Game Development - 2013-05-04 (page 1 of 2)

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12:00 AM

Finished finals yesterday gonna finally buy the new BioShock :D

Loved all of them so far

Mrm... I still need to play that

Wife really wants to also... I think that might be what's keeping me from getting it

I kind of secretly hate when she gets to play a game first

I have to say that's kinda silly

Mrm... Well, that's emotion for you.

I mean it doesn't bother me that much, but I don't really need to play the game after watching her

It happened with Portal 2, the single player part anyway

The alternative is buying two copies and literally playing next to each other (We tried with AC3 because we play the multiplayer)... It was weird.

ToddersLegrande

So, a Zealot walks into the bar, and orders a drink. The bartender looks him over and says “gee, what’s with the long face pal?” The Zealot replies “Rough day at the base. One of the other Zealots was slacking off and a bunch of Zerglings came storming up our ramp. We cleared them out, but not before they took out a bunch of stuff. Gateways, Forges, even our Twilight Council”

Oh yeah well don't watch. Watching someone play it before you get to play it is a terrible thing

ToddersLegrande

12:03 AM

The bartender nods sympathetically, saying, “Damn, not the Twilight Council. Tell you what,” he continues, handing the Zealot his drink “for you, no charge.”

I lol'd

lol

Ha.

I like it

@ClassicThunder Hard not too; she's always around, being all spousey and stuff.

I suppose I've been gaming longer than her, she deserves some fond memories

She lets me fight the hard bosses anyway... Which is horrible because without having played the game half the time I don't even know the controls

lol my last gf did that and my sister did right until I moved out for college

Seems to be pretty common

12:13 AM

Heh.

I suppose it's more a social than a technical thing

11 hours later…

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

10:54 AM

Greetings kids

looks sternly at @Todders

PythonInProgress

11:39 AM

good morning @William'MindWorX'Mariager

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

Mornin' :D

PythonInProgress

whats up?

btw the old login button doesnt work anymore on your game

@William'MindWorX'Mariager the login button doesnt work on your game

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

It doesn't?

PythonInProgress

yeah

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

Works fine for me

PythonInProgress

11:43 AM

it says ok

it says ok then you cant get out of the login screen

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

Oh, I see.

I'll get that fixed.

PythonInProgress

thank you!

the new login screen looks better btw :P

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

Should work now

And thanks. :) I just need to figure out a nice style for the textboxes.

I'm thinking something along the lines of the buttons. But I'm not sure yet.

PythonInProgress

cool

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

Also, if you're interested, the reason it failed to login but still displayed "done" was because I had switched to XML data, but forgot to update the client. :P So the request worked resulting in the "done" text, but it couldn't read the data, which meant that GameState.IsLoggedIn was never set to true. The interface is bound to the GameState and animates and reacts depending on the properties.

PythonInProgress

11:51 AM

wow, wasnt expecting that :D cool how that works

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

Yeah, XAML is pretty sexy like that. But it does take some getting used to. Either you hate it or you love it. And I love it.

PythonInProgress

:D

never tried it

2 hours later…

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

1:37 PM

Woo!

No more flickering animations!

Much more sexy to look at now.

PythonInProgress

1:55 PM

@William'MindWorX'Mariager cool!

PythonInProgress

2:50 PM

hello @CodeAssassin

@PythonInProgress hi

PythonInProgress

anything up?

trying to get ps3 controller to work on my computer.

PythonInProgress

ahh see u later then

hi guys

@CodeAssassin wow that's cool, would love to play fez that way !

is it hard to get it to work? might try it myself tomorrow

PythonInProgress

2:55 PM

idk, never tried it

@user1103457 I just got it to work

Nah, it's not that hard.

I'm using the MotionInJoy Gamepad Tool

Makes things a lot easier.

PythonInProgress

ahh

So code, i still cannot get my python pgm to work......

awesome! Ah okay. Will look into it tomorrow then!

@PythonInProgress It is probably because you do not fully understand arrays. Have you every worked with arrays besides using it for your game?

PythonInProgress

nope

lols

also ,the counter that i copied directly from the internet doesnt work....

3:05 PM

Here's what I want you to do(I'm going to have to brb soon too). Open a new project and work with arrays and for loops. THEN go back to the game :)

http://www.i-programmer.info/programming/python/3942-arrays-in-python.html

PythonInProgress

ok sure

Here are some challenges:

PythonInProgress

ok

1. Store random numbers in a 1D (meaning 1 Dimension) array. Then sort it from greatest to least

2. Store random numbers in a 1D (meaning 1 Dimension) array. Then sort it from least to greatest.

PythonInProgress

sounds good so far

what i need for the game needs to be 2d

3:06 PM

Okay here's one thats a bit more challenging

PythonInProgress

ok

@CodeAssassin are you gonna post the next challange? :P

Create a text based version of tic-tac-toe :) It doesn't need to be complete but it uses 2D Dimensional arrays :P

PythonInProgress

ok sure

ALSO while your at - look into Lists (in Python)

They are sort of like arrays but more Dynamic

PythonInProgress

sounds like fun (and a lot of reading)

3:09 PM

in the end it's all worth it

PythonInProgress

lists and arrays :D
yeah is should be

i have weird amazing music in the bkg

:P

xD

PythonInProgress

want a link to download (not my download link, the authors)

wait ill give you his youtube channel

youtube.com/channel/UCZO_hYEMUyxvaPOYIUGmc-w

ok will get started now :D

Also learn to read documentation (it's going to be hard lol - but the more you know about your language's capabilities the better).
http://docs.python.org/2/reference/index.html

PythonInProgress

kk

3:13 PM

and docs.python.org/2/tutorial/index.html#tutorial-index

PythonInProgress

will do sir CodeAssassin

xD haha good :P

PythonInProgress

thanks so much :P

Hey code, i could just use a list maybe?

so
q = True
w = Flase
e = True
blockList = [q, w, e, r, t, y]

etc?

and
if blocklist[0] == True:

pygame.draw
?

back

sorry man :P

Nah - stick to arrays for now

Once you learn what arrays are - I guarantee you you'll catch on to lists quickly

|1|-|2|-|3|
|4|-|5|-|6|
|7|-|8|-|9|

Imagine this as a tic tac toe board

Since your making a text based one - you ask player 1 (who is X) where they would like to place their X (or token).

Let's say the user says: 9

Okay so it's up to you which dimension of an array you would want to use (preferably 2D) but let's say you went with 1D

You know that the items the array can store is 9

So first you need to make sure that the user isn't going out of the range and saying something like 10 or 0 or -1 (try to make your programs smart - because there are going to be players that are going to want to expose your game :) ).

Then you search for the corresponding position in the array (array index's are different from what you think they are - if it's the same for the Python Programming Language). Remember how you need to store 9 values in that 1D array

well in order to access certain values in the array such as the position 9(on the chart above) - it would be:

myArrayName[8] = 'X'

If you wanted to access the 1 then that would be:

myArrayName[0] = 'O'

Good Luck :)

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

3:50 PM

I prefer the XBox360 controller. Works perfectly with windows.

No need to install a bunch of extra things

PythonInProgress

hey guis @William'MindworX'Mariager @CodeAssassin
got most of the first program done, how to sort it?

bbl

@William'MindWorX'Mariager Windows = Microsoft

Microsoft = Xbox

heh, sometimes working with a web-less web stack, the SO solutions are less than desirable. Like... I have an external JSON file that I'd like to include in my JS, and all the answers on SO involve AJAX, which... doesn't really apply in my case

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

@CodeAssassin, Exactly

@William'MindWorX'Mariager It's not really a bunch lol - just one tool

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

3:56 PM

It's still a lot compared to plug'n'play. :P

And I prefer plug'n'play

My preference for the xbox controller also comes from how easy it is to use with Arduino/FEZ boards.

Very simple USB protocol.

Haha I have a Ardunio Uno sitting here right by me but I haven't used it

I'm thinking about making a World Clock as my first project - though I'm not sure.

Think :)

Here's a hint: If statements and < or > or = :) also for loops

so basically you want to do something like this:

for x in range(0,3)

print array[x]

@JohnMcDonald lol wat. im not a network doods. now mak me feel bad

The only thing i understood was JSON which I used for a Book Planner project(which I must revive)

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

@JohnMcDonald I remember Awesomium having a resource hook. You could hook it and prepend whatever you want to the .js files.

JSON is just data really, and I'm using a "web-less web stack" for UI, because it's HTML/CSS/JS without the web. So doing things like AJAX (Async Javascript And XML) doesn't really apply because everything is local, and I'd like it to be synchronous

@William'MindWorX'Mariager hmm

Ohh

I see what you're saying... yeah. The JSON I'm trying to include is prefixed with: if(!inXNA()){ // load the sample data

so, anything I can do with Awesomium won't really help, :(

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

Ah

I see.

So you want to load some dummy data for testing.

That's correct. And I'd rather it didn't pollute the actual code

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

4:06 PM

Understandable

I guess ajax would work, but it just seems silly

The file is right there

But I suppose if I plan to upload it to web, which I've been doing, I should probably use ajax

:) Thanks for listening

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

Any time. :P

<3

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

I wish I could use multiple styles in XAML.

I can inherit styles but I can't apply two styles to the same item.

So to apply multiple styles to the same item, I have to have an inheritance chain.

hmm

Really?

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

4:21 PM

I wanted to have my buttons have their current look and then have a swappable color style.

PythonInProgress

lols

could you declare a variable and say if x = true then declare the style?

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

Sure I could do anything I want from codebehind, but I'd rather avoid that for the view.

for sure

PythonInProgress

ahh

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

Trying to respect the whole MVVC model. :P

PythonInProgress

4:23 PM

?

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

Model–view–controller

Model–view–controller (MVC) is a software architecture pattern which separates the representation of information from the user's interaction with it. The model consists of application data, business rules, logic, and functions. A view can be any output representation of data, such as a chart or a diagram. Multiple views of the same data are possible, such as a bar chart for management and a tabular view for accountants. The controller mediates input, converting it to commands for the model or view. The central ideas behind MVC are code reusability and separation of concerns. Component int...

yeah... hmm, looks like you're right. Only 1 style, but you can use inheritance

:/

PythonInProgress

:/

looking at my CSS, I don't think I have many (if any) cases where that wouldn't work for me

PythonInProgress

:/

lols

@CodeAssassin im stuck :P

@CodeAssassin i can generate the list/array and pull variables but i have no idea if i can do a whole loop of if a >b if a= b if a<b....

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

4:37 PM

How does this look?

gws.intellisenseless.com

Hit the register button to see what I'm talking about.

I'm unsure if it's going to be annoying for the user the way it resizes.

Nah, looks good man. Except like others have mentioned: confirming an email address, or something without *'s is a little bit of a nuisance

:p I'm bad. I just copy/paste when websites do that

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

Hehe, true.

PythonInProgress

hey will?

@William'MindWorX'Mariager it still opens a new login window facepalm

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

Hehe, that part isn't finished yet. :P Just making the final touches on the UI.

PythonInProgress

ahh

i see :D looks good!
font is much better

@William'MindWorX'Mariager and there is no way to logout now

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

4:48 PM

Nope. :P

PythonInProgress

lols

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

It's coming though.

PythonInProgress

good

my task that CodeAssassin is making me do is hard for some reason

i have to make a list and order it least to greatest
the least to greatest part is hard

ToddersLegrande

5:13 PM

@William'MindWorX'Mariager you there buddy??? :O

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

I AM!

I AM RIGHT HERE BUDDY!

ToddersLegrande

GTALK

I have sensitive information to send you

email is obviously not sufficient

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

Obviously

5:50 PM

Hey guys...

I've asked this before, but want to get some more opinions.

How do you think they made Myst III?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eMwQrRvPVjg

My theory is they place the players POV in the centre of a 3D sphere, and the inside of this sphere is has a 2D texture of the prerendered world applied to it

PythonInProgress

idk

a bit like Google's street view

what do you think?

PythonInProgress

umm i dont really know
never looked at the game (or even played it)
so i wouldn't know how

It's a bit of a cult game to be fair

PythonInProgress

mmmmhmmmm

5:53 PM

just want to see what people think

PythonInProgress

ok then, see u

ToddersLegrande

No I think the world is 3D, but it might be that each "room" is inside a sphere like you say

But I'm pretty sure there are 3d objects inside the room and its not just textured

anywho

I'm out

Interesting..think you're probably right!

Don't know if you notice, but the sea is moving with ripples and waves

True 3D or animated texture?

Been as the POV is predefined, I think animated texture

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

I noticed the the let's play video that the player is moving some objects.

So some parts are either prerendered from a ton of angles or they're 3D objects.

Do you mean at around the 5:08 mark?

05: 15 to 05:52 is definitely a pre-rendered movie

This game is about 10 years old now. I was thinking, what with current technology, does any one think it would be viable to have the whole texture on the inside of the sphere animated?

Still 2D, still pre-rendered, but moving

For each room, you'd be looking at 72 hi res images a second, and the looping movie would probably be around 10 seconds long

720 hi res images over ten seconds

Do you reckon a java application running on a normal computer could handle that?

Just run some tests

pretty insane, I don't think so :L

6:44 PM

Indeed, myst is prerendered.

6:54 PM

Mhh... according to en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myst_III:_Exile, 360° panoramas where used, but it's hard to find sources extending upon that statement.

7:07 PM

I know, I've trawled through the making ofs for all the games, and cannot find out how they make them :L

I think all animations apart from very basic ones are prerendered movies though

How do you reckon they do the water?

The moving water?

I mean, if the inside of the 360 sphere is textured, how is the water moving? Is the 'water' a separate object...maybe a 2D plane with an animated water texture on it?

7:21 PM

If I remember correctly, most animations forced your view to a certain position/orientation. They were most probably movies. About the water, I'm not sure. Replacing a part of the textured sphere with different frame of an animation is certainly possible, as long as the animation frames fit into memory.

7:52 PM

(the) Making of Myst III: youtube.com/watch?v=zc8c5HpIDtU . Part 2 talks about the graphics - youtube.com/watch?v=XfvOVGpu9i8

8:03 PM

Part 3 - youtube.com/watch?v=MOXiFpJ-TqU , Part 4 - youtube.com/watch?v=kE8L26M_lac

@JWH Part 4 explains how they did the animations and water.

PythonInProgress

8:16 PM

@William'MindWorX'Mariager It works! logging in looks good, and the logout button works. the logout button is slightly weirdly placed though. if you ever need a beta tester email me!

@PythonInProgress How's arrays coming along?

PythonInProgress

ok, i got the first thing almost done, still the sorting is really glitchy..... should i use the sort() function?

@CodeAssassin idk whether i should use the sort function or not...

@PythonInProgress Nonono. Just loop through it and have a variable called tempGreat or something and go like this:

tempX = 0
for x in range(0,3)
if(x > tempX)
make x equal to tempX

Make sense?

PythonInProgress

so wait

@CodeAssassin if a > b:

a = x

b=a

wait nm

it should be
if a > b:
x = a
a = b
b = x

to flip them

so it saves a in x, then moves b to a then moves x (which has a in it) to b

:) Good Job

So go implement it :D

PythonInProgress

8:31 PM

lols kk

8:47 PM

@PythonInProgress @CodeAssassin to swap two variables I like this mechanism much more: if (a>b)a^= b ^= a ^= b;

PythonInProgress

what i am confused

this is python i am writing in, what programming lang is that?

@PythonInProgress it's some dirty c code.

PythonInProgress

ahh i started learning c sharp then gave up and learned python

it basically translates to

if a>b:
	a = a ^ b;
	b = a ^ b;
	a = a ^ b;

hello youse

8:49 PM

@PythonInProgress I mean if operator ^ means xor in python

does anyone know a framework that works mobile and desktop, and allows scripting somehow?

@EfEs cocos2d-html

@EfEs unity3d

oh god not cocos2d hahahaha

I thought unity

@EfEs what's wrong with it?

but it slows down on mobiles hard

I worked with cocos2d-x for a while

C++

8:51 PM

@EfEs yeah I'm using it right now and I'm almost in post beta state

I worked for a company that used it

a year ago

we had to rewrap everything and it crashed more than not

I quit, but I think they got several games out

so not so bad

of course the PC port of cocosdension has many issues...

anyway I don't do HTML5 so I cannot use it :(

but besides that it's actually a good/stable framework

@EfEs cocos2d-x also offers lua scripting

hmmmm

if it does, then libgdx too

by the same principle (?)

8:55 PM

I've never tried libgdx, so I can't either suggest it or reject it

also there is SDL/SFML

I'm such an idiot, 2 days asking around and I was just doing the wrong google search -.-

code.google.com/p/libgdx-users/wiki/LuaTutorial

@EfEs yes, yes you are...

hmmmmmmmm

python or lua

looking at their syntaxes lua seems to offer more, while python looks more mature/stable

PythonInProgress

whoa

8:58 PM

but I've never tried either of them for a real project, so I can't really suggest either

PythonInProgress

@Gajoo hey gaj? can you troubleshoot for me? do you do python?

hey @Almo

what up

PythonInProgress

i dont remember, do you know python

@PythonInProgress nope, just a simple tests checking language features a long time ago (python 2.4 era)

PythonInProgress

ahh

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May '134

Game Development

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