Game Development

Kevin van der Velden

20:11

@Pip and 5 minutes in to that game I had a heart attack when the game disconnected =p

Fortunately it was the server

Pip

Nice

Icy Defiance

@SpartanDonut it might, but I don't think it'll do them much good unless they also make it cross-platform and compete more directly with opengl, but that will be replaced by vulkan soon and directx will probably be left in the dust.

SpartanDonut

Well DX would have to go cross platform to stay alive

Does Vulkan have tech demos of similar quality?

Icy Defiance

not yet. they haven't finalized the standard yet, I don't think.

SpartanDonut

But yeah DX might have to go cross platform and open source to keep up

If Vulkan is as good as it seems

I think MS realizes cross platform is the future though and they're likely working on it... dunno

Icy Defiance

20:21

well Vulkan was specifically designed to be close to 1:1 with how gpus work today. DX wasn't, so DX isn't gonna compete without a major overhaul.

SpartanDonut

I have no clue what that means

Icy Defiance

the cpu overhead of both DX and GL are massive compared to what Vulkan will be.

SpartanDonut

Ah

TheMuffinCoder

Wait everyone is Vulkan made by Microsoft?

SpartanDonut

Even with DX 12?

Icy Defiance

20:22

nah, it's made by...Khronos I think the name is

same people who made OpenGL

DX12 made pretty big improvements in cpu usage, but nothing like what Vulkan is claiming

SpartanDonut

But how big of a deal is that really?

TheMuffinCoder

Hey is it going to be Vulkan going to be this awesome because it doesnt have to support the legacy junk like Opengl and DirectX

SpartanDonut

I guess it depends on context / game

Less CPU overhead means the game logic can be more complex since it's not being used in rendering

Maybe MS has it's eggs in the wrong basket here and is banking on cloud computing as the solution

Icy Defiance

not just game logic, but there can be more "stuff" in the scene. more light sources, more random debris in the wind, tree leaves with more detailed physics, things like that.

TheMuffinCoder

guys the future is in.... QUANTUM COMPUTERS :P

SpartanDonut

20:25

Well the DX12 tech demo had some 60+ million polys in the scene

That's a lot of stuff

TheMuffinCoder

Hey guys I got a serious questions tho

Is DX12 worth learning anymore?

Icy Defiance

nah quantum is awesome, but limited in what it can actually do. the future is more likely in computers using photons instead of electrons...or something like that. I forget the details.

SpartanDonut

For you no

TheMuffinCoder

Like how many years before Vulkan hits big?

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

Vulkan?

SpartanDonut

20:25

Learn a high level framework and don't sweat the details

Icy Defiance

I think Vulkan is projected to release late this year. It's gonna be more complex than either OpenGL or DirectX though, and even those two aren't recommended for anyone who wants to make a game instead of a game framework.

SpartanDonut

I think it's naive to count MS out though

Icy Defiance

oh yeah. I just have no idea what they're gonna do to compete. should be interesting.

TheMuffinCoder

Wait I dont want to be a game developer tho :P

SpartanDonut

I love waiting to see what the future holds :D

Icy Defiance

20:26

shh you will be a game developer

TheMuffinCoder

I want to actually learn many I can somehow help develope the engines in the future

SpartanDonut

Never even expected hololens and that looks awesome

Icy Defiance

no. shh. be a gamedev, muffin.

TheMuffinCoder

Lol I dont want to be a game developer

Seems unstable

As a job career

I rather learn about Security and stuff, maybe even learn enough to be a engineer for the military

Icy Defiance

security is cool. you won't get that by making a game framework, but it's a good thing to learn about.

TheMuffinCoder

20:28

@IcyDefiance lol the game stuff is only for now

Icy Defiance

you just need to convince companies they actually need a security guy. *cough*Adobe*cough*

TheMuffinCoder

Pretty animations to show family and friends

@IcyDefiance cough Java Applet cough

Wait too late it died

Vulkan? youtube.com/watch?v=KdnRI0nquKc

PowerVR Rogue GPUs running early Vulkan demo (experimental drivers)

►

Icy Defiance

I get the feeling most of the problems with java applets were because of NPAPI, not Java itself... but I'm not sure.

Ali.S

reading the introduction page for vulkan... it seems everybody is involved except MS and google

Icy Defiance

ooh so there are vulkan demos out already

nothing amazing in that demo, but it means they have something working I guess

TheMuffinCoder

20:33

@IcyDefiance lol and its running on android >.<

Icy Defiance

android, yes, but I can't find any info on how fast its gpu is

it's no 980, but it might be good enough to run that demo with opengl

vOv

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

@SpartanDonut If hololens works 50% as well as they hope, I'll be ecstatic :D

SpartanDonut

I honestly will probably be an early adopter

TheMuffinCoder

lol i thing the main thing most of us will use it for is to play minecraft

SpartanDonut

I don't know that I'll be productive with it but it will be one hell of a toy

Icy Defiance

20:36

hololens isn't gonna play minecraft

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

I just hope the pricetag will make sense for a group of people to get one each.

SpartanDonut

There was a mini crash course at build and they already are using Unity to make apps for it

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

I want to use it with roleplaying for a super interactive battlegrid.

user146722

dude that demo is actually really good for mobile

TheMuffinCoder

Microsoft HoloLens Demonstration Shows off Holographic Minecraft, Apps, and More

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SpartanDonut

20:36

@William'MindWorX'Mariager Yeah. Unfortunately I have a bad feeling about that bit - maybe a few grand

TheMuffinCoder

Going 1:00

SpartanDonut

It is a PC after all

TheMuffinCoder

lol maybe it's just modeling worlds but its still mc :P

Icy Defiance

oh okay, so blocks projected into the world, that makes sense

SpartanDonut

Actually... I read an article recently on the Minecraft point

engadget.com/2015/05/01/…

The article doesn't actually say much but the headline is kind of significant

user146722

20:40

Man that video killed any excitement I had for augmented reality in one swoop

user146722

With that disgusting feel-good music that's faker than a politically correct statement.

SpartanDonut

That's nice

user146722

Lol ok I'm excited again, it wore off a few seconds after closing it

TheMuffinCoder

@SelflessPsychopath lol reminds me of Google Glass's ad

Guy we need to speed up VR I want Sword Art Online to be a reality

Icy Defiance

eh, seems like a baseless theory, but that had a link to this article: http://www.engadget.com/2015/01/21/microsoft-hololens-hands-on/
and that confirms hololens is already pretty awesome. I'm excited now.

TheMuffinCoder

20:42

I guess the only way to do is to learn about electronics and help out microsoft :P

SpartanDonut

@IcyDefiance I agree. It definitely isn't clear that it was a the sole reason for purchasing Minecraft but it was a reason for purchasing Minecraft at least

nytimes.com/2015/05/03/technology/…

> Mr. Nadella said HoloLens was a big reason for buying Minecraft.

user146722

That, and trying to save xbox since PC master race and xbone cashscum

SpartanDonut

Not sure what that has to do with anything

user146722

I'm totally just joking a joke based on how I actually feel

Icy Defiance

@SpartanDonut ooh okay, that puts the quote into context. the other article had the same quote, but it didn't sound like he was talking about minecraft.

makes sense now

SpartanDonut

20:47

Yeah. Problem with most news sources these days - always getting their news second hand

Not always but often

Icy Defiance

eh, engadget is usually pretty good, they just could've worded it better in that article

SpartanDonut

For sure

user146722

I read the article and lost excitement again :(

Icy Defiance

you might be bipolar instead of a psychopath :P

user146722

I thought Microsoft actually had something... besides the idea everyone already has: make augmented reality

user146722

20:49

@IcyDefiance I think you can be both :P

user146722

But on a serious note, I just got through the part where they explain actually it's a big uncomfortable prototype headset that needs to be tethered.

SpartanDonut

Well what were you hoping that something might be?

Oh

You are misinformed

user146722

Something further than what we've had for years already...

SpartanDonut

The demo unit back in january was tethered

user146722

Is it fixed now?

user146722

20:50

Excitement restored.

SpartanDonut

The latest unit at build last week was untethered and this has always been the plan

user146722

Of course it has, obviously

user146722

I just was hoping someone was actually getting close to actually doing it. Not just talking marketing shit like usual.

user146722

Or, they are?

SpartanDonut

The biggest complaint people seem to have is field of view

if a hologram is too big it clips - doesn't bleed into peripheral

@SelflessPsychopath it is untethered now

reddit.com/r/HoloLens/comments/34c0i0/…

user146722

20:56

boiu4rtjiorujtoibux I need to re-install windows and try unreal again

user146722

I always thought unreal was the better one but I constantly hear unity here and never unreal

TheMuffinCoder

Unreal is dead

jk jk jk

I have no idea what unreal even is xD

user146722

the program from Unreal Tourney

SpartanDonut

Unreal has a much steeper learning curve IMO

Almo

than unity?

SpartanDonut

20:59

yeah

Almo

agreed

SpartanDonut

Subsequently people can't be bothered to learn it

user146722

If the damn thing ran on my machine... I'd learn it lol

Icy Defiance

that's pretty much it

UE4 certainly seems more polished though

I liked it better in the 30 minutes I spent with it

TheMuffinCoder

@SelflessPsychopath Hey Selfless I used the newest method on my actual spritesheet 2048x16 and it scaled great :D

user146722

21:00

sweet

TheMuffinCoder

lol at first it didnt work but turned out I had to wait for the spritesheet to load first xD

user146722

@TheMuffinCoder I just had another idea

TheMuffinCoder

@SelflessPsychopath :P yea?

user146722

Maybe it's faster to rotate the image before and after scaling it

TheMuffinCoder

lol am about to implement into my actual code

@SelflessPsychopath rotate?

user146722

21:02

So that the loop in the middle gets to go around 2048 times before having to do the other stuff again

user146722

and then just hope the GPU canvas makes the rotates so fast they don't matter :P

TheMuffinCoder

@SelflessPsychopath lol couldnt I just change my spritesheet instead?

user146722

or that ;)

TheMuffinCoder

and make it 16x2048

user146722

jsperf it

TheMuffinCoder

21:03

kk am going to add it in and clean it up :P

@SelflessPsychopath xD nah the current is fast enough

user146722

@TheMuffinCoder Now you will feel the wrath

TheMuffinCoder

@SelflessPsychopath o.O sowy

user146722

muahahaha HAHAHAHAAH! just kidding

TheMuffinCoder

xD

Like i spent like 2 weeks on optimizing scaling

The last 3 days was just because of IE10

user146722

@TheMuffinCoder You better get your game really fucking famous and do a lot of run-time scaling, to save those 2 weeks back

TheMuffinCoder

21:05

You're right TIME TO FOCUS HARDCORE

user146722

ugh no you're right... time to focus hardcore

Jovito

@TheMuffinCoder you're making something in js?

Almo

ok!

score system in, leaderboards display, scored points for numbers show in entries listing.

all on dev server

bit of testing, then I'll push it live

@IcyDefiance game?

Icy Defiance

uhh...not right now. finally solved my bug last night and now I want to get a bunch of coding done.

Almo

hahah ok

have fun :)

I got about 6-7 hours of coding done today, so that's it for me

Icy Defiance

21:14

I just woke up 2 hours ago :D

Almo

:D

@SpartanDonut you playin a full game there?

Icy Defiance

actually before that, I woke up because of an earthquake

in Michigan

SpartanDonut

@Almo bots

Almo

woa

Icy Defiance

we never get earthquakes

Almo

21:15

@SpartanDonut so you want to play a game with me, or finish your bot game first?

we had an earthquake a while back... was weird

SpartanDonut

I'm going to finish this bot game I just started

I don't understand the question lol

Almo

ok man :)

Icy Defiance

4.2 magnitude. wasn't enough to even knock things off the shelves. but in my entire life, it's only the second earthquake I've been able to feel, so it was interesting.

Almo

if you were playing JUST bots... like with bots vs bots, then I thought maybe you'd want to get in with people

heard this muffled thud in the distance, then shortly after a rumble

SpartanDonut

ah

no

coop vs ai

Almo

21:32

ok :)

Deep

I have a question:

I'm working on an RPG, and I'm unsure as to how to make the story

I don't want to do a "save the town/princess" like the rest of them.

How important is a good storyline to an RPG?

SpartanDonut

RPG is a very loose term depending on who you ask

Deep

well, how can I clarify?

SpartanDonut

Just describe your game as a whole instead of lumping it into a broad category

Some self proclaimed RPGs have very rich stories. Others are lacking in story but have really solid gameplay

Icy Defiance

I think the most important thing is your game doesn't feel like it's "missing" something. If your game has awesome gameplay, you probably don't need more than a very basic story, but don't go the route of Destiny and be all like "there is an incredible story here, but it's a secret, we're not gonna tell you"

SpartanDonut

21:38

Depending on what your game is doing may determine how important story is

Deep

So should I explain game style, mechanics etc?

SpartanDonut

Icy makes a solid point

Icy Defiance

lol on the other hand, Dark Souls was also like "there is an incredible story here, but it's a secret, we're not gonna tell you" and it actually made the game more awesome.

so it really depends

Deep

Its based mainly around combat, physical and magic, (like kingdom hearts, almost) It has a huge focus on items, with (planned) hundreds of unique items that will change combat in a unique way. It is 2d, with some overhead, pokemon style peaceful sections, and contra style sidescrolling battle sections

there will be a large pokemon-like world which you are free to roam and explore, however, there will probably be no side quests, except small "can you fetch me x" side quests that give you more money

these items would be things like shields, swords and rings that cast magic, among others

SpartanDonut

@IcyDefiance I don't know for certain... but I want to say that DS has at least some really good clues throughout the game about what's happening that let you draw some (and some of your own) conclusions - at least this is how I think it's happened in bloodborne

Destiny was just kind of vague about everything

Icy Defiance

21:46

if there's a series of "main quests" then you probably want to give the player a reason to keep progressing, and a story is the easiest way to do that, but not the only way

SpartanDonut

And yeah I was going to say something along the lines of what Icy said

Deep

Could multiplayer be used as a plot device?

"go win the tournament, make daddy proud" etc?

SpartanDonut

Really make sure it makes sense and make sure the player can progress

TheMuffinCoder

I love how VS for JavaScript helps hide private members when its suppose to and shows you the public members :D So easy to avoid bugs with closures

Icy Defiance

DS pretty much just said "you're the chosen undead, and if you don't want to go hollow, you must collect powerful souls, now go kill shit"

there's a couple hints that the player is supposed to become a king or something after defeating the 4 "big bosses", but it's extremely vague

haven't finished the game yet so I don't know if that would answer any questions

user146722

21:49

I get super cheesed out when games try to mix their story world with the real world.

user146722

I would personally avoid the "hey go play multiplayer, because uhh... do it!" part of the storyline, but I'm a horrible approximation of a "market cross section"

SpartanDonut

That reminds me... need to watch Inglourious Basterds again sometime soon.

Deep

fair enough

user146722

In fact, I could potentially be presenting the polar opposite of your intended market

user146722

Maybe you should just try it lol

Almo

21:51

@SpartanDonut you know I almost really liked that movie.

:D

SpartanDonut

My only complaint is that it's terribly long lol

Almo

like it was quite good but I think django and pulp fiction are better :)

SpartanDonut

I never got into Pulp Fiction

Django was definitely good though

user146722

That's not really fair to expect thing t- thingsToLiveUpToPulpFiction runs

SpartanDonut

Basterds is probably my favorite

Almo

21:53

:)

SpartanDonut

I might have lied... probably largely depends on my mood but Kill Bill is amazing

user146722

weeeee! ooooooo! weeeeee! ooooooo! dat! dunnun! duh nah! naaaa!

user146722

Kill Bill Ironside Siren Sound

►

SpartanDonut

hahaha yeah

Almo

:(

Deep

21:57

So, a isolated, well thought out, single player story is the way to go?

Almo

there are many ways to go

Icy Defiance

Kill Bill blow dryer

►

Almo

that is one way

@SpartanDonut game?

SpartanDonut

yeah

Icy Defiance

@Deep yeah there's no definite answer to this one. nothing is required except to make something that is fun to play.

SpartanDonut

21:58

What he said

Icy Defiance

we can give you inspiration, but we can't tell you what to do

Deep

alright

SpartanDonut

Just be wary of your game having an identity crisis - is it a multiplayer game or a single player game?

etc.

Deep

Ok, thanks guys, I'll get thinking!

Icy Defiance

basically just don't do anything wrong

good luck! :D

lol

Kala J

21:59

I want to implement a way to change brightness and contrast using image effects and I found this post:

armedunity.com/topic/4950-brightnesscontrastsaturation-shader

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