Game Development

ToddersLegrande

16:07

@Almo As in you were walking instead?

or not running fast enough perhaps

Almo

hehehe

What they really needed was me, but with a couple years of MVC experience.

ToddersLegrande

For better or worse I've not had to take any code tests

Almo

they can be scary

ToddersLegrande

I imagine so

Almo

I hate the "program a linked list" one, since I've never had to do that in practice.

though I understand it shows understanding of pointers pretty well

assuming they haven't just memorized it

ToddersLegrande

16:09

Yeah thats a relatively simple one that even I could do if I brushed up on my C++ a bit

BlueBug

why is that even a good test I am curious. Isn't it just better to use existing list?

Almo

it's better in the real world to use an existing list

endrohat

they test your logic

BlueBug

*STD list that comes with other good helpful functionality.

Almo

but if you want to ask someone to program something requiring pointers that is something that can be coded pretty fast and is fraught with places to fuck up, it's great.

BlueBug

16:10

a ha.

endrohat

same with sorting/searching algorithms

Almo

chances are, if someone can't do that test, then they have a serious problem understanding pointers.

if they can do it, they at least have basic understanding (or memorized the answer since it's such a common question)

first time I ever wrote a linked list was at just such an interview.

endrohat

i had to use doubly linkd list for my assignment

a turing machine simulator

Blue

I had no test in this one.

They just played on my Street Fighter Combo Trainer fork for 15 minutes.

ToddersLegrande

:O

I get this feeling I need a link

Because I suck at Street Fighter

Blue

16:13

github.com/Necrophagos/SF4ComboTrainer

endrohat

i can only do ryu and ken's combos

one of my friend used to call it a keyboard breaking game

ToddersLegrande

Ah but it seems I need the PC version of Street Fighter 4... and I'm holding out for the ultimate edition or whatever its called

Blue

Why "holdout" you get a discount off Ultra if you have Super..

@endrohat I use a stick with mine but Keyboard has advantages and disadvantages

endrohat

i'm just kinda used to the keyboard

Blue

Charge characters can cheat using it.

ToddersLegrande

16:20

@Blue because I have super for Xbox

No need for two copies of super right now

Because I assume, perhaps falsely, is that Ultra is given an "expansion" like price versus paying for the full game again... so the price probably evens itself out

So it probably doesn't matter much either way

but yeah... I'll just wait :)

endrohat

price ? Arrr:P

Blue

True that.

"So when can you play it? If you already own Super Street Fighter IV or Super Street Fighter IV: Arcade Edition for Xbox 360 or PlayStation 3, you'll be able to download a "digital upgrade" for £11.99 / $14.99 / €14.99 in early June of next year. Owners of the PC versions will have to wait until August 2014 to download the digital upgrade. August is also when Capcom will release the full retail and digital versions for Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3."

joapet99

When does the gamejam start?

ToddersLegrande

Do they have pricing on the full version?

35 minutes

Blue

"As a kind of apology for making PC gamers wait until August to play the game--after EVO 2014 has come and gone--Capcom will offer them a full digital version of the game, along with all previously released costumes, for $29.99 / €29.99."

Jon

16:24

First unity success

ToddersLegrande

@Blue That works for me. Thanks for the info

@Jon awesome

Blue

I have no idea how that will progress, but gj @Jon

joapet99

@Jon is there a goal in that game yet?

Jon

not yet

I posted my monogame version

I'm trying to redo it in unity now

Almo

:D

Jon

16:27

I did it in two days in monogame

Almo

i hate that I can prototype and tune gameplay for a brand new game with original gameplay in 2-3 weeks, then not finish it over the next year.

though the commuting has been hard on me

Jon

I hate that learning a new framework takes me forever

Almo

maybe with the new job I'll get back and finish it finally

Jon

I'm impatient.

Blue

+1 @Almo

I want to get back into my Bunny Brawler, I have no idea how much spare time I'll have though, you know - getting married and all :D

Almo

16:29

heh yeah

Jon

i was married once

Blue

...

awkward

brb - coffee is calling my name.

Lasse

ready for the jam?

Jon

i wish

joapet99

YES

Never been there before

Blue

16:35

To all those doing the Jam, best of luck to you all and have fun!

John McDonald

I won't be able to start coding until tomorrow morning (~24 hours from now), but I'll be able to come up with an idea, :)

Jon

Does it have to be web accessible?

John McDonald

No

BlueBug

Does it have to be a game?

John McDonald

Yes

Blue

16:36

lol - OffTopic in the title. Oh look, it's off topic.

Almo

dogpile!

Lasse

I gave it an upvote, as it already had so many downvotes

I want people to be able to participate

Almo

it's not a good question for the site.

upvotes mean "good question for the site"

Blue

And yet someone still upvoted him.

Whoever did should serioulsy remove it.

Lasse

lol

I removed the upvote

Blue

16:38

Thank you.

user4704

@Almo I replied to your email.

Blue

@JoshPetrie Hey man. We secured our wedding Venue :D

Almo

ok thanks dude. :)

user4704

@Blue Cool.

user4704

This is a terrible answer: gamedev.stackexchange.com/questions/69577/…

user4704

16:49

I can't believe it got accepted :(

Lasse

Well, the one who accepted it seems to be quite new to the site

user4704

It also got upvoted!

Almo

I considered that a borderline question when it went across the feed

user4704

It's pretty crummy, yeah.

user4704

Really broad.

user4704

16:52

Not really worth my stomping on it though, unless it gets more close votes.

Alex M.

k, got home JIT

Blue

I'm going to edit it to quote the post.

Alex M.

@Blue choose a number between 5 and 10 please :D

Blue

Oh never mind, it's deleted.

@AlexM. 7

Alex M.

aight, thanks

user4704

16:54

@Blue Yeah, it got converted to a comment looks like.

Byte56

Theme voting is about to be locked. Get your last second votes in.

Alex M.

yup

@Byte56 want to do it yourself or can I pick it?

user4704

VOTE DOWN ALL THE THINGS.

Blue

hahaha

Byte56

@AlexM. I can do it if you don't mind.

Are you taking part in the jam?

Alex M.

16:56

alright

I'm not

ToddersLegrande

VOTE UP ABNORMAL INPUT NAO

Byte56

Oh, well it doesn't really matter then.

Almo

voted

Alex M.

but you chose the theme the last time too

ToddersLegrande

I want to see what people would do

Alex M.

16:56

so it's sort of a tradition

Almo

i voted abnormal input

looks cool

Lasse

once in a lifetime tradition

Byte56

OK, I'll do it.

Alex M.

@ToddersLegrande they're going to make Oculus-only games

because it's about abnormal input

lol

ToddersLegrande

@AlexM. That's fine... they'll only get like 2 votes since only 2 people can play

Alex M.

16:57

and one of them is Carmack

ToddersLegrande

Also lame

Alex M.

who will not vote

Byte56

Theme is: "Time is broken"

Jon

:O

You are a watch maker, and you have to fix watches

ToddersLegrande

WAIT I GOT IT

You are a clock maker, and you have to fix clocks

Jon

17:09

You are an atomic clock, don't fuck up.

Byte56

You have to go around un-solving puzzles

Your character levels down as time goes on

user4704

I submitted my game already.

user4704

And you guys already voted it to be the winner!

user4704

THANKS GUYS! WHERE IS MAH PRIZES?

Byte56

Now I feel dumb, I should have told everyone the theme at the end of the jam.

user4704

17:11

heh

user4704

Here's my actual game:

user4704

int main() { while(true); }

Lasse

is the game about taking up all cpu resources?

user4704

Time never advances so the game never launches!

Jon

just add a random delta time to your current game

Lasse

17:12

You need to make it multithreaded

Jon

blam, you got yourself an entry

Blue

@JoshPetrie how dare you not return a value on that int main()

WHAT HAVE YOU DONE!

ToddersLegrande

He.... HE BROKE TIME :O

user4704

@Blue That's 100% legal.

Blue

@JoshPetrie legal or not, makes my eyes twitch, you code demon you.

user4704

17:17

See 3.6.1 / 5 I think.

user4704

The quote is along the lines of "If control reaches the end of main without encountering a return statement, the effect shall be that of executing 'return 0;'.

ToddersLegrande

Some inspiration for everyone in the jam - retrogradegame.com

Jon

The theme should of been Orbs

Blue

@ToddersLegrande fucking awesome link man.

ToddersLegrande

I was thinking of an idea but then I remembered it had been done before lol

Alex M.

17:21

time is broken

inb4 on each frame

float realDeltaTime = deltaTime * rand();

user4704

10 mins ago, by Jon

just add a random delta time to your current game

Alex M.

sorry, I was eating back then

didn't read

user4704

:D

Blue

@AlexM. Just say time is broken in the chat too.

Alex M.

lol that makes sense

ToddersLegrande

17:32

Alex M.

Parents with benefits should have been the theme

ToddersLegrande

damn image preview size is too small haha

Alex M.

the dark mod must be the best thing to have ever come out for thief fans

I mean, an engine that was customized especially for Thief's gameplay

that looks amazing

and has friendly editors for scenarios

it's basically a collection of community scenarios that keeps on growing

John McDonald

So, we have a shorter window to make this in this time, eh?

Alex M.

@JohnMcDonald unless... the time breaks

YEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAAH

MickLH

17:42

^ win

John McDonald

:/ yes

It's over at 10am Sunday my time

So, I basically get Friday evening + Saturday to make it.

MickLH

see that's a fair 48 hours

John McDonald

But, I'm busy tonight (Friday evening), so Saturday it is!

MickLH

You even have time to sleep before monday!

If you're old or something

John McDonald

What was unfair about the hours last time?

Pretty sure we tried to give everyone Friday evening + all weekend

I'm ok with making a game in a day, so, meh

Alex M.

17:54

I proposed for me to be allowed to coordinate the rest of the team from now on and get a bit of order in our work

and was allowed to

this should be good.

if it doesn't happen to be bad.

AMD (almost) rolls out Mantle, its high performance alternative to Direct3D and OpenGL
Battlefield 4 framerates boosted by as much as 58 percent in CPU-bound situations. http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2014/01/amd-almost-rolls-out-mantle-its-high-performance-alternative-to-direct3d-and-opengl/

John McDonald

yeah, like 58% in single-player, lol. Something like 25% in 64-man multiplayer

(Sorry, Single-Player in the Battlefield series is sort of a running joke)

Alex M.

I once played the bad company 2 single player

when my internet connection dropped

John McDonald

I bet you were all like: "shoulda just gone for a walk"

Alex M.

CoD's campaign was better yes

and that says a lot

John McDonald

heh

The joke started because BF1942 and BF2 didn't even have single-player. It just wasn't a concern. So when they first added a campaign in BF:BC2 (BC1 doesn't exist because it's not on PC), not a lot of attention was paid to it.

Alex M.

18:06

IEEE
Meet Tanishq Abraham. He started his college degree at the age of 7 and has been invited by universities to give guest lectures on astronomy and nanotechnology.

Listen to Tanishq explain nanotechnology to a reporter and how it could lead to us inventing invisibility cloaks: http://huff.to/1ezUf06

Almo

Warhawk on PS3 didn't have single player. Didn't need it.

I specialized in Tank on that game. :)

SalarianEngineer

Wow, interesting theme for the game jam

Almo

what's the theme?

oh i see

star that shit

SalarianEngineer

Lol, I just realized that I don't have enough rep to post my game to the GDSE question anyway...so brainfarted out a question to hopefully get rep, lol. Too bad SharePoint.se rep doesn't sync here.

Alex M.

1

Q: Efficiency: Rotate sprite or use a spritesheet?

I'm developing my first game, in Javascript and HTML5, and am wondering about which is more efficient for displaying a rotating sprite (for example, a square). Is it more efficient to just use a spritesheet to "animate" the square flipping end over end as it moves across the canvas by x/y coor...

SalarianEngineer

18:13

^ Yup, that's mine.

user4704

Yeah. That's not a very good question :(

user4704

I'm thinking about closing it.

SalarianEngineer

How is it not a good question?

user4704

There's no one good answer.

user4704

Both options have performance tradeoffs.

SalarianEngineer

18:15

Sure there is. "Which is more efficient?", in terms of not bogging down the browser.

user4704

It depends.

SalarianEngineer

And it's not down to opinion, it's down to testing (assuming someone has tested it before).

user4704

You should edit it to give more specifics.

user4704

Profiling it will give different results based on different implementations.

SalarianEngineer

Do you have any suggestions? At 11am running on 3 hours of sleep, that's the best that I could shove out with only 1 cup of coffee ;-)

user4704

18:16

Yeah.

user4704

Maybe provide more details about the specific technologies and implementations you are using

Alex M.

shit man, I haven't seen this one in YEARS

MickLH

@SalarianEngineer just rotate

Alex M.

we're planning a TCP/IP LoD run on a local forum

can't wait

user4704

What your memory constraints are

user4704

18:17

what resolution you need for animation

MickLH

There's no pixel block transfer (bit-blt / "blitting") anymore, the pixels and texels are abstracted away from each other

So for runtime performance, just rotation costs nothing on top of what's already going on in a sane engine, where using a sprite sheet puts pressure on the memory manager, and might cause you to need more pages of memory at once

Given that it's a browser based game, you better not have memory problems or time problems

SalarianEngineer

Edited in an attempt to better clarify it.

MickLH

My point was that there's no reason why it would matter for performance, this is one of the worst cases of premature optimization I've ever seen.

I mean literally, you should be proud, I've seen quite some useless optimizations but this might be the new extreme for me

Alex M.

we need to do something about that rep requirement for the jam

we can't attract new users if they're required to have a certain amount of rep to answer

MickLH

@SalarianEngineer There IS an advantage to dynamic rotation (besides that is does technically use less texture memory), which is that you can run at an arbitrarily high framerate and still deliver a correct rotation at every frame

@JoshPetrie The same duplicate again already lol, what's it been a few minutes? gamedev.stackexchange.com/questions/69660/…

SalarianEngineer

18:29

@MickLH There's nothing wrong with trying to optimize code as it's being written. And while you *could* be trolling, I appreciate your input. But there was no reason to be rude about it. Obviously, I've not got the experience that you have, which is why I asked the question. Understanding that I need to gain 5 reputation to participate in the jam, I attempted to ask a question that might be helpful to other newbies, and that
1 - Wasn't open to opinion, but towards hard data.
2 - Wasn't a duplicate of something else asked.

MickLH

I'm not trolling I'm just a dick

SalarianEngineer

I see XD

MickLH

No offense intended ;) ... just trying to get emotional satisfaction, ya kno'

user4704

@SalarianEngineer I don't think it's opinion-based (did I say that? If I did I mis-spoke).

user4704

I just think it's too broad.

SalarianEngineer

18:31

None taken. I can be a dick too, but I'm too tired, heh.

user4704

Reviewing your edit now.

MickLH

@AlexM. does this help with the jam at all? shadertoy.com/view/ls23zK

SalarianEngineer

I got the gist of what you were talking about, Josh. I tried to be as specific as I could, but being someone who doesn't know a lot about game development (other than game theory, etc), that was about the best I could do.

Almo

Optimizing code as you write is in fact dangerous

MickLH

^ truth

user4704

18:32

I'm wondering if rephrasing it from "what is more efficient" would be better.

Almo

I would have had some serious problems at Grip/Autodesk had I continued to try doing that.

SalarianEngineer

@Almo

Bah

@Almo Why is it dangerous? I optimize my code at work all the time, as I write it.

Almo

Grip was a 5 man company (including me) with 3 developers. Autodesk bought us for 4 million.

SalarianEngineer

Granted, it's C# and SQL, but still.

Almo

this was partially because our codebase was spotless, and part of the reason for that was we focused on making the shit work and be legible, and optimizing only IF we needed to.

SalarianEngineer

18:35

Oh, I see what you mean.

MickLH

@SalarianEngineer because programming languages are meant to allow humans to work with algorithms

Almo

Optimized code is often harder for humans to read. Code is "write once, read many"

readability is very important.

SalarianEngineer

Yes, but this is also why we have comments.

MickLH

A comment is a hack to accomplish the same task as the programming language itself originally set out to...

Almo

making the MVP application I wrote was hard enough, without having to optimize as I went. And in the end, the app worked fine despite the code redoing stuff multiple times on certain events because it did not actually impact performance. So optimizing it while writing it would have been a waste of time.

MickLH

18:36

Your function has a name for a reason, to describe what it does, otherwise we would just call 0x3432F7EC

Almo

and comments tend not to be maintained. The code changes, the comment doesn't, now you're fucked.

MickLH

@SalarianEngineer I hope you don't feel attacked

SalarianEngineer

For instance, I had to start writing code so that it could be unit tested, which I don't particularly like to do. But I also knew that I needed to optimize the calls that I was making to the back-end, lest requests take too long.

@MickLH No way, not in the slightest.

MickLH

cool :)

Almo

obviously you're free to program how you want. But there's a reason one of the best programmers ever (Donald Knuth) said ""We should forget about small efficiencies, say about 97% of the time: premature optimization is the root of all evil""

SalarianEngineer

18:39

I have thicker skin than that, lol

Alex M.

fuck man, I really had no idea you had to have extra rep to post on meta

might as well kiss the jam goodbye unless this is lifted

we'll always play against ourselves

MickLH

lol

SalarianEngineer

yea, I think I've only ever posted once or twice here, and the first time was on a different account.

I mean, on the board, not in the chat

Kind of makes me wonder the reason for the rep limit for the GJ. I mean, it's not like spambots are going to be submitting games XD

BlueBug

in Flash, I realized I have to have unique signature for each function, function overload impossible. So I ended up with functions such as func00 func01 func02 func03... OTL then I forget which one I need to call

SalarianEngineer

@Almo I see your point.

Well, the boss is taking all the coders out for bbq...so I'm going to go hit that up ;-)

Almo

18:41

have fun

SalarianEngineer

Cheers.

MickLH

that sounds good man

SalarianEngineer

I'd ask if you want something

MickLH

sigh

SalarianEngineer

But I'm not sure if squishing bbq into my monitor is a good idea

Alex M.

18:42

we all do that

SalarianEngineer

If anything, it'll give me time to think of "time is broken" lol

Alex M.

it's fine

SalarianEngineer

back in a bit ^^

Alex M.

@JohnMcDonald the duration and start/end dates were selected by noctrine on the previous jam

they were fine

noctrine was not around this time when I needed to set the start/end dates

John McDonald

No, the previous jam had 24 more hours at the end

Alex M.

18:43

and I am not good with clocks

so it was chosen by me, pip and hasherr

you can tell what went wrong

MickLH

time dilation?

John McDonald

You broke TIME!

So, was it supposed to be the same times as last time?

*edited to be more punny

Alex M.

I don't know

I'm not good with clocks

John McDonald

Unlike the star of my next game

>.>

\_/

user4704

@SalarianEngineer Okay, I reopened and answered it. I couldn't really think of a better way to phrase it other than adjusting the title, and upon review I can't think of compelling arguments (other than the two I listed, which are outweighed) in favor of the pre-rendering option so I guess it's not broad enough to be problematic.

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