I'm too cowardly to downvote anymore

because I realized it was the reason why a few points randomly disappear from my reputation on occasion.

with no notification

@Nihilist_Frost I hope that we'll comment more often when we downvote and it's less clear where the answer goes wrong (in our opinion).

@Nihilist_Frost D'you mean retaliatory downvotes? Or do you mean downvoting answers, where you lose reputation for doing so?

@jimsug Downvoting answers.

Now that post about the defenestrate question being word golf will stay on the front page of ELL for some time...

I've just reviewed a bunch of questions on ELL. I think we still have voting problems on ELL, and the problem is probably getting worse.

Many not so good answers seem to gain a handful of votes.

And some good answers are simply overlooked.

There are vote-magnet users.

Araucaria, Stoney.

There are also so many vote-bait questions too

I dread when Araucaria shows up on any question.

He'll take 60+% of the votes if he appears.

I think the number of votes an answerer gets is not as important as how the learners think of the number of votes on answers they see.

If a good answer has got many votes, it's fine.

Imagine a language website that lots of so-so, or not so great answers have got tons of votes.

Would learners stick around?

change subject.

/dʁw, tʁw, kʁw/ by extension

Sounds like speaking in French is harder when we've got a sore throat.

prntscr.com/90blgj

I actually posted that link-only answer to make a point.

that if the question can be 100% answered by looking up a plain link or googling, it is a bad question for ELL.

Sometimes both the question and answer can be found by googling elsewhere!

hola

Halo, @Freddy!

People vote less!

@snailboat Sigh

Hey, guys, wanna gimme a hand here?

@dam how are you? :)

@StoneyB To be honest, I would never ever use "frangible".

@Nihilist_Frost I wouldn't go that far - but I'm pretty sure I never have used frangible.

@StoneyB K.

meta.ell.stackexchange.com/questions/2735/… -- @Arau @Stoney see for yourself the reason I won't be contributing to meta.ELL anymore. People don't like me here, and I perfectly understand that. But I tried to make two come backs, and it's clear that ELL isn't my place, and won't be.

I'll just go ahead and answer stuff to get shiny numbers and digital points, like everyone else.

@Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ. Don't bother with Meta.

Yeah, I figured.

I closed the last meta.ELL tab I had.

But somehow now I'm going to write something in meta.chem.

Because!

The defenestration fiasco made me have a poor attitude about Meta.

Eh, was it a fiasco?

Well, chat.ELL is really an awesome place, thanks to @Dam and @Snail.

In fact, I first came here, then went to the chem chat.

The whole defenestration thing has been on the front page of ELL for some time.

But ELL itself and its meta have a sickness, and that's not adhering to any arbitrary rules we make.

I raged about the defenestration question when it was posted because I didn't think it was helpful for ELL.

Some more people came on too and all the rage/argument comments were deleted.

@Nihilist_Frost And yet we have a mod who think he has put himself in the OP's shoes. :/

@Nihilist_Frost That's sad. I expected it coming.

@Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ. Who is that?

The rage comments and stuff.

the mod?

ELL is degenerating into something worse than it already is. Let me write one last meta.ELL post.

@Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ. 1) I hope that what you mean by "People don't like me here" is no more than "There are a couple of people around here who don't like me" -- which I think could be said by everybody active on the site. There are at least a couple dozen people who don't like me, or my attitude, or my answers. Shrug. You can't let it get under your skin.

@StoneyB here meant meta.ELL - chat.ELL

2) I hope, furthermore, that the lack of response on Meta isn't going to keep you from answering questions and extending help to folks here on chat, where I think you are an extremely valuable presence.

@StoneyB Well, this isn't a rage-quit. I'm just bothering to stand up and move somewhere else so that I won't be frowned upon. I'm backing off from meta.ELL, but chat activity will be as usual. And the main site can do well with or without me. I don't do much there anyway.

3) I just saw the exam-questions post for the first time. If I'd seen it earlier I'da said it has the same sort of value as word-request and sentence-meaning and interpretation, which are all basically meta-tags that go to the form and intent of the question rather than its substantive content. None of them are of the slightest use to people looking for answers to specific questions . . .

@StoneyB I can't get any consensus on the post if half of the votes I get are gonna be downvotes. The problem isn't you. It's certain people who're too shortsighted to decide on meta.

. . . but they do seem to be valued by people who want to filter for particular sorts of questions they enjoy or detest answering. So I'm not gonna trouble myself with the matter.

By 'decide' I don't mean 'express opinions', but 'giving the final verdict'.

Meta.ell has always been apathetic. Very few people care at all about most of the issues raised there; and since issues which do get people excited tend to arouse more heat than light, I think most people prefer to let sleeping dogs lie.

"No truer words were spoken" @Stoney.

But the sleeping dogs will bite when you don't expect them @Stoney, and that's the point I'm gonna try to make in my last meta post. Whether people will care to try and understand what I'm saying is something else.

@Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ. My advice is that you save yourself the trouble. People who want to hear what you have to say will nod wisely and leave it at that; and people who don't will sneer and invent theological reasons why you're wrong. Democracy only works when the democrats want to work, and folks here mostly don't.

@StoneyB I'm not one of the people that can just sit and do nothing when they should be. I am heeding your advice in fact. I'm saving myself the trouble, but am also indicating what people miss there.

@Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ. Go read Lenin first! :)

Blame my youth, but I can't keep quiet. Well, people can't blame me later when ELL would turn into  . . . .

But they will, you know . . .

@StoneyB Please let me be apathetic about something. :)

tu moriturus nos salutas