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12:09 AM
does this look OK?
or should they be connected
 
@DownChristopher >_> is that a yes it looks OK or yes it sohuld be connected
 
Connected
 
Hey @DownChristopher ! What's in the background of -1 in the profile pic of yours?
Itna sannata kyon hai, bhai??
 
12:29 AM
@Downgoat just pushed
 
:D thanks
 
12:58 AM
@ГригорийПерельман We won't need to run something only once if we use a more interesting method of taking input.
 
@Downgoat did it work good?
 
1:19 AM
@Arjun Calvin and hobbes
 
2:16 AM
0
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Cole><> Out of Water code-golf The beloved fish who swims through the code of ><> has been taken out of its natural environment. This change has rendered it incapable of moving around in the way it's used to: what used to be tordial movement has been restricted to simple left-to-right movement. But ><...

 
@ATaco I've been thinking about that, I've had the idea that since capturing groups are 1-indexed, $0 could be the input, but that doesn't actually solve anything.
 
$0 is usually the full match.
 
I personally like avoiding implementing my own Magic, if I can help it. It needs some thought.
 
@ГригорийПерельман That is literal $
 
2:31 AM
\$ isn't taken.
It's also literal $.
 
I'd do $_n where n is input number from 0 to 9
 
Numbers for STDIN?
 
If it's not golfy enough then $n where n is a letter from a to z
@ATaco ?
 
The input is just Standard Input.
 
Yeah but if you don't have a way to use multiple inputs many of the challenges will eb such a pain
e.g. multiply two numbers
 
2:35 AM
You're allowed to specify that input must be seperated by a character.
Generally, STDIN is seperated by newlines.
 
@ATaco Oh wait true this is a regex language
Then yeah $$ or $_
 
Basically, it's Retina, but rebuilt with new features.
Hopefully
Martin might have already thought of everything.
 
Actually, the intention was /// but with Regex.
 
Retina, but delimited with / instead of \n
 
I'd like it if it was golfy though, but that would mean a stdlib with things like basic math
 
2:41 AM
I had that idea, ATaco vetoed it as "cheating"
 
I've been thinking about an import syntax, as I've already got a standard math lib written.
I want to do it this way, because I don't like the idea of forcing any particular method of writing.
 
Yeah, good idea
I think like 200 bytes of boilerplate is not a good idea
 
Anyone have a hunch why ajax.googleapis.com/ajax/libs/jquery/2.1.1/jquery.min.js has 4 newlines in it rather than all being on one line? (Or two lines considering the comment at the top.)
 
Literal Newlines?
 
@ATaco Yeah
Well the longest is at column 32062, the second longest at 32013
I wonder if there is some kind of length limitation
 
2:46 AM
Actually, they seem to be at blocks aswell.
Perhaps it has something to do with the Autosemicolon syntax.
 
But that says 500, I have no idea what's changed since then
 
This probably wasn't autocompiled.
 
@ATaco Why not
 
I should say, it probably wasn't autocompiled with a public tool like that.
 
@ATaco Why not
 
2:49 AM
@ASCII-only If I'm not mistaken it goes [82 bytes of comment]\n[32012 bytes of code]\n[32061 bytes of code]\n[20086 bytes of code] (not counting \r\n's in there)
 
-shrug-
 
@HelkaHomba Yeah
 
@ASCII-only Maybe. Would make sense for 2^15 = 32768
 
@HelkaHomba Yeah that's what I thought but even the longest lines is ~700 bytes away from that
 
Perhaps that's the last place to insert a newline before it.
Unlikely, but meh.
 
2:53 AM
But in js there could be a newline after any semicolon (if not in a string)
Though on line 3 the first semicolon is at column 161 :o
 
Wait jQuery uses uglify
22
A: Why do we have newlines in minified JavaScript?

MattjQuery currently use UglifyJS to minify their source code. In their build script, they specifically set the max_line_length directive to be 32 * 1024: The documentation for UglifyJS has this to say on the max-line-len directive; --max-line-len (default 32K characters) — add a newline after a...

So it is 32768
I'm assuming it's at ~32k to make the gzipped file as small as possible
 
@ASCII-only Ah, thanks
But still curious since I bet lines 2 and 3 could be closer to that limit
 
@HelkaHomba Yeah, Closure says it may not exactly be 500 to make to gzipped file smaller, I'm assuming UglifyJS does the same
 
I'm curious if I could get a job in JS minification
I mean most JS minfiers are pretty bad
 
@Downgoat How
 
2:58 AM
they don't account for semantics at all
 
@Downgoat example?
 
like var a = 1; var b = a; console.log(b)
this should become console.log(1) or at least console.log(a)
 
@Downgoat CMC: Make the minified jQuery file shorter than 84000 bytes but still work just the same (i.e. you could still script-src it in html and it would be indistinguishable to the user from normal jQuery)
 
oh my god uglify.js is horrible
Does it really just only remove spaces
 
@Downgoat Complain to UglifyJS
 
3:02 AM
"(?:\\\\.|[\\w-]|[^\\x00-\\xa0])+"
nonononono
 
But yeah it could do a lot better e.g. shortening properties/constant folding
 
also it doesn't convert strings to regexes
e.g. /\test/.source == "\\test" comes in helpful for larger strings
 
I actually wanted to write a challenge a la "Using a substring of the jQuery source write code that does X". That's what brought this on
 
@Downgoat Idea: Fork UglifyJS
 
@Downgoat But would that be less efficient when actually running the code? Efficiency is probably more important than byte count
(for sane non-code golfers)
 
3:10 AM
> non-code golfers
Is that like English golfers or somethign
 
@HelkaHomba I minifyng itself significantly slow downs code
 
when syntactically identical?
 
@Downgoat Really
Uglify says it has constant folding though
 
@Downgoat also I'm not sure that sentence came off :p
 
3:25 AM
@HelkaHomba it converts ifs and other items to horrible ternaires (ternaires are good if you do right)
 
@Downgoat ifs are best for me here jsperf.com/ternary-vs-switch
22
Q: javascript if/else or ternary operator is faster?

JeffWhich method is faster or more responsive in javascript, if/else or the ternary operator? Is it preferred to use one or the other and if so, for what reasons?

 
3:39 AM
Seriously disturbed...
 
0
Q: TiB, not TB, Seriously?

SIGSEGVIf you're like me (and/or use Windows), You should have found this issue quite disturbing. You plug in a hard drive (2TB for my occasion), and realize it doesn't show as 2TB, but a bit smaller size which is clearly not 2TB. Over some research, I found it was because Microsoft's horrible mistake...

 
@NewMainPosts Damnit Charcoal can't do this without float support
Chat mini-poll: Should Charcoal have float support
 
0
Q: Zero (neither positive or negative) attention to challenge proposal in sandbox - what to do?

mEQ5aNLrK3lqs3kfSa5HbvsTWe0nIuA challenge proposal I posted into the sandbox has received zero attention (no votes, no comments). Should I: just post it on the main site and hope for the best? do an edit to bump the question up in the "active" sorting? consider it failed? do something else?

 
3:55 AM
I was told to post my challenge proposal here if I received no feedback from the sandbox.
 
Nothing you can do about it, but nothing negative is a good sign.
 
I don't think no feedback at all is a good sign, especially as this will be my first challenge.
 
Hmm I'm not good at providing feedback but it seems fine
 
The only thing I'm worried about is it being networking related, from what I know this site really doesn't like anything IO based
 
But it's a little specific so don't expect too many answers
@mEQ5aNLrK3lqs3kfSa5HbvsTWe0nIu It's not that PPCG doesn't like it
 
4:01 AM
The idea came because I implemented this myself first using normal OOP design, then decided "can I crank it down into one Kotlin file"
 
It's just a bit specific so it excludes a lot of languages without the needed builtins
 
Funny enough that was my first experience with "code golfing"
shortly after I discovered this site
Yeah it definitely excludes a lot of languages, hence I'm hesistant
also I should really change my name, the "generate random usernames for all websites" really doesn't fit SO...
 
@HelkaHomba this seems like a thing you could ask SO
 
4:25 AM
@HelkaHomba aww yiss. it worked what a coincidence
 
5:21 AM
Does anyone here have any Clojure knowledge?
I need to think of a Clojure-esque way to make a grammar
 
I just watched "Nerve"
It was... interesting
 
(defn -main [& args]
  (defgrammar "testlang"
    [["Number"
      {:n #"[0-9]+"}
      #(read-string (string/join :n ""))]
     ["Whitespace"
      {:ws #"[ \n\r\t]+"}
      #(string/join :ws "")]]))
I honestly don't like the look of this
I need help :(
 
5:59 AM
Could I get chat opinions on a proposed code golf challenge I had? https://codegolf.meta.stackexchange.com/a/11859/42833

(also I'm not too familiar with the etiquette of this particular chat so let me know if this is frowned upon)
 
@Cole Posting your own challenge in the chat for reviews/popularity once or twice is fine
 
 
1 hour later…
7:04 AM
@ATaco Idea: Since # is currently comments, you could use something like #include math replaced with the contents of the file math.rr
 
That was the intention.
 
Yeah, and I just came up with syntax for it.
So, the JetBrains toolbox has added a button to GitHub repos written in Java/Python/Whatever to open it in the corresponding IDE. That's cool.
I never noticed before
 
7:25 AM
How would I make a left-recursion supporting grammar?
 
7:43 AM
I've got this monstrosity:
[["Expression"
  {:none "("
   :left
   (rule-or
     [{:expr "Expression"}
      (fn [] :expr)]
     [{:num "Number"}
      (fn [] :num)])
   :none "Whitespace"
   :plus #"\+"
   :none "Whitespace"
   :right
   (rule-or
     [{:expr "Expression"}
      (fn [] :expr)]
     [{:num "Number}
      (fn [] :num)])
   :none ")"}
  (fn [] [left plus right])]
 ["Number"
  {:num #"[0-9]+"}
  (fn [] (read-string :num))]
 ["Whitespace"
  {:ws #"[ \n\r\t]+"}
  (fn [] :ws)]]
I'll give five points to Gryffindor if anyone can guess what it's meant to be
 
Only a wizard could guess anyways
 
It's a tokeniser
 
@KritixiLithos Bonus points if you can guess what it's matching
I'm making a parser library
 
Numerical expressions?
 
8:07 AM
@KritixiLithos though oddly, the only operator is +
 
anyone interested in a lichess?
antichess maybe?
 
8:31 AM
@AdmBorkBork I found this post, do you know how this makes sense? imgur.com/pV9WtP5
 
is it js?
not sure which is weirder: that or js
 
8:47 AM
array[0.5]
Why.
Why have you done this?
 
@DestructibleLemon Are you replying to me
 
@DestructibleLemon Oh, then that lang is Powershell
 
@Qwerp-Derp actually it appears to be dart
 
@DestructibleLemon ?????
Wait
Dammit I didn't see the dart
I thought cause of the PowerShell background thing that it was PowerShell
 
9:11 AM
What is the most byteous character?
I mean the character which has the greatest value in bytes.
 
In ASCII, ~
 
Probably one of the Zalgo characters, like this one: Z̵̶͓̹̹͚̖̘̜͕͖͖͍̞̐̉̈́̓̆ͤ̽̓̇̽͜ͅ
 
In all the charsets of the world
 
53 bytes
 
Really?! That Z with an accent!?
Costs 53 bytes!
Every command of code-bowling languages should be prefixed tens of those.
*wit tens of those
**with tens of those
 
9:18 AM
Come to the sandbox, I found one at 61 bytes (not putting it in TNB)
 
Okay
 
9:36 AM
Given the equations for two lines which are tangents of a circle with a given radius, is it possible to find the distance between the intersection of the two lines and the centre of the circle?
 
How will you find the centre of the circle? It could be anywhere
Oh wait, "given radius"
 
Here is a desmos, and the radius of the circle is 3
@KritixiLithos?
 
nvm, I didn't see that the radius was given
 
@KritixiLithos Ah, in that case, I might need halp on solving it
 
10:14 AM
0
Q: Safety in numbers

Greg MartinWrite a program to determine if a periodic sequence of positive integers has the property that, for every integer n occurring in the sequence, there are never more than n other integers between two consecutive occurrences of n. For example, 2, 3, 5, 2, 3, 6, 2, 3, 5, 2, 3, 6, ... does have this ...

 
@Qwerp-Derp I've got something, testing now on the Desmos example
Nvm, I forgot to solve something important
 
Windows pls
 
10:36 AM
I am getting stuck at the same place again
So far I have (not sure if it is correct): $x=\frac{(m_2m_1)(C_2-C_1)}{m_1-m_2}$
Where $x$ is the x-coordinate of the circle, $m_1$ and $m_2$ are the gradients of the lines and $C_2$ and $C_1$ are the y-intercepts of the radii
And I am trying to figure out how to express the y-intercepts using the radius of the circle
 
 
1 hour later…
11:50 AM
@Qwerp-Derp Got something on Desmos: desmos.com/calculator/p0qzhhbhbz
All that's left now is to make $C_1$ a constant instead of a slider
 
It looks like a huge maze of lines to me
 
y is the equation of the tangents (1 and 2)
Y is the equation of their normals (ie the circle's radii)
M is the angular bisector of y_1 and y_2
 
I never excelled at geometry...
 
I did it!
 
@KritixiLithos You should colour code your lines :P
Link?
 
11:54 AM
But the problem is that I have to make it work on Desmos
 
@KritixiLithos make a 3d engine in desmos
i know desmos is not a programming language, but that's possible
 
How do I make C a constant? Does anyone know?
Write now it is a line instead of a constant (because there are 2 possible values of C)
@Qwerp-Derp I had to manually set the value of C, but I took the value from the last line: desmos.com/calculator/yk8ikpd2d7
 
But C is not a list
 
@KritixiLithos Awesome! Thanks! As a side note, if you activate the slider of m_1, it looks like a pretty cool slingshot thing.
 
12:01 PM
@LearnHowToBeTransparent I'll give you a simpler version, how do I extract 3 from A^2=9?
 
@KritixiLithos Let C is 1st element of the list.
 
C[0] or C[1] gives an error
 
It's not a list
 
lemme check
@KritixiLithos I doubt that there is a way. The official docs doesn't say anything about that.
 
12:19 PM
When your answer gets posted on Twitter by the creator of SE: twitter.com/spolsky/status/842809220403793920
 
Is it just me or does Windows 10 really BSOD a lot?
 
Just you
The last OS that BSODed for me a lot was Win 3.14
Win7 BSODed for be about once per year or so
 
My Win10 install BSOD 1 time per week
And I'm not even playing with drivers or whatever that can bork
 
12:37 PM
Win10 BSOD'ed for me when I tried it out in its technical preview stage 2 years ago in a virtual machine, while also running Visual Studio on the host machine.
 
 
1 hour later…
1:45 PM
0
Q: How can I find out the jobs occuring at a given time given the intervals at which they run?

purezenA set of jobs are started at the same time and have different and fixed intervals at which they run (eg. every 1s, every 2s..). How can I find out the jobs running at a given time?

 
0
Q: Batch files - Do we need to hide the prompt

SteveFestAs most batch script writers know, we need to add either: @echo off @ to hide the unneeded foo\bar> prompt. Now the problem comes: Do we need to hide the prompt in PPCG answers?

 
2:02 PM
I've finally got round to adding in the support software to https://codegolf.meta.stackexchange.com/a/11221/26981
I would be very glad to hear if anyone would be interested in golfing that monstrosity, and if not, how I might change it to persuade you.
An example solver and automatic verification script it provided, which will hopefully make life substantially easier for any competitors.
(Thanks to those that have already given feedback)
 
 
1 hour later…
3:13 PM
does pdf have a programming language like postscript?
I mean in a similar way to postscript, which is a programming language
 
LaTeX?
 
I think pdf files contain code in a postscript subset that doesn't contain programming features.
 
@fergusq interesting, thanks
I had no idea
@TuxCopter sadly not :)
 
TIL that the bottom right piece of this paper could be the last things Mozart wrote before he died and that's why it was tore off and stolen
 
3:28 PM
TIL?
 
Today I Learned
 
thanks
that is interesting
maybe it said "Bye" in German
 
it said "Quam olim d: C:" according to wikipedia
"an instruction that the 'Quam olim' fugue of the Domine Jesu was to be repeated da capo, at the end of the Hostias"
 
even better :)
where was it stolen from?
 
World's Fair in 1958 in Brussels
 
3:31 PM
good quality facts!
 
3:50 PM
@Qwerp-Derp This would make a nice challenge
 
 
1 hour later…
@Haunted it's because you're changing a +n to a -n, so that's a change of 2n; thus if you need a change of k, then n has to equal k/2
 
5:27 PM
I found a fast way to make test cases, if you have a JS function that solves the problem:
let f = /* function that solves the problem */
let post = document.getElementById("wmd-input")
let test = function () { post.value += " -> " + f(/* parse post.value.split("\n").slice(-1)[0] here */) }
(Note: only tested in the Sandbox)
Then you can enter an input at the bottom of the post, type test() in the console, and it will add the proper output for you
 
5:52 PM
Hey, has there been a plain "average of an array of integers" challenge?
 
0
Q: Language util name byte counting

agcI'm trying to figure out the byte counting works in "Sum the numbers on standard in". In one answer using the jq util counts the non-space bytes after the util name, but not the util or the spaces. Using similar reckoning, (i.e. don't count the util name), one could get a byte count of 0 from n...

 
0
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

ETHproductionsAverage of a tune code-golf math music Often times when I'm bored, I'll find I have a catchy tune from a song stuck in my head. Then I notice the fingers on my right hand moving as if playing that tune on a piano. If I have nothing better to do, I'll spend some time calculating where on the s...

 
@NewMetaPosts Wait, I thought each flag counts as 1 byte
i.e. add + -s flag = 4 bytes
 
I am just giving my interpretation of how lynn was scoring it
 
6:08 PM
Yes, I guess I'm just not sure why Lynn is scoring that way in the first place
But the space definitely doesn't need to be counted
 
I think agc thought that it was the bash program to run it which was being scored
 
If you're wondering how to do str.substring(3, -2) in swift it's: string.substring(with: string.index(string.startIndex, offsetBy: 3)..<string.index(string.endIndex, offsetBy: -2)) O_o
this is horrible
 
@flawr I want to know more about the rise of bread
 
6:26 PM
@Downgoat I wasn't wondering, but thanks for the info anyway, I'll remember to never use Swift
Hey @Downgoat, do you know of any JS libraries or clones that let you change the behavior of operators?
If it's a library, obviously it would only work in a custom eval function
 
@ETHproductions I mean you could with babel
 
Everything I'm googling just comes up with "Expressions and operators" on MDN, etc.
I'm considering making such a library myself, if only as an experiment
 
^ simple babel example, you'd then just eval the resulting code
 
Cool
A babel plugin might be more useful than a standalone library anyway
(What program/website is that, btw?)
 
@ETHproductions astexplorer.net
it's like the best thing ever
 
6:40 PM
Nice, I'll check it out
 
Aww yiss, infinite scrolling works on GitGoat
 
6:58 PM
@Downgoat What's the code on line seven in the lower left?
I mean line six
 
oh, that's the arguments in the generated function
line 6 generates the expression Overloads.add
it's:
t.memberExpression(
   t.identifier("Overloads"),
   t.identifier("add")
)
 
Oh, got it
 
7:23 PM
@DJMcMayhem Regarding what you say here, I found a shorter approach. I'm not sure if it's related to yours
 
7:49 PM
@LuisMendo why was I pinged by this?
 
@flawr it may have been this:
1 hour ago, by Mistah Figgins
@flawr I want to know more about the rise of bread
 
Considering posting this challenge soon... like on Monday or something. Any last minute thoughts on it?
 
@Poke example image is awful big
 
well I can scale that down
@HelkaHomba better?
 
yes
 
@ETHproductions but I've seen that before
 
Huh, no clue then
 
@ГригорийПерельман That's brilliant
 
@flawr Were you? Weird!
 
8:08 PM
@flawr It's obvious that you are DJMcMayhem's sock
 
Or he is my sock.
 
You are a pair of socks. Now we need to find whose are the feet
 
Might explain my love for cheese.
 
@ГригорийПерельман That site is glorious. :) http.cat/500
 
8:12 PM
You should use them on TIO, the current 404 page is boring.
 
@ГригорийПерельман cheese is grated
 
That is also true
450 is great (Slightly NSFW)
 
I like 204, it's hard to pick just one favorite though
 
304 is also one of my favorites
 
8:16 PM
@flawr :O does this mean you'll use cheddar :D
 
imho cheddar ∉ cheese
206 is cool too
4
 
@flawr what if I change name to Pepperjack
 
I'm not really familiar with american cheeses
 
Tilsit all the way.
 
@mınxomaτ I quite like that one too.
also Gruyère
@Downgoat You should have chosen one of these for your language.
 
Is that really just one note?? :-O
 
@LuisMendo Hmm, that's definitely related. Nice work!
 
Thanks!
 
@LuisMendo I'm sure this guy copied this. It has been played hundreds if not thousands of times before he claimed it to be his piece.
 
8:34 PM
Indeed, the empty set is unique :-)
 
@LuisMendo Prove that
 
On a related note: Probably the shortest song: You Suffer by Napalm Death.
 
@JanDvorak Assume A is empty and B is empty too. Then every element of A is in B, and similarly every element of B is in A. QED
Gotta go! See you all
 
Assume we have two uniqe, empty sets A and B. This means that either A or B contains an element not present in the other. As neither set contains elements, this is impossible.
 
Cu!
 
@ГригорийПерельман We're talking about sets, not arrays :D
 
Anyway, you were ninjad by luis
 
I know, I was trying to improve on it.
 
might have already seen it but 10/10
and I guess ГригорийПерельман also, but I don't think I need to ping you
 
ok
@ГригорийПерельман best part is that you can onebox those images
doesn't innately onebox but !http.cat/420 works
 
Cool
I'm just glad that .cat is a valid domain extension.
 
.cat is a Catalonian domain that can only be registered for the purposes that have something to do with Catalonian language and culture and by persons that are connected to Catalonia somehow. That's sad.
For regular persons it is impossible to get a .cat domain usual ways. :(
 
9:16 PM
how about .dog domains?
 
@fergusq What about monster.cat
 
@Mendeleev That page contains the words 'Monstercat <3 Català' and nothing else.
 
Any people here play KSP
 
@ГригорийПерельман Yes, I know
They use it as a URL shortener
 
9:38 PM
@DownChristopher Me
 
@TuxCopter Have you tried the Netherdyne Mass Driver mod?
I am trying to get it to work but i can't
 
@Mendeleev I guess the authorities don't really check that all domains follow the rules, so it is possible to lie in the application and get the domain.
 
@fergusq Well, I mean, the homepage is somewhat related to Catalonia...
 
I mean the mod works but i cannot get my stuff to go flying
 
k, I'm going to try it and see if it works for me
 
9:41 PM
At least http.cat is certainly not related to Catalonia (although it has a Catalonian translation).
Maybe the authorities accept every web site that contains the word "Català"???
 
0
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

ignasas kielasasMake a generated MIDI sound better Being a crazy man, I sometimes listen to music made to midi trough a filter that makes it MIDI. It is a great experience, but I need to work a lot on it, because MIDI has a lot of instruments, and not every one sound good with every track Challenge Write a pr...

 
@TuxCopter sweet
 
I think that the authorites don't care as long as you do anything to make it even remotely related to Catalonia. If running your site through google translate and offering that version is what you do, it counts.
 
@Downgoat I've got the basics of my experimental plugin set up, now how do I set it up as a plugin?
 
@ETHproductions use babel.trasform(code, { plugins: [ yourPlugin ] }) to transform
 
9:56 PM
OK, cool, I'll try that
 
@DownChristopher Uh, how to use the mass accelerators?
 
@TuxCopter There is a readme in the download
it explains everything
I found out my problem
 
oh ok
 
Also how do i get all my batteries to turn on at once? @TuxCopter
 
I don't think it's possible
 
9:58 PM
Crap
I have to active ~50-100 batteries
I am in sandbox but can't find a infinite power bank (I swear there was one)
 
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