@WorldEngineer depends on the action. I think it takes 3 people voting "leave opened" to kick the post out of the queue

I'm not sure, I was under the impression that conflicting review results would result in more users needed to review... but I'm not sure why I have that impression.

@Walter I believe that's true for the suggested edits queue, but not so much for the others.

@AnnaLear that may be where my confusion lays... thanks.

@WorldEngineer Eh, I work here and I only have a passing knowledge of the specifics of /review. ;)

There's a LOT of detail in there. Don't feel bad if you can't remember all of it.

@WorldEngineer that's basically what I do

@WorldEngineer my point was merely the overwhelming amount of influence those 3 people constitute in the governance of the site when you consider precedence is often used as evidence for future policy

Not that the rest of the community couldn't hold an equivalent amount of influence by merely participating when they are not, it's just interesting to note that is the current state of the site

Thus why the Y combinator is so beautiful :)

@JimmyHoffa that's probably always been the case but it's just more visible now. Look at the top Rep users, top editors and most common names in close votes... It's the same group of active users. You're just seeing 3 users (me included, I assume) that like to hang out in /review

@Walter I get it, but it hasn't always been the case. the All Time close vote count is 6k, 1k of those are from a user who's been a member for 6m, and 700 from a user who's been around for 1 year.

You've been around a longer time so your record in there is at a considerably slower rate than either of them

Really?

I did not know that. How new?

@JimmyHoffa Six months or so.

Ah

Nevermind the time aspect of the function then

Only the suggested edits queue was back filled.

That also means the stats could be wonky from low sample since <6 months isn't a significant time

True but with sufficient sample size they aren't lying

still interesting over the last 6 months the size of influence by those 3 folks vs others (the 4th person in stats has half as many reviews as the 3rd person)

@JimmyHoffa Another thing about /review is that it isn't exactly mod friendly, personally I stay as far away from it as I can (except suggested edits). The 300+ questions I've closed this quarter aren't logged in the review stats.

In my perview moderators have different expectations and responsibilities than the rest of the community, so I wouldn't even factor you in

plus doesn't it take a close vote to actually show up in the queue?

@Walter Or a flag (I think?)

Not sure which but yes

I am just curious how the site would look if those 3 users abstained for a month, allowing a larger majority of the community that 44% of influence back

@YannisRizos I had one of those happen to me... I was curious how that could happen

@JimmyHoffa What's stopping everyone else from influencing the community right now?

@YannisRizos if you ask sociologists they'd say the biggest factor in voter disenfranchisement is the feeling that they are not represented and therefore sense that their vote doesn't count

which considering only 3 people hold 44% of the influence right now, is kind of true

well, that or violence depending on which country they were studying ;)

@JimmyHoffa completely playing devil's advocate here (cause i really don't believe the point i'm about to make) but couldn't I say that I deserve that influence because of the amount of activity I bring to the site?

and that in turn you would deserve that influence with an equal amount of activity?

The site exists to benefit the community, you are but a fraction of a percent of that community, I would say that claim is tantamount to saying you know what is beneficial to, in your case, ~15% of the community or you're perspective is as valuable as 100 other community members if you claim yourself to be .15% of the community (I don't know how many active users we have?)

@JimmyHoffa Sorry, but that's crap. What's your solution, no one should be reviewing so everyone feels "represented"?

haha no

I'm just trying to think about it is all

@YannisRizos I wonder what would happen if there were a more equal availability of close-vote tokens or something, everybody can do ~10 a day or something. That would have huge problems itself. I'm just pondering the fact that these numbers are so far out of skew

like I said, just playing devil's advocate to stir the discussion. my only point is the same as @WorldEngineer, involement counts

What would a balanced version of these numbers look like? 44% of close-vote reviews being done by maybe the top 20 most active members rather than top 3? What would that look like? It would mean the top 3 would be capped or perhaps at the bottom of the queue due to activity

I know involvement counts.

@JimmyHoffa Everyone gets 20 reviews per queue per day (on the queues they can access, there are certain rep limitations).

Interesting

and some days I can get on the site and see more than a dozen sitting there

some days zero

also interesting

I wonder if queue sorting could work that out

or reminders to the less active

so it doesn't really take a lot to build up a lot of reviews in a couple of weeks if timing works out

Either way, I wonder what the site would look like if that 44% were given back to the community at large.

do you have enough rep to use the /review?

@JimmyHoffa What 44% and who took it from the community?

Sorry, you're right, that's 44% of the activity that they gave to the governance of the community :P

@JimmyHoffa The governance of the community isn't reflected in the close queue stats.

@Walter as of last week I finally do

@YannisRizos it isn't? You don't think that when someone goes to post a question, see's similar closed questions, they aren't come to understand they aren't supposed to post questions on topics like that?

@JimmyHoffa excellent. Then use it and you can add yourself to make it 4 people. All are welcome!

@JimmyHoffa On Programmers people can: Ask, answer, edit, review, participate in Meta, chat, organize tags, vote, etc (I know I'm forgetting something). Every contribution counts towards the site's governance.

@Walter I hope to. With luck we'll see closed question counts go down on the front page, though I have a lot of opposition heh

@JimmyHoffa balancing based on review queue stats won't do the trick; one of the most active close-voters per my observations isn't even listed in top 10 reviewers - one can just read questions, assign votes and participate anonymously...

@YannisRizos excellent point. look at Rachel... she's not on that list, but she definitely contributes to the site's governance (she's just an example off the top of my head)

@gnat you can close vote anonymously in the queue?

it's only Review tasks not anonymous by design, any voting done outside is as usual

@Walter hah how do you figure? Her contribution is proposing perspectives to be demonized as an annoying troll

Active voters influence the community by identifying great posts (upvoting) and crap ones (downvoting), for example.

(That's not what I think of her point-of-view, but there's a highly active element on the site which clearly does)

@gnat had no idea. Cool to know.

@JimmyHoffa generally speaking, no closing is anonymous; closers are always displayed in the question notice; it is just that review numbers don't reflect close votes done from outside of the queue. By the way regarding your note about abstaining,...

@JimmyHoffa I didn't say I agreed with her opinion or not, just that she's not on the list and is vocal in other ways. to @YannisRizos point, there's a ton of ways to participate. you just happened to pick a new feature where 3 users are very active. i wouldn't read more into it than that

...I am one of the most active close voters and I did abstain for a while (few weeks) - there were no difference

at least no difference I could notice

Okey dokey then. Cool to hear you were curious and gave it a try yourself

Might be worth looking at the data API for those 3 weeks

but if you didn't notice anything, you're probably right.

@JimmyHoffa More often than not I strongly disagree with @Rachel's perspective, but I'm very glad it's her that's bringing up almost every issue I disagree with and not someone who'd go straight for Godwin's law.

I know, that godwin was a wanker, whoever he was :)

per my observations, for close votes bus factor is more than one

@JimmyHoffa Well, he's a lawyer, so he's a wanker by definition ;P

Heh, unsurprisingly the UserId is clipped from data.SE on votes of VoteTypeId Close

was worth a shot just to see if counts levelled out more in there with a group by

Meh, doesn't matter, I enjoy answering questions here all the same

anyone know how to permanently hide that news feed