’s “tricker”
@EriktheOutgolfer yeah what quartata said
you can see I'm close to finishing a solution
17:10
@EriktheOutgolfer In which language?
@Adám yeah... can't disclose atm
@EriktheOutgolfer Question is if worth for me to begin in APL.
@Adám nope, definitely not APL
You could always brute force!
so you can start
17:11
@Zacharý My idea
Guys you can edit posts on SE
5
You don't need to leave a comment
btw, why are we leaving comments... as Pavel said
@Pavel Yes, but authors often edit right after posting, and this could lead to editing clashes.
@Adám um, no, many revisions doesn't necessarily mean clashes
*mumbles something about the post sitting in the sandbox for 3 months*
17:14
@EriktheOutgolfer No, but beginning to edit, and then it says "this post has been edited - click to refresh" and then you do so and loose your changes…
@Pavel Did you request last reviews in TNB right before posting?
not that the typos were at all noticeable
Usually making things integer just make code-golf easier. — user202729 1 min ago
hahaha, I would've posted an answer long ago if not for that
Usually I skip the sandbox entirely
@EriktheOutgolfer You never know, there could be a brain-flacker out there who's super happy about it
@Pavel Personally I don't like editing other people's posts, especially if the post has just been made
@EriktheOutgolfer So too here, actually.
well, editing is less bothersome than comments
17:18
I'm pretty sure he's doing it in Jelly.
@Adám what if the average of e.g. the X coordinates of the two points is float, i.e. x.5?
then you have to move the center 0.5 units to either direction, and how are you sure that won't suddenly leave a point out
@EriktheOutgolfer Brute force.
Well that's broing
@Adám good luck...
well, I'm already using some brute-force, but that's to get all possible pairs of points to find out which pair has the greatest distance between the two points
Well, found a downside to insert: ⌊/,⌈/
17:21
wut
@EriktheOutgolfer PAIRS of points? Or just every point within a box?
@Pavel RAD...
@Zacharý "within a box"? no, the diameter must obviously be at least the greatest distance between two points
Oh. Wasn't thinking straight.
>_<
17:47
Ooh an answer
looks like somebody's back yet again...
@Pavel hm, is the output format acceptable? [3, [4, 4]]
Yeah, you just need some way of representing a disk
I'd say it might be if [4,4] is the point.
If it's not the point though, then wtf.
No it is
17:50
Good, that'd actually be some creative trickery if it wasn't.
You don't even need numbers if e.g. you're using Mathematica and want to return an actual Disk
looks like the answerer is a bit behind on the latest news of Jelly though...
§?
Or am i missing something?
/me doesn't know jelly
I've managed to golf that to 21 bytes, 3 bytes because of new features, 1 because of an old one :P
17:52
0
Q: ASCII Art Octagons

AdmBorkBorkGiven an input integer n > 1, output an ASCII-art octagon with side lengths composed of n characters. See examples below: n=2 ## # # # # ## n=3 ### # # # # # # # # # # ### n=4 #### # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # # ...

its cool that i still have the most postss here despite not actually doing anything
true power
alright, I wish every day was like today, regarding the challenges
Well, we all know what to do on the NMP .. Charcoal.
Or Canvas
If only I knew either of those
17:57
Canvas is already there
When in doubt, look at the docs religiously.
I know charcoal has a regular polygon builtin
the "docs", eh? not that they always exist adequately...
So it should be like 4 bytes max
@EriktheOutgolfer yeah whenever I see a post and think "oh this could be done in canvas" Dzaima will already have posted an answer in it.
18:00
Y'sure charcoal has a regular octagon built-in?
There's a polygon builtin you can feed 8 into
no, there's surely no octagon built-in
@J.Sallé Yah, dzaima is really quick on the draw (hah-ha).
6
LOL!
@AdmBorkBork 5/7 pun.
18:02
A perfect score! Thanks!
alright, Pietu's answer has turned confusing...
@EriktheOutgolfer You can post the 17 byte solution yourslef
no, it's based on a previous revision of Pietu's answer
Um, how does one do verbosifying in Charcoal?
the only change I did is exchange useless transposition and mapping for vectorization
and maybe trivial stuff too
18:05
@Zacharý pass a -v argument, iirc
I'm not sure it's useless. and don't vectorize.
it's been put under the test
and yeah, I don't think they're supposed to vectorize over there anyway (if that revision really works, btw)
oh joy is Dennis about to pull out a magic 5 byte answer
definitely no, that's too little
</joke>
18:07
ZµṂrṀ) is the same as ṂrṀ, btw
at least in this case
r does vectorize
hm, looks like that's a pretty deep thing
Oh, --deverbosify
@Zacharý you had asked for verbosifying though >.>
@EriktheOutgolfer It really isn't. and find the lexicographical minimum and maximum. So they just look at the first element of the pair; the second one is only considered for tie breaks.
18:11
@Zacharý or -vl
@J.Sallé >_<. Wow, I am out of it today
@Dennis yeah, I just thought about accounting for the Y coordinates too >_>
That said, «/r»/ is still shorter.
yep
@Dennis yeah, I think not needing the was in my first suggestion (first deleted comment)
quite annoyingly, I can't find a way to make that a function while not making it longer
Yes, it was.
18:17
I don't think I've seen a single Jelly solution where the "optimal" solution had multiple links
that used to be quite common before a few new quicks were introduced... although, in many cases, Ç€ and a link on top could be substituded with µ(link_on_top)µ€ anyway
It used to be more common. ), Ɗ etc. are recent additions.
> Begins a 2-digit base-250 number. If the number is larger than 31500, subtracts 62850, otherwise adds 750.
That's... a strange rule
Well, it's a strange language.
why base 250 and not 255?
18:26
I belive it's because you can't use quote characters themselves
mobile edit bad
Natural numbers up to 1000 can be represented using 3 bytes or less, so ⁽¡¡ is 1001.
i get the purpose, but if the length of the digit string is fixed you should be able to use any character. so whys it base 250 and not 255
@Pavel and it should've been base-256, but a whoopsie happened
That was essentially an oversight. Fixing it would break backwards-compatibility, so I'd rather not.
18:29
because of parsing?
@Dennis yeah, ik
i assume you dont want null bytes so it wouldnt be base 256 anyways
Looks like Pietu isn't going to take your golf suggestions
@Pavel Canvas does stranger stuff - starts with 11, skips even numbers < 21. SOGL had something like that too, but it also skipped 25, 50, 75, 100 & 200 IIRC, and a couple more probably.
@Pavel or is just afk...
ohhh
@EriktheOutgolfer No he posted a whole explanation of hist current answer just now
so yeah it breaks the old literals you mean
well, his decision anyway
Yes, that. The parser is fine.
18:31
@dzaima oh yep, missed some
@Pavel You just have to get people time. :P
no, he really did post an explanation... although I'm not sure if that's really a conscious decision or just forgetting some comments
Not sure about y'all, but I don't constantly check for new comments while I'm typing up an explanation.
I have a browser extension that notifies me of new inbox content
oh cool
18:36
Even so, I'd rather save the explanation I've already written, before overhauling the whole post.
if I want to save the part I've already written, I paste the new solution without selecting it with Ctrl-A
Spoken like someone who doesn't get power outages on a regular basis.
I usually have the support of a battery in that case... saving the post to a file and putting my laptop on standby until the outage is over
@Dennis UPS?
In my experience, UPS batteries don't last long enough to justify their prices.
Batteries in general don't enjoy this climate.
18:47
Goodness, 05AB1E's canvas, totally forgot that was a thing
19:06
oh hey a fractal. I got distracted golfing the octagon :p
pretty
Anyone know what the discard top of stack is in 05AB1E
 
1 hour later…
20:26
anyone here know how to compile a clean program? I have tried
../Downloads/clean-bundle-complete/bin/clm -h 1500m -s 50m -fusion -t -IL Dynamics -IL StdEnv -IL Platform main
Compiling main
clm: can't start the clean compiler: No such file or directory
You need to set CLEAN_HOME to the real path of ../Downloads/clean-bundle-complete.
@Dennis Aha.. let me try that
0
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

MilkyWay90Name: Create a Programming Language Tags: code-bowling, and cops-and-robbers Cops: The cops must design a programming language that takes in the contents of the program from a default I/O method, and do something. Rules: The program must not print anything to STDERR The program must be able...

@Dennis bpaste.net/show/76aef7635951 Still no luck
@Dennis I tried adding the PATH too and now I get bpaste.net/show/d5e08def2b8e
@Οurous Hi... are you about? I am having trouble compiling your clean code
The compiler takes a module name, not a PATH. Try cd-ing into /home/raph/C.
I'm sure there's a way to compile files from other directories, but I haven't done that.
20:41
wow... that worked
thanks
@Dennis After all that I think codegolf.stackexchange.com/a/174678/9207 is incorrect
anyone got any idea how to run ? codegolf.stackexchange.com/a/174657/9207
I have installed sbcl
but I don't even know if the code should be put in a file and somehow called from sbcl
21:01
@Anush If you get a wrong output, it probably is. I don't know enough Clean to provide any insight.
 
3 hours later…
23:36
2
Q: Professor at MIT needs an AP!

Erik the OutgolferThe 5-card magic trick involves a magician whose assistant gives them 4 shown cards and a hidden one, in this order, and the magician must guess the hidden one. WARNING: Solution below! Leave now or get spoiled with it. The solution The trick here is that the five cards are given in a specif...


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