CURED - 2021-11-03

12:13 AM

@Shaun Then it will be seen in the reopen review queue, and re-evaluated.

3:32 AM

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Repeating words in answer (87): Create an isosceles triangle from only equilateral triangles. Possible or impossible? by asdf on math.SE

SmokeDetector

5:35 AM

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Mostly non-latin body (79): How to solve this Partial Differential Equation with 3rd order Liner Equation by Saurabh Meena on math.SE

Peter

8:40 AM

C

Again the claim in the comments in this post that $\pi(10^{28})$ is known. Have I missed a recent new record ?

Jitendra Singh

C

Peter

9:44 AM

CD - nice answer, but unfortunately to a contextless question.

Peter

11:02 AM

D

CD

amWhy

12:23 PM

@Peter question is closed, open now for deletion.

islamm

12:54 PM

C

user21820

1:26 PM

@BillDubuque @ParclyTaxel @ArcticChar @RRL @TheSimpliFire: You might be interested in this suggested moderator election question, which would tell us whether the candidate would be willing to help get rid of nonsense that are 'sincere attempts to answer'.

@Peter Wow 6 upvotes but no evidence of any attempts.

@JitendraSingh It has since been improved, though I don't think the added stuff amounts to much effort.

TheSimpliFire

@user21820 Well the good news is hardly any questions now make it on the HNQ for a long time before removed.

user21820

@TheSimpliFire Maybe, but that's not the focus of that question anyway.

I mention it here because current moderators tend to avoid using their deletion votes even for clear-cut wrong answers, making it a problem that normal users can't solve (there just aren't enough users who care). And the final question list will come from only the top 8 suggestions.

Peter

1:45 PM

C

islamm

C

TheSimpliFire

@user21820 It's good to have on the list but I like user1729's suggestion.

I don't think it's often that blatantly incorrect/cranky posts have a net positive score (if they're not community deleted then they're downvoted quite heavily), but there are other ways to deal with them aside from mod deletion.

islamm

D

Jitendra Singh

@MartinR would you like to become a moderator?

Peter

@user21820 Moreover a random equation for which the structure of the solutions probably cannot be determined.

By the way : The "you voted to delete message" appears again :)

D - not quite clear what the author actually wants to know.

rschwieb

2:16 PM

Feels like the makings of a bad big-list: gitea.dev.seegrid.com/eng/blue-server/pulls/1274https://…

personal/offtopic: math.stackexchange.com/q/4283715/29335

amWhy

2:38 PM

Please vote to delete

user21820

@Peter Where? Can you post a screen-shot here and ping Xander so that he can make a Meta post?

TheSimpliFire

@user21820 Relevant meta.stackexchange.com/questions/233537/…

Peter

Does this make sense ? I have very little experience with topology.

user21820

2:53 PM

@TheSimpliFire Thanks for your feedback, but the point is that the HNQ drive-by voters generally do not downvote. For example this rubbish got 17 upvotes and we barely managed to delete it, and after that it got an undelete-vote...

And recently:

May 6 '20 at 2:39, by Xander Henderson

This answer is simply wrong, and managed to get 11 upvotes thanks to the vagaries of the HNQ.

But instead of disappearing it now has 14 upvotes... Xander was not a moderator at that time, but I'm pretty sure he won't delete it even now.

Xander Henderson

@Peter It seems to make sense to me, but the question itself is kind of borderline "Does this have a name? / What is it good for?" doesn't strike me as an excellent question. Also, I think that knowledge of typology is less important here than knowledge of extended number systems and infinite ordinals.

@user21820 Yes, it is annoying. Though the most recent votes are more than a year old.

TheSimpliFire

@XanderHenderson Isn't that what reference-request is for?

José Carlos Santos

@amWhy Assuming that you meant the question and not the answer, it's done (and the answer is gone too, of course, but as a side effect).

TheSimpliFire

(I haven't checked its correctness but if it is it would be very well received on MO)

Xander Henderson

@TheSimpliFire Maybe? I feel like the reference request tag should be for more specific or precisely stated problems. "Does this have a name?" and "Has this been studied?" feels too broad to me, in contrast to "Where can I find a proof of [theorem]?"

But note that I said that is isn't excellent, not that it is clearly off-topic or terrible.

user21820

3:02 PM

Wrong answer with 5 upvotes still not fixed and not deleted.

José Carlos Santos

@user21820 As you may have guessed, I have already downvoted it long ago.

TheSimpliFire

@user21820 As I said before, HNQ-related upvoted nonsense is nowadays a much more reduced issue than before. But your second link is a good one to discuss; since mods are exception handlers, where an answer is simply incorrect it might not be a bad idea to add a notice saying precisely that.

Unfortunately this feature request has not been made available yet, but it is possible for CMs to add to the selection of post notices (by request of site mods) if that is warranted by consensus.

user21820

Completely bogus answer got 12 upvotes due to HNQ and only 6 downvotes despite 23 upvotes on a comment pointing out the error, and the second version still makes no sense.

Xander Henderson

@TheSimpliFire We have generally been admonished not to judge the mathematical correctness of answers. I think that changing this stance would require, at the very least, some discussion on meta. I also do not know how the rest of the moderation team feels about adjudicating mathematical correctness.

user21820

Totally fails to answer the question as Paramanand pointed out but got 9 upvotes. (Disclaimer: I posted a counter-answer but the asker failed to accept it...)

TheSimpliFire

3:10 PM

@XanderHenderson Exactly. That's why I said consensus at the end, this is a big decision and should not be something approved by one/a small group of people.

user21820

@TheSimpliFire And that's why my suggested question is phrased as "Do you think moderators should ..."

Because if the candidate doesn't even think so, then we lose from move one.

If the candidate thinks so, it doesn't imply that things will change. But at least it's worth knowing what they think.

TheSimpliFire

@user21820 That must require community approval as Xander has suggested. But I see no harm in the action of raising this issue on meta, as it has not been discussed in depth recently.

Xander Henderson

I would love to have a wikipedia-style banner to tack onto a post: "This answer is of disputed mathematical correctness. The information contained in the answer may not be accurate. If you are knowledgeable in this area, please consider leaving a comment, voting (up or down), or nominating the post for deletion."

TheSimpliFire

@XanderHenderson Put my thought into words, also note Skeptics.SE has their own custom post notices so it's definitely a viable path if it's agreed upon.

user21820

@XanderHenderson The last option fails, because (if you forgot) normal users cannot delete-vote unless the score is low. That's why HNQ throws a pile of poop into the system.

Xander Henderson

3:14 PM

@user21820 Can't a normal user with 20k XP vote to delete?

TheSimpliFire

No

@user21820 for instance, I can't VTD this

Xander Henderson

Oi... :( meta.stackexchange.com/questions/5221/…

user21820

@XanderHenderson No!

Now you know why we keep pestering moderators to delete things we can't...

TheSimpliFire

I'll note that with the new shift in the SE team they are considering extra perks for 30k+ users.

Martin R

@JitendraSingh No, thanks. I do not think that I am suited for that position. Apart from that, I do not have the required “Convention” tag because my activity on Meta is almost zero.

amWhy

3:17 PM

@JoséCarlosSantos Great, thanks!

Martin R

I have respect for the moderators who surely spend a lot of time and energy with that job, and still are regularly criticized because they cannot meet everybody's expectations. I could not do that.

user21820

@MartinR Hah good description of their job, yes.

Arctic Char

D1, D2, D3, D4

D5, D6, D7, D8

D9, D10, D11, D12

amWhy

@TheSimpliFire That'd be awesome! I'll cross my fingers x. They can start by adding back, at least for 30K and + users

TheSimpliFire

@amWhy They mentioned "Focusing on moderator and high-reputation user projects" so maybe there'll be more than one category (100k would be nice)

amWhy

3:31 PM

... capacity to vote to delete a post a second time?

@TheSimpliFire Thanks for your link!

Martin R

@user21820 That answer can be deleted now. There is another answer to that question which has the same flaw.

user21820

@MartinR Thanks! That needs one more delete-vote and The other needs one more downvote for deletion.

amWhy

Delete

TheSimpliFire

@XanderHenderson Forgot to reply to this, but it's not too broad if the result they are looking for is very specific. However, it would be very/more suitable on MO, see Is this a known compactification of the natural numbers?

Martin R

@amWhy Interestingly, one close-vote is from the answerer who complained about the downvote :)

user21820

3:40 PM

@MartinR: The other is up for deletion now as well.

Martin R

@user21820 Well, I (inadvertently) retracted my delete vote because I did not pay close attention to the dialog. – The ability to retract reopen and delete votes is a new feature!

user21820

@MartinR Crap that's bad...

Someone needs to suggest aging away of undelete-votes.

Hmm maybe not, they might make delete-votes age too, lol.

Martin R

@user21820 I am not the only one

user21820

These annoyances are all trying to make Math SE's quality become monotonically decreasing.

2

TheSimpliFire

Has there been any consensus on a three-vote closure policy here yet?

user21820

4:00 PM

@MartinR ARGH I also did that!!

amWhy

@TheSimpliFire No; still, five votes are needed. Is it an option for individual sites to choose such an option? One modera

user21820

I didn't realize until I refreshed to see my vote gone!

@amWhy @TheSimpliFire: Please help to delete the wrong post mentioned above, because both MartinR and I accidentally retracted our delete-vote. =(

Martin R

@TheSimpliFire I had mentioned that in the Math Meta Chat when Stack Overflow reduced the close/reopen vote threshold from 5 to 3, but apart from one comment there was no feedback.

in Math Meta Chat, Dec 4 '19 at 8:58, by Martin R

Stack Overflow has just lowered the close/reopen vote threshold from 5 to 3:

in Math Meta Chat, Dec 4 '19 at 22:09, by Isabella

@MartinR I don't know. But 5 seems better than 3. A question would be better judged with 5 users instead of only 3.

amWhy

...One math moderator really needs to keep track of such matters

TheSimpliFire

@user21820 Just did, though I only did so after seeing they were last active in July.

Peter

4:03 PM

3 close-votes is no lucky solution in general.

user21820

Not an answer at all but got an upvote!

amWhy

@user21820 Gone.

user21820

@amWhy Thanks to all!

amWhy

@MartinR Dang it; given the major activity among only a handful users, but quite vocal, in the Reopen&Undelete thread, I don't know how this would fair in a contemporary post to meta to test the idea out. We'd need to have strong justifications, and support from many of us. Meta, at times, draws more complainers of downvoted, closed, and/or deleted posts, than any other type of question.

TheSimpliFire

4:22 PM

IMO a three-vote closure policy would be a nice extension to EoQS and especially as close reviews are at 700.

Feeds

user21820 has made a change to the feeds posted into this room

user21820

@amWhy I added a feed so that we can keep track of that.

amWhy

@user21820 Great idea! Thanks!

user21820

The NAA is up for deletion now. Please vote only once! =)

amWhy

@user21820 Nice timing; I had just dv'd it. In any case, one more del vote needed. Please vote only once =P

user21820

4:38 PM

-1. The point of moderators is not to judge technical accuracy. This has been mentioned hundreds of times on meta stack overflow and meta stack exchange. — Ekadh Singh - Reinstate Monica 3 mins ago

^ See, some users don't want moderators to care about mathematical correctness. =(

I don't know what's the point of Math SE if even the mathematics is wrong lol.

Feeds

-4

A: Requests for Reopen & Undeletion Votes (volume 01/2021 - today)

Question closed, reopened, closed again, deleted. Please undelete my answer to the question https://math.stackexchange.com/questions/4248118/is-this-proof-correct-for-positive-semidefinite-matrices?noredirect=1 The question had been closed as a duplicate to the older question Is it true that $A^2...

-1

A: Requests for Reopen & Undeletion Votes (volume 01/2021 - today)

Reopened Please reopen Solving $2\cos \left( \frac{\pi }{2}-\theta \right)=3\cos \left( \frac{\pi }{3}+\theta \right)$ for $0 < θ < 2π$. This question was closed as a duplicate by the Community bot, yet it is not remotely related to Find all $x$ that satisfy $ 3 \cos{2x}=-1 $ for $0^{\circ} \leq ...

-6

A: Requests for Reopen & Undeletion Votes (volume 01/2021 - today)

Please undelete : https://math.stackexchange.com/questions/4152081/is-this-a-valid-proof-that-2x-0-has-no-real-solutions I fail to see why this has been deleted. The user clearly provides an attempt. The question was unilaterally closed before as a dupe of a question(that didn’t meet the site g...

1

A: Requests for Reopen & Undeletion Votes (volume 01/2021 - today)

Undeleted, deleted again How can Irrational numbers go on forever asks an elementary but reasonable mathematical question with a factual answer. It was closed as “needs details or clarity”, but I found it clear enough to answer. (I think it should probably have been closed as a duplicate.) Par...

-1

A: Requests for Reopen & Undeletion Votes (volume 01/2021 - today)

Reopened question closed for too broad/unfocused even after it was edited to have only 1 question: Whether or not a (cyclic and thus Abelian) group $\mathbb Z_{p^m}$ (prime power) is decomposable into (normal) subgroups I don't mean to be arrogant, but I think the previous close votes were for ol...

user21820

(Note that whenever a new feed is added the last 5 items would be dumped after a while. In the future it would only come one by one as it is posted.)

Jitendra Singh

@user21820 Will feeds only give negative score or less positive score posts?

amWhy

@user21820 I wasn't sure of what feed you added. This is perfect!

user21820

@JitendraSingh All.

amWhy

4:56 PM

@Feeds Crap! I ran into the same issue as mentioned on meta: tried to vote to delete one of the posts, which had 2 delete votes, and instead of being informed I already had voted to delete, I inadvertently "retracted" my vote. I which there were some things the developers didn't screw up, for once.

Let me just say, before they correct the issue, when receiving a pop up after voting to delete anything, be sure to read the prompt. They look exactly alike: One is "vote to delete this post?" or "Vote to retract your vote?" ... with no warning "You already voted to delete this post."

Arctic Char

5:40 PM

C Collatz again.

amWhy

6:05 PM

@ArcticChar Probably need to the "Help FAQ", under "Asking" "(1) Don't even dare mention the Collatz Conjecture. JUST DON'T!!" Half-joking, but then again ... ;D

Math

Poor Q not about math really

rschwieb

too broad/not useful math.stackexchange.com/q/4253540/29335

special snowflake recommendation request: math.stackexchange.com/q/4253540/29335

"looking for reassurance my feelings are normal" math.stackexchange.com/q/4232425/29335

amWhy

6:21 PM

@Math I'll give you one warning for you to stop your nonsense in this chat room. I'll also ping @Xander. It seems every question you post here for deletion is a post answered five or more years ago by a user you're well known to have harassed. Do not target any user ever.

Math

6:31 PM

I am sorry @amWhy I was not aware of that rule; please remove the comment(I can't delete) thanks

amWhy

→ 1 message moved to Trash

user21820

@ArcticChar Up for deletion now.

@amWhy I can fix this BUG using a greasemonkey script to change the appearance of the "delete" button. For me, it now looks like "Delete-voted already (1)" instead of "Delete (1)". Who wants the script? CC @MartinR @Peter @TheSimpliFire

amWhy

@user21820 I do! But I don't know how to install it or write it ... or where to enter it. I'm really a novice wrt scripts.

I take it that I need to install/add on GreaseMonkey to my browser?

user21820

6:48 PM

Yes that's right. It would be the same process as with Makyen's script:

Oct 19 at 6:53, by user21820

For real-time request status: Install Greasemonkey (for Firefox derivatives) or Tampermonkey (for Chrome). Then install Makyen's script.

(1) Install either of those two addons to the browser.

(2) Click on Makyen's script and it will ask you whether you trust it. If you do, then install it.

Done.

amWhy

Yikes, I somehow missed that message. Thanks for reposting.

user21820

7:31 PM

D1, D2, D3.

user21820

8:04 PM

C1, C2, C3.

amWhy

9:13 PM

Hi @Joe!

Joe

9:30 PM

@amWhy: Hi! Sorry I didn't quite catch you the other day. My MSE activity has been more sporadic since the semester has begun.

amWhy

@Joe No problem! I understand. Glad to see you, though! Have you read the meta announcement about an upcoming election? Next week, nominations begin, then depending on the number of people running, the actual week of the election will be announced.

Joe

I flicked through the announcement, but I haven't been following the details closely. It does seem that this election is going to be very significant, in light of the EOQs announcement.

amWhy

10:00 PM

@Joe Indeed. I saw you comment; good work!

Needs to be closed, asap, big time.

amWhy

10:57 PM

^^^ Asker self deleted the question (fine because there were no answers posted, which is good).

amWhy

11:31 PM

pls close

^^^ closed!

Transcript for

$Mathematics$ CURED