Ask Ubuntu General Room

Jorge Castro

00:00

it is in the body

aking1012

i must have missed it. sorry

re-read it and i see it now. is there a possibility it should be more prominent so it's an inspiration to view more posts instead of its current status as a sort of footnote?

aking1012

00:39

o/ @jrg

jrg

Evening @aking1012.

Did gnomeslice go nuts?

@aking1012 what purpose would this communal option do?

aking1012

it would allow users to sort of group vote or pool votes. not like some one person would have more votes than before, just that their group-votes would carry more weight

scenario forthcoming

jrg

Uh... not sure I understand. We already have the whole "takes 5 votes to close a question" thing.

BUt i will wait for a scenario before I speak further. :)

(side note: once I got it working, the whole webapps ppa thing seems to be working fairly well.)

aking1012

a has 20 total votes.
b has 20 total votes.
a has used 10.
a and b agree to have communal votes.
a on the remaining 10 votes carries weight of 2 votes.
cannot exceed 20 vote limit, but user to user trust allows the votes to carry more weight.
now the next day, b sees a problem and votes. it carries the weight of 2 people(but a cannot vote again on that same question)
make sense?

2

daslinkard

Sup room!

jrg

00:45

Yeah, in a weird, twisted rude-goldbergish kind of way. Then again, i'm still not seeing how a technical solution will solve a community (or more precisely, a lack thereof) problem.

daslinkard

I've got a question maybe someone can help me with....I've been over in the IRC chat for ubuntu....but no success.

aking1012

@jrg it allows the community to sort of elect moderators without actual elections i suppose. it's a grossly different model

jrg

Because really, you know how long it takes for a super bad question to get closed on ServerFault and SO? Hour, max.

aking1012

not sure who that was directed at

jrg

Here it will take 2-3, unless a mod is lurking around. Still acceptable. So I'm not sure I see the problem as large as you think it is.

aking1012

00:48

i didn't say it was a problem. i just said it would be super-convenient -- and imo crazy helpful

jrg

@daslinkard howdy! whats up?

daslinkard

I have 2 computers networked to 1 printer....1 computer is able to print coupons correctly....the other PC prints the coupon in a black box and is not readable

Marco Ceppi

@daslinkard interesting, both running the same version?

jrg

Oh yeah, it would be. But what happens when say, you and Jorge no longer trust each other, since you downvoted him? He still has your votes.

aking1012

togglebox

daslinkard

00:49

@MarcoCeppi Yes....Ubuntu 11.10

I'm wondering if it might be something with Adobe by chance??

Because on the same pc that is not printing correctly....my daughters cannot play any games at pbskids.org

jrg

@daslinkard did you set the printer up as a postscript printer?

Almost every single printer issue that I have is solved by telling Ubuntu that it is a Generic postscript printer. (well, except the network and physical issues)

daslinkard

To be honest, I don't know how to answer that....I added the printer through the network port....downloaded the recommended drivers Ubuntu suggested and that was it.

Anwar Shah

Good morning

aking1012

@AnwarShah morning

Anwar Shah

I feel a little irritation with this comment, what actually he wanted to say
http://askubuntu.com/questions/165108/how-can-i-prevent-a-standard-account-to-mount-a-specific-partition/165548#comment203258_165548

jrg

00:57

Why yes Mom, I am about to print a 30 page document on Whist and various other card games. What else do you think I'm going to do during the week I'm at camp? Sleep? sigh

Anwar Shah

If i missed the security point, He missed the brother point.
He makes OP's younger brother as his friend and gave a good name also "Alice"

mateo_salta

@aking1012 Say, A- you like how someone reviews/closes questions, and B- you know you aren't going to be able to spend time on the site for a day, with a daily or possibly weekly way of "donating" or giving weight to another users closings (with a way to review after for the user giving weight, so they can choose someone else next time, or monitor for abuse)

It could be intresting...

aking1012

I'm not saying it's a fully worked out model, I just think it's an interesting one. I suppose you could timeline it. I was more thinking group-vote would be approve-deny and you could flip the toggle any time, but once it's spent it's spent. The other end of it is that it wouldn't be user attribution. If I contribute votes to a, then it will just show a closed twice, not attribution to me.

it makes historical introspection easy and lets you moderate your trusted list quite quickly

Anwar Shah

How this question closed as duplicate of this one, or why?

First one -> from a usb
Second -> to usb

aking1012

they're related, but i see the gap you're pointing towards

Jorge Castro

01:03

2

Q: How do I install Ubuntu from an USB drive?

I tried to use the usb-creator.exe from Ubuntu 10.10 desktop i386 ISO image and it does create an USB stick that doesn't boot. When I try to boot from it I get: "Operating System not found". I try to do this from Windows 7 x64. I'm not looking to create a live Ubuntu media, only an installation ...

that's the right one

aking1012

do mods have a way to shift dupe target? that might be appropriate in this situation

Anwar Shah

Yes, that was the right one.

jrg

We can. It's called "reopen and then close again"

aking1012

there's a solution...

daslinkard

Any suggestion?

jrg

01:09

@aking1012 @JorgeCastro @AnwarShah ok, all fixed. I think.

aking1012

i like the solution

Anwar Shah

thanks, mod

The Interrupter

01:39

Can you answer this? System info showing VESA even after installin the officical AMD drivers http://askubuntu.com/questions/107887/system-info-showing-vesa-even-after-installin-the-officical-amd-drivers?atw=1 #radeon

Tweeted by AskUbuntu on July 20, 2012 at 1:34 AM

George Edison

02:29

@jrg: You heard there's a new version of the Stack Exchange API out with limited write support?

Roland Taylor

Hi all.

lazyPower

o/ @RolandTaylor

o/ George, aking

Roland Taylor

@lazyPower \o

@GeorgeEdison oh?

George Edison

Yup.

I'm adding support for it right now to my Python library.

Roland Taylor

sweet

Does it mean we can ask/answer from a desktop application in theory?

Or does the API not allow those?

George Edison

03:04

It only allows comments as of now.

(Found a bug in it already.)

It has an advanced search route though - so now you can search for closed questions.

Roland Taylor

Nice!

I was thinking it would be great to write a desktop application but I guess that will have to wait.

Unless (I) someone uses WebKit containers to make it look native so to speak.

George Edison

Believe me, once true write support comes along, StackMobile will implement it :)

Roland Taylor

\o/

George Edison

03:19

My Python library makes complex queries really compact.

Want to know the reputation of the user who asked the first question on Ask Ubuntu?

Site('askubuntu').questions(1)[0].owner.reputation

And because of all of the meta-type information in the API, you can do this:

au = Site('askubuntu')
me = au.users(5)[0]
my_questions = au.users(me).questions
for q in my_questions:
    print q

That will print the titles of 30 questions I asked.

Notice how I can pass 'me' as a parameter to any method expecting a user ID.

Eliah Kagan

03:35

@izx While I hope/think my answer may be valuable to this OP, I don't really know exactly what's going wrong. I recommend that you keep your answer, even if mine gets accepted. It can still help other people who would describe their problem in this way.

Roland Taylor

@GeorgeEdison Sweet!

George Edison

@RolandTaylor I just saw this.

That's a huge disappointment.

Roland Taylor

@GeorgeEdison yeah :(

These days is good business to get involved in anything that will sideline morality.

George Edison

I wish I could say my country was better, but... it's probably worse :P

At least there is some resistance to this in America.

Roland Taylor

One guy nailed it in two words:

Click bait.

George Edison

03:46

He's probably on to something.

Roland Taylor

Every company that has something to sell is going to "support" anything that the "majority" (in the eyes of the media of course) supports.

Unless that company is run either by Christians, people with a backbone, or me (I am both).

George Edison

Yeah, and then that company will get attacked.

Roland Taylor

Like Chick-Fil-La

George Edison

(Angry comments, threats, etc.)

Roland Taylor

Speaking of which, I had my fair share of attacks myself.

George Edison

03:47

@RolandTaylor I actually never heard what happened with them.

Roland Taylor

I wonder since when it was morally "wrong" to disagree with people.

@GeorgeEdison They essentially gave money to groups that are against the whole... you know...

...and that has open a can of sandblasting.

George Edison

99% of the people I interact with face-to-face believe the same things as me, so I haven't really been attacked at all in-person. It's online that I get into trouble :)

@RolandTaylor The bitter irony - referring to us as intolerant (which is itself intolerant). It's almost funny.

Roland Taylor

@GeorgeEdison lol :P

I have been attacked irl, but only when I was studying.

Since then I haven't had a wide group of people to interact with, so I've returned to your boat lol.

George Edison

...and people will tell you not to judge them and "just be tolerant" - but wait, doesn't toleration imply that you've already judged them? Facepalm...

@RolandTaylor Yeah, this boat is a little safer :)

Roland Taylor

@GeorgeEdison haha

George Edison

03:54

Bottom line: don't send your kids to school in America. They will get all manner of nonsense shoved down their throats.

Roland Taylor

@GeorgeEdison I still get stones thrown in at me.

And, stay off of the internet if you have a weak self esteem.

George Edison

@RolandTaylor Literally? That's childish.

Roland Taylor

@GeorgeEdison not literally

George Edison

Oh, I thought some idiot was throwing stones at your house.

Roland Taylor

I mean figuratively

Nah!

George Edison

03:55

Ah, sorry.

Roland Taylor

Trust me, if someone tried that in Barbados... at this house :)....

muhahaha

Let's just say...

I literally know people.

Not even people who know people :)

George Edison

^--- Get 'em with that.

(Yeah, I'm not really very inspiring at this time of night.)

lazyPower

@RolandTaylor you calling in the Barbados hit squad?

Roland Taylor

@lazyPower I know people in high places ;)

Las Policias, etc

lazyPower

I didn't ask if they were standing on chairs

Roland Taylor

03:58

and...

lazyPower

i asked if you were calling out the hit squad :P

</lame troll>

Roland Taylor

In my neighborhood, if you mess with us... :>

haha

We don't have a hit squad ;)

(La la la)

lazyPower

I wouldn't admit to it either

keep it secret, keep it safe

Roland Taylor

@GeorgeEdison lol don't worry :D

George Edison

I should have posted an image of an airsoft gun instead of a water gun.

It looks a bit more intimidating.

Roland Taylor

04:00

@lazyPower ha if you lived around us for a while you would feel super safe :)

lazyPower

I feel super safe where i'm at - i have a guard kitty

Milo doesn't put up with nonsense - he ninja's it out of peoples systems

Roland Taylor

xD

lazyPower

i'm out, have a good evening all

Roland Taylor

cya

Eliah Kagan

04:20

As I've commented, this question (by Kaktaura) needs better answers. Maybe someone knows how to restrict the ability of a user to mount a particular partition (but not others). The problem with the current answers is that they assume, incorrectly, that having a partition in fstab and restricting permissions on its default mount point as specified there will prevent it from being mounted dynamically by users who can dynamically mount partitions.

4

Q: How can I prevent a standard account to mount a specific partition?

I have a root account from which I do all of my tasks. I set up my partitions to mount at startup. I have also created an account for my younger brother. I do not want him to access specific partitions, while still having access to others. I have: sda5 sda6 sda7 I want to block access to ...

mount permissions automount

George Edison

Check. It. Out.

This comment was posted with version 2.1 of the API. — George Edison 33 secs ago

jokerdino

nice!

write support??

George Edison

Yes.

Roland Taylor

:D

George Edison

Visit the link and hover your mouse over the comment.

It will tell you how I posted it.

jokerdino

04:23

> via Stack Alert [Google Chrome]

George Edison

(Although it's lying - I didn't use Stack Alert - I just stole the API key for it :) )

jokerdino

@.@

George Edison

Success!

jokerdino

crazy

George Edison

IKR?

jokerdino

04:24

:D

George Edison

Now to come up with a legitimate use for posting comments...

I need to come up with an idea for an app that will actually be useful.

Ask Ubuntu Meta

0

Q: i need instructions on how to mark a question as answered

I raised a question, and got an answer. I replied that the answer was good, and the answerer asked that i mark the question as answered. He (or she?) was absolutely right. I should mark it as answered. But i have no idea how to. I can't even press the up-arrow on the answer to rate it (i'm t...

support

The Interrupter

04:48

Is it acceptable to threaten users with downvotes? http://meta.askubuntu.com/questions/3709/is-it-acceptable-to-threaten-users-with-downvotes?atw=1

Tweeted by AskUbuntu on July 20, 2012 at 4:34 AM

jokerdino

@TheInterrupter NO!

Roland Taylor

@TheInterrupter hi.

@TheInterrupter can I get you something to drink?

Anwar Shah

05:11

They can still mount it somewhere else. Non-root users who are configured (as is default) to be able to mount partitions in general can still mount it with udisks --mount DEVICE (either directly or by clicking on the volume in a file manager like Nautilus). — Eliah Kagan 55 mins ago

but having an fstab entry prevents me

if I do not provide root password

Can someone check this

neither udisk nor nautilus works

@EliahKagan but In my case, it successfully prevents

Even if I am the admin user

^^ this message is returned when i tried to mount it via nautilus,

and I have the admin passwod

fstab entry was /dev/sda3 /media/work ntfs 0 0

jokerdino

@izx around?

Anwar Shah

correction: fstab entry was /dev/sda3 /media/works ntfs defaults 0 0

jokerdino

05:27

@izx if you ever want to revert your votes meta.stackoverflow.com/q/133301/177471

Anwar Shah

@jokerdino hi

jokerdino

hi

Anwar Shah

I was busy with the testing..sorry

jokerdino

no big deal

Anwar Shah

want to give him some vote

1

A: How can I decrease key repetition time in gnome-terminal like konsole in KDE?

To customize the delay until a key is repeated in Ubuntu, do: Open Dash (Super key). Search for keyboard and click on the Keyboard result. A new window opens where you can set the delay and speed. In the terminal, these hotkeys may be useful: Ctrl + U to delete the characters from the cursor...

jokerdino

05:32

done

Anwar Shah

thanks.

I'll try to collect two more for him

jokerdino

not worth your time.

Anwar Shah

hmm.... that feature was so nice to me. thanks for your advice

Eliah Kagan

05:44

@AnwarShah It seems you're right. I'll remove my comments. I recommend that you do keep your explanation (or similar) in your answer, to address this concern (after I remove my comments).

Anwar Shah

@EliahKagan Thanks.

I am glad, you didn't mind it.

Eliah Kagan

I'm still uncomfortable with this though. I am able to prevent mounting a partition with udisks in this way. But I can still mount the whole disk by forcing a partition!

Anwar Shah

I think the point is ntfs partition

you can check this with NTFS.

Eliah Kagan

Sorry, I mean, I can mount the whole disk by forcing a partition type.

Anwar Shah

can you give the command

Eliah Kagan

05:46

That is, I can use udisks as a non-root user to mount (for me) /dev/sdd itself.

Anwar Shah

sorry. battery low

Eliah Kagan

No problem.

So when I put /dev/sdd1 in /etc/fstab, I can actually make udisks mount /dev/sdd even though it cannot mount /dev/sdd1.

jokerdino

dupe enough - askubuntu.com/q/139799/25798

and then a mint - askubuntu.com/questions/40910/…

Eliah Kagan

@AnwarShah So by mounting the device itself, you should be able to modify its contents, though you might have to use some tricks to access them, nothing is in place to restrict that. I think. Plus, I can't help but thinking there must be other ways around this, other names of the device that (unlike the entries in /dev/disk/by-uuid) are not just symbolic links but separate device nodes that could be used to access the same partition.

@jokerdino Considering the OP is unlikely to accept an answer (accept rate 0 and hasn't touched the question), and the only answer is currently by me, and I don't have any problem with it being made a duplicate.....yes! Let's close it as a a duplicate.

@jokerdino Agreed. Close-voted. 3 more votes needed.

jokerdino

@EliahKagan great. thanks!

@EliahKagan and thanks again.

Anwar Shah

06:29

@EliahKagan hmmm.... I tried to mount `/dev/sda` and it gives this message
`Mount failed: Error mounting: mount: /dev/sda already mounted or /media/disk busy`

I think, this will only happen, if your drive is an external

or your drive isn't mounted at boot time or have a partition with / mount point

I'll try to be more accurate.

BBL

George Edison

06:59

Night all.

aking1012

nite @George

Eliah Kagan

07:40

@AnwarShah If one of /dev/sda's partitions is always mounted, you might always get that error. I don't know what physical disk the Ubuntu system is installed on in the question. If it's not /dev/sda, then there might not always be a /dev/sda partition mounted to prevent that error.

The Interrupter

07:57

Is it appropriate to downvote an answer to a question which I have also answered? http://meta.askubuntu.com/questions/3653/is-it-appropriate-to-downvote-an-answer-to-a-question-which-i-have-also-answered?atw=1

Tweeted by AskUbuntu on July 20, 2012 at 7:34 AM

jokerdino

09:19

As I went to bed last night, they freaking released the web app integration??!!

Anwar Shah

How did they know?

jokerdino

How did who know?

Anwar Shah

the releaser

jokerdino

Mark Shuttleworth presented in OSCON.

as you know, he is the founder of Ubuntu and Canonical.

Anwar Shah

How did they know, you went to bed.

jokerdino

09:21

oh kk

Anwar Shah

got the joke now?

jokerdino

yeah :/

Anwar Shah

o_O

aking1012

ooh hulu rolled out a new cleaner interface

Anwar Shah

I think, aking1012 does not sleep at all...

aking1012

09:24

you're not alone. there are others that believe that as well

jokerdino

aking has a polyphasic sleep cycle that not many can understand.

i have a limited grasp myself after spending considerable time chatting with him.

Anwar Shah

I have known the fact little early may be.

aking1012

you get limited "good sleep". if you can trick your body in to only getting "good sleep" you need much less

Anwar Shah

I'll discuss that topic another day

jokerdino

Get into REM faster and sleep lesser.

Anwar Shah

09:27

REM!! you mean RAM..

Rapid eye movement sleep

Rapid eye movement sleep (REM sleep) is a normal stage of sleep characterized by the rapid and random movement of the eyes. REM sleep is classified into two categories: tonic and phasic. It was identified and defined by Nathaniel Kleitman, Eugene Aserinsky, and Jon Birtwell in the early 1950s. Criteria for REM sleep includes rapid eye movement, but also low muscle tone and a rapid, low-voltage EEG; these features are easily discernible in a polysomnogram, the sleep study typically done for patients with suspected sleep disorders. REM sleep in adult humans typically occupies 20–25% of t...

aking1012

yes. i didn't know if you would know what i meant

Anwar Shah

plain english please. not a native speaker..

jokerdino

which part you don't get?

i am bored and can afford to explain

Anwar Shah

> if you would know what i meant

He didn't know, I can know what he meant?

aking1012

i knew the term REM sleep. i didn't know if you did. so calling it "good sleep" was a simplification

jokerdino

09:31

he didn't know whether you understood what he said

apparently, i knew REM o.O

Anwar Shah

@aking1012 Oh. I really didn't know REM before

Uncle Google told me

Select REM--> Right Click--> Search for Google "REM"

jokerdino

:-)

Anwar Shah

^^ that was the process

jokerdino

basically, REM is the time you have dreams in sleep

aking1012

yep. which is the only part your brain really needs

Anwar Shah

09:33

I seldom have dreams in sleep

aking1012

everyone dreams. not everyone remembers it. it's how your brain purges /tmp space

Anwar Shah

Let me know the tricks to get REM, so that I can dream for 10k rep in AU

@aking1012 o_O. Is there any way to store the information anywhere in your /home so that you can remember

before reboot

jokerdino

no, you never reboot

you only resume from suspend

aking1012

heh

Anwar Shah

oh.. yes.

I asked a question in productivity SE site, about "successful resume from hibernate"

so, it might be a hibernation

jokerdino

09:38

hmm

Anwar Shah

the title was changed now

That question was tweeted !!

jokerdino

@AnwarShah get a paper and write down your thoughts.

you have to record what you think to not lose them

Anwar Shah

hmm.... I am thinking to start doing so..

Though I am not sure if i can maintain it.

I must fix my laziness before

Oh. good question: "How can I fix my laziness?"

catchy heading.. must ask

aking1012

lists and deadlines

jokerdino

interest and enthusiasm

aking1012

09:45

equally accurate

Anwar Shah

then "How to keep your interest and enthusiasm ?"

aking1012

multiple projects so you can switch...and large quantities of coffee ;)

Anwar Shah

I feel interested in something. doing only that for some days, then lost

@aking1012 Thanks, that exactly I was thinking..

without the coffee part

I must save this important dialog

jokerdino

dialogue

Anwar Shah

yes..

and saved in a text file, like a Unix geek

@aking1012 How large it should be in a day?

aking1012

09:51

don't think there's a right answer to that closed as subjective

o/ @foss

fossfreedom

good morning all!

Anwar Shah

morning....@fossfreedom

brb

jokerdino

10:14

> Thank you for completing the post-class assessment. Your score is 100%. Based on your Course Overall Score (which includes the mid-class and post-class assessments), you have passed the class. Congratulations! You will be receiving your Certificate of Completion in your e-mail soon.

whee!

Almost there ;p

aking1012

@jokerdino what class?

jokerdino

power searching with Google ;p

i thought they mentioned it there.. bah

Ask Ubuntu Meta

0

Q: How do you add an apt-link to an askubuntu question?

Possible Duplicate: How to post links that install software via apt? I was answering a question and I wanted to add a direct link to a package using the apt: format but the askubuntu told me the link is invalid. Is there a way to add this kind of link to an askubuntu question?

discussion

jokerdino

i think i might sign up for more lessons over time

aking1012

you did mention it. i wasn't sure if there was some other class you were pursing like learn lang X the hard way

jokerdino

10:24

i was. then it became too much to do. then i dropped it for the mean time

i would sign up for a python class

let's see

oh my, google has code classes o.O

The Interrupter

11:03

Can you answer this? Ubuntu - Win7 Dualboot Failure? http://askubuntu.com/questions/164042/ubuntu-win7-dualboot-failure?atw=1 #windows

Tweeted by AskUbuntu on July 20, 2012 at 10:34 AM

aking1012

my_first_bit_of_trivial_blender_scripting_complete = True

Anwar Shah

@jokerdino Does google have a python class?

congrats !

aking1012

@AnwarShah code.google.com/edu/languages/google-python-class

Mitch

Hello all

aking1012

o/ @Mitch

Mitch

11:09

I went to bed this morning with 24 bronze badges, and noe they are 23 what gives?

Anwar Shah

I find this as a dupe askubuntu.com/q/138630/61218

@Mitch what badge was lost?

aking1012

@Mitch was one of them vote or edit based? a vote could have been reversed or an edit rolled back

Mitch

That the thing, I don't know

@aking1012 for a badge?

aking1012

i always thought they were not un-awardable, but it's my best guess

Anwar Shah

^^ I agree.

I was given an autobiographer badge for completing all fields in profile
Then i remove some fields
but still have that badge

jrg

11:13

@GeorgeEdison Ah no i haven't.

Mitch

@jrg Can you look at my comment above about the lost badge?

@AnwarShah Did you see my comment on my question?

Anwar Shah

@Mitch CD question? yes. Then I have no clue..

most of the time, those are caused by boot problem

@Mitch How did you try to boot from USB?

Mitch

@AnwarShah I realy hate to have to use window, I'm going to try 11.10 and see..

Anwar Shah

nvr mind. did you get into the BIOS setup screen?

Mitch

@AnwarShah Made a bootable USB using my other machine. Yes I can get in the BIOS

Anwar Shah

11:20

Then,You have changed the boot device order to first boot from USB?

aking1012

@Mitch have you tried powering up, letting it get to flashing cursor and soft rebooting? i've seen CDs/HDs not spin up fast enough to answer a bootable-check but solve on soft-reboot

Mitch

@aking1012 Yep about 10 times. I'm burning an 11.10 CD to try

aking1012

how old is the lappie? could be a non-PAE/processor support issue

also i've also seen old dells refuse to boot some non-windows boot-loaders (matrox HD diagnostic CD for instance)

Anwar Shah

he had 12.04 before the problem

aking1012

oh

Mitch

11:23

@aking1012 it had 12.04 on it until my kid format it

2

aking1012

missed that :/

Anwar Shah

starred that :-)

Mitch

No P

aking1012

<-- has a tendency to "ready, shoot, aim"

Mitch

lol

@AnwarShah Sorry I didn't see you previous comment. Yes I have changed the boot order for USB

Anwar Shah

11:28

Good luck with 11.10. let us see what happen

I am clueless

aking1012

if only eclipse was written in python not java... smh

2

aking1012

11:49

why is this not in repo: pypi.python.org/pypi/xmiparser/1.5

accepted answer needs votes and an edit disclaimer on compiz being buggy:

1

Q: Split monitor in two

Is there a way to split a single monitor in two, so that the two halves will be treated as separate monitors? This means that windows should fill half the screen when maximized. Also, gnome panels should fill half the screen.

monitor split

jrg

@Mitch Never give kids root access.

3

learned that the hard way with his sister

Anwar Shah

^^ that was I wanted to say. thanks

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